- montgomery_boats - mailman.xmission.com

M-15 Plan
by Steve_McClellan＠hmco.com 28 Dec '01

28 Dec '01

Bob, thanks so much for your kind welcome. I do have a question you may be able to answer, or perhaps someone else out there can. I mentioned briefly what I fear may be a leak in the centerboard trunk area of my M-15: there is water in the keel sump and also in what appears to be a narrow space between the outer and inner hulls(?) directly below where the porta-pottie sits. There are several good descriptions in the archives, from people who have had a similar problem, of how to find and fix the leak. I guess what I'm really wondering is -- is there available out there some kind of drawing or diagram that would show exactly how the M15 (specifically here I'm thinking of the CB/keel area) is put together? I don't have a clear picture of how the centerboard trunk is sealed out (isolated) from the space between the outer and inner hull. How is water able to communicate between them (I guess it's not supposed to right?) Is it that the centerboard trunk walls are attached and sealed directly to the inner hull (floor)? Does anything prevent water that has found it's way between the inner and outer hulls in one area, from travelling to any other area of the boat? I remember from my gear-head days that you could always get books with diagrams of how things went together in your CAR (that's back when you used to actually be able to tune up your own engine -- shows you how old I am) but I suspect such things would not be available for sailboats, yes? I realize that at the end of the day, I just need to establish precisely where the leak is, if any exists, and fix it, and that theoretical understanding is not necessarily required for that. I'm just the curious type I guess. Steve Chicago, Illinois M15 #151 Bob <Bobeeg(a)earthlink.net>@mailman.xmission.com on 12/19/2001 03:38:06 PM Please respond to montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com Sent by: montgomery_boats-admin(a)mailman.xmission.com To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com cc: Subject: M_Boats: Welcome Steve..... I'm happy you found a suitable Montgomery 15. I know you and your wife will enjoy her for years to come. I also appreciate your comments about Cruising World Magazine. It does seem that they only cater to the gold-plate crowd and have left the small boat sailor behind. I know that your comments are accurate and at the same time somewhat tongue-in-cheek :-) If you need any help or advise this is the place to ask. If I can help just give a call.

3 3

RE: M_Boats: Window & Fitting Leaks
by Morris, Giles 27 Dec '01

27 Dec '01

>>> What is the recommended material to use to seal around windows? >Last spring I installed new brass opening ports from NewFound Metals I'm in the process of updating Dolphin's six ports to the bronze ones from New Found Metals, and have used the sealant that they recommend: 3M Strip Caulk. It is intended to be used with automobile glass (although it seems to be in the process of being superceded) and comes in a box full of strips (surprise). It never sets. So far, it looks good, although I wish that I'd bought the white version instead of black. Several auto glass supply houses denied all knowledge of it before I found it in a large old-fashioned auto parts warehouse. Giles Morris Arlington VA Vancouver 25 #002 "Dolphin" Montgomery 15 #264 "Umiaq" Sundry kayaks

1 0

Re: M_Boats: Window & Fitting Leaks - do polysulfide
by Wcpritchett＠aol.com 27 Dec '01

27 Dec '01

I agree with Theo. Silicone will not stick to fiberglass like polysulfide...been there and done that mistake. Use Boatlife polysulfide and it will be the last time you will need to recaulk. Portholes don't need to be glued in either so 3M 5200 isn't necessary. Bill

1 0

Window & Fitting Leaks
by Steve_McClellan＠hmco.com 27 Dec '01

27 Dec '01

What is the recommended material to use to seal around windows? Whatever is there now seems pretty deteriorated; it's probably original--some kind of black substance. What about 100% silicon caulk? Steve & Debra M15 #152

2 1

Re: M_Boats: New MSOG member
by Conbert H Benneck 27 Dec '01

27 Dec '01

Steve, Scott Grometer is an M15 owner out in the Northwest. He's off the air at the moment - I haven't seen a posting from him in the past month (vacation?) but just drop him a line, and he'll answer in due course. As for a sealant, you want something that seals, but is removeable in the future. not something like 3Ms 5200. Once that's in place you can't remove it without blasting! WEST marine catalog, 1999 edition page 173, gives you a listing of sealants and their recommended uses by product names. If you haven't got a WEST catalog, call them at 1-800-262-8464, and they will send you one. The WEST catalog of boat items becomes the common denominator amongst the M web site people. They just quote item and page number so you can find it. Connie ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.

