April 2009 - montgomery_boats - mailman.xmission.com

M-15 outboard
by Stan Winarski 14 Apr '09

14 Apr '09

Sandra, I've had both a regular and a long shaft motor over the years and I prefer the long shaft. Usually the only time you will want to use the motor is when you are reluctant to sail out of a slip or launch site - or sail into one. Unusually, you may want to use the "iron jib" to get to a harbor when caught in some rough seas or winds - or to try to catch up to Doug Kelch (may be more in demand now that he's re-rigged). In each of these occasions, the few additional inches of depth seem to be very useful. I'm not aware of any downside to a long shank. Will be interesting to see any responses. Stan Carol II, 1981 M-15 #177

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Re: M_Boats: Refit
by John and DesAnne Hippe 14 Apr '09

14 Apr '09

Hey Connie, Thanks for the ideas. I know that I have a leak at the leading edge of the keel -- water is dripping out of a small crack there. I did some repair of this last year and it slowed the water infiltration down some. Still leaks a bit so will repair again. I have also been wondering about the aft end of the centerboard case though. So with the bubbling agent, did you apply this from below with the centerboard removed? Also what did you use for a bubbling agent? Liquid soap? Thanks, John Hi John, Connie here.... It sounds as if you have the same kind of problem that I did on our M15. After a brisk sail across Lake Champlain and back to the Essex, NY marina, I found both lockers under the mattresses with about a gallon of water on each side. At the dock my wife careened the boat, and I found water merrily flowing into the lockers on each side, through gaps in the inside liner. The next question was: where is the water coming in? To make a long search operation description short, it turned out to be coming from the aft end of the centerboard trunk slot, at a joint between the centerboard trunk and the interior liner of the boat M15). I found it the hard way, by filling the inside of the boat with water and waiting for it to drip underneath to see where the leak was. Once it started dripping, I found the leak was in the centerboard trunk. The next question was; exactly where in that area was the leak? To pinpoint the exact location of the leak I made Styrofoam hatch boards; sealed all companionway joints, and sail locker lid joints with duct tape; fired up my big shop vac on "blow"; put the hose nozzle in a hole I cut in the Styrofoam, and pressurized the interior of the boat. Then I painted every area in the centerboard slot with copious amounts of bubble solution, and watched for the location of where the bubbles would originate. When I found the location - the aft corner of the centerboard truck / cabin liner joint. I then removed the teak board in front of the cabin entrance (drill out the center of the teak plugs and break out the pieces - new teak plugs are available at WEST Marine) That allowed me to do some surgical removal of the back end of the centerboard slot (pieces were reinstalled after the repair) in order to gain access to the leak area. I then ground out material at the joint where the leak occurred, using a DREML tool. This area was then sealed using thickened epoxy. My repair solved the problem: no more leaks: dry lockers at any angle of heel or amount of burping water through the C/B slot because of excessive speed. Good luck on your search; and the pressurized interior and bubble liquid is a lot easier solution as a search tool than the fill-it-with-water method I initially used. Connie ex M15 #400 LEPPO

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Re: M_Boats: gaff rig pictures
by JDavies104＠aol.com 13 Apr '09

13 Apr '09

Doug, Great pictures and a beautiful job. You must be one happy dude! Rick M-17 #633 Lynne L ************** The Average US Credit Score is 692. See Yours in Just 2 Easy Steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1221621489x1201450100/aol?redir=htt… 3Fsc%3D668072%26hmpgID%3D62%26bcd%3DAprilAvgfooterNO62)

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Re: M_Boats: Refit
by John and DesAnne Hippe 13 Apr '09

