June 2018 - montgomery_boats - mailman.xmission.com

Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder
by Bill Dixon 17 Jun '18

17 Jun '18

Yes, what Gail reports is an issue at the public ramp. You can rig near the bottom of the ramp but it is uniformly sloped. Not a lot of fun, especially when crowded, and there is no associated dockage.Nearby Lake Sonoma Resort Area is the better option for sailing craft. It has a small semi-level rigging area and good docks. Call well in advance if you want to park, store, launch or berth during warmer months.BillM-17 Robbin Sent via the Samsung Galaxy S® 5 mini, an AT&T 4G LTE smartphone -------- Original message -------- From: gail <gail(a)zeliga.com> Date: 6/16/2018 5:41 PM (GMT-08:00) To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder We tried to go to lake Sonoma in our 17. Could not find a place to raise the mast on land because you had to go under the overpass and onto a steep slope before raising the mast? Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone -------- Original message --------From: Bill Dixon <bill(a)miralee.com> Date: 6/16/18 4:40 PM (GMT-08:00) To: 'For and about Montgomery Sailboats' <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder Yes, CA. Lake Sonoma was about 93% full and breezy enough to dissuade power craft. BTW, the mast-raising system was designed for control (no kinked hardware) without needing to manually lift or use a gin pole. Wishing you laminar flow, Bill -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of John Schinnerer Sent: Wednesday, June 13, 2018 3:58 PM To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder You're welcome...did last coat of varnish on rudder refinish yesterday. A few days to cure and the hardware goes back on! Lake Sonoma CA I take it? I did a canoe camping trip there many years ago with my dad. The lake was not at all as full as it looks in your picture...glad to see quite a bit of water there. cheers, John S. On 06/13/2018 03:49 PM, Bill Dixon wrote: > Dave, sw and John, > > Thanks for clear info on mahogany rudder raising. Attached is a photo of mast raising at L. Sonoma. > > Bill > > -----Original Message----- > From: montgomery_boats [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of swwheatley(a)comcast.net > Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2018 10:50 AM > To: 'For and about Montgomery Sailboats' > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > > Usual practice involves running a line (1/4" seems typical) from a pad-eye mounted high on the transom just to one side of the rudder down to a hole drilled in the rudder (near the waterline vertically and near the leading edge laterally) and back up to a cleat (usually a horn cleat or cam cleat) opposite the pad-eye on the other side of the rudder. Newer boats can use a hole drilled in the lip where the deck meets the hull in place of the pad-eye. > > I have an older boat (no lip to speak of) and I am thinking of putting two flared copper pipes through holes drilled in the transom and bedded in goop to keep the transom core dry. That would avoid cluttering the transom with more hardware, avoid any chance of the rudder hitting said hardware, and allow me to mount the cleat inside the cockpit. All just theoretical at this point. > > -----Original Message----- > From: montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com> On Behalf Of Bill Dixon > Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2018 10:57 AM > To: 'For and about Montgomery Sailboats' <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > > What is the best way to place and hold the mahogany rudder in its UP position? > > Bill > M-17 Robbin > Windsor, CA > > -----Original Message----- > From: montgomery_boats [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Dave Scobie > Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2018 7:20 AM > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > > The solid mahogany one piece rudders that Jerry made are very good and not at all prone to failure. In the 'up' position they are higher than the keel (centerboard up). > > If you believe the rudder shape isn't right look online for a NACA12 foil and make a template to confirm the shape of your boat's. Very easy to refine the shape on a nice piece of wood. > > :: Dave Scobie > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com > > On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 7:14 AM Kevin Sandwick <ksandwick(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > >> Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick >> Up Rudder on an M-17 ? >> >> Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? >> >> Thanks >> >> Kevin >> > > > > -- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john(a)eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com

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Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder
by Kevin Sandwick 17 Jun '18

17 Jun '18

Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick Up Rudder on an M-17 ? Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? Thanks Kevin

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Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder - the M15 solution?
by David Grah 14 Jun '18

