February 2003 - Utah-Astronomy - mailman.xmission.com

Challenge Doubles
by UTAHDEB＠aol.com 04 Feb '03

04 Feb '03

Has anybody had success splitting these doubles?: Lambda Oph 52 Orionis 32 Orionis 36 Andromedae Zeta Bootis Lambda Cygni If so let me know the magnification and aperature. Thanks, Debbie

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RE: [Utah-astronomy] Eyepiece seminar
by stargaze＠attbi.com 04 Feb '03

04 Feb '03

Lippy: Good to see you are a part of this group. I am proud to let you know that the 12.5 inch f8 mirror I made in Brent's class turned out really well. I had it out at the Saturn party a few weeks ago for the first unveiling, other than my back yard, and it was producing some good images. I'd love to get together with you, Dave, Larry and others that put up with all my moaning while we were grinding and polishing and look through your scopes. Maybe we could have a Brent Watson influenced homemade mirrors and telescopes reunion starparty. Steve Nielsen, 73, KD7 CQJ

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] Re: White flare
by stargaze＠attbi.com 03 Feb '03

03 Feb '03

Patrick, Brent, Jim, Larry and anyone else that went down: I have been asked by a number of people how big the re entry appeared and I am having a hard time describing it. I wish I would have thought to hold something up to have a comparison. Would you say it was about the size of a dime held out at arms length, or am I being to optimistic. My daughter that went down with me said that I could compare it to an airplane flying at 35,000 feet surrounded by all the colors. Any better size comparisons? Thanks, Steve Nielsen

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Re: [Utah-astronomy] test - delete
by Josephine Grahn 03 Feb '03

03 Feb '03

Dear sir or madam: I'm sorry to inform you that you have flunked. This is a non-negotiable grade. There will be no make-up. You may not take the test again. We wish you every success in your future endeavours. At 04:02 PM 2/3/2003 -0700, you wrote: >01 10 11 > > >_______________________________________________ >Utah-Astronomy mailing list >Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com >http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > >

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test - delete
by David L Bennett 03 Feb '03

03 Feb '03

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NASA servers not responding
by Chuck Hards 03 Feb '03

03 Feb '03

I haven't been able to access any pages from NASA today. Their servers must be smoking by now. C. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com

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RE: [Utah-astronomy] Shuttle - our experience
by Wayne Reese 03 Feb '03

03 Feb '03

I can see what appears to be something on my east most shots, does anyone know how to ask NASA if they want these? Wayne -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-admin(a)mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-admin@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Jim Gibson Sent: Saturday, February 01, 2003 2:31 PM To: utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Shuttle - our expierence I would like Patrick to respond first but he must be tied up right now. My expierence was as follows. I met Patrick and others at exit 23 outside of St. George about 6:00 AM along with my wife and 4 year old grandson. We went to a good observation point and Patrick and I set up our cameras. There were about 10 others inour group there. Patrick set his up with a telephoto (film) and he suggested that I set mine up wide angle (digital). Patrick kept us informed when to watch for the shuttle. The Shuttle approached where and when he said it would to the West or North West about 7:56 (+ or - a minute). My camera was set at f2.8 open for 8 seconds. I took my first shot. The thing was beautiful, straight as an arrow, obviously high, and moving fast, and way faster than any jet airline I had ever seen. The Shuttle glowed with an indescribable orange glow. By the time the first shot ended I could tell the Shuttle was on top of me so I shot straight up. I touched off the camera the looked up just in time to see a noticeable increase in glow, not only in brightness but also in width of the contrail. Later, Patrick referred to the event as a flare. The shot ended and I had to turn the camera 180 degrees, pointed towards the eastern horizon and shot off another picture. The whole time my wife was using my Galileo binoculars 15X70s. Sheila, my wife, saw the bottom of the space shuttle with 15x Binos at approximately 300,000 feet and could see swirls of flames or balls of heat coming from off the tiles. She would compare it to when someone sucks on a cigarette the end glows and there are sparklies and it keeps getting brighter as they suck. While she was watching, she said, "I see flames." We understand that this was our first experience observing the re-entry; we are inexperienced and were unalarmed at the site. Sheila wants to be cautious because they weren't like licking flames, just a growing brighter glow like a cigarette. We don't know if what we saw was normal. She could not see the individual tiles but she could see a lot of dynamic activity or movement on the bottom (don't blow this out of proportion, maybe normal). She noticed this at about the 10 o'clock position to the 12 o'clock position relative to our location. She didn't see anything fall or any debris. She did NOT notice the flair per se that I photographed. Jim Gibson _____ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! <http://rd.yahoo.com/mail/mailsig/*http:/mailplus.yahoo.com> Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now <http://rd.yahoo.com/mail/mailsig/*http:/mailplus.yahoo.com>

