- montgomery_boats - mailman.xmission.com

Yard work
by Thomas Buzzi 21 Apr '14

21 Apr '14

Back in 1967 I had a "dream job" working in Old Saybrook, Conn. at the "Saybrook Marine Service Boat Yard". We were situated just off the Long Island Sound on the Connecticut River. When I started I worked with the yard gang pulling boats on the travel life or the marine railway and blocking them for winter storage. We always blocked the keel first and then shored up the sides with proper cross bracing. One of the fellows was very experienced and we had to add several stations of bracing on the older wooden hulls so they would not "take a sag" during the winter months. Eventually I started repairing the boats themselves. We had a lot of "old timers" made of wood and I learned how to spile planking and replace garboards as well as caulk with caulking irons and mallet. Deck and rigging work followed. My boss was a ship's carpenter and he taught me how to care for my tools and keep sharp edges on them.He was a pleasure to watch work and could use a spoke shave like Perlman uses a violin bow. Beautiful. One room stored the oakum and I used to like going in there. Being a "sea struck" young lad (Sterling Hayden's term) the smell of oakum really brought me back to the days of "wooden ships and iron men". My stay there lasted a year than curiosity about life's next chapter drew me away. I am thankful for such a rich experience early on. Tom B Mont. 17 #258, 77'

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Re: M_Boats: strength for compression posts
by Leonard 20 Apr '14

20 Apr '14

Robbin I have a 23 and the compression post is original. Just wondering what happened to make you turn into a nautical engineer? Lol. Lenny Smith On Apr 19, 2014, at 11:19 AM, Thomas Buzzi <thomaspbuzzi(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Robbin, > I had a civil engineer run some numbers for me on just that issue. What IS > the compression load likely on, in my case with an M17, a sailboat with > about 200 sq feet of sail up in, say, 25 knots of wind. It came out to > about 1000 pounds. I also found out that a 4x4, yellow pine, #1 grade post, > eight feet long with no side bracing will handle the compression load of > about 6000 pounds. So a shorter post and one with side bracing such as a > bulkhead will handle considerably more. Then too if you choose oak, the > numbers would go even higher. > Fair winds, > Tom B > > > > On Sat, Apr 19, 2014 at 10:54 AM, Robbin Roddewig < > robbin.roddewig(a)verizon.net> wrote: > >> Hi M-list, >> I am trying to figure out a design for a compression post for my M-23. I >> have a stainless steel plate being fabricated by emachineshop that will >> transfer the load from the tabernacle and solid core deck to the three >> boards that are on the end of my bulkhead in the M-23. I am going to open >> the floor liner and set the boards on solid hull/keel with a glassed in >> block of oak at the base. I have some questions. >> 1.) What is the load from the mast that I need to make sure the >> compression post will carry? >> 2.) How to calculate the tensile strength (compression load) limit of the >> three boards (they will be epoxied together and form a U shape). I am >> assuming cross sectional area. And I will put in the factor for laminated >> boards. >> >> >> Any help would be appreciated! >> >> Thanks >> Robbin >> >>

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Soft Tiller Extension
by Ronald McNeil 20 Apr '14

20 Apr '14

I have been meaning to put a tiller extension on my M17, but just haven't decided on what to get yet. When sailing solo the other day I was desperate so I created a tiller extension out of a piece of line. It actually worked amazingly well, so I thought i would share. I tied a piece of line about 2' long to the end of the teller and I put a little loop in the end so I could hold it with one finger. Using it I was able to stand in the front of the cockpit and hold the boom out when sailing down wind while still being able to steer. Going up wind, because I had some weather helm, I was able to sit back and just keep a little tension on the line. Once in a while I had to grab the tiller (when it swung toward me) but it worked pretty good. If it was just a little longer I think I could of reached things in the cabin or uncleat the halyard without letting go of the tiller and going into a death spiral. I still want to get a fixed extension for heavier weather but until then I will count on my soft extension. If anyone can advise on a brand or size extension that's good for an M17, please let me know. Thanks, Ron McNeil M17 #675 / Jackpot

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Re: M_Boats: Is the foam under my starboard cockpit seat structural or for fl...
by GILASAILR＠aol.com 19 Apr '14

