October 2014 - montgomery_boats - mailman.xmission.com

Sage 15 & Sage Cat shows?
by stevetrapp 15 Oct '14

15 Oct '14

Dave, Saw your ad for introducting the Sage 15; Sage Cat, and Sage Sloop in the November - December 2014 issue of Small Craft Advisor. Do you plan to show either of those boats in the Pacific Northwest, at the Seattle Boatshow, or Portland Boatshow, or in Port Townsend, Spokane, or Couer D' Alene? Steve M-15 # 335

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M-15 Ballast
by Antonio Martinez 09 Oct '14

09 Oct '14

I understand the trim/ballast issues. What I didn't know was whether the lead production phase was ingots or pellets. The bricks i have a relatively small - I think I estimated 1-1.5x3-4" (?) which would mean 75-100 lbs or so IIRC. . I'll try to get back in and take a look. I think I could remove them w/out too much trouble if i needed to. Will see how she sits w/out crew. I did find this Jerrry quote on webs: *Summer 85; # 335, Added 50 lbs of trim ballast forward, making total of 75, then changed 50 of that to a steel plate to make more room for those who wanted to install an elect pkg. *(my M15 is #405) And I think the previous (known) two owners sailed mostly solo. Or at least a great deal of hardware was added to bring all control lines to the cockpit... Thanks all for replies! Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2014 12:04:27 -0700 > From: "stevetrapp" <stevetrapp(a)q.com> > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: M-15 Ballast > Message-ID: <C2DDF781177C42E080145529BDCFAA30@STEVEEW> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > One way to avoid the problem of too much weight in the aft of an M-15 > is to not sail solo. The weight of the crew person helps balance the boat, > plus I think it is more fun to always have another person aboard, and it is > safer. > Steve > M-15 # 335 > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Howard Audsley" <haudsley(a)tranquility.net> > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" < > montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Sent: Wednesday, October 08, 2014 6:30 AM > Subject: Re: M_Boats: M-15 Ballast > > > Difficult to tell the scale as to the size of those ingots and how much > they might weigh. > > There has been some discussion over the years about how the M15 points > better with the skipper's weight forward. The idea is to keep her level, > fore and aft, vs. squatting in the aft end. When that happens, the bow > weathercocks away from the wind. Think lee helm. Nothing wrong with the > design of the boat, it is just that it is small enough to be affected by > weight in the aft end. If one skipper weighs 150 pounds, and another > 250......they extra weight in the aft end will matter. > > To compensate, people will move the weight of coolers, water jugs, etc. > forward when under sail, and will sit as far forward as possible, use > tiller extensions, hiking sticks, longer tillers, etc. to enable them to do > it. All this being an attempt to balance the weight fore and aft. > > This looks like an attempt by someone to install more permanent ballast > forward. Again, nothing wrong with the boat as designed, it is simply a > small boat that is affected by as little as the skipper's weight. The M17's > are too, just not as much. > > If those are small ingots, and are permanently attached with epoxy, you > might be "stuck" with them. > > > On Oct 6, 2014, at 6:55 PM, AM wrote: > > > http://icenine.smugmug.com/Sailing/i-fpFGP2J/0/L/M15%20ballast-L.jpg > > > > Dave: You are correct - I misspoke... I meant to say forward most > > compartment (usually screwed shut). Take a look at photo in link. These > > are directly against bulkhead in the bow compartment. I've read that > > Monty's eventually went to lead ballast - is this what replaced all the > > little steel punchings? Or does this look added? > > > > The boat sails well, but of course it's my first M-15 so I would not > > necessarily know if it's been mucked with. > > > > Cheers, > > a > > > > Message: 1 > > Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2014 07:02:31 -0600 > > From: Dave Scobie <scoobscobie(a)gmail.com> > > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > > Subject: Re: M_Boats: M-15 Ballast > > Message-ID: > > <CAGjBOA67JBQNBY=cO4R0LX=z4138Lfg=pUhD6m0c+6YkRwkpaA(a)mail.gmail.com> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > > > Those bricks are not stock. Where are they