June 2012 - montgomery_boats - mailman.xmission.com

Canjun Tiller Tamer
by Tom Jenkins 28 Jun '12

28 Jun '12

Well, it turns out the web page is still working after all this time; check it out, if you feel like fiddling. This Judy B. sounds strangely familiar, incidentally. http://www.blumhorst.com/potterpages/Photopoint/0005/cajun-tiller-tamer.htm

1 0

Tiller immobilization again
by Tom Jenkins 28 Jun '12

28 Jun '12

I did not mention it because I posted on it two or three years ago, but I found a site on the net describing a simple way to hold the tiller for singlehanding. You just run a line between the stern cleats, wrapped about three times around the tiller, and when it is pulled forward almost to the holding position, the loops jam and hold the tiller. When not in use, you just slide the loops back to the transom out of the way. It takes some initial adjustment to fit the shape of the tiller, but it has worked for me in some pretty nasty blows. The mechanical tiller holders are more foolproof, and gadgets are great, but you might give it a try if you like just wood and rope. Tom Jenkins M17 Scintilla

2 1

Yaw Thrust Roll Pitch
by Hale Irwin 28 Jun '12

28 Jun '12

In helicopters or in aerodynamics in general one considers Yaw, Thrust, Roll, and Pitch (Young T-ts Really Point)! In a boat: The ruder action changes yaw : left -right motion of bow Thrust is the power of the sail minus any drag of the hull in the water Roll is the rolling of the boat over its fore-aft axis Pitch is the up-down motion of the bow of the boat.. Keep 'em flying (sailing) SEMPER FI ........ Hale ----- Original Message ----- From: <montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com> To: <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2012 10:52 PM Subject: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 112, Issue 12 > Send montgomery_boats mailing list submissions to > montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com > > You can reach the person managing the list at > montgomery_boats-owner(a)mailman.xmission.com > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of montgomery_boats digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: M-17 weight adjustment (Tom Jenkins) > 2. Gas smell in cabin (Bill Wickett) > 3. Tiller Clutch (Kevin Lynch) > 4. Rudder Finishes (Ted Weidenbach) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2012 18:13:11 -0700 > From: Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: M-17 weight adjustment > Message-ID: <11064E44-5006-4AE5-8EED-5D749409D004(a)gte.net> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Dave, > Sorry to butt in, but I have a Torqeedo 1003. The specs on Randy's motor > sound nearly identical. > > Tom > > > On Jun 27, 2012, at 5:48 PM, David Gilroy wrote: > >> Hi Randy, >> >> I'm curious which electric motor you chose? >> >> Dave >> >> >> >> >> On Jun 27, 2012, at 4:38 PM, Randy wrote: >> >>> After some 11 years of following threads on engine ideas, I finally made >>> a >>> dead weight adjustment. After all, when you are sailing the engine, >>> fuel >>> tank fuel are all dead weight. >>> I went from a 100lb. 9.9 Yamaha outboard to a 3.5hp 35lb >>> electric....o.k. so >>> I am an extremist! >>> Still, it sails much better. I also got rid of one of my two deep cycle >>> marine batteries. It also was strapped at the bottom aft corner of the >>> boat. >>> So far, it has worked out well in even some pretty testy mountain lake >>> winds. And, as expected, in light winds we are moving along much >>> better! >>> Thanks to all who have finally gotten through this thick skull...now a >>> thick >>> "green" skull. >>> >>> Randy >>> M-17 "Fore Play" >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com >>> [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of >>> montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com >>> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 10:53 PM >>> To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com >>> Subject: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 112, Issue 9 >>> >>> Send montgomery_boats mailing list submissions to >>> montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com >>> >>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >>> >>> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >>> montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com >>> >>> You can reach the person managing the list at >>> montgomery_boats-owner(a)mailman.xmission.com >>> >>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than >>> "Re: Contents of montgomery_boats digest..." >>> >>> >>> Today's Topics: >>> >>> 1. Re: How much heel on M17 (Tom Jenkins) >>> 2. Re: How much heel on M17 (W David Scobie) >>> 3. Re: How much heel on M17 (John Schinnerer) >>> 4. Re: How much heel on M17 (Tom Jenkins) >>> 5. Re: How much heel on M17 (jerry montgomery) >>> 6. Re: aspens are trembling outside my window (W David Scobie) >>> 7. Re: How much wind (James Poulakis) >>> 8. Re: How much wind (Jeffrey Johnston) >>> 9. Re: How much wind (jerry montgomery) >>> 10. Re: How much wind (James Poulakis) >>> 11. M15 Tiller Extension (Don) >>> 12. Re: M15 Tiller Extension (Neil Dorf) >>> 13. Re: M15 Tiller Extension (Tod) >>> 14. Re: M15 Tiller Extension (Daniel Rich) >>> 15. Re: M15 Tiller Extension (Beowulf) >>> 16. Main sail luff slides (Beowulf) >>> 17. Re: Main sail luff slides (Stan Susman) >>> 18. Re: How much wind (Stan Susman) >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> Message: 1 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 11:42:36 -0700 >>> From: Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 >>> Message-ID: <58224808-8687-4D91-9CDE-A19D9A4AF46C(a)gte.net> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 >>> >>> Dave, >>> Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks. Been waiting years to use that >>> word. >>> >>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>> >>>> the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15. i find SWEET PEA >>>> sails >>> better with some heal ... more than a P15 or P19. >>>> >>>> the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from about 10 degrees one >>> side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 