December 2004 - montgomery_boats - mailman.xmission.com

Re: M_Boats: McKibbin Sails
by Frederick M Berthrong 24 Dec '04

24 Dec '04

Yes, Gilbert, it is a big sail but actually it has the same foot length as the sail that came with the boat. I haven't used it in very many different wind conditions so I don't know how it fills when in strong winds and reefed in tight. However, it does nicely in light winds fully deployed and in a fresh breeze reefed to about a 100% size. I am very pleased with the CF-2 roller reefer/furler. It is very simple, quite stout and so far it has furled very easily. I bought the package with the ball bearings which I figured certainly can't hurt anything. The ball bearings are about 1/2" diameter and there are only about seven of them so they just don't seem to want to cause trouble. Also, regarding size .... the masthead on my boat is a full 23' - 3" high above the tabernacle. I don't know if that is common or what and would appreciate knowing from the group if that length mast was standard for a certain vintage M-17. My hull is #300 which puts it in 1979. I got it with two head sails; a 100% jib and a 150% + genoa. She pulls hard in a stiff breeze with the genoa but the jib is about right. I went to the roller because it is, for me, a bit of a tussel to change head sails single handed when a squall shows up. While I prefer to sail with company, I want to rig the boat so that I can sail it alone without a hassle. I now have all lines in the cockpit and have rigged a deal for the anchor that I have yet to try out, that will permit me to drop it from the cockpit as well. Fred "Dulce" M-17 #300 On Thu, 23 Dec 2004 20:30:50 -0600 "Gilbert Landin" <gilbert(a)mindgame.com> writes: > Fred , it just dawned, on me your jib is 160%!! Man thats a lot of > cloth. > How small can you run it. > > Gilbert > > > > > _______________________________________________ > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > >

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Turnbuckles
by Rik Sandberg 24 Dec '04

24 Dec '04

Howard, >I'm thinking that part of the bend in the "T" bolts also involves the uppers >with aft swept spreaders pulling on the chainplates at an angle...maybe 10 >degrees or more...that contributes to the bending situation. > Unless your t-bolts/turnbuckles/toggle are somehow bound up where they attach to your chain plates, there is no bending force on them when the mast is up. If your t-bolts/turnbuckles/toggles are free to rotate on their pin through the chain plate, it will always be a straight pulling force on them, no matter how your mast is raked. On all of the boats I have had, the toggle/turnbuckle assembly has been free to rotate many more degrees on the chainplate than could ever be needed to allow for *any* amount of mast rake. If your shroud and turnbuckle assemblies do not run in a straight line once your mast is up and your shrouds are adjusted, you probably have the wrong toggles for your boat. Rik

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Re: M_Boats: McKibbin Sails
by Frederick M Berthrong 24 Dec '04