19 Apr '14

I 'think' my seat at the location in discussion here has a balsa core as do all the horizontal surfaces on the deck (coaming 'cap' and companionway sliding hatch excepted) - probably PO's version of insulation. My boat is a 1980 # 316 FWIW. Old deck and interior. You know - the collectible ones! Have a great day, Go Sailing! GO In a message dated 4/18/2014 11:07:02 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, scoobscobie(a)gmail.com writes: the foam in your prior picture does look 'low density' so the insulation idea seems logical. i've inspected a couple of the 'old deck' M17s (when i was looking to buy a M17 and to help others) ... i can't say 100%, but i think the 'old deck' M17s don't have any core in that location. don't hold me to this, i honestly can't remember. (Jerry?) there is core in the locker lids ... i inspected a boat where the locker lid core was completely rotten. On Fri, Apr 18, 2014 at 11:23 AM, <swwheatley(a)comcast.net> wrote: > The more I think about this the more I think the foam was just for > insulation. The built-in cooler just aft appears to be wrapped with the > same stuff and I'm guessing that without the foam you would get lots of > moisture condensing on the underside of the seat and dripping onto the > quarter-berth and its occupant. > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Dave Scobie" <scoobscobie(a)gmail.com> > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" < > montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2014 1:10:53 PM > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Is the foam under my starboard cockpit seat > structural or for flotation? > > that foam wasn't for flotation. to keep the M17 floating the entire space > under the cockpit, including the lockers, and 1/2 the cabin would need to > be full of foam. > > the foam has me puzzled as Jerry preferred(s) balsa core to strength the > decks and transom. about 1/4" balsa on the seats would be enough. > > i'm wondering if the foam you see there was added by a past owner? > > Jerry needs to jump in here about the layup schedule for the original M17 > deck. my M17 has the 'new' deck design so i'm not able to provide a > comparison when looking at SWEET PEA. > > > > On Fri, Apr 18, 2014 at 10:39 AM, <swwheatley(a)comcast.net> wrote: > > > As noted before, I removed the slab of 1" green foam from the underside > of > > my starboard cockpit seat. I assumed the foam was structural, but it has > > been suggested on another forum that the foam was for flotation. That > makes > > some sense because a structural foam core on a small boat would not > usually > > be 1" thick, but I am not aware that the M17 was ever touted as having > > positive flotation. The foam appears to have been factory installed > before > > the deck was attached to the hull. Perhaps it was a custom option? Boat > is > > a 1976, hull no. 215. > > > > Any insight would be much appreciated. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Stanley Wheatley" <swwheatley(a)comcast.net> > > To: "montgomery boats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > > Sent: Sunday, April 6, 2014 8:51:51 PM > > Subject: M_Boats: Behold the carnage > > > > New to me M17 had delamination under the starboard cockpit seat due to > > some pretty big voids in the resin the core was supposed to be bedded in. > > Appears to be 1” foam core covered with 1 layer of 6 oz. fiberglass > cloth. > > Any suggestions on what core I should use to replace it? I would prefer > to > > use some kind of foam again but I’m not sure about the thickness. The > > available foam cores seem to thinner now days. > > > > Thanks. > > > > > > > -- > :: Dave Scobie > :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com > > -- :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com

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Behold the carnage
by Stanley Wheatley 19 Apr '14

19 Apr '14

New to me M17 had delamination under the starboard cockpit seat due to some pretty big voids in the resin the core was supposed to be bedded in. Appears to be 1” foam core covered with 1 layer of 6 oz. fiberglass cloth. Any suggestions on what core I should use to replace it? I would prefer to use some kind of foam again but I’m not sure about the thickness. The available foam cores seem to thinner now days. Thanks.

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Re: M_Boats: Aviation Fuel
by bownez＠juno.com 16 Apr '14

16 Apr '14

1966 Bonneville for me Tom..... Bones ____________________________________________________________ Old School Yearbook Pics View Class Yearbooks Online Free. Search by School & Year. Look Now! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/534f46bcc9cf446bc5f07st01vuc

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Re: M_Boats: Aviation Fuel
by SALGLESSER＠aol.com 16 Apr '14