13 Apr '09

Hello Chris, I take two weeks because I circumnavigate the island which takes about 8-9 days of sailing. I like to allow an extra day for every 3 or so days of sailing to allow for weather delays and for sight seeing. The distance for me is around 230 miles all told. The 25 mile hop over to the island usually takes me about 7 hours. On some trips I have motored across because of no wind and on others I have sailed. My longest legs on the trip around the island are around 32 miles. Depending on wind direction, I can be out on the water up to 10-12 hours. In my experience, expecting to make 50 miles in one day is pushing it. With the right winds it would be possible but given the fact that hull speed on an M-15 is somewhere around 5 knots, this would still necessitate 10 hours of perfect wind... Winds seem to come mostly out of the west ( sw, w, nw) but can come from any direction. Storms are a bit of a risk. On my 2007 trip I had a storm come ripping through -- calm and placid one minute and winds blowing 25-30? a few minutes later. There are no currents to worry about. A "must have" book is "Superior Way: A Cruising Guide to Lake Superior" by Bonnie Dahl. She covers the entire lake section by section with information on anchorages, weather, sights to see, etc. It is geared to the large boat crowd but is still an excellent resource. In addition, look into Marlin Bree's books "In the teeth of the Noreaster: A solo voyage on Lake Superior" and "Wake of the Green Storm: A Survivors Tale." These two books detail his trip around Lake Superior on his home built 20 foot boat. Great reading. John Great. Thanks for the information/advice. I'll have to start photodocumenting the changes I make as well. I'm quite excited about my Isle Royale trip - perhaps I'll have to give it 2 weeks instead of one... I've only day sailed on Superior, are there significant currents or changing prevailing winds? How long did it take to go the 25 miles (under sail or motor?)? Any advice on good places to get this information (or if it's terribly relevant)? I figure that if I can pull off 50mi. per day, I can everywhere I want to go - but perhaps this is too ambitious... Thanks again! Chris

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Re: M_Boats: refit
by John and DesAnne Hippe 13 Apr '09

13 Apr '09

Hello Chris, The centerboard was pretty easy. After I lifted the boat I simply lowered the centerboard. I then put some soft material under the centerboard and cut the line. This lowered the aft portion. I then supported the centerboard and then drove out the pivot pin. It just slid out. Took all of about 10 minutes. Yes I have gone to Isle Royale twice on my M-15 and plan to go again this summer (August 15-30) for two weeks with my two young daughters. When I go, I put in at Grand Portage, MN. This gives me a short hop of about 25 miles over to the island. Isle Royale is a fantastic cruising gound -- I love the isolation of the wilderness up there. You can literally go for a few days without hardly seeing anyone else. With regard to the teak, I use the three step teak cleaner. I have uploaded three pictures to my picture site that shows the state the teak was in before cleaning and a picture of it part way cleaned. The last picture you can see the front have of the tow rail with the oil and the back half without the oil. I will have to re-clean the teak again this spring as the road travel has made it grimey again. John M-15 Jester Fantastic! I'm hoping to do much the same thing to my M15 this summer. How difficult was it to get the centerboard out? >*From looking at your pictures I see you went to Isle Royale! Where did you *put in? I am planning a ~1 week trip this summer, and am currently trying to decide if that is enough time to put in at the Apostle Islands and make the crossing to Tettegouche, then up to Isle Royale. I'd like to get a little open water time - remind me of ocean sailing (albeit on much bigger boats...). Also, the toe rails and other woodwork looks great on your boat! Did you refinish it? I've gotten some conflicting opinions on the proper way to refinish teak - I guess this question is up for everyone: what is the best way? Sand/stain/poly? teak restorer stuff? Thanks! Chris M15 Persephone

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Re: M_Boats: gaff rig pictures
by W David Scobie 13 Apr '09

13 Apr '09

VERY salty looking rig! the M15 takes to that refinement with style. dave scobie M15 #288 - SCRED visit Scred's www-site: http://www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred --- On Mon, 4/13/09, Doug Kelch <doug_kelch(a)yahoo.com> wrote: From: Doug Kelch <doug_kelch(a)yahoo.com> Subject: M_Boats: gaff rig pictures To: "Montgomery" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Date: Monday, April 13, 2009, 10:15 AM Sunday was a nice windy day so I asked a friend to take some pictures of my modified rig on the M15. http://montgomeryowners.com/gallery/ The winds were a steady 15kts with gusts to 25 kts. What a hoot :-) I have a lot to learn about tuning the rig but she handled exceptionally well. I was able to carry full sail during the 12 - 15 kts without an serious heeling and the gaff rig shed the intial 20 kt gusts pretty well. As the wind increased the tacking became slower with all of the leverage against the turn with the jib way out there. The wind increased to 18 kts with gusts to 25 kts so I put 1 reef in the main and with 1 gust over 25 and the main fully release the jibs absolutely took control and we took off to leward. The boat was a little sluggish to me going to windward with both jibs up and 1 reef in the main so I rolled up the jib and sailed under the staysail and single reefed main with a substanial increase in speed. Interesting. This is going to be a fun season. :-) Thanks Doug Kelch "Seas the Day" _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet!