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RE: [Utah-astronomy] White flare
by David Dunn 03 Feb '03

03 Feb '03

I don't think you are missing anything. I was looking at the picture and the description at not being the same. I think part of the problem was that visually the part that came off streaked the opposite direction as the shuttle was going. This was only because it slowed down so quickly. I think that I was looking at the picture wrong. Dave -----Original Message----- From: Brent Watson [mailto:brentjwatson@yahoo.com] Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 2:25 PM To: utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: RE: [Utah-astronomy] White flare Dave and Jim, We were south of the ground track, and Jim was north. This will give a perspective change. I have no problem resolving the two reports. What am I mossing? Brent --- Jim Gibson <xajax99(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > Dave > > Patrick Wiggins, Steve Nielsen, myself and others, > who's names I can't recall at the moment, all > witnessed a puff, or flair with the unaided eye from > almost directly under the orbiter. If an object were > at a lower altitude than the orbiter, it would > appear to us as being on the same level as the > orbiter. Considering where you were located south of > St. George, and if an object were at a lower > altitude the observed object may appear to be on the > left side of the orbiter as viewed from your > location even though the object may have drifted to > the right. From the distances we are talking about > it would be difficult to say where the object was > from one position. > > I believe what you saw was at a lower altitude > thereby making it appear to the left. What do you > think? > > Jim > > > David Dunn <david.dunn(a)albertsons.com> wrote: > Jim, In the picture that you are describing, it > looks like the shuttle is still coming towards us. > Would this mean that the long streak is going down > the right side of the shuttle? The reason I ask is > that I saw several of these visually with my > binoculars and they all appears to be on the left > side when it was coming towards me and on the right > side when it was going away. Dave-----Original > Message----- > From: Jim Gibson [mailto:xajax99@yahoo.com] > Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 3:17 PM > To: utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] White flare > > > Patrick > Would you mind adding the enlarged photo to your web > so otheres can see what we are talking about? > I have studied the photo for a while. Keeping in > mind that my shutter was open for 8 seconds, that > would correspond to the bright pink contrail. The > gray contrail before that would have occured before > the shutter was opened. I would intrupret the first > jiggle in the pink contrail as my hand touching off > photo. Then I see the the pink contrail stabalizing > of a short time indicated by its straightness. Then > I see a new bright pink line appear on the right > side of the photo corresponding to the shuttles left > side and immediately crossing over to the opposite > side. The original contrail remains relatively > stable while the new trail is pronounsly serpintine. > That to me says that the camera was not jiggling > because original contrail remains straight. > I would ask for insight form all who wish to express > it. I am most intrested in an accurate > interpretation of the photo, and Patrick, yours my > well be the correct one. What do otheres think. If > it's nothing, its nothing. > I had thought that the second pink line might be a > blast form the course adjustment rocket, but on > closer inspection I don't think we could see blue > sky between the two contrails if it were and the > shuttles course was not altered that I could tell. > Jim > > > Patrick Wiggins <paw(a)trilobyte.net> wrote: As with > my answer to your other post, I invite others to > correct me if > necessary, but I'm pretty sure the multiple tracks > and "flares" in your image > were caused by the camera being moved while the > shuttle was open. > > Patrick > > Jim Gibson wrote: > > > > Attached is the enlarged section of the flair-out. > I think the first giggle > > is me touching off the camera. The contrail Then > stabilizes. Subsequently a > > flair-out begins on the right side and moves > immideatly to the left side of > > the contrail. I read your post about the timing of > the event that may coincide > > with the heating of the tires. I can not discount > the possibility of a jet > > blast corresponding to a course correction. Of > course, I am no expert in these > > things.t > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy

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RE: [Utah-astronomy] White flare
by Brent Watson 03 Feb '03

