May 2002 - Kraftwerk - mailman.xmission.com

Re: [Kraftwerk] Re: "from noise to sound to music to ... eternity !!!" ;-)
by Rob Evans 04 May '02

04 May '02

I mused: > > I think Kraftwerk spent four albums experimenting > > before they descovered themselves. > Oh Jay mused: >well ... imho , kw spent 3 albums ( NOT includin' the "tone float" album by >their predecessor project organisation , of course !!! ;-) on >"experimentation" >with sounds in general & the next two albums ( "autobahn" & >"radio-activity" ) >to discover their concept status , as both - "autobahn" & "radio-activity" >- >still included lots of "noisy" trax that simply can't be described as >conventional songs , because they jus' lack such a structure !!! I think, that as Kraftwerk get older, they become more and more obssessed with perfectionism. That is why they can no longer make an album, they are perhaps driving themselves crazy trying to achieve the impossible? I think that the Radio-Activity album marked the beginning of their intention to be perfect. The emphasis on production is greater with every album. Rob _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx

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Re: stockhausen vs. sala ...
by Oh Jay 04 May '02

04 May '02

From: markus.berzborn(a)t-online.de (Markus Berzborn) > Stockhausen has never been very interested in pop music, > although recently some journalist had the silly idea > to send him some recordings by techno artists to ask him > what advice he could give to his "younger colleagues". > As you would expect, the advice was always something like: > "Stop using these regular rhythms" and "Stop using these > conventional major/minor harmonies", > which of course for pop musicians comes close to saying: > "Stop making music altogether"! *LOL* ;-))) i really wonder , if any of those silly journalists ever had the idea to send him some "stuff" by autechre or funkstÃ¶rung & their likes ??? *G+* ;-) somethin' that's surely VERY_FAR from bein' "repetitive" in rhythm & its overall structure !!! *BWG* ;-))) oh well ... i suppose that after the 11th of sept.2001 & stockhausen's utterin' that the attack was "a truly great piece of art" , NOBODY would be interested in what he has to say about their music anymore !!! :-/ this only proves that some of the greatest artists must be @ least a tad bit insane to produce such outstandin' pieces of art , like stockhausen certainly did !!! *slyest_grin* ;-))) > What he seems to be primarily looking for in a synthesizer > is not the "sound" as such but the possibilities to edit given sounds > as radically as possible and to "compose" sounds from scratch. this makes me wonder ( once again ) , why stockhausen & sala ( & his still highly enigmatic mixturetrautonium ) never really came together !? :-o i suppose that they both jus' didn't liked each other !? *sigh* :-o fyi : the mixturetrautonium most certainly would have been an instument that stockhausen could have used to produce sounds that wasn't heard before in such a way ... with the incredible possibility to create subharmonic structures ... from scratch , so to say !!! ;-) > as there are now some instruments which come close to his conceptions. ... as there were even DECADES before now !!! :-o jus' see my example above !!! *sigh* :-o well ... this only proves that some of the greatest possibilities are lost sometimes ( & maybe forever ??? :-o ) ... ONLY because some stubborn ol' genius doesn't like to "werk" with another even more stubborn ol' genius !!! :-/ however ... many greetinx , oh jay ;-) *~\^/~*

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Re: "from noise to sound to music to ... eternity !!!" ;-)
by Oh Jay 04 May '02

04 May '02

rob mused : > I think Kraftwerk spent four albums experimenting > before they descovered themselves. well ... imho , kw spent 3 albums ( NOT includin' the "tone float" album by their predecessor project organisation , of course !!! ;-) on "experimentation" with sounds in general & the next two albums ( "autobahn" & "radio-activity" ) to discover their concept status , as both - "autobahn" & "radio-activity" - still included lots of "noisy" trax that simply can't be described as conventional songs , because they jus' lack such a structure !!! however ... many greetinx , oh jay ;-) *~\^/~*

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Re: the predecessors of "t.e.e." ...
by Oh Jay 04 May '02

04 May '02

From: <erik(a)tinyonline.co.uk> > Does anyone know which came out first, > "From Here to Eternity" or TEE? > And what about "I Feel Love" by the way? > Did that precede TEE? i dunno about that , but what is for sure , is the FACT that kw got the sound ideas to "metal on metal" & similar sounds from oskar sala's soundtrack to the mannesmann industrial movie "stahl - thema mit variationen" , which was done almost two decades before "t.e.e." !!! ;-) simply blame it on "don" schneider's fascination for "the meastro" ( oskar sala ;-) , his "werk" & especially his instrument , the still highly enigmatic mixturetrautonium !!! *G+* ;-) however ... many greetinx , oh jay ;-) *~\^/~*

