June 2010 - montgomery_boats - mailman.xmission.com

Honda 2 hp
by Patti Raymond 11 Jun '10

11 Jun '10

I've been out sailing here in San Diego bay in Dancing Bear my new (for me) M-15 (#151) and I'm wondering how in tar-nation I can get this motor to come all the way out of the water...I have the original motor-mount of course and it seems to me I've seen pictures of these darn things free and clear but for the life-of-me I can't see how... Greg Adams

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Bottom painting on trailer
by Bill Wickett 09 Jun '10

09 Jun '10

Hello all, Can anyone offer any trick or tips on SAFELY bottom painting an M17 while on the trailer? I am thinking of bracing one side at a time and lowering the bunk board brackets. May not be able to get to the bottom of the keel or the CB slot. Thanks, Bill M17 Makin' Time

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Re: M_Boats: Honda 2 hp
by SALGLESSER＠aol.com 09 Jun '10

09 Jun '10

Hi Greg, For us, the solution was a long shaft Honda 2HP and an aftermarket adjustable mount (West Marine). sal M15 - "Justus" - 1986 - #361 M23 - #2 - being built In a message dated 6/8/2010 1:50:57 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, sailmonty15(a)gmail.com writes: Hi Greg; I'll assume you have a short shaft. Before I installed an adjustable motor mount I did a couple of different things. Turn the motor to one side and lock it in the raised position, then put a piece of wood to hold it up. I remember that I had to "bump" the motor against the transom to get the catch to engage. Once the latch was set the motor will drop back down a short distance so why the chunk of wood was needed. One other method would be to add a spacer to the top of the mount. Just tall enough to insure the motor clamps still attach directly to the MM. The other solution that worked better was to mount a wood pad on the back of the original MM that raised the motor up a couple of inches. Hope this helps Don Haas M15-248 On Tue, Jun 8, 2010 at 9:04 AM, Patti Raymond <pattiraymond(a)sbcglobal.net>wrote: > I've been out sailing here in San Diego bay in Dancing Bear my new (for me) > M-15 (#151) and I'm wondering how in tar-nation I can get this motor to come > all the way out of the water...I have the original motor-mount of course and > it seems to me I've seen pictures of these darn things free and clear but > for the life-of-me I can't see how... > > Greg Adams > _______________________________________________ > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! > _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet!

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Backstay tensioner
by Bill Wickett 06 Jun '10

06 Jun '10

Joe, No furler unit yet, but I do like the forestay rigid going to windward. Just yesterday I purchased the parts to tension the back stay with. This is how I plan to set it up. Others may have different ideas, and who knows, maybe I will change it after trying it out. I had a couple of ways to do it. A CS Johnson standard duty split backstay car 39-201 http://mt.csjohnson.com/marinecatalog/00036.htm Clam cleat CL253 or CL230 ( I went with CL230 and the PT Link. The 230 is slightly lower profile than the 253). Both these clam cleats have a roller in them to enable bringing the line in the bottom and turn it back out the top. If you click on this link you will see how it sets up. Gives you a cleat on the line you use to tighten/loosen with. http://www.clamcleat.com/cleats/cleat_details.asp?theid2=49 Small shackle or ring on the stbd backstay chainplate. Line from there up through the center sheave of the backstay car, then tied off to the clam cleat top end. Second line down from the clam cleat to the port backstay chainplate through a small swivel block there and back up through the clam cleat and leading down to tighten. A little less than 2:1 on the first line, cascading onto the 2:1 of the clam cleat line will give almost 4:1 The other way I had looked at was to have a single line, going through swivel blocks at each chainplate, up through the adjuster car. Each end would cleat on a clam cleat or camcleat on transom coamings. The mechanical advantage would not be quite as great and I would have to drill into the coaming for each cleat. My earler way takes away the coaming mounts. Hope it works. I will let you know. Bill M17 Makin' Time On Sun, Jun 6, 2010 at 3:29 PM, Joe Murphy <seagray(a)embarqmail.com> wrote: > Has anyone with a M17 with a CDI furler toyed with installing a backstay > tensioner? I have my backstay tightened down as far as the turnbuckle will > allow but notice that the headstay/furler looks a little limp. To > compensate I tightened up the headstay but now I have very little rake, if > any. I've seen recommended rakes as much a 12". > I'm thinking that a backstay tensisoner might kill two birds with the same > stone..... tighten the forestay and create some rake??? > I'm thinking of using a pincher design using a 4 part purchase to tension a > pair of blocks to ride down the split stays. Has anyone tried this? Are > the attachements at the the deck for the split backstay strong enough to > handle a backstay tensioner? Am I toying with danger that might damage any > of the rest of the rigging?? Any advice is always welcome. > Thanks, > Joe > M17 Seafrog #651 > _______________________________________________ > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >

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Re: M_Boats: Backstay tensioner
by GILASAILR＠aol.com 06 Jun '10

06 Jun '10

Joe, You idea for a backstay tensioner should work just fine. Put the proper rake in the rig with the forestay. then use the backstay tensioner to tighten the backstay forestay, bend mast slightly (flattens mainsail by moving draft forward). The tension on your jib/genoa halyard at the FF furler foil should in my experience be quite tight (used truckers hithes to tension the foil halyard. There will be some sag in the foil so try to get rid of the sag in the sail luff. You will be rewarded with the boat sailing better upwind, the furler working smoothly like it never did before (very easy to furl/unfurl) and you will have the newfound ability to rake the mast forward when sailing downwind as much as the rig will allow. The rig raked forward on a run is beneficial and aids in headsail trim also. I cannot speak to the attachment points on the boat as I am not familiar with the late models - I use a 5:1 cascade (10:1) and I have been known to pull the adjuster on using both arms and one leg! (my fasteners are in shear at the chainplates). Be careful initially and watch the chainplates. Good Luck, Take Care, Have Fun, Go Sail GO In a message dated 6/6/2010 12:29:21 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, seagray(a)embarqmail.com writes: Has anyone with a M17 with a CDI furler toyed with installing a backstay tensioner? I have my backstay tightened down as far as the turnbuckle will allow but notice that the headstay/furler looks a little limp. To compensate I tightened up the headstay but now I have very little rake, if any. I've seen recommended rakes as much a 12". I'm thinking that a backstay tensisoner might kill two birds with the same stone..... tighten the forestay and create some rake??? I'm thinking of using a pincher design using a 4 part purchase to tension a pair of blocks to ride down the split stays. Has anyone tried this? Are the attachements at the the deck for the split backstay strong enough to handle a backstay tensioner? Am I toying with danger that might damage any of the rest of the rigging?? Any advice is always welcome. Thanks, Joe M17 Seafrog #651 _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet!

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Handheld VHF radio, and handheld GPS recommendation
by Bill Day 06 Jun '10

06 Jun '10

I need to replace my VHF radio, and also need to buy a handheld GPS. I'm thinking of a Midland Nautico NT3VP as a radio. I'm also considering a Garmin eTrex Vista HCx GPS. From what I can see on the internet, I can't tell if the GPS unit comes with nautical maps, or if you have to buy them separately. I would appreciate any first hand reports on these two items, or suggestions of something else that would be appropriate for a Montgomery 15. Thanks, Bill Day M-15, 363, "Gee Whiz!"

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Re: M_Boats: Internal Halyards?
by eisenee＠aol.com 05 Jun '10