16 Apr '14

I remember Norton's, BSA's, Triumph's, Bultaco's, Montessa's, Velocette's and a host of others. I've also synchronized SU carbs. Thanx for the memory trip. sal In a message dated 4/16/2014 2:02:51 P.M. Mountain Daylight Time, jdavies104(a)gmail.com writes: Who remembers Nortons? BSAs? On Wednesday, April 16, 2014, Tom Smith <openboatt(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Who remembers driving down a dark highway on a Norton and having the lights > go out? t > > > On Wed, Apr 16, 2014 at 5:00 AM, Rick Davies <jdavies104(a)gmail.com<javascript:;>> > wrote: > > > Who remembers synchronizing SU carburettors? > > > > Rick > > M17 #633 > > Lynne L > > > > On Tuesday, April 15, 2014, Sandy <sandyal55(a)aol.com <javascript:;>> > wrote: > > > > > Only 2 things wrong with old British cars: Lucas and Girling > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: stevetrapp(a)q.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;> > > > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats < > > > montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>> > > > Sent: Tue, Apr 15, 2014 4:02 pm > > > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Aviation Fuel > > > > > > > > > > > > Hey guys, those of us who have owned British Cars know that the reason > > the > > > Brits drink warm beer is because of lucas refrigerators. But we wised > up > > > and bought Montgomery sailboats, built in the USA. > > > Steve > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Tom Smith" <openboatt(a)gmail.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>> > > > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" > > > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>> > > > Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2014 7:52 PM > > > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Aviation Fuel > > > > > > > Yes, and the lights should have failed at the same time.... > > > > > > > > > > > > Hahahahahahahahaha t > > > > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Apr 15, 2014 at 6:25 PM, John Tyner > > > > <tynerjr(a)md.metrocast.net <javascript:;> <javascript:;>>wrote: > > > > > > > >> Isn't that normal for a British car of that vintage, David? :-) > > > >> ----- > > > >> John Tyner > > > >> M-15 #412 "Chimpanzee" > > > >> > > > >> On 4/15/2014 8:14 PM, David Grah wrote: > > > >> > > > >>> I ran out of gas in my 1963 Triumph TR4 and the airport when there > > > >>> flying > > > >>> my 1950 Cessna 170. I put some 100 low lead aviation fuel in the > car > > to > > > >>> get > > > >>> home. It smelled like a plane and ran fine but by the time I got > home > > > >>> the > > > >>> gasket on the fuel bowl had swelled, warped, and allowed the gas to > > > leak > > > >>> out profusely. This suggests to me that aviation gas is not always > > > >>> harmless. > > > >>> > > > >>> David Grah > > > >>> Bishop California > > > >>> Montgomery 15 Serial 369 Sky > > > >>> > > > >>> Sent from my iPhone > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >> > > > > > > > > >

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Re: M_Boats: Aviation Fuel
by GILASAILR＠aol.com 16 Apr '14

16 Apr '14

Had a friend with a Victor - I wanted that thing hard - sometimes wanting is better than owning. WrinkleBoat content - I have owned Montgomery sailboats - 5-8, 7-11*,10, 15, 17* * current fleet. GO In a message dated 4/16/2014 1:02:51 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, jdavies104(a)gmail.com writes: Who remembers Nortons? BSAs? On Wednesday, April 16, 2014, Tom Smith <openboatt(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Who remembers driving down a dark highway on a Norton and having the lights > go out? t > > > On Wed, Apr 16, 2014 at 5:00 AM, Rick Davies <jdavies104(a)gmail.com<javascript:;>> > wrote: > > > Who remembers synchronizing SU carburettors? > > > > Rick > > M17 #633 > > Lynne L > > > > On Tuesday, April 15, 2014, Sandy <sandyal55(a)aol.com <javascript:;>> > wrote: > > > > > Only 2 things wrong with old British cars: Lucas and Girling > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: stevetrapp(a)q.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;> > > > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats < > > > montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>> > > > Sent: Tue, Apr 15, 2014 4:02 pm > > > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Aviation Fuel > > > > > > > > > > > > Hey guys, those of us who have owned British Cars know that the reason > > the > > > Brits drink warm beer is because of lucas refrigerators. But we wised > up > > > and bought Montgomery sailboats, built in the USA. > > > Steve > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Tom Smith" <openboatt(a)gmail.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>> > > > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" > > > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com <javascript:;> <javascript:;>> > > > Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2014 7:52 PM > > > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Aviation Fuel > > > > > > > Yes, and the lights should have failed at the same time.... > > > > > > > > > > > > Hahahahahahahahaha t > > > > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Apr 15, 2014 at 6:25 PM, John Tyner > > > > <tynerjr(a)md.metrocast.net <javascript:;> <javascript:;>>wrote: > > > > > > > >> Isn't that normal for a British car of that vintage, David? :-) > > > >> ----- > > > >> John Tyner > > > >> M-15 #412 "Chimpanzee" > > > >> > > > >> On 4/15/2014 8:14 PM, David Grah wrote: > > > >> > > > >>> I ran out of gas in my 1963 Triumph TR4 and the airport when there > > > >>> flying > > > >>> my 1950 Cessna 170. I put some 100 low lead aviation fuel in the > car > > to > > > >>> get > > > >>> home. It smelled like a plane and ran fine but by the time I got > home > > > >>> the > > > >>> gasket on the fuel bowl had swelled, warped, and allowed the gas to > > > leak > > > >>> out profusely. This suggests to me that aviation gas is not always > > > >>> harmless. > > > >>> > > > >>> David Grah > > > >>> Bishop California > > > >>> Montgomery 15 Serial 369 Sky > > > >>> > > > >>> Sent from my iPhone > > > >>> > > > >>> > > > >> > > > > > > > > >