deg. arc) if you try to keep her >>> flat >>> as her hull shape 'wants' her to heel. much more 'stable' if you have >>> her >>> leaning to one side. >>>> >>>> hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different on the M17 and >>>> M15, >>> especially the hull shape port and starboard of the keel, and aft of the >>> keel. >>>> >>>> >>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>>> >>>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Dave, >>>>> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails best flat. I >>>>> assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, but I never checked. What you >>>>> think? >>>>> Tom Jenkins >>>>> M17 Scintilla >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 2 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 11:48:07 -0700 (PDT) >>> From: W David Scobie <wdscobie(a)yahoo.com> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 >>> Message-ID: >>> <1340736487.98898.YahooMailClassic(a)web162704.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 >>> >>> Tom: >>> >>> more roll than yaw. the M15 wants to stay on her course (not yaw) just >>> roll >>> ... wobble ;-) ... from port to starboard if you don't have her heeling. >>> >>> M17 isn't doesn't do this as much as the M15. >>> >>> >>> :: Dave Scobie >>> >>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >>>> >>>> Dave, >>>> Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks.? Been waiting years to use that >>>> word.? >>>> >>>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>>> >>>>> the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15.? >>>> i find SWEET PEA sails better with some heal ... more than a >>>> P15 or P19. >>>>> >>>>> the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from >>>> about 10 degrees one side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 deg. arc) >>>> if you try to keep her flat as her hull shape 'wants' her to heel.? >>>> much more 'stable' if you have her leaning to one side. >>>>> >>>>> hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different >>>> on the M17 and M15, especially the hull shape port and starboard of >>>> the keel, and aft of the keel. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >>>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>>>> >>>>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Dave, >>>>>> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails >>>> best >>>>>> flat.? I assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, >>>> but I >>>>>> never checked.? What you think? >>>>>> Tom Jenkins >>>>>> M17 Scintilla >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 3 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 11:57:18 -0700 >>> From: John Schinnerer <john(a)eco-living.net> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 >>> Message-ID: <4FEA060E.1030905(a)eco-living.net> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed >>> >>> In the world of paddlecraft (canoe and kayak) we'd call that the >>> difference >>> between 'primary stability' and 'secondary stability' - sounds like the >>> M15 >>> has 'loose' primary stability (wobbles when flat) and distinct secondary >>> stability (sits securely 'on edge' or with a bit of heel). The M17 >>> sounds >>> like it has slightly more primary stability. >>> >>> Terminology...go figure! >>> >>> cheers, >>> John S. >>> >>> On 06/26/2012 11:48 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>>> Tom: >>>> >>>> more roll than yaw. the M15 wants to stay on her course (not yaw) just >>> roll ... wobble ;-) ... from port to starboard if you don't have her >>> heeling. >>>> >>>> M17 isn't doesn't do this as much as the M15. >>>> >>>> >>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>> >>>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Dave, >>>>> Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks. Been waiting years to use that >>>>> word. >>>>> >>>>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15. >>>>> i find SWEET PEA sails better with some heal ... more than a >>>>> P15 or P19. >>>>>> >>>>>> the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from >>>>> about 10 degrees one side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 deg. arc) >>>>> if you try to keep her flat as her hull shape 'wants' her to heel. >>>>> much more 'stable' if you have her leaning to one side. >>>>>> >>>>>> hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different >>>>> on the M17 and M15, especially the hull shape port and starboard of >>>>> the keel, and aft of the keel. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >>>>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>>>>> >>>>>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Dave, >>>>>>> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails >>>>> best >>>>>>> flat. I assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, >>>>> but I >>>>>>> never checked. What you think? >>>>>>> Tom Jenkins >>>>>>> M17 Scintilla >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design >>> -------------------------------------------- >>> - Eco-Living - >>> Whole Systems Design Services >>> People - Place - Learning - Integration >>> john(a)eco-living.net >>> http://eco-living.net >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 4 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 12:11:40 -0700 >>> From: Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 >>> Message-ID: <20506EB8-AE32-4B5E-846E-13F80DAD41AD(a)gte.net> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 >>> >>> Dave, >>> Got it; not 10 degrees veering of the bow from the average direction of >>> travel. That would be poor tracking. I have not sailed an M15, but as >>> John S. suggests, the M17 is not very "tippy" for its weight. Hey, the >>> aspens are trembling outside my window; time to go sailing instead of >>> sitting in front of the computer. >>> Tom >>> >>> >>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:48 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>> >>>> Tom: >>>> >>>> more roll than yaw. the M15 wants to stay on her course (not yaw) just >>> roll ... wobble ;-) ... from port to starboard if you don't have