14 Jun '18

There is maybe too much discussion on this topic but I just can't help adding my own comment. I have a 1986 Montgomery 15 with what I believe to be the original kick up mahogany rudder. I love my rudder! It goes up and down so easily when I tell it to and even goes up when I run into something and didn't know in advance I wanted it up. I have done this often enough to appreciate this feature. It is also easy to clear it of things that wrap around it but quickly raising and lowering it. As you all probably know, the rudder is raised and lowered by raising and lowering the tiller. Up or down the process involves getting a little momentum going in the rudder to move it from one position to another. It works great. I know a 17 foot boat is different from a 15 foot boat but I don't understand why no one seems to pursue a beefier version of a Montgomery 15 rudder system for a Montgomery 17. It seems like such a great solution! David GrahBishop California

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Re: M_Boats: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 184, Issue 7
by Gary Oberbeck 13 Jun '18

13 Jun '18

If I were looking for a KU rudder for a M-17 I would modify a C-22 rudder head with all the parts in place (esp. 'hockey pucks') as a good starting point using a wood or ? blade with that rudder, they are strong and quite solidly engineered pieces. My 17 had an original wood rudder and it was in poor condition so I replaced it with a new wood one years ago - stored indoors vertically and cared for beyond reason - it warped - I threw it away I was so disappointed! Used a fiberglass Catalina 250 early model (discontinued) rudder for years and still have it in the garage. It was VERY heavy (35+#) That rudder has been replaced with a foam core composite rudder made for me by a good friend - I mounted delrin gudgeons and shaped the foil on the core that he so generously built for me(it is not quite finished to this day!) This rudder shows huge advantages in weight savings at the stern (weighs 11#15oz!) it FLOATS up on the rudder rod! I have run agound on rocky bottoms and the rod took a slight bend - blade undamaged. It has been drug on a concrete ramp when retrieving (not me ;>) - a bit of abrasion at tip - easy repair. The rudder shows the smallest bit of flutter under power ONLY at max throttle then settles down (too sharp at leading edge) and is virtually impossible to stall!! There is NO flex in the blade and no 'lead' on the pintles to make it semi balanced. The boats helm has been adjusted with the rig rake. See photo of 'deflection test' when core was built. Imagine driving a 1954 Chevy truck with manual steering and then driving a 'modern car' with rack and pinion steering - that dramatic. I have owned boats with kickup rudders and they were never as positive as a fixed or sliding foil IMO. I would not trailer any boat with the rudder in place as the wear on the pintles/gudgeons is unnecessary. Whatever 'floats yer boat' - 'blows yer hair back' - 'tickles your wallet' Come on out to the 2018 Cruiser Challenge at Monterey Bay see details here - great time has been had by yours truly EVERY time I have sailed there! We will be there with the rudder blade guy as crew! cruiserchallenge.potter-yachters.org Have fUn, Go Sailing! GO -----Original Message----- From: Jon Barber <brbrbarber(a)gmail.com> To: montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tue, Jun 12, 2018 10:02 pm Subject: Re: M_Boats: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 184, Issue 7 I have the Rudder Craft rudder on my M17 "Ol'44. The rudder seems to give me crisper handling. It swings a little forward of center thus reducing weatherhelm. It came with the mast raising system so now my rudder and mast raising system remain on the boat in the water and on the trailer, saving considerable work when launching and retrieving. That alone was worth $500. I'm very happy with it. Jon Barber Ol'44 Montgomery 17 I sail therefore I am, I think On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 11:01 AM < montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com> wrote: > Send montgomery_boats mailing list submissions to > montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > https://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > montgomery_boats-owner(a)mailman.xmission.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of montgomery_boats digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Kevin Sandwick) > 2. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Dave Scobie) > 3. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Bill Dixon) > 4. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Dave Scobie) > 5. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Gerald Wolczanski) > 6. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Dave Scobie) > 7. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (swwheatley(a)comcast.net) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2018 14:13:53 +0000 > From: Kevin Sandwick <ksandwick(a)hotmail.com> > To: "montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com" > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > Message-ID: > < > DM3PR16MB06821E703EBA901E9341A0C5AA7F0(a)DM3PR16MB0682.namprd16.prod.outlook.com > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick Up > Rudder on an M-17 ? > > Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? > > Thanks > > Kevin > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2018 07:19:31 -0700 > From: Dave Scobie <scoobscobie(a)gmail.com> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > Message-ID: > < > CAGjBOA7BrRYbRr7ZUiqAYHPM0ZnSMdyhc57PFxdyoDOemk3Lyw(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > The solid mahogany one piece rudders that Jerry made are very good and not > at all prone to failure. In the 'up' position they are higher than the > keel (centerboard up). > > If you believe the rudder shape isn't right look online for a NACA12 foil > and make a template to confirm the shape of your boat's. Very easy to > refine the shape on a nice piece of wood. > > :: Dave Scobie > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com > > On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 7:14 AM Kevin Sandwick <ksandwick(a)hotmail.com> > wrote: > > > Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick Up > > Rudder on an M-17 ? > > > > Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? > > > > Thanks > > > > Kevin > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2018 07:57:01 -0700 > From: "Bill Dixon" <bill(a)miralee.com> > To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > Message-ID: <003b01d4025d$9f0c1410$dd243c30$(a)miralee.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > What is the best way to place and hold the mahogany rudder in its UP > position? > > Bill > M-17 Robbin > Windsor, CA > > -----Original Message----- > From: montgomery_boats [mailto: > montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Dave Scobie > Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2018 7:20 AM > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > > The solid mahogany one piece rudders that Jerry made are very good and not > at all prone to failure. In the 'up' position they are higher than the > keel (centerboard up). > > If you believe the rudder shape isn't right look online for a NACA12 foil > and make a template to confirm the shape of your boat's. Very easy to > refine the shape on a nice piece of wood. > > :: Dave Scobie > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com > > On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 7:14 AM Kevin Sandwick <ksandwick(a)hotmail.com> > wrote: > > > Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick Up > > Rudder on an M-17 ? > > > > Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? > > > > Thanks > > > > Kevin > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2018 08:10:39 -0700 > From: Dave Scobie <scoobscobie(a)gmail.com> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > Message-ID: > <CAGjBOA7TZEQ-yR6ETTQntc9GG= > azC_kO7GxkfSXq_fMTnLUu5g(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Bill. > > A line should be there at the transom that goes through a hole in the > rudder. > > Line on the second generation decks goes through the hull deck joint (held > there with an 8-knot) down through the rudder and up to a cleat on the > transom. On the original decks the line is dead-ended on an eye bolt on > the transom; cleat the same. > > Pull line up to pull up rudder and secure in cleat. simple and easy. > > A picture attached just taken here at Washington State Fort Flagler State > Park where I am on a buoy. You can also see a transom picture that shows > the system on my BLOG linked below (it is the top banner picture on the > site). > > Need more details let me know. > > :: Dave Scobie > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com > > On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 7:57 AM Bill Dixon <bill(a)miralee.com> wrote: > > > What is the best way to place and hold the mahogany rudder in its UP > > position? > > > > Bill > > M-17 Robbin > > Windsor, CA > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: montgomery_boats [mailto: > > montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Dave Scobie > > Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2018 7:20 AM > > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > > > > The solid mahogany one piece rudders that Jerry made are very good and > not > > at all prone to failure. In the 'up' position they are higher than the > > keel (centerboard up). > > > > If you believe the rudder shape isn't right look online for a NACA12 foil > > and make a template to confirm the shape of your boat's. Very easy to > > refine the shape on a nice piece of wood. > > > > :: Dave Scobie > > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com > > > > On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 7:14 AM Kevin Sandwick <ksandwick(a)hotmail.com> > > wrote: > > > > > Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick > Up > > > Rudder on an M-17 ? > > > > > > Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Kevin > > > > > > > > > >

