December 2012 - Utah-Astronomy - mailman.xmission.com

Re: [Utah-astronomy] Voyager 1 new discovery.
by Joe Bauman 10 Dec '12

10 Dec '12

Don, these are really valuable insights into the space program and they're fascinating. I don't want to push you into speaking if you don't want to but I think you could come io with a great lecture. It would be cool to tie your work with space exploration to your astrophoyography hobby, especially with pics of your equipment and your space images. Congratulations on your impressive accomplishments. -- Joe ------------------------------ On Thu, Dec 6, 2012 9:09 AM MST Don J. Colton wrote: >Hi Patrick and Joe, > >I doubt anyone's finger prints are on the amplifiers since they were >assembled in "clean rooms". I do have my name on a microchip on Mars since >I also worked on the Viking Lander Mission as a negotiator for a change >order. Watkins-Johnson also built the amplifiers for the Viking Lander. I >can't remember whether they had a microchip with the participants names on >the Voyagers. If they did, they probably would have asked for signatures >after I left the program. > >Since I was a Deputy Program Manager for only a few months before being >promoted to Head, Export - I don't have much to tell. What I do remember is >we had a large flow chart on the wall and I would every few days check on >each item and get a status report. We also had to subject the amplifiers >(not the ones for the mission but duplicates) to all kinds of tests >including vibration, radiation etc. They also required that many of the >components were "potted" in a plastic type compound to hold them immobile. >JPL, who was the lead for NASA, had a permanent employee on site for the >duration of the project. He was the "nitpicker of all nitpickers" and keep >thinking of some new kind of worst case scenario. Our project (the >amplifiers), which was cost plus, was originally budgeted for $3,000,000 but >ended up costing $8,000,000 not because of any padding but because of all >the additional testing JPL demanded. They considered the amplifiers as one >of the critical components. Also, I would go around almost daily and >question charges made by those working on the project. My boss, the Program >Manager, was a very honest man and did not want anyone charging for time >they did not actually spend on the mission. > >In the early days of NASA the extreme care put into each program resulted in >many successes. After the retirement of some of these "nitpickers", things >got a little sloppy for a while due to new people and budget constraints. >Hence, the Hubble Problem and one the Mar's projects fiascos where the >computer programmer had mixed up metric and English units. JPL in the 1970's >would have checked the Hubble mirror's figure 10 different ways and not >relied on one flawed test. That I can guarantee, having worked with those >people. > >Clear Skies, > >Don > >-----Original Message----- >From: utah-astronomy-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com >[mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Joe Bauman >Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2012 12:20 AM >To: Utah Astronomy >Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Voyager 1 new discovery. > >Don, I second that idea, especially if you could work in photos of your >Voyager efforts as well as your stunning astrophotography. -- Joe > > > > >________________________________ > From: Wiggins Patrick <paw(a)wirelessbeehive.com> >To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com> >Sent: Wednesday, December 5, 2012 12:15 AM >Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Voyager 1 new discovery. > >On 04 Dec 2012, at 09:34, Don J. Colton wrote: > >> As Deputy Program Manager for the radio amplifier portion of the >> Voyager spacecrafts, I saw firsthand how exacting NASA was in those >> days. The Traveling Wave Tube (TWT) amplifiers we used were subjected >> to every conceivable test and they are still working today! For more >> on TWT's see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traveling-wave_tube. > >Hi Don, > >Very impressive that you actually worked on the mission. > >Does this mean your fingerprints are now traveling in space? :) > >I would like to hear more about your experiences working on Voyager. Would >you be interested in talking about them at a SLAS meeting? > >If so maybe Rodger could get you scheduled. > >patrick >_______________________________________________ >Utah-Astronomy mailing list >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > >Send messages to the list to >Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > >The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. > >To unsubscribe go to: >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy >Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on >"Unsubscribe or edit options". >_______________________________________________ >Utah-Astronomy mailing list >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > >Send messages to the list to >Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > >The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. > >To unsubscribe go to: >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy >Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on >"Unsubscribe or edit options". > > >_______________________________________________ >Utah-Astronomy mailing list >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > >Send messages to the list to >Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > >The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. > >To unsubscribe go to: >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy >Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".

