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SOS: how to get the *TRUE* "River Deep, Mountain High"?
by Patrice L. Roussel 28 Apr '03

28 Apr '03

Does anybody know what's going on with "River Deep, Mountain High"? This is one of my top favorite songs and I can't find it anymore on any record by Ike & Tina Turner. I want the version produced by Phil Spector. Where can I find it? Thanks, Patrice (worried to buy another Ike & Tina compilation).

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Re: [off-topic] using songs for commercials
by Perfect Sound Forever 27 Apr '03

27 Apr '03

Steve's story about Faust (in the Superbowl) reminds me of another similar story. Kleenex/Liliput were a Swiss punk band from the late 70's/early 80's. I helped to get their material reissued on indie label Kill Rock Stars records. Recently, KRS was approached by some SUV company, saying that they'd offer to pay the band and the label about twenty grand for the use of Kleenex song in one of their commericals. KRS contacted the band and asked them about this even though they didn't have to according their contracts. Marlene Marder, the band's guitarist, said that she couldn't approve of such a thing (she works for the World Wildlife Federation now) but she also told KRS that she'd understand if they said yes and collected the money themselves. KRS told the SUV company that they weren't interested in doing business with them. I was in awe of Marlene and KRS for turning them down. Best, Jason Perfect Sound Forever online music magazine with warped perspectives perfect-sound(a)furious.com http://www.perfectsoundforever.com

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Moondog
by patricio gomez 27 Apr '03

27 Apr '03

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msg from karl berger re Coaching Projects
by Acousticlv＠aol.com 27 Apr '03

27 Apr '03

hi gang, passing on a message from vibraphonist & woodstock creative music studio dude karl berger. yrs steve koenig n.p.: candi staton: young hearts run free/house of love reissue Coaching of Music Projects Award-winning composer / arranger Karl Berger, known for his arrangements for Jeff Buckley (Grace), Natalie Merchant (Ophelia), Angelique Kidjo (Black Ivory Soul) and many collaborations with producers Bill Laswell (Operazone etc), Malcolm Burn, Peter Collins (The Cardigans) and others, is now also coaching selected projects of young composers and recording artists ( composition, arrangement, improvisation, recording production, all styles ). focusing on, in his words, "expanding viewpoints, effective communication, esthetic economy". Some project times are available July through October in the Tri-state area. Contact Karl Berger in Woodstock NY at 845 679 8847 or at KarlBerger(a)aol.com.

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RE: [off-topic] using songs for commercials
by Perfect Sound Forever 27 Apr '03

27 Apr '03

Hi all, Kind of a slippery slope considering this kind of thing, eh? I think most peoples' gut reaction when hearing that an artist has a song in a commercial is that they 'sold out' somehow. The fact that many artists license their music for record promos, video games and now ring-tones usually doesn't get them the kind of finger pointing as they would for having a song in a commercial (that's not even mentioning how they license merchandise to a variety of companies). Not to mention all the corporate sponsorship that's being done for tours. As someone pointed out here, I do think there's a difference when a multi-platinum act does this. Does Sting really need to be in a car commercial? He probably doesn't need the money, right? Madonna and Michael Jackson probably didn't need the money from soft drink companies (but look what happened to them for their trouble). If John Zorn does music for a commercial, I don't begrudge him that at all, especially if this is used to fund his own work, Tzadik and other things that he's then able to do. Also, some performers realize that the perceived integrity of their work takes a knock when they do this sort of thing. That's why there was such an out-cry when the Beatles "Revolution" was heard in a Nike commerical in the 80's. Nowadays, you'll hear not just the Who or Led Zeppelin in commercials but also the Stooges and the Buzzcocks. Somewhere in the ad world in the last 10 years, there was a sea change where they thought 'we can hook boomers and their kids in with this stuff.' This was also reflected in the phone-answering services which recently implemented a choice for 'classical rock' in addition to the muzak we're used to hearing when we're on hold. I think that in all, because this is becoming more and more pervasive, people are getting less inclined to get upset about it. I also remember when they started including commercials in movie previews a few years ago- at first, people in the theatres would be booing at the screen but by now, everyone realizes that this is just an annoyance they have to sit through until the previews and the feature come around. Best, Jason Perfect Sound Forever online music magazine with warped perspectives perfect-sound(a)furious.com http://www.perfectsoundforever.com

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re: music in commercials
by CuneiWay＠aol.com 26 Apr '03

26 Apr '03

Faust had some bit of music off of one of their ReR albums used in a commercial for the Superbowl. It was done with their permission. It was used one time only. Chris Cutler (owner of ReR) told me that the payment was some $30,000.00 My contracts with my artists stipulate that both the label and the band has to agree to any kind of a usage like that, which I feel very comfortable about. I can't sell their music off to someone they find distasteful, and if we do agree, it's stipulated that we share the $$ evenly. To be honest, I sincerely wish that a reasonable/tasteful opportunity like that would fall in our laps - and I know many of our artists would agree... Steve Cuneiform Records

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Re: [off-topic] using songs for commercials
by William Crump 26 Apr '03

26 Apr '03

While I honor Densmore's position, that doesn't make the opposite position dishonorable, and I gotta say, there's a lot of creativity in advertising. (Miller Lite catfight commercials notwithstanding.) When all the ethical back-n-forth lets up for a minute, I have to admit that it was just a pure pleasure to hear the Buzzcocks on the TV. Ditto for the other day when I heard the Jon Spencer Blues Explosion used in a new Subaru commercial. (It was the opening section of "Bellbottoms.") It's the same pleasant shock of the familiar that I used to get as a kid listening to the radio. On the other hand, if the music is used to plug a product I hate, I reserve the right to inconsistently holler "sellout!" Like just a few minutes ago, when I caught "Train in Vain" in a commercial for the new Jim Rome ESPN show. Speaking of products to hate, Jim Rome makes me want to kill myself for being a sports fan. William Crump