03 Feb '03

Dave and Jim, We were south of the ground track, and Jim was north. This will give a perspective change. I have no problem resolving the two reports. What am I mossing? Brent --- Jim Gibson <xajax99(a)yahoo.com> wrote: > > Dave > > Patrick Wiggins, Steve Nielsen, myself and others, > whos names I cant recall at the moment, all > witnessed a puff, or flair with the unaided eye from > almost directly under the orbiter. If an object were > at a lower altitude than the orbiter, it would > appear to us as being on the same level as the > orbiter. Considering where you were located south of > St. George, and if an object were at a lower > altitude the observed object may appear to be on the > left side of the orbiter as viewed from your > location even though the object may have drifted to > the right. From the distances we are talking about > it would be difficult to say where the object was > from one position. > > I believe what you saw was at a lower altitude > thereby making it appear to the left. What do you > think? > > Jim > > > David Dunn <david.dunn(a)albertsons.com> wrote: > Jim, In the picture that you are describing, it > looks like the shuttle is still coming towards us. > Would this mean that the long streak is going down > the right side of the shuttle? The reason I ask is > that I saw several of these visually with my > binoculars and they all appears to be on the left > side when it was coming towards me and on the right > side when it was going away. Dave-----Original > Message----- > From: Jim Gibson [mailto:xajax99@yahoo.com] > Sent: Sunday, February 02, 2003 3:17 PM > To: utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] White flare > > > Patrick > Would you mind adding the enlarged photo to your web > so otheres can see what we are talking about? > I have studied the photo for a while. Keeping in > mind that my shutter was open for 8 seconds, that > would correspond to the bright pink contrail. The > gray contrail before that would have occured before > the shutter was opened. I would intrupret the first > jiggle in the pink contrail as my hand touching off > photo. Then I see the the pink contrail stabalizing > of a short time indicated by its straightness. Then > I see a new bright pink line appear on the right > side of the photo corresponding to the shuttles left > side and immediately crossing over to the opposite > side. The original contrail remains relatively > stable while the new trail is pronounsly serpintine. > That to me says that the camera was not jiggling > because original contrail remains straight. > I would ask for insight form all who wish to express > it. I am most intrested in an accurate > interpretation of the photo, and Patrick, yours my > well be the correct one. What do otheres think. If > it's nothing, its nothing. > I had thought that the second pink line might be a > blast form the course adjustment rocket, but on > closer inspection I don't think we could see blue > sky between the two contrails if it were and the > shuttles course was not altered that I could tell. > Jim > > > Patrick Wiggins <paw(a)trilobyte.net> wrote: As with > my answer to your other post, I invite others to > correct me if > necessary, but I'm pretty sure the multiple tracks > and "flares" in your image > were caused by the camera being moved while the > shuttle was open. > > Patrick > > Jim Gibson wrote: > > > > Attached is the enlarged section of the flair-out. > I think the first giggle > > is me touching off the camera. The contrail Then > stabilizes. Subsequently a > > flair-out begins on the right side and moves > immideatly to the left side of > > the contrail. I read your post about the timing of > the event that may coincide > > with the heating of the tires. I can not discount > the possibility of a jet > > blast corresponding to a course correction. Of > course, I am no expert in these > > things.t > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now > > > --------------------------------- > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com

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RE: [Utah-astronomy] Dave's & Brent's tests
by David Dunn 03 Feb '03

03 Feb '03

I agree that more sessions would be beneficial. My conclusions change frequently as I am always being taught new things. I guess the thing that I was taught on Friday night was to look at the planet both ways and to see if I can see any improvement by using the filter. I think that to get everything out of it I may have to study the planet using both techniques. Hopefully we can have many more observing sessions where we can exchange ideas and techniques. -----Original Message----- From: Chuck Hards [mailto:chuckhards@yahoo.com] Sent: Monday, February 03, 2003 12:29 PM To: utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Dave's & Brent's tests Sorry I can't recall the name of this thread, but I've had to do a lot of deleting today to keep my mailbox from filling up, inevitably wiped a few that I wanted to respond-to in depth. Anyway.... C'mon, guys, you're drawing a conclusion from one outing, with one filter? I have used a blue filter many times to increase the visibility of festoons at the edge of the equatorial belts. These are tiny details that you won't see at low powers and probably won't see through even thin cloud and less than perfect seeing. I'm not talking about the largish shear features, resembling "fingers" that most commonly are seen, but small, delicate wisps at the edge of resolution. I think when Mars comes into opposition you will have more dramitic opportunities to experience the advantages of filters. Your and Brent's descriptions tell me that you're not looking for details that a filter can actually help bring-out. You're still expecting an "Ah-ha" experience....this is more subtle than that. C. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy

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