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End of the World Star Party
by Michael Wells 10 Dec '12

10 Dec '12

HI, I'd like a few more details on this. I'm still new to my telescope, and not yet proficient enough to confidently say that I can find anything but the moon after setting it up and have people counting on me. :-) How do the star parties work? Do people set up their scopes and someone organizes what objects to observe, or does it all rely on the scope's owner? I would really like to participate as something more than just an observer, but I also don't want to be the person who is constantly having to tell everyone 'Just a sec, a-l-m-o-s-t there...', if everyone understands what I mean. If we're all kind of on our own, then I would greatly appreciate anyone who could help me out. I also understand if an event like this really isn't the time to be taking someone else's time to ask for a lot of help. Eventually I'll be confident enough to say that I can handle this on my own, but it's my first scope and I'm just starting to learn. No matter the outcome, I will definitely be there with my family, and I am really looking forward to the ed of the world. Thanks guys. Mike Wells

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Weird??!!
by Ray Druian 10 Dec '12

10 Dec '12

One day last week, I think Wednesday, a member of this august list published a note to the effect that Woot.com had Celestron Planetarium thingies for a very attractive price. I went ahead and ordered one. Having purchased from them before, I knew that it would take about two weeks and that it would arrive in a carton with tape around it that says "Woot." On Friday a package arrived from Amazon. Since I had a birthday right around then, I figured that it was a gift from my brother. Wrong! It was my Celestron Planetarium thingie, and it arrived two days after I ordered it, and not from the folks from whom I ordered it. I think this is absolute proof that the world is indeed about to end. -- Thanx, *Ray *

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] OT, metrics -- was Re: Patrick scores again!
by Michael Wells 09 Dec '12

09 Dec '12

Pure and simple, metrics is a scientific system of measurement, it's not some kind of dirty trick. There is no reason to use SAE except for the stubborn American factor. -------- Original message -------- From: Joe Bauman <josephmbauman(a)yahoo.com> Date: To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: [Utah-astronomy] OT, metrics -- was Re: Patrick scores again! Yes, of course Patrick is right, I was joking about not knowing what the metric system is; I can even convert metric figures into our own system, usually. But it's time for metric-centrics to realize that they lost that battle long ago. And they lost with good reason, in that it's not native to our country and nobody should try to foist a foreign system onto us. If the rest of the world does it differently, so what? I haven't seen any big loss to our economy because of it. If it's easier to figure out volume using metric, again, so what? I'll happily use fluid ounces instead of mm. My point is, this is a little like the rotten attempts at Indian schools -- which children from reservations were forced to attend -- to make students speak English, which included punishing them for using their own languages. The argument undoubtedly was made that the children couldn't succeed in America if they didn't understand English. It was still a cruel practice and has been pretty much universally contemned. Well, there's not even that argument to be made for metric: we do very well, thank you, without using it.Thanks for letting me blow off steam -- Joe PS: That is a great picture of Pahvant Butte and a fine write-up. I've hiked inside it, and I remember the remains of some huge windmill are there. _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] End of the World Star Party
by Michael Wells 09 Dec '12

09 Dec '12

Sweet, thanks guys. I've been wanting a closer look at Jupiter, since it's been so prominent lately. I'll see everyone then, weather permitting. -------- Original message -------- From: Wiggins Patrick <paw(a)wirelessbeehive.com> Date: To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] End of the World Star Party On 09 Dec 2012, at 19:09, Michael Wells wrote: > HI, I'd like a few more details on this. I'm still new to my telescope, and > not yet proficient enough to confidently say that I can find anything but > the moon after setting it up and have people counting on me. :-) As a followup to what Rodger just said, this month's star party will feature the Moon early in the evening and Jupiter the whole time. So no need to worry about finding things. The public loves the Moon and they like Jupiter too. patrick _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Send messages to the list to Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. To unsubscribe go to: http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".