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Re: M_Boats: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 184, Issue 7
by Jon Barber 13 Jun '18

13 Jun '18

I have the Rudder Craft rudder on my M17 "Ol'44. The rudder seems to give me crisper handling. It swings a little forward of center thus reducing weatherhelm. It came with the mast raising system so now my rudder and mast raising system remain on the boat in the water and on the trailer, saving considerable work when launching and retrieving. That alone was worth $500. I'm very happy with it. Jon Barber Ol'44 Montgomery 17 I sail therefore I am, I think On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 11:01 AM < montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com> wrote: > Send montgomery_boats mailing list submissions to > montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > https://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > montgomery_boats-owner(a)mailman.xmission.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of montgomery_boats digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Kevin Sandwick) > 2. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Dave Scobie) > 3. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Bill Dixon) > 4. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Dave Scobie) > 5. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Gerald Wolczanski) > 6. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Dave Scobie) > 7. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (swwheatley(a)comcast.net) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2018 14:13:53 +0000 > From: Kevin Sandwick <ksandwick(a)hotmail.com> > To: "montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com" > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > Message-ID: > < > DM3PR16MB06821E703EBA901E9341A0C5AA7F0(a)DM3PR16MB0682.namprd16.prod.outlook.com > > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick Up > Rudder on an M-17 ? > > Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? > > Thanks > > Kevin > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2018 07:19:31 -0700 > From: Dave Scobie <scoobscobie(a)gmail.com> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > Message-ID: > < > CAGjBOA7BrRYbRr7ZUiqAYHPM0ZnSMdyhc57PFxdyoDOemk3Lyw(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > The solid mahogany one piece rudders that Jerry made are very good and not > at all prone to failure. In the 'up' position they are higher than the > keel (centerboard up). > > If you believe the rudder shape isn't right look online for a NACA12 foil > and make a template to confirm the shape of your boat's. Very easy to > refine the shape on a nice piece of wood. > > :: Dave Scobie > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com > > On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 7:14 AM Kevin Sandwick <ksandwick(a)hotmail.com> > wrote: > > > Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick Up > > Rudder on an M-17 ? > > > > Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? > > > > Thanks > > > > Kevin > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2018 07:57:01 -0700 > From: "Bill Dixon" <bill(a)miralee.com> > To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > Message-ID: <003b01d4025d$9f0c1410$dd243c30$(a)miralee.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > What is the best way to place and hold the mahogany rudder in its UP > position? > > Bill > M-17 Robbin > Windsor, CA > > -----Original Message----- > From: montgomery_boats [mailto: > montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Dave Scobie > Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2018 7:20 AM > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > > The solid mahogany one piece rudders that Jerry made are very good and not > at all prone to failure. In the 'up' position they are higher than the > keel (centerboard up). > > If you believe the rudder shape isn't right look online for a NACA12 foil > and make a template to confirm the shape of your boat's. Very easy to > refine the shape on a nice piece of wood. > > :: Dave Scobie > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com > > On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 7:14 AM Kevin Sandwick <ksandwick(a)hotmail.com> > wrote: > > > Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick Up > > Rudder on an M-17 ? > > > > Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? > > > > Thanks > > > > Kevin > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2018 08:10:39 -0700 > From: Dave Scobie <scoobscobie(a)gmail.com> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > Message-ID: > <CAGjBOA7TZEQ-yR6ETTQntc9GG= > azC_kO7GxkfSXq_fMTnLUu5g(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Bill. > > A line should be there at the transom that goes through a hole in the > rudder. > > Line on the second generation decks goes through the hull deck joint (held > there with an 8-knot) down through the rudder and up to a cleat on the > transom. On the original decks the line is dead-ended on an eye bolt on > the transom; cleat the same. > > Pull line up to pull up rudder and secure in cleat. simple and easy. > > A picture attached just taken here at Washington State Fort Flagler State > Park where I am on a buoy. You can also see a transom picture that shows > the system on my BLOG linked below (it is the top banner picture on the > site). > > Need more details let me know. > > :: Dave Scobie > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com > > On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 7:57 AM Bill Dixon <bill(a)miralee.com> wrote: > > > What is the best way to place and hold the mahogany rudder in its UP > > position? > > > > Bill > > M-17 Robbin > > Windsor, CA > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: montgomery_boats [mailto: > > montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Dave Scobie > > Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2018 7:20 AM > > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > > > > The solid mahogany one piece rudders that Jerry made are very good and > not > > at all prone to failure. In the 'up' position they are higher than the > > keel (centerboard up). > > > > If you believe the rudder shape isn't right look online for a NACA12 foil > > and make a template to confirm the shape of your boat's. Very easy to > > refine the shape on a nice piece of wood. > > > > :: Dave Scobie > > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com > > > > On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 7:14 AM Kevin Sandwick <ksandwick(a)hotmail.com> > > wrote: > > > > > Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick > Up > > > Rudder on an M-17 ? > > > > > > Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Kevin > > > > > > > > > >

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Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder
by Thomas Buzzi 13 Jun '18