24 Dec '04

No Gilbert, I used a machine that was purchased from Sail Rite. A regular machine would work for about 90% of the job. However, on the tack, head and clew reinforcements, where there are up to five plies, a regular machine would probably not have the ooommmph to make the stiches. My friend had purchased one a while back to make a couple of sails so I benefited. Fred, "Dulce" M17 #300 On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 22:12:38 -0600 "Gilbert Landin" <gilbert(a)mindgame.com> writes: > Fred, did you guys use a regular sewing machine? I am saving all my > atta > boys for a furler, I currently do not have one. > > gilbert > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Frederick M Berthrong" <fthrong(a)juno.com> > To: <chonshell(a)ia4u.net>; <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 12:06 AM > Subject: Re: M_Boats: McKibbin Sails > > > > To all interested in new sails and like to do hands on things (and > are > > cheap, like me), > > > > This is not a commercial. > > > > I just purchased a 160% Genoa from Sail Rite for the new CF2 > roller > > reefing/furling gear. With the help of Jud Preston who had done > this > > before we sewed up the precisely cut pieces in about 6 hours; add > to that > > about an hour to finish up the do-dads and there it is. ... a > beautiful > > new Genny all in for $243 (which includes a bottle of fine 12 yr. > scotch > > for Jud). The folks at Sail Rite (www.sailrite.com ) were very > helpful > > and knowledgeable about the M-17 with a standard cut or able to > make > > whatever adjustments to the actual measurements of luff, leach and > foot > > that you want. My mast is a full 23' - 3" off the tabernacle so > we added > > about a foot in luff and leach over the standard .... no > additional > > cost!. I was very impressed and what fun to sail under a hand > made rag. > > They include everything you need except the sewing machine. Cloth > to > > your specs (I chose the dacron Supercruise 4.4 oz at Sail Rites > > recommendation for the type of sailing I will generally do here in > the > > mountain West), dacron thread, clew, tack and head attachments to > your > > specs and excellent instructions. I could not be more pleased and > the > > sail makes a big difference in the way the boat responds whether > in tight > > or off. > > > > My next will be the main. and then .... > > > > Fred Berthrong > > M-17 #300 "Dulce" > > > > On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 21:02:03 -0500 "Craig F. Honshell" > > <chonshell(a)ia4u.net> writes: > >> > >> I'm just relieved to find I'm not the only one still using mine . > . > >> . :-) > >> > >> My originals do fine, but I'm sure I'd appreciate the improved > >> performance of > >> replacements . . . If I could afford them . . . > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: Saltm17(a)aol.com > >> To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com > >> Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 6:42 PM > >> Subject: McKibbin Sails > >> > >> I still use my McKibbin sails after 20 years, and it's true that > >> virtually > >> any sail that isn't torn will move a sailboat through the water, > but > >> the > >> difference that new, well cut sails can provide has to be felt to > be > >> believed. The > >> increased speed is amazing. I was nowhere near competitive with > my > >> McKibbin > >> sails and only picked up enough speed to be in the race when I > >> purchased new > >> ones. Also a new main will let you point much higher than an > old > >> baggy one. > >> And "baggy" is a relative word. My McKibbin main doesn't look > >> baggy to the > >> eye, but I can point higher and go much faster with the new > main. > >> > >> John Edwards > >> _______________________________________________ > >> > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > >> > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > > > > _______________________________________________ > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > >

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Re: M_Boats: Rigging question...off list
by Larry E Yake 24 Dec '04

24 Dec '04

Well, I guess putting "off list" on the subject line doesn't make is so, does it? <grin> I just found I had "Copy to all recipients" checked on my reply settings, so hopefully I won't be bothering you guys with off list replies anymore. Larry On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 22:44:39 -0800 Larry E Yake <leyake(a)juno.com> writes: > Hi Bill, > I haven't forgotten about you. I just haven't been out to the > boat so > I could measure the mainsheet yet. The line I used was at least > 3/8. I > think it may have even been 7/16. It was one I bought a few years > ago for > jib sheets, but didn't like because it would kink and then hang up > on the > turning blocks. It was around 40 feet long, but I trimmed some off. > > I'm on vacation next week, so I'll try to get more exact info for > you. > Larry > > On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 23:24:58 EST BILLAMICASR(a)aol.com writes: > > Hey - - - Merry Christmas & Happy Holidays ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! > > > > For those of you who may have changed their M-17 mainsheet from a > > > three part > > to a four part purchase... > > 1. Do you recall what size line 5/16 or 3/8? > > 2. Do you recall how many feet were required? > > Thanks, > > Bill M-17 #496 "Tipperary" > > _______________________________________________ > > > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > >

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Merry Christmas to all - (For those that haven't seen this)
by Keith Diehl 23 Dec '04