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Fwd: TillerClutch control line on an M15?
by Dave Scobie 16 Apr '14

16 Apr '14

Charlie: picture attached showing the strapeye (transom) and v-cleat (cockpit combing backrest) hardware that WaveFront recommends for the TillerClutch. from the aft cockpit corner it is 12" to the v-cleat and 12" to the strapeye. there are two options for the v-cleat: plastic or metal. plastic bonus is if the pressure gets so great it will break before tearing out the of the fiberglass, but will not hold as firm as metal. contact Katherine and Pete, info(a)wavefront.com<https://us-mg5.mail.yahoo.com/compose?to=info@wavefront.com>, to purchase the hardware. there are a few negatives to this install: as noted above the hardware can rip out of the fiberglass (installing a backing plate is very very hard as your hands will not fit between the cockpit wall and the transom, and to reach the location of the v-cleat you must cut out the cockpit locker pan); next using the aft cleats the control lines will better hold the tiller (and can't be ripped out); third is drilling more holes in your boat. the TillerClutch on my M17 and S17 use the aft cleats for the three reasons above. note: be sure to loosen at least one side of the control line, and the tillerclutch is unengaged, before moving the rudder up/down. the tillerclutch will stop the tiller from moving up/down (see above comment about ripping hardware out of fiberglass). -- :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com

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Re: M_Boats: Opening up the deck of an M-23 like a can of sardines
by GILASAILR＠aol.com 16 Apr '14

16 Apr '14

Connie, Thanks for the 'careening' reminder.(I forgot that one momentarily) I appreciate your sharing of skills. If you ever get to central Arizona - I would be honored to take you for a sail - In the middle of the desert - on a Montgomery of course! Take Care, Have Fun, Keep sailing - in memories or on 'other folks' boats' The offer stands - I hope someone will take me out for a sail when I 'swallow the anchor'. GO _gilasailr(a)aol.com_ (mailto:gilasailr@aol.com) In a message dated 4/15/2014 9:29:24 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, chbenneck(a)gmail.com writes: On 14-Apr-14 10:07 PM, bownez(a)juno.com wrote: Hi Bones, Thanks for your kind words of encouragement. Having just passed 93, and counting, I'm afraid that all I have left are lots of fond memories of solving boat problems / learning all sorts of new things ( designing and installing a refrigeration system in our 29-footer), so that we always had ice cubes for our Martinis, while the rest of our sailing gang (with larger boats) were still lugging blocks of ice to their boats. It was my form of One-Upsmanship on my senior Pratt & Whitney Aircraft engineer sailing buddies. Sailing expands your horizons / your experience / and thereby makes it so much more rewarding. As a beginning sailor life is filled with the fear of the unknown (your lack of knowledge of what the hell you are doing out there), but gradually experience begins to supplant fear. Now you know what you are doing. Oh there still are surprises (usually unpleasant) caused by local conditions in an area you hadn't encountered before, but you learn from the experience. In the Adriatic a Bora - a fiercely blowing cold wind that sweeps down on the northern Adriatic out of the Alps for a few hours and then shuts off again had us dragging an anchor (we only had one on board a friends boat we were using), and our fin keel was firmly stuck in the soft mud bottom. Trying to row out the anchor and use that to pull us into deeper water didn't work. The anchor just plowed a furrow in the soft mud...., and the boat didn't move an inch. Now what? Finally, I did an underwater survey (with mask and swim fins) to find the shortest path to deeper water. Then, using a hatch board as a shovel, I dug an underwater trench in front of the keel to deeper water.... We made it, but that experience made a firm believer out of me that a boat should always have at least 3 anchors on board. If I had had a second one available I could have used it to careen the boat, reducing the draft, and getting to deeper water in easier fashion. But (after it is all over) it was fun wasn't it? Happy Easter and good sailing, Connie & Katrina > My Dear Connie, > > Once again, I relish your words of wisdom. > You are so correct sir, the learning never ends, which is one of the main reasons I find the sport so enjoyable. > Every sailing outing is different, it is an adventure and a challenge. A wise man learns from his experiences and his mistakes (hopefully). > > I'm so pleased you are still monitoring this fine list, don't you ever leave us. > > Bones > ____________________________________________________________ > The #1 Worst Carb Ever? > Click to Learn #1 Carb that Kills Your Blood Sugar (Don't Eat This!) > http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/534ca2ae7d5c222ae30a7st03vuc >

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