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moondog/commercials
by jim & nika 26 Apr '03

26 Apr '03

Tracked down some more info on moondog commercial--it's from his 1969 CBS album. Still not sure of the specific make of the minivan. From AMG: The best-known track on this album, "Bird's Lament," was the uncredited basis for dance DJ Mr. Scruff's "Get a Move On," which was used in an extended series of minivan commercials in 2002. Stewart Mason So it was doubly appropriated! jim mcauley

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dubby laswell recs
by mwisckol＠ocregister.com 26 Apr '03

26 Apr '03

delayed response here: sacred system: nagual site (wicklow/bmg) -- this is my favorite of laswell's dubby stuff, lots of different textures and details. really a thoughtful and finished work. strong indian current (zakir, badal) plus brief appearances from dave liebman, byard lancaster, graham haynes and craig harris. also, skopelitis and bernie worrell.... jah wobble/bill laswell: radioaxiom, a dub transmission (palm/axiom) -- luscious! not as ambitious as nagual site, but very rich and stands up to repeated listenings. (nils petter molvaer, graham haynes, skopelitis, gig amina, karsh kale, sly dunbar et al.). of the previously recommended: laswell: dub chamber 3 (RIR) -- i second this rec. a more static outing than either of the above, but with endless enjoyable dub grooves. gigi: illuminated audio (palm) -- this remix is really more laswell in the studio -- gigi doesn't sing all that much. dubby ambient, very pleasant. laswell: points of order and sacred system chapter two -- i like these but would rank them in the second tier of laswell's bountiful discography, lesser works than those mentioned above. my jury is still out on the tabla beat science discs, altho the L.A. show was a blast. pharoah sanders, the singer from system of a down, and lili hadyn joined the crew as guests.... martin np. zero-7 -- simple things

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RE: [off-topic] using songs for commercials (Geoffrey Balasoglou)
by Geoffrey Balasoglou 26 Apr '03

26 Apr '03

I've never seen the Chryser advertisement. I am however a big fan of his music. I came across him digging up information using the website www.allmusic.com I was randomly searching and somehow I ended up arriving to his description. (Moondog was linked as a similar artist to Harry Partch). I don't think I've ever discovered music through a television advertisement, maybe it's because I don't watch much television, and normally if I do a put the mute on during the advertisements! However I am fascinated to hear what song Chrysler used. I've heard Moondog's Prestige music, and the albums he recorded on CBS (Moondog i/ii) and the album 'Sax Pax for A Sax'. Moondog was quite a character, he was never interested in money, in fact he spent a lot of time on the streets of New York, so much so that the place he used to stand became known as Moondog Corner. In fact sometimes Moon Dog used to live on the streets as he revealed in an interview in 1992. Quote: Q: How much of your time on the streets were you actually homeless? MOONDOG: I had a choice. If I kept a hotel room, then I wouldn't have enough money to hire a copyist to copy the music or to go up to my place, because to make a trip up there would cost around $50, including carfare and food for a couple of weeks. I couldn't have the room and the music copying and the trips up there, so I had to make a choice: either keep a room and not go up there, or not have a room and go up there once in a while. So some of the time I would just sleep on the streets to save money. I could have a room all the time, but I wouldn't then be able to do all the other things. Q: How big a hassle was that life for you? Were you ever assaulted or robbed? MOONDOG: Yes, I've been kicked when I was sleeping, and pissed on, and abused and robbed sometimes. But never stabbed in the chest - I mean, they could have killed me if they'd wanted to. One night a cop came up to me and said, "Are you all right, Moondog?" And I said, "Yes." He said, "Here's a couple of bucks." He gave me two dollars. But dealing with the facts, would Moondog allow for Crysler to use his music. Well maybe another section from an interview might give the answer. Janis Joplin of all people covered a Moondog composition called 'All is Loneliness' *on Moondog ii on CBS. QUOTE: Q: Did Janis Joplin ever get your permission to use "All Is Loneliness"? MOONDOG: No, she just did it. The piece was written in 5/4 but she sang it in 4/4. She took great liberties, but as long as she called me "beautiful cat" then I don't mind. Q: No royalties though, I take it. MOONDOG: No, I didn't get anything. As you can see poor old Moondog didn't have much say when it came to people using his music without asking. Since he was blind, and due to other factors he probably could have done nothing to stop the advertisement had he been alive. Moondog has to be one of the most under-rated composers I've heard of. He used to hang out with Steve Reich and Phillip Glass, met Dizzy Gillispie, Duke Ellington and Charlie Parker (it is said that Parker offered to do an album with him, of course this never came true in fact Bird died shortly after meeting Moondog). Even Stravinsky respected Moondog, when Moondog was being trialed for being homeless I believe Stravinksy said to the judge 'Take care of this man. He's a serious composer. Do him right." I can talk for hours on Moondog, but I'll leave it there! Thanks, Geoffrey Balasoglou ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 12:14:51 -0700 From: "jim & nika" <ultimatefrog(a)attbi.com> Subject: commercials To: zorn-list(a)mailman.xmission.com Message-ID: <E1998VZ-0003I9-00(a)mailman.xmission.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" And I'm guessing that most people's only exposure to the music of Moondog is through the auto (Chrysler?) ad. Any speculation as to how he would have responded? jim mcauley ------------------------------

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