23 Dec '04

I have no idea why this didn't post for Gordon: ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gordon Allgrove" <gordonallgrove(a)mindspring.com> T'was the night before Christmas, when all through the yacht, Not a through hull did pop, No need for a mop! The stockings were hung from the handholds with tethers, In case we got knocked while going to weather. The crew were all nestled, snug in their bunks, While visions of new gear danced in their heads. Mamma in her SOSpenders and me tethered in, Had just settled down for the mid watch to begin. When out on a swell there arose such a spray, That I sprang from my bunk to see what washed away. Away to the portlight I flew in a flash, Undogged the clamps and looked for a splash. The moon on the crests of velvety swells, Gave the luster of mid day to the floatsom and gulls, When what to my wondering Steiners should appear, But an S&S hull with eight tiny reindeer. "Now, DASHER! now, DANCER! now, PRANCER and VIXEN! On, INTREPID! on COURAGEOUS! on WEATHERLY and CONSTELLATION! To the top of the coachroof! to the top of the mast! Now dash away! dash away! dash dash dash dash!" As dry heaves that before a wild hurricane fly, When they meet with the rigging, mount to the sky, So up to the coachroof the coursers they flew, With the sleigh full of toys, and St. Nicholas too. And then, in a twinkling, I heard on the coachroof The prancing and pawing of each little hoof. As I drew the EPIRB in my hand, and was turning around, Down the dorade St. Nicholas came with a bound. He was dressed all in Gill foulies, from his head to his toes, And his clothes dusted with fiberglass from where I don't know; A bundle of toys he had flung on his back, And he looked like a Yacht Broker, or something like that. His eyes -- how they twinkled in his Costa del Mar's! His cheeks were like roses, (from a night at the bar). His droll little mouth was drawn up like a flap, And the beard of his chin was as white as wave caps; The stump of a pipe he held tight in his teeth, And the cap on his head looked like it was reefed; He had a broad face and a little round belly, That shook, when he laughed like naval jelly. He was chubby and plump, a right jolly old salt, And I laughed when I saw him, in spite of my malt; A wink of his eye, he ran to the head, Soon gave me to know I had nothing to dread; After, he spoke not a word, but went straight to his work, And filled all the stockings with GPS's and beef jerk, And laying his finger aside of his nose, he looked quite lit, I ran to open the hatch before the crew saw it; He sprang to his sleigh, to his team blew a bos'n's whistle, And away they all flew like a full canvassed Thistle. But I heard him exclaim, ere he cruised out of sight, "HAPPY CHRISTMAS TO ALL, AND TO ALL A GOOD-NIGHT."

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Re: M_Boats: McKibbin Sails
by Wcpritchett＠aol.com 23 Dec '04

23 Dec '04

Check a sailbroker for sails before making them too. You may find some good deals. I've purchased from Bacon several times and bought sails that looked like they were never hoisted or were factory new...mint. Prices were less than making my own. I do my own canvas sewing for boat stuff but just can't beat buying brokered sail prices and quality.

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Re: M_Boats: turnbuckles
by bownez＠juno.com 23 Dec '04

23 Dec '04

Gilbert and listers, I have also suffered bent "T" bolts in my turnbuckles on the M17. One must carefully watch the shrouds while raising the mast. I have replaced the bent items with the smaller .250 "T" and matching clevis. It fits fine, no problems. I carry a spare as well. Minus one degree F in Mpls this morning, sitting on fiberglass would be a bit cool on the fanny. Merry Christmas all. Bones ________________________________________________________________ Juno Gift Certificates Give the gift of Internet access this holiday season. http://www.juno.com/give

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Re: M_Boats: McKibbin Sails
by Larry E Yake 23 Dec '04