her >>> heeling. >>>> >>>> M17 isn't doesn't do this as much as the M15. >>>> >>>> >>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>> >>>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Dave, >>>>> Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks. Been waiting years >>>>> to use that word. >>>>> >>>>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15. >>>>> i find SWEET PEA sails better with some heal ... more than a >>>>> P15 or P19. >>>>>> >>>>>> the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from >>>>> about 10 degrees one side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 >>>>> deg. arc) if you try to keep her flat as her hull shape >>>>> 'wants' her to heel. much more 'stable' if you have >>>>> her leaning to one side. >>>>>> >>>>>> hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different >>>>> on the M17 and M15, especially the hull shape port and >>>>> starboard of the keel, and aft of the keel. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >>>>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>>>>> >>>>>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Dave, >>>>>>> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails >>>>> best >>>>>>> flat. I assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, >>>>> but I >>>>>>> never checked. What you think? >>>>>>> Tom Jenkins >>>>>>> M17 Scintilla >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 5 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 12:35:36 -0700 >>> From: "jerry montgomery" <jerry(a)jerrymontgomery.org> >>> To: <john(a)eco-living.net>, "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 >>> Message-ID: <CB1FB5223DC8446CBE791C095D8A19D1@jerryws10> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; format="flowed"; charset="iso-8859-1"; >>> reply-type="response" >>> >>> John- what do you paddle, out of curiousity? >>> >>> jerry >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "John Schinnerer" <john(a)eco-living.net> >>> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 11:57 AM >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 >>> >>> >>>> In the world of paddlecraft (canoe and kayak) we'd call that the >>>> difference between 'primary stability' and 'secondary stability' - >>>> sounds >>>> like the M15 has 'loose' primary stability (wobbles when flat) and >>>> distinct secondary stability (sits securely 'on edge' or with a bit of >>>> heel). The M17 sounds like it has slightly more primary stability. >>>> >>>> Terminology...go figure! >>>> >>>> cheers, >>>> John S. >>>> >>>> On 06/26/2012 11:48 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>>>> Tom: >>>>> >>>>> more roll than yaw. the M15 wants to stay on her course (not yaw) >>>>> just >>>>> roll ... wobble ;-) ... from port to starboard if you don't have her >>>>> heeling. >>>>> >>>>> M17 isn't doesn't do this as much as the M15. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>>> >>>>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Dave, >>>>>> Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks. Been waiting years >>>>>> to use that word. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15. >>>>>> i find SWEET PEA sails better with some heal ... more than a >>>>>> P15 or P19. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from >>>>>> about 10 degrees one side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 >>>>>> deg. arc) if you try to keep her flat as her hull shape >>>>>> 'wants' her to heel. much more 'stable' if you have >>>>>> her leaning to one side. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different >>>>>> on the M17 and M15, especially the hull shape port and >>>>>> starboard of the keel, and aft of the keel. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>>>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >>>>>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Dave, >>>>>>>> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails >>>>>> best >>>>>>>> flat. I assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, >>>>>> but I >>>>>>>> never checked. What you think? >>>>>>>> Tom Jenkins >>>>>>>> M17 Scintilla >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design >>>> -------------------------------------------- >>>> - Eco-Living - >>>> Whole Systems Design Services >>>> People - Place - Learning - Integration >>>> john(a)eco-living.net >>>> http://eco-living.net >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. >>> SPAMfighter has removed 6728 of my spam emails to date. >>> Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len >>> >>> Do you have a slow PC? Try Free scan >>> http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 6 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 13:02:05 -0700 (PDT) >>> From: W David Scobie <wdscobie(a)yahoo.com> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: aspens are trembling outside my window >>> Message-ID: >>> <1340740925.96334.YahooMailClassic(a)web162701.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 >>> >>> going sailing on your boat is best idea shared by any of us today!!! :-) >>> >>> >>> :: Dave Scobie >>> >>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >>>> >>>> Dave, >>>> Got it; not 10 degrees veering of the bow from the average >>>> direction of travel.? That would be poor >>>> tracking.???I have not sailed an M15, but as >>>> John S. suggests, the M17 is not very "tippy" for its >>>> weight.? Hey, the aspens are trembling outside my >>>> window; time to go sailing instead of sitting in front of >>>> the computer. >>>> Tom >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 7 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 14:01:22 -0700 >>> From: James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >>> Message-ID: <542BA21D-91FF-4789-B5A2-9B96E322BB51(a)comcast.net> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >>> >>> Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log". So much for my patent >>> hopes... >>> >>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>> >>>> i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved >>>> doing >>> this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times longer. in >>> these >>> wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. >>>> >>>> if you can steer the M15 you are moving. she will have helm control >>>> (yes, >>> rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. >>>> >>>> i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat is >>> moving i will spit over the side. i can then see if the boat is moving >>> in >>> relation to the spit. this is better than moving the tiller needlessly >>> (as >>> noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. >>>> >>>> i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - >>>> >>>> * SIT FORWARD. be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin and >>> cockpit. if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat. >>> if >>> you don't have a tiller extension get one. (FYI, this is how you should >>> be >>> sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). >>>> >>>> * sit on the leeward side. the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 degrees. >>> this is especially true in light winds. the M15 is not at her best when >>> sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. >>>> >>>> >>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>>> >>>> >>>> --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> can someone tell me how much wind it >>>>> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a >>>>> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move , the >>>>> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it >>>>> take >>>>> Thanks >>>>> KLaas >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 8 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 16:15:07 -0500 >>> From: Jeffrey Johnston <frjeff(a)gmail.com> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >>> Message-ID: >>> <CAFS5qAs+spg4m3czePcOjUthh_X77-+5aF9gBBDfdjpFX8rMKQ(a)mail.gmail.com> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >>> >>> I've used your spit log for years - with pumpkin seed hulls. >>> >>> Off to Tawas Bay (Lake Huron) for a *"Wrinkles"* sail tomorrow. >>> >>> Jeff Johnston >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 4:01 PM, James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log". So much for my patent >>>> hopes... >>>> >>>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>>> >>>>> i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved >>>> doing this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times >>>> longer. >>>> in these wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. >>>>> >>>>> if you can steer the M15 you are moving. she will have helm control >>>> (yes, rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. >>>>> >>>>> i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat is >>>> moving i will spit over the side. i can then see if the boat is moving >>>> in >>>> relation to the spit. this is better than moving the tiller needlessly >>> (as >>>> noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. >>>>> >>>>> i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - >>>>> >>>>> * SIT FORWARD. be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin >>>>> and >>>> cockpit. if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat. >>>> if >>>> you don't have a tiller extension get one. (FYI, this is how you >>>> should >>> be >>>> sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). >>>>> >>>>> * sit on the leeward side. the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 >>>>> degrees. >>>> this is especially true in light winds. the M15 is not at her best >>>> when >>>> sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >>>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> can someone tell me how much wind it >>>>>> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a >>>>>> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move , the >>>>>> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it >>>>>> take >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> KLaas >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> *Jeff+* >>> Mol?n labe! >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 9 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 14:52:26 -0700 >>> From: "jerry montgomery" <jerry(a)jerrymontgomery.org> >>> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >>> Message-ID: <0CD48FC8164349C2AC783D9694EDF838@jerryws10> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; format="flowed"; charset="utf-8"; >>> reply-type="original" >>> >>> I've always used a P log! >>> >>> jerry >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Jeffrey Johnston" <frjeff(a)gmail.com> >>> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 2:15 PM >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >>> >>> >>> I've used your spit log for years - with pumpkin seed hulls. >>> >>> Off to Tawas Bay (Lake Huron) for a *"Wrinkles"* sail tomorrow. >>> >>> Jeff Johnston >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 4:01 PM, James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log". So much for my patent >>>> hopes... >>>> >>>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>>> >>>>> i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved >>>> doing this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times >>>> longer. >>>> in these wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. >>>>> >>>>> if you can steer the M15 you are moving. she will have helm control >>>> (yes, rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. >>>>> >>>>> i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat is >>>> moving i will spit over the side. i can then see if the boat is moving >>>> in >>>> relation to the spit. this is better than moving the tiller needlessly >>>> (as >>>> noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. >>>>> >>>>> i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - >>>>> >>>>> * SIT FORWARD. be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin >>>>> and >>>> cockpit. if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat. >>>> if >>>> you don't have a tiller extension get one. (FYI, this is how you >>>> should >>>> be >>>> sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). >>>>> >>>>> * sit on the leeward