13 Jun '18

Hi All, I am using the Ruddercraft "blue sea" rudder. The fore and aft measurement of the blade is wider than their regular design. I was told it gets a better bite on the water by the salesman. It is about ten pounds heavier than the standard setup so I suppose there is more material used. I don't know how the AK race boat rudder broke so have no ideas about that. It looks well made although I have not run it aground yet. I doubt you could damage it that way, anyway as it would just do as it was designed to do and kick up. Raising and lowering it is literally a "snap". I was able to position it so that once it is up I can use a lifting line and raise the whole ss hinge out of the water as well so none of it is exposed to marine growth. A very nice rig. If one was being blown sideways towards a rocky shore I could see how some part of the rudder could be bent but that kind of sideward pressure is outside of the design parameters of the unit. I recommend for the tool handy man the alteration of a standard Monty rudder with ss side plates to hold a ss bolt pivot. That will work well. Fair winds, Tom B

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Re: M_Boats: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 184, Issue 7
by Kevin Sandwick 12 Jun '18

12 Jun '18

Dave, Thanks for the reply, Looking at the profile for a NACA 12 foil My rudder does need some reshaping. I just acquired this boat in the spring and all the wood on the boat was in really rough shape, It made me nervous the amount of wood I took off with sand paper. The leading edge of the rudder is square and with out much curve until it tapers at the trailing edge. This may be a replacement by the previous owner. There will soon be two more M-17's joining the flotilla where I moor my boat so I will wait until I can get an eyeball on one of them before making any changes. After sailing in 15-20 kt wind with a reefed main and working jib ( 105 % ) I cannot keep the boat from rounding up in any gust, I am playing with adjusting the rake of the mast and have gained some improvement but still looking for better response. Again, Thank you, I will stay tuned ! Kevin ________________________________ From: montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com> on behalf of montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com <montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2018 1:00 PM To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 184, Issue 7 Send montgomery_boats mailing list submissions to montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com You can reach the person managing the list at montgomery_boats-owner(a)mailman.xmission.com When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of montgomery_boats digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Kevin Sandwick) 2. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Dave Scobie) 3. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Bill Dixon) 4. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Dave Scobie) 5. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Gerald Wolczanski) 6. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (Dave Scobie) 7. Re: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder (swwheatley(a)comcast.net) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2018 14:13:53 +0000 From: Kevin Sandwick <ksandwick(a)hotmail.com> To: "montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder Message-ID: <DM3PR16MB06821E703EBA901E9341A0C5AA7F0(a)DM3PR16MB0682.namprd16.prod.outlook.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick Up Rudder on an M-17 ? Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? Thanks Kevin ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2018 07:19:31 -0700 From: Dave Scobie <scoobscobie(a)gmail.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder Message-ID: <CAGjBOA7BrRYbRr7ZUiqAYHPM0ZnSMdyhc57PFxdyoDOemk3Lyw(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" The solid mahogany one piece rudders that Jerry made are very good and not at all prone to failure. In the 'up' position they are higher than the keel (centerboard up). If you believe the rudder shape isn't right look online for a NACA12 foil and make a template to confirm the shape of your boat's. Very easy to refine the shape on a nice piece of wood. :: Dave Scobie :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 7:14 AM Kevin Sandwick <ksandwick(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick Up > Rudder on an M-17 ? > > Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? > > Thanks > > Kevin > ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2018 07:57:01 -0700 From: "Bill Dixon" <bill(a)miralee.com> To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder Message-ID: <003b01d4025d$9f0c1410$dd243c30$(a)miralee.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" What is the best way to place and hold the mahogany rudder in its UP position? Bill M-17 Robbin Windsor, CA -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Dave Scobie Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2018 7:20 AM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder The solid mahogany one piece rudders that Jerry made are very good and not at all prone to failure. In the 'up' position they are higher than the keel (centerboard up). If you believe the rudder shape isn't right look online for a NACA12 foil and make a template to confirm the shape of your boat's. Very easy to refine the shape on a nice piece of wood. :: Dave Scobie :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 7:14 AM Kevin Sandwick <ksandwick(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick Up > Rudder on an M-17 ? > > Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? > > Thanks > > Kevin > ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Tue, 12 Jun 2018 08:10:39 -0700 From: Dave Scobie <scoobscobie(a)gmail.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder Message-ID: <CAGjBOA7TZEQ-yR6ETTQntc9GG=azC_kO7GxkfSXq_fMTnLUu5g(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Bill. A line should be there at the transom that goes through a hole in the rudder. Line on the second generation decks goes through the hull deck joint (held there with an 8-knot) down through the rudder and up to a cleat on the transom. On the original decks the line is dead-ended on an eye bolt on the transom; cleat the same. Pull line up to pull up rudder and secure in cleat. simple and easy. A picture attached just taken here at Washington State Fort Flagler State Park where I am on a buoy. You can also see a transom picture that shows the system on my BLOG linked below (it is the top banner picture on the site). Need more details let me know. :: Dave Scobie :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 7:57 AM Bill Dixon <bill(a)miralee.com> wrote: > What is the best way to place and hold the mahogany rudder in its UP > position? > > Bill > M-17 Robbin > Windsor, CA > > -----Original Message----- > From: montgomery_boats [mailto: > montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Dave Scobie > Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2018 7:20 AM > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Rudder Craft Kick Up Rudder > > The solid mahogany one piece rudders that Jerry made are very good and not > at all prone to failure. In the 'up' position they are higher than the > keel (centerboard up). > > If you believe the rudder shape isn't right look online for a NACA12 foil > and make a template to confirm the shape of your boat's. Very easy to > refine the shape on a nice piece of wood. > > :: Dave Scobie > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com > > On Tue, Jun 12, 2018, 7:14 AM Kevin Sandwick <ksandwick(a)hotmail.com> > wrote: > > > Just curious, Is anybody using the Rudder Craft High Performance Kick Up > > Rudder on an M-17 ? > > > > Not an inexpensive modification. Any thoughts? > > > > Thanks > > > > Kevin > > > > >