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Re: M_Boats: M17 F/D AMY relocating
by Larry E Yake 12 Apr '09

12 Apr '09

If you ever want to do any cruising in that flush-deck, Mark, the San Juan cruise is in two months! Larry On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 12:57:15 -0700 (PDT) Mark Escovedo <m17flushdeck_amy(a)yahoo.com> writes: > Hello Arnold, > It will be a nice change of scenery I think, the shore of southern > California is not > that particularly interesting. I may even tow Amy north, on > occasion, if we get a > hanker'n for some salt air. > > Hope to see you on the water. > > Fair Winds > Mark E > M17 F/D > #103 > AMY > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Arnold Sharpe <afsharpe(a)mac.com> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Sent: Saturday, April 11, 2009 9:52:53 PM > Subject: Re: M_Boats: M17 F/D AMY relocating > > Mark, I believe you'll like it once you get used to the current all > going one way. Camas/Washougle has a great marina. We sail > "Little Breeze",( M-17 #265) out of Portland both up and down river. > Good sailing..Arnold Sharpe > On Apr 11, 2009, at 9:38 PM, Mark Escovedo wrote: > > > Hello All, > > > > Well Amy (My M17 F/D) and I have had about as much as we can take > of southern Ca. > > So we are heading to the great Northwest, AMY's new home port will > be along > > the northern shore of the great Columbia river. In the > Vancouver/Camas area in the > > state of Washington. > > I'm going to treat AMY to some fresh water sailing for a change. > > > > Fair Winds > > Mark E > > M17F/D > > #103 > > AMY > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > > > Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! > > > _______________________________________________ > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! > > > > > _______________________________________________ > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! > >

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M17 F/D AMY relocating
by Mark Escovedo 12 Apr '09

12 Apr '09

Hello All, Well Amy (My M17 F/D) and I have had about as much as we can take of southern Ca. So we are heading to the great Northwest, AMY's new home port will be along the northern shore of the great Columbia river. In the Vancouver/Camas area in the state of Washington. I'm going to treat AMY to some fresh water sailing for a change. Fair Winds Mark E M17F/D #103 AMY

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Towing Question
by Live File 12 Apr '09

12 Apr '09

Does anybody have any experience with towing a M17 with a 1993 ish Toyota 4x4, manual transmission. Gross combined weight is 7800 lbs ( vehicle weights about 4,200 lbs ) which would probably give me an extra 500 - 600 lbs reserve capacity according to the owners manual. However I was looking for real world experience. Not interested in going fast up hill; just looking to make it.

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Re: M_Boats: Winchers
by JDavies104＠aol.com 11 Apr '09

11 Apr '09

My 2005 M17 has plain jam cleats just aft of the jib winches on the cockpit coaming. The angle makes them hard to work from the windward side. I agree that the cross sheeting is a neat idea. I'll try it. There are several forums out there where the winchers are discussed, and there are lots of opinions. The main contribution seems to be that when the turns on the winch run up against the underside of the wincher it greatly increases the effective winch friction, which makes tailing more manageable. They definitely don't work as self-tailers. Combining that with the cross sheeting might work even better. Since they only cost $35 at Defender I think I'll give them a try and provide feedback when I've done a sea trial. Thanks for the input, Rick M-17 #633 Lynne L ************** Hurry! April 15th is almost here. File your Federal taxes FREE with TaxACT. (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/100126575x1221653545x1201423923/aol?redir=htt… 102950004%26p%3D82)

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