05 Jun '10

We installed 3/8 internal halyards on Motu iti when we first bought her in 1997. I need the larger dia so I can wrap my old fingers around them.I have slept since then so I don't remember any install problems. The adventages are there are less lines to get tangled or wrapped around something you don't want it wrapped around, and you only have to secure 1 end to keep it from slapping the mast while you are trying to sleep. Eldor M17 Motu iti -----Original Message----- From: Ronnie Keeler <ronkeeler(a)hotmail.com> To: Montgomery boats mailing list <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Sat, Jun 5, 2010 9:17 am Subject: Re: M_Boats: Internal Halyards? riselda, my 1974 M17 origonaly had wire internal halyards with rope tails. I ecently converted to all rope vectra internals of a samller diameter than the ope tails. I used the origonal sheaves in the masthead and ran all the alyards to the housetop. While I was at it, I ran wiring for a masthead ricolor, combo steaming/deck light and VHF antenna coax. It all fit with no roblems or binding. Since the boat had been on the hard for almost 20 years, y biggest challenge was cleaning all the bird and squirrel nest material from he mast tube. Whitebeard Date: Sat, 5 Jun 2010 09:51:56 -0400 From: billwick(a)gmail.com To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: Internal Halyards? Has anyone on the list converted to internal halyards? Pro and cons? Bill On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 5:31 PM, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: > Bill, > Thanks for the info; I think I will try those sheaves. I just eyeballed my > mast, and I think I will use 1/4" line for the jib halyard because I use it > for raising the mast only, and it stays cleated in place. As for the main > halyard, I know that bigger lines are better for grasping, but it does not > seem as if M17 mains require that much force to raise, so I will probably go > for 1/4 there as well. That said, it is hard to believe that the difference > in weight between the two sizes is all that important for a mast that > height, although windage and aesthetics might favor the slimmer. > Thanks again, > Tom Jenkins > > > On Jun 3, 2010, at 11:12 AM, Bill Wickett wrote: > > Tom, >> >> Makin' Time is a 2005 #622. >> >> I looked at opening up the groove in the aluminum sheaves, but they seemed >> a >> bit rough in the bore, so went with new. Wish they could be a larger >> diameter, but that won't work in the mast head casting. >> Regards, >> >> Bill >> On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 12:53 PM, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >> >> Bill, >>> Would you tell us what era of 17 you have? It is probably an issue in >>> sheave size. >>> Thanks, >>> Tom Jenkins >>> M17 Scintilla >>> >>> >>> On Jun 3, 2010, at 9:11 AM, Bill Wickett wrote: >>> >>> Hi Andrei, >>> >>>> >>>> Re: the sheaves for rope halyards. >>>> >>>> I ordered 4 from http://zephyrwerks.com/. Very good service, easy to >>>> deal >>>> with, great quality product. >>>> >>>> I sized them for 8mm (5/16") line. May still go with smaller OD line. We >>>> had >>>> a discussion on the list back in January re weight aloft. >>>> >>>> 1.25" x .375" x .25" for 8mm line. I used my existing pins. Fit is very >>>> good. Less play than the original aluminum sheaves that the wire ran in. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> Bill >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 11:18 AM, Andrei Caldararu < >>>> andreic(a)math.wisc.edu >>>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>> >>>> Hi fellow Monty sailors, >>>> >>>>> >>>>> I need to attach two cam cleats on the mast of my M-17 for the >>>>> halyards. >>>>> It >>>>> is an arrangement I had on a previous Compac 16 and I liked it a lot -- >>>>> it >>>>> consists of two integrated block+cam cleat attached to the mast, and to >>>>> raise the sail you just pull on the halyard, no need to cleat it off, >>>>> the >>>>> cam holds it there. >>>>> >>>>> In any case, my question is what do people use to attach stuff to the >>>>> mast; >>>>> I have heard of stainless steel screws+loctite+some compound (don't >>>>> remember >>>>> the name) to prevent corrosion; or aluminum rivets. Are the rivets >>>>> holding >>>>> up as well as the screws? They sound easier to put in than screws, no >>>>> corrosion issues, etc., but I am worried about their holding strength. >>>>> >>>>> A second question is related to the sheaves at the top of the mast. At >>>>> the >>>>> moment I have wire-to-rope halyards, but I am going to install new >>>>> all-rope >>>>> halyards. Do I need to replace the sheaves with ones with a more >>>>> rounded >>>>> groove? Where does one buy new ones if I do need to replace them? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks for all opinions. >>>>> >>>>> Andrei. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >>>>> >>>>> Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>>> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >>>> >>>> Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >>> >>> Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >> >> Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >> > > > _______________________________________________ > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! > _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! ________________________________________________________________ otmail is redefining busy with tools for the New Busy. Get more from your nbox. ttp://www.windowslive.com/campaign/thenewbusy?ocid=PID28326::T:WLMTAGL:ON:W… ______________________________________________ ttp://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet!

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Re: M_Boats: Handheld VHF radio, and handheld GPS recommendation
by ndorf＠surfbest.net 05 Jun '10

05 Jun '10

I wanted a handheld VHF that floats. Icom makes some (like the M34) as does Standard Horizon. I chose the Standard Horizon HX750 for the price and the fact that it floats "on it's back" so you can see more of it while it's floating, vs the Icom which floats upside down (antenna facing down). The SH also comes with both an AC and a car power adapter which I like. I think tx power ratings are probably close. Both xlnt radios I've heard. the HX850 family models have integrated GPS recieverso that in a distress situation they will xmit the coordinates for you. My GPS is a handheld Garmin GPSMAP 76s (black & white screen. I found it new on eBay for less than $100. It has simple maps embedded with some navaids. It is the last of the models that have selectable downloadable maps instead of the memory card approach. It's OK, but goes through batteries quickly so spares are necessary for longer trips. I bought the very last edition of the BlueChart maps on CD; Garmin discontinued support for them. No substitue for paper charts, to be sure. I carry both. Neil The Garmin Oregon 400c also looks nice but it feels a little chunck in the hand.