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2018 Cruiser Challenge
by jerry＠jerrymontgomery.org 07 Jun '18

07 Jun '18

So far I don’t see any Montgomerys registered in the Monterey CC. It’s July 28-29th, and their site is open for online registration. I hope my Sage is not the only wrinklebote there! Several of us are talking about staging a spinnakers- allowed race on Sunday for those interested. Montgomerys and Sages usually dominate this race. Be there or be square!

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Bow Eye or not to Bow Eye
by Lawrence Winiarski 06 Jun '18

06 Jun '18

I'm thinking about putting a bow eye, or u-bolt in the bow stem closer to the waterline (My m-15 doesn't have one) . I've got a few reasons for wanting this. 1. I'd like a mooring attachment down low, so the line/pendant can't catch or chaffe. I want to have one of those big pool noodles to put aroundthe line as a float/stiffener to keep the mooring ball away from my nice boat and have the whole thing near water level. I learned the hard way the last time when my boat drifted around and around and around the ball, eventually wound up stuck to it. Seems therehas to be a better way. 2. Another attachment point for a mooring ball so there are 2 points if one fails. 3. I'd like to have a low attachment point for a snubber for the anchor in rougher waves. It just seems better to be pulling fromdown low, especially if the waves are coming sideways. I read through the archives and found thishttps://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm/product/1882/bow-eye-rebuild-k… but they say explicitly in the description "Never moor your boat from the trailer bow eye. It is intended to take the load from the trailer winch directly forward of the boat....." I see the point. Bolt's aren't meant for side loads, but but reading lots of stuff on the net, it seems LOTS of people moor from the bow eye, andit seems that while side loads are bad for the bolt, side loads are also a reason to attach closer to the waterline to make the boat less tippy. So what is the solution?

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Advice Repainting Reburbishing Trailer
by David Grah 04 Jun '18

04 Jun '18

The Trail-Rite trailer for our 1986 Montgomery 15 has thick (it must have been repainted at least once before we had it), chipped, and peeling paint and spots with surface rust. We'd like to repaint it but wonder what sort of preparation work the old paint would take to get new paint to stick properly at last a long time. Plus it would be good to get the rust off of it. It looks like a lot of work to do entirely ourselves! Can anyone share any experiences, good and bad, repainting old trailers like ours? I can imagine taking off the removable stuff, taking it somewhere and somehow without wheels, having it dipped to remove the old paint, and then sand-blasted, and then repainting it, but that might be a bit more work than the trailer justifies. Thanks! David GrahBishop California

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