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Re: noise : decoded ... ;-)
by Oh Jay 04 May '02

04 May '02

From: markus.berzborn(a)t-online.de (Markus Berzborn) > I like early Kraftwerk and ALL Stockhausen recordings. > They may be noisy, but does noise automatically mean crap? "music is organized noise !!!" ;-) however ... many greetinx , oh jay ;-) *~\^/~*

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Re: [Kraftwerk] Karl Bartos and Karlheinz Stockhausen in Stockhol m
by Rob Evans 04 May '02

04 May '02

> > >Actually early Kraftwerk also falls into that category (noise crap with >a > > >few exceptions). > > > > I think Kraftwerk spent four albums experimenting before they descovered > > themselves. > >Or waiting for technology to catch them up? It depends what you think Kraftwerk is. Rob _________________________________________________________________ Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com

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Re: [Kraftwerk] Karl Bartos and Karlheinz Stockhausen in Stockhol m
by Rob Evans 04 May '02

04 May '02

>Actually early Kraftwerk also falls into that category (noise crap with a >few exceptions). I think Kraftwerk spent four albums experimenting before they descovered themselves. Rob. _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx

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Giorgio Moroder on Kraftwerk
by Mike F 04 May '02

04 May '02

I just came across this detailed interview with Giorgio Moroder from 1978 where he speaks about Kraftwerk: http://www.hocker100.freeserve.co.uk/mor/part01.htm -- Regards, Mike F mailto:mff@acedsl.com

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Kraftwerk borrowed by Julius Papp
by C. Twomey 04 May '02

04 May '02

Has anyone heard this? Julius Papp Move your Body EP Large LAR071 US 12" "Percussive and pumping deep house with some soulful keys, live instrumentation in an overall sensuous feel flipped by a tech house cut, "Tekwork," that's taking it's main theme from a well known KRAFTWERK song."

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Discovering ones self in the looking glass
by ian tyson 04 May '02

04 May '02

Wolfgang said. >What's so dammned gripping on >that? Kraftwerk members with naked upper bodies under a garden >shower, wouw! >As you know Ralf & Florian did a legal ban on my book here because >they didn't want to be shown under Florians garden shower with me. Thomas said: >Wolf...what the hell is your POINT? Are you trying to turn us against >Kraftwerk and come to hate Ralf and Florian Main event said: >Thats what society/media/image can do to some people.. take a soap >opera >or a drama show.. Its that well written that there are some >people out >there believe that the settings and characters are actually >real people, >not actors. So what Im trying to say here is that >Kraftwerk's image >manipulation was so good that many believed that >they are silent, moody >people who talk about machines all the time!! >Its silly that Ralf Hutter and Florian Schnieder want people to >believe >that they are slient robots without feeling. People watch soaps because it reflects real life. So yes it is pathetic when people start to confuse actors with real life. The Kraftwerk image however is an artistic expression. The appeal in the KW image is that it is not real life. I find the image of KW intriguing, just as I may find a performance of a Wagner opera intriguing. I know KW are not robots. I know the opera singers do not constantly sing their conversations in real life, nor do they wear outlandish clothing when they go to the supermarkets. The thing is, I'm not particularly interested in the real life of KW members. Nor do I want to see the dressing room of the opera singers. So KW members have fun when they are not working!, have taken candid pictures in the shower!. What next? "exposing" opera singers because they talk instead of sing when they go home at night. I would suspect that R & F are not so much worried about suggestions of homosexuality, but rather they are more concerned about the KW image being spoiled by associating it with the tabloid celebrity fodder that accompanies other less accomplished musicians. After all Ralph, Florian, Wolfgang and Karl have successfully portrayed this dramatic corporate anti-celebrity image for many years. That is quite an achievement. I don't want to get involved in a Wolfgang v R&F wrangle, and I am sure there are two sides to every story. However R&F are not going to talk publicly about this because they want to preserve the KW image. I would like to appreciate KW for what they are (even if that is long term silence). My only reservation with Wolfgang's book is that it was aimed at KW fans. Wolfgang chose to be a member of KW for the time he was there and accept the conditions that go with it. The Yamo project is certainly worthwhile and enjoyable. I just wish he called the book "Yamo, I am a musician", and did not bother to print candid pictures of KW (especially as he now criticises some of the list members for showing an interest in them). I believe Wolfgang does however have some genuine grievances and I sincerely hope these will be addressed to his personal satisfaction. Long may he continue to produce enjoyable music. sincerely, ian t _________________________________________________________________ Join the worlds largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com

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