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comic
by D P Pierce 09 Dec '12

09 Dec '12

http://www.gocomics.com/ziggy Deloy

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] Utah-Astronomy Digest, Vol 118, Issue 19 RE: Americanized System
by Joe Bauman 09 Dec '12

09 Dec '12

Well, I said I wouldn't comment again but cannot keep my mouth shut. I am aware of two -liter soft drink bottles and altimeters with metric units. But do you really think we will ever make the change where it's most important for most Americans, distance measurmunts? I just doubt it. ------------------------------ On Sun, Dec 9, 2012 8:06 AM MST John R. Peterson wrote: >Thanks you, Michael, for the concise summary. I'd like to add to that by saying, the process of conversion is already well in in place here in the World's biggest economy (the real recent that it's taking so long). The last time I looked, almost EVERY item in the grocery store has its label showing its weight or volume in both English (lbs or oz, pts. or fl. oz., for example) and metric (grams, although g and kg are each actually mass and not weight) and mL or cc. By the way, most people can get a handle on grams and kilograms being mass and newtons being weight, but we tend to use only pounds, a unit of weight in the English system. The English unit of mass is the slug, which someone did mention without explanation a few messages back. >John R. Peterson > > >> >>Message: 2 >>Date: Sun, 9 Dec 2012 00:33:57 -0700 >>From: Michael Wells <eyeonyouproductions(a)gmail.com> >>To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] OT, metrics -- was Re: Patrick scores >> again! >>Message-ID: >> <CADxGsn7N6hUYSZOrY676wfJ5ygSZXCAfUROE8khigCxCM6VV+g(a)mail.gmail.com> >>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 >> >>Yes I can, because there was a plan in place to do it gradually, not like >>there was a switch that they were going to throw overnight. People were >>just being stubborn. I heard as a child adults all over the place talking >>exactly like you are now. They weren't going to change not because it was >>hard, or that we already had a system in place, but because they were not >>going to let anyone "tell" them what to do. This wasn't a foreign >>government or the UN forcing us, this was our government trying to drag us >>closer to the 21st century, and we held our threatened to hold our breath >>until we turned blue. >> >>The SAE system is obsolete, exactly like the 8-Track, the cassette tape, >>the wax cylinder, the Victrola, the floppy disk and the VHS tape(Won't say >>video tape because it is still a valid storage format). >> >>As for an example of how it is beneficial, I will once again go back to >>cooking as an example, because it's an easy one. It shows up all of the >>time, and everyone encounters it. Recipes constantly call for 1/2 cup of >>one ingredient, 2 ounces of another, a pint of something else, maybe a >>gallon of another. You end up all over the place, trying to figure out what >>is what. Also, when a recipe calls for 2 cups of something, 90% of the >>people don't know that that is a pint, 2 pints in a quart, and 4 quarts in >>a gallon. If they've only got measuring cups, that gallon gets pretty >>tedious and requires a trip to the internet, and a bunch of math. Put it in >>the metric system, and you have a liter as your standard for liquid >>measure. 1 deciliter is a tenth of that, a centiliter one hundredth of it. >>10 liters is a decaliter, and 1000 liters is a kiloliter. >> >>Here's the wonderful SAE system for length: >>The base unit is the inch >>12 inches in a foot(Anything smaller has to be fractions of an inch) >>3 feet in a yard >>5,280 feet in a mile >>How many inches in a mile, without using a calculator, writing it down, or >>doing the math in your head? >> >>Now the metric system, a nice beautiful base-10 system with all of the same >>prefixes whether you are measuring volume, distance or weight. >>The base unit is the meter. >>1/100th of that is a centimeter >>1,000 meters in a kilometer >>So, same rules, how many centimeters in a kilometer? >>100,000, it's that easy. >> >>SAE for volume: >>Base unit is an ounce(Anything smaller is fractions of an ounce) >>4 ounces is a cup >>4 cups in a pint >>2 pints in a quart >>4 quarts in a gallon >>Same rules, how many ounces in a gallon? >> >>Metric: >>Base unit is the liter >>1/100th of that is the centiliter >>1000 liters is a kiloliter >>How many centiliters in a kiloliter? >>100,000 >> >>To sum this up, there is no rhyme nor reason to the SAE system. The metric >>system is base 10, uses the same prefix, no matter the medium being >>measured, and can go infinitesimally small or extremely large, and all >>anyone has to know is where the particular latin prefix falls on the scale. >> >>Yes, it's people being stubborn, and it should have happend years ago. It's >>ludicrous to still use the SAE system when it actually makes no sense >>whatsoever. Teaching would be streamlined, and work would be improved. >>Hell, even when I worked graphic design, we had to print up conversion >>charts between fractions and decimal equivalents, because 1/64th gets >>pretty hard to figure out in your head. Doing t all decimally would >>eliminate that. >> >> >>On Sat, Dec 8, 2012 at 11:37 PM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman(a)yahoo.com> wrote: >> >> Michael, you can't say people not wanting to change miles to kilometers, >> feet to meters, inches to centimeters, etc., is equivalent to your stepsons >> refusing to do something just to be contrary. And are you saying we should >> get in trouble when we stick to our native measurements? Peer pressure from >> people who don't know what they're takig about -- I don't understand that >> comment. Please give me a specific example. So here's a challenge: show how >> the life of an ordinary person -- not a doctor working in nuclear medicine >> -- would improve if he were forced to switch to a metric system. Would the >> difficulty be worth any advantage to him? I can easily see the trouble of >> trying to learn new units, but I certainly don't see any advantage for an >> ordinary person forced to change. Who's being contrary -- the people who >> prefer the system they grew up with, or the people who are trying to force >> difficult, non-beneficial changes on them? Thanks, Joe >> >> >> >> > >_______________________________________________ >Utah-Astronomy mailing list >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > >Send messages to the list to >Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > >The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. > >To unsubscribe go to: >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy >Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".