side. the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 >>>>> degrees. >>>> this is especially true in light winds. the M15 is not at her best >>>> when >>>> sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >>>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> can someone tell me how much wind it >>>>>> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a >>>>>> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move , the >>>>>> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it >>>>>> take >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> KLaas >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> *Jeff+* >>> Mol?n labe! >>> >>> >>> -- >>> I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. >>> SPAMfighter has removed 6729 of my spam emails to date. >>> Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len >>> >>> Do you have a slow PC? Try Free scan >>> http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 10 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 15:03:25 -0700 >>> From: James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >>> Message-ID: <316ED3E4-DC68-475B-A458-3FDECB6C6139(a)comcast.net> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 >>> >>> Doesn't that measure water temperature too? >>> >>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 2:52 PM, jerry montgomery wrote: >>> >>>> I've always used a P log! >>>> >>>> jerry >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeffrey Johnston" >>>> <frjeff(a)gmail.com> >>>> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 2:15 PM >>>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >>>> >>>> >>>> I've used your spit log for years - with pumpkin seed hulls. >>>> >>>> Off to Tawas Bay (Lake Huron) for a *"Wrinkles"* sail tomorrow. >>>> >>>> Jeff Johnston >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 4:01 PM, James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log". So much for my patent >>>>> hopes... >>>>> >>>>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved >>>>> doing this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times >>>>> longer. >>>>> in these wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. >>>>>> >>>>>> if you can steer the M15 you are moving. she will have helm control >>>>> (yes, rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. >>>>>> >>>>>> i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat is >>>>> moving i will spit over the side. i can then see if the boat is >>>>> moving >>> in >>>>> relation to the spit. this is better than moving the tiller >>>>> needlessly >>> (as >>>>> noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. >>>>>> >>>>>> i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - >>>>>> >>>>>> * SIT FORWARD. be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin >>>>>> and >>>>> cockpit. if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat. >>>>> if >>>>> you don't have a tiller extension get one. (FYI, this is how you >>>>> should >>> be >>>>> sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). >>>>>> >>>>>> * sit on the leeward side. the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 >>>>>> degrees. >>>>> this is especially true in light winds. the M15 is not at her best >>>>> when >>>>> sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >>>>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> can someone tell me how much wind it >>>>>>> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a >>>>>>> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move , the >>>>>>> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it >>>>>>> take >>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>> KLaas >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> *Jeff+* >>>> Mol?n labe! >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. >>>> SPAMfighter has removed 6729 of my spam emails to date. >>>> Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len >>>> >>>> Do you have a slow PC? Try Free scan >>> http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 11 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 18:59:15 -0700 >>> From: Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> >>> To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com >>> Subject: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >>> Message-ID: <4FEA68F3.2080309(a)gmail.com> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed >>> >>> After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight forward >>> got me thing about tiller extensions again. >>> >>> What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. >>> >>> Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone >>> used that one? >>> >>> Thanks >>> Don M15-248 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 12 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 19:20:23 -0700 >>> From: Neil Dorf <ndorf(a)surfbest.net> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >>> Message-ID: <B7ADE2EC-6CA6-4FE3-B8AF-C3C8754FC488(a)surfbest.net> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >>> >>> I use a Ronstan Battlestick for my M15 and like it. I think it's 18" but >>> not >>> sure. The round golf ball sized, foam encased end is comfortable and >>> easy to >>> grip. >>> >>> Now contemplating Tiller Tamer vs Tiller Clutch...the latter seems to >>> have a >>> loyal following. >>> >>> Neil >>> >>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 6:59 PM, Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight >>>> forward >>> got me thing about tiller extensions again. >>>> >>>> What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. >>>> >>>> Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone >>>> used >>> that one? >>>> >>>> Thanks >>>> Don M15-248 >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 13 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 22:24:51 -0400 >>> From: "Tod" <htmills(a)zoominternet.net> >>> To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >>> Message-ID: <00d101cd540c$08177c30$18467490$@net> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >>> >>> BuscaBrisas came with a Davis Tiller Tamer, and I wouldn't wish that on >>> anyone. >>> >>> Tod >