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Internal Halyards?
by Bill Wickett 05 Jun '10

05 Jun '10

Has anyone on the list converted to internal halyards? Pro and cons? Bill On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 5:31 PM, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: > Bill, > Thanks for the info; I think I will try those sheaves. I just eyeballed my > mast, and I think I will use 1/4" line for the jib halyard because I use it > for raising the mast only, and it stays cleated in place. As for the main > halyard, I know that bigger lines are better for grasping, but it does not > seem as if M17 mains require that much force to raise, so I will probably go > for 1/4 there as well. That said, it is hard to believe that the difference > in weight between the two sizes is all that important for a mast that > height, although windage and aesthetics might favor the slimmer. > Thanks again, > Tom Jenkins > > > On Jun 3, 2010, at 11:12 AM, Bill Wickett wrote: > > Tom, >> >> Makin' Time is a 2005 #622. >> >> I looked at opening up the groove in the aluminum sheaves, but they seemed >> a >> bit rough in the bore, so went with new. Wish they could be a larger >> diameter, but that won't work in the mast head casting. >> Regards, >> >> Bill >> On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 12:53 PM, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >> >> Bill, >>> Would you tell us what era of 17 you have? It is probably an issue in >>> sheave size. >>> Thanks, >>> Tom Jenkins >>> M17 Scintilla >>> >>> >>> On Jun 3, 2010, at 9:11 AM, Bill Wickett wrote: >>> >>> Hi Andrei, >>> >>>> >>>> Re: the sheaves for rope halyards. >>>> >>>> I ordered 4 from http://zephyrwerks.com/. Very good service, easy to >>>> deal >>>> with, great quality product. >>>> >>>> I sized them for 8mm (5/16") line. May still go with smaller OD line. We >>>> had >>>> a discussion on the list back in January re weight aloft. >>>> >>>> 1.25" x .375" x .25" for 8mm line. I used my existing pins. Fit is very >>>> good. Less play than the original aluminum sheaves that the wire ran in. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> Bill >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Jun 3, 2010 at 11:18 AM, Andrei Caldararu < >>>> andreic(a)math.wisc.edu >>>> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>> >>>> Hi fellow Monty sailors, >>>> >>>>> >>>>> I need to attach two cam cleats on the mast of my M-17 for the >>>>> halyards. >>>>> It >>>>> is an arrangement I had on a previous Compac 16 and I liked it a lot -- >>>>> it >>>>> consists of two integrated block+cam cleat attached to the mast, and to >>>>> raise the sail you just pull on the halyard, no need to cleat it off, >>>>> the >>>>> cam holds it there. >>>>> >>>>> In any case, my question is what do people use to attach stuff to the >>>>> mast; >>>>> I have heard of stainless steel screws+loctite+some compound (don't >>>>> remember >>>>> the name) to prevent corrosion; or aluminum rivets. Are the rivets >>>>> holding >>>>> up as well as the screws? They sound easier to put in than screws, no >>>>> corrosion issues, etc., but I am worried about their holding strength. >>>>> >>>>> A second question is related to the sheaves at the top of the mast. At >>>>> the >>>>> moment I have wire-to-rope halyards, but I am going to install new >>>>> all-rope >>>>> halyards. Do I need to replace the sheaves with ones with a more >>>>> rounded >>>>> groove? Where does one buy new ones if I do need to replace them? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks for all opinions. >>>>> >>>>> Andrei. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >>>>> >>>>> Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> >>>> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >>>> >>>> Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >>>> >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >>> >>> Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >> >> Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >> > > > _______________________________________________ > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >

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How to mount stuff on mast
by Andrei Caldararu 03 Jun '10

03 Jun '10

Hi fellow Monty sailors, I need to attach two cam cleats on the mast of my M-17 for the halyards. It is an arrangement I had on a previous Compac 16 and I liked it a lot -- it consists of two integrated block+cam cleat attached to the mast, and to raise the sail you just pull on the halyard, no need to cleat it off, the cam holds it there. In any case, my question is what do people use to attach stuff to the mast; I have heard of stainless steel screws+loctite+some compound (don't remember the name) to prevent corrosion; or aluminum rivets. Are the rivets holding up as well as the screws? They sound easier to put in than screws, no corrosion issues, etc., but I am worried about their holding strength. A second question is related to the sheaves at the top of the mast. At the moment I have wire-to-rope halyards, but I am going to install new all-rope halyards. Do I need to replace the sheaves with ones with a more rounded groove? Where does one buy new ones if I do need to replace them? Thanks for all opinions. Andrei.

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