1 0

Re: M_Boats: New MSOG member
by IDCLLC＠aol.com 27 Dec '01

27 Dec '01

In a message dated 12/26/01 9:20:43 PM Central Standard Time, chbenneck(a)juno.com writes: > Steve, > > Can't help on your stability question, but Scott Grometer is the man to > contact regarding long range cruising on an M15. > > Connie > Thanks Connie. Who is Scott Grometer and how might I reach him? Steve Tyree

1 0

Re: M_Boats: New MSOG member
by IDCLLC＠aol.com 27 Dec '01

27 Dec '01

In a message dated 12/26/01 6:13:45 PM Central Standard Time, AirEvacLen(a)aol.com writes: > Steve > There are several books with a generic formula for > stability...........This will at least get you in the ball park...........I > worked out the formula once for my M-23 and it came out to a > 2..........Meaning it is a good coastal cruiser, but serious offshore > cruising ( blue water ) would be subject to the owners interpretation of > stability............Not a Dana 24, Valiant, or Island Packet,,,,,,,,,,But > a darn sight better built than some of the other boats on the > water............. > > Lenny > M-23 > Thanks for the tip. I believe I'm familiar with the formula you speak of, one that attempts to screen out boats that are too beamy for blue water safety. What I'm looking for is this: how far will an M-15 or 17 heel before it reaches a point of no return and turtles? In the case of my Potter, it's not too far! On my wife and I's first sail, we managed to lay the boat on its side due to a number of mistakes made. Amy Ann was quite content to stay there until I swam around and weighted the CB, whereupon she popped back up and we continued sailing. Thus in real terms I would say that our boat has an ultimate range of stability of less than 90 degrees. With the M-boat's significantly greater ballast, I assume that their range is much higher. I'm confident it's one of the calculations Lyle Hess made and considered when he designed the M-17. Cheers Steve Tyree, P-15 Amy Ann

1 0

Re: M_Boats: New MSOG member (AUTO FWD)
by Conbert H Benneck 27 Dec '01

27 Dec '01

Hi Steve and Debra, My guess is that you got water in the hull through - window leak - fitting leak - rain under forward lip of companionway hatch while trailering in the rain -water through companionway hatch boards (?) In my case, I had gallons of water in both cabin storage lockers (under the bunks). We had had a nice frolicking sail back across Lake Champlain, and found the water in the lockers when I opened them up to put something away. After emptying the water out of the lockers - P & S - we creened the boat at the dock and found water coming into the Port locker via a hole in the laminate in the aft upper edge. I also had water in the bow locker too (the areas aren't sealed very well), so any water will migrate fore and aft in a seaway. You will find that you will get squirts of water from the centerboard slot in the cockpit if you hit a motor boat wake. The water was also gurgling in while we were sailing - well heeled. I subsequently found the actual leak was at the aft end of the centerboard slot. I determined this by filling the boat with water until it started dripping out of the centerboard slot at the bottom of the hull - now I had the where: then next question was locate the exact spot where the leak occurred. To solve that problem, I built styrofoam hatch boards: cut a hole for my shop vac hose in one panel; and sealed everything with duct tape. Then I inserted the shop vac hose in the hole: taped it in place, and fired up the shop vac. to build up pressure inside the boat. Then I painted the centerboard slot area with soap suds, and Voila, ...big fat bubbles coming from the aft corner of the C/B slot. The rest was easy. I opened up the leak area; filled it with epoxy mixed with a filler, and let it cure. Problem solved. In your case, I'd pump out the water and go for a sail to see if this was rain water from trailering / standing, or if it is really a hull leak. If you dry it out, and you don't find any water after you've been sailing, then your problems are solved - it was rain water leaking in from above. Why head for the Apostle Islands, when the Lake Huron islands sound so appealing???? Connie Connie ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.

1 0

Re: M_Boats: New MSOG member
by Conbert H Benneck 27 Dec '01

27 Dec '01

Steve, Can't help on your stability question, but Scott Grometer is the man to contact regarding long range cruising on an M15. Connie ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.

1 0

Re: M_Boats: New MSOG member (AUTO FWD)
by Saltm17＠aol.com 27 Dec '01

27 Dec '01

Steve, I charted an O'Day 27 out of Bayfield in 1987. Had a great sail. There is an outside chance I will take my M17 up that way next summer (probably August) to sail the Apostle islands. If it works out I would enjoy having company; I'll let you know when I know for sure. John Miss T M17 # 372

1 0