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Comics
by D P Pierce 09 Dec '12

09 Dec '12

http://www.gocomics.com/brewsterrockit Deloy

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] Patrick scores again!
by Joe Bauman 09 Dec '12

09 Dec '12

Oh Patrick, I don't think we're being very awful with this one .... ------------------------------ On Sun, Dec 9, 2012 4:24 PM MST Kim Hyatt wrote: >When the Intelligent Designer created the universe 6,000 years ago, He (not >She or It) did so using English units and made sure that the climate would >remain unchangeable until the world ends - in 12 days. > >You lose, Patrick. > >Kim > >Patrick wrote [clipped]: > >At any rate, I guess there are now three things we need to shy away from on >Utah-Astronomy. > >1: Climate change >2: Creationism >3) Units of measure > > > >_______________________________________________ >Utah-Astronomy mailing list >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > >Send messages to the list to >Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > >The Utah-Astronomy mailing list is not affiliated with any astronomy club. > >To unsubscribe go to: >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy >Then enter your email address in the space provided and click on "Unsubscribe or edit options".

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galaxies in the mist
by Gary Vardon 09 Dec '12

09 Dec '12

Try looking at astronomy photographs for galaxies that can be seen in background. The famous Hubble photograph of deep space is an example of doing this. Doing this makes one appreciate the infinite size of the universe. Sincerely, Gary Vardon The book DO It Right will help you understand vital ideas leading to your greater success. GO to PublishAmerica.com Consulting For Profit is also available. Learn how to make money as a consultant. Jokes? is a wild and witty look at the world and the mbook Marketing can show you how to make good money selling goods and services. All books are available at PublishAmerica.com

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