located? > > > > You wrote 'aft locker'. The 15 does not have a aft locker, just two port > and > > starboard lockers. > > > > Foam should fill 2/3rd of the under forward vberth and under the cockpit > > floor. > > > > :: Dave Scobie > > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA > > :: Former M15 owner > > On Oct 6, 2014 6:37 AM, "AM" <middleriverstudio(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > >> New-to-me M-15. Aft locker is missing most of the foam (will soon > >> remedy with noodles) and I see lead (?) ballast bricks. Is this > >> stock, or did someone add more lead? I know it's supposed to have a > >> hump here, but photos I've seen looked a bit different. Anyone else > >> have same bricks? > >> > >> > >> > >> Thx > >> > >> a > > Message: 3 > Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2014 15:13:30 -0600 > From: Dave Scobie <scoobscobie(a)gmail.com> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: M-15 Ballast > Message-ID: > < > CAGjBOA5AwdFXwzzk2anQMZ1dzxC0OwsFQnYmBfPPUJUKusLm6w(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > Jerry did go to lead ballast. the ballast used is lead shot, the same > product used in #6 or #8 shotgun shells. > > with the added description i agree with others that this is someones effort > to ad trim ballast. > > if there is no more than about 50lbs of lead you should be fine. this is > about the same as the weight i had on my M15 after i installed the > electrical system (a group 24 battery weights about 50 lbs). > > another check is to put the boat in the water. look at how she is > sitting. if she no more than a 'bit' bow down you are OK. > > the M15 isn't under-ballasted so what you want to do is assure the boat is > not sitting off her lines. > > -- > :: Dave Scobie > :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com > > > > > On Oct 6, 2014, at 6:55 PM, AM wrote: > > > > > http://icenine.smugmug.com/Sailing/i-fpFGP2J/0/L/M15%20ballast-L.jpg > > > > > > Dave: You are correct - I misspoke... I meant to say forward most > > > compartment (usually screwed shut). Take a look at photo in link. > These > > > are directly against bulkhead in the bow compartment. I've read that > > > Monty's eventually went to lead ballast - is this what replaced all the > > > little steel punchings? Or does this look added? > > > > > > The boat sails well, but of course it's my first M-15 so I would not > > > necessarily know if it's been mucked with. > > > > > > Cheers, > > > a > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2014 18:06:42 -0400 > From: Rick Davies <jdavies104(a)gmail.com> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Outboard Motor for M17 > Message-ID: > < > CA+0OvVh66BwWgzHX5-pUP8Cjy49aNMsk2hKK5hujZBgQvivhMQ(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > Can't beat a 2 horse long shaft Honda for an M17. Weighs less than 30 lb. > Had mine for 7 years and never needed anything more. > > Rick > M17 #633 > Lynne L > > On Wednesday, October 8, 2014, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > 6HP is more than is needed. the weight is the real problem of a 4-cycle > > outboard of the 6HP type > > > > my 4HP suzuki is just a 'de-tuned' 6HP outboard. weights about 65 or so > > lbs. no fun to carry or lift onto the outboard bracket. also a lot of > > weight hanging aft of the transom. > > > > so i say use that old Johnson! it is lighter than my 4HP! > > > > -- > > :: Dave Scobie > > :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred > > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2014 17:35:29 -0500 > From: Thomas Buzzi <thomaspbuzzi(a)gmail.com> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: M_Boats: Outboard Motor for M17 > Message-ID: > <CA+TbpAUAOrDAA8hEm= > 23euBu9kJpd-_X+nv45uyWsnv8Z101fA(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > That's good news, Rick, > I will end up with a 3.5 for mine for the very reasons that Dave mentioned > earlier. Was concerned that the 3.5 might not be enough. > Tom B > > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > montgomery_boats mailing list > montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com > https://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! > > > ------------------------------ > > End of montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 140, Issue 10 > ************************************************* > -- *Antonio Martinez, LEED AP* Middle River Studio Verona, VA 540-248-3310 (h) 540-414-4782 (c)