23 Dec '04

I have a furler, but no atta boys. On Wed, 22 Dec 2004 22:12:38 -0600 "Gilbert Landin" <gilbert(a)mindgame.com> writes: > Fred, did you guys use a regular sewing machine? I am saving all my > atta > boys for a furler, I currently do not have one. > > gilbert > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Frederick M Berthrong" <fthrong(a)juno.com> > To: <chonshell(a)ia4u.net>; <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 12:06 AM > Subject: Re: M_Boats: McKibbin Sails > > > > To all interested in new sails and like to do hands on things (and > are > > cheap, like me), > > > > This is not a commercial. > > > > I just purchased a 160% Genoa from Sail Rite for the new CF2 > roller > > reefing/furling gear. With the help of Jud Preston who had done > this > > before we sewed up the precisely cut pieces in about 6 hours; add > to that > > about an hour to finish up the do-dads and there it is. ... a > beautiful > > new Genny all in for $243 (which includes a bottle of fine 12 yr. > scotch > > for Jud). The folks at Sail Rite (www.sailrite.com ) were very > helpful > > and knowledgeable about the M-17 with a standard cut or able to > make > > whatever adjustments to the actual measurements of luff, leach and > foot > > that you want. My mast is a full 23' - 3" off the tabernacle so > we added > > about a foot in luff and leach over the standard .... no > additional > > cost!. I was very impressed and what fun to sail under a hand > made rag. > > They include everything you need except the sewing machine. Cloth > to > > your specs (I chose the dacron Supercruise 4.4 oz at Sail Rites > > recommendation for the type of sailing I will generally do here in > the > > mountain West), dacron thread, clew, tack and head attachments to > your > > specs and excellent instructions. I could not be more pleased and > the > > sail makes a big difference in the way the boat responds whether > in tight > > or off. > > > > My next will be the main. and then .... > > > > Fred Berthrong > > M-17 #300 "Dulce" > > > > On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 21:02:03 -0500 "Craig F. Honshell" > > <chonshell(a)ia4u.net> writes: > >> > >> I'm just relieved to find I'm not the only one still using mine . > . > >> . :-) > >> > >> My originals do fine, but I'm sure I'd appreciate the improved > >> performance of > >> replacements . . . If I could afford them . . . > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- > >> From: Saltm17(a)aol.com > >> To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com > >> Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 6:42 PM > >> Subject: McKibbin Sails > >> > >> I still use my McKibbin sails after 20 years, and it's true that > >> virtually > >> any sail that isn't torn will move a sailboat through the water, > but > >> the > >> difference that new, well cut sails can provide has to be felt to > be > >> believed. The > >> increased speed is amazing. I was nowhere near competitive with > my > >> McKibbin > >> sails and only picked up enough speed to be in the race when I > >> purchased new > >> ones. Also a new main will let you point much higher than an > old > >> baggy one. > >> And "baggy" is a relative word. My McKibbin main doesn't look > >> baggy to the > >> eye, but I can point higher and go much faster with the new > main. > >> > >> John Edwards > >> _______________________________________________ > >> > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > >> > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > > > > _______________________________________________ > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > >

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Rigging question...off list
by Larry E Yake 23 Dec '04

23 Dec '04

Hi Bill, I haven't forgotten about you. I just haven't been out to the boat so I could measure the mainsheet yet. The line I used was at least 3/8. I think it may have even been 7/16. It was one I bought a few years ago for jib sheets, but didn't like because it would kink and then hang up on the turning blocks. It was around 40 feet long, but I trimmed some off. I'm on vacation next week, so I'll try to get more exact info for you. Larry On Tue, 21 Dec 2004 23:24:58 EST BILLAMICASR(a)aol.com writes: > Hey - - - Merry Christmas & Happy Holidays ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! > > For those of you who may have changed their M-17 mainsheet from a > three part > to a four part purchase... > 1. Do you recall what size line 5/16 or 3/8? > 2. Do you recall how many feet were required? > Thanks, > Bill M-17 #496 "Tipperary" > _______________________________________________ > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > >

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Some messages--no line breaks
by David Wood 23 Dec '04

23 Dec '04

I suppose this might be better directed to Keith Diehl, but I was wondering if any others here were encountering the same problem that I have with some of the messages posted here. No it's not the personal attacks ;) it is that the text doesn't get wrapped around at the right side of the screen. It only happens with about 30% of the messages here, but it makes them a little bit of a hassle to read. I've tried four different web browsers on both Macintosh and Windows computers, and I get the same results. And Keith, if you're interested in knowing exactly which messages exhibit this problem, I'd be happy to let you know. Heck, for all I know, my messages might be doing the same thing. So, does anyone else run into this? David =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= David W. Wood -=- dwood(a)woodatwork.com 1981 M15 -=- Hull #163

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