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Outboard Motor for M17
by Thomas Buzzi 08 Oct '14

08 Oct '14

That's good news, Rick, I will end up with a 3.5 for mine for the very reasons that Dave mentioned earlier. Was concerned that the 3.5 might not be enough. Tom B

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Re: M_Boats: Outboard Motor for M17
by bownez＠juno.com 08 Oct '14

08 Oct '14

Hi Henry, I believe a sailing buddy has a long shaft 2-stroke for sale. I'll check with him. Bones ____________________________________________________________ Map Your Flood Risk Find Floodplan Maps, Facts, FAQs, Your Flood Risk Profile and More! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/5433ddc548df5dc4025bst03vuc

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M-15 Ballast
by AM 08 Oct '14

08 Oct '14

http://icenine.smugmug.com/Sailing/i-fpFGP2J/0/L/M15%20ballast-L.jpg Dave: You are correct - I misspoke... I meant to say forward most compartment (usually screwed shut). Take a look at photo in link. These are directly against bulkhead in the bow compartment. I've read that Monty's eventually went to lead ballast - is this what replaced all the little steel punchings? Or does this look added? The boat sails well, but of course it's my first M-15 so I would not necessarily know if it's been mucked with. Cheers, a Message: 1 Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2014 07:02:31 -0600 From: Dave Scobie <scoobscobie(a)gmail.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: M-15 Ballast Message-ID: <CAGjBOA67JBQNBY=cO4R0LX=z4138Lfg=pUhD6m0c+6YkRwkpaA(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Those bricks are not stock. Where are they located? You wrote 'aft locker'. The 15 does not have a aft locker, just two port and starboard lockers. Foam should fill 2/3rd of the under forward vberth and under the cockpit floor. :: Dave Scobie :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA :: Former M15 owner On Oct 6, 2014 6:37 AM, "AM" <middleriverstudio(a)gmail.com> wrote: > New-to-me M-15. Aft locker is missing most of the foam (will soon > remedy with noodles) and I see lead (?) ballast bricks. Is this > stock, or did someone add more lead? I know it's supposed to have a > hump here, but photos I've seen looked a bit different. Anyone else > have same bricks? > > > > Thx > > a

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M-17 (Project) for sale in NW Louisiana.
by k docter 08 Oct '14

08 Oct '14

I spotted a M-17 in a storage lot a couple years ago. It took some tracking down the out of state owner, but I finally rescued the M-17 and have the title in my name. I gave him $900 for it...now I just want it out of my backyard. I rescued it out of my love for Monty's. Anyone interested in a winter project call or text Kendall at 318.470.5749. Or email me at kdocter(a)bellsouth.net for pictures.

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forestay
by Charles Hill 07 Oct '14

07 Oct '14

I want to install CDI roller furling on my M-15. My question is. Since I have to change the forestay to a turnbuckle arrangement plus buy a new sail, would it be advisable to go to a Masthead configuration since I live in an area of light winds most of the year? This is the second time I have posted this with no responses. Does anyone have Dave Scobies email? Also: I have a 2012 Honda 2hp longshaft OB for sale. Charles Hill 865-438-0600 chsail36(a)aol.com

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Albemarle Sound Cruising Area
by Michael Murphy 06 Oct '14

06 Oct '14

Explored the western end of the Albemarle Sound this weekend from the Scuppernong River to the Little Alligator River. Only 30 miles south of Virginia the 9 rivers feeding it offer a lot of scenic cruising. Found a decent spot to anchor until the winds clocked to the north & picked up to 15 knots with gusts to 20 which made the boat veer back & forth. A 2nd anchor on a short scope reduced the sheering to a comfortable level. The Albemarle has some of the most spectacular sun rises I've ever experienced. Unlke my last trip the winds were consistently good at 12-14 knots most of the time. The NNW wind built up a little chop but the M-15 handled it pretty especially on the starboard tack. Mike, Fionnula

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Outboard Motor for M17
by Henry Rodriguez 06 Oct '14

06 Oct '14

I've been watching Craigslist for a 4hp long shaft motor for my M17 all summer. I can't afford a new one and don't want to spend much over $700. I want to use the cut-out in the transom rather than an outboard bracket if I can. I'm not too concerned about 2-stroke vs 4-stroke since it will not be used that much. The boat will be at a mooring that I can sail to and from. The motor will only be used occasionally for docking and to get me out of trouble! Yesterday I got the bright idea of weighing the 1972 (these motors run forever!) Johnson that I use on my VN23 Chiquita. I got out my bathroom scale and was surprised to see that it weighs only 53 lb. That's better than the specs I see for most new 4hp motors with FNR gears at 57-60 lb. So I tried putting it in the cut-out on the M17. I found that if I mount it slightly off center in the opening I can get full turning motion to starboard and almost full turning to port. Raising the tiller handle on the motor to 90 degrees gives full turning to port. I know that 6hp is a bit of overkill for the M17 but given that the 6hp Johnson is several pounds lighter than a newer 4hp, is there any reason to keep looking for a long shaft 4hp with FNR? They are hard to find, but used 6hp motors are plentiful around here and go for under $400. Another question: I have an old short shaft Evinrude that I use on my inflatable dinghy. It runs well but is totally unsuited for the M17 as is. I tried mounting it in the cut-out and the prop barely reached the waterline. It also has no reverse or clutch and cannot be spun around in the cutout. Could it be made to work if I used an external motor mount? I know that I could mount it low enough to get the prop at the proper depth but would an external bracket allow it to spin around for reverse? If so, is the performance hit of moving the motor further aft worth it considering this motor only weighs 38 lb (verified by my bathroom scale.) -- Henry https://picasaweb.google.com/heinzir

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M-15 Ballast
by AM 06 Oct '14

06 Oct '14

New-to-me M-15. Aft locker is missing most of the foam (will soon remedy with noodles) and I see lead (?) ballast bricks. Is this stock, or did someone add more lead? I know it's supposed to have a hump here, but photos I've seen looked a bit different. Anyone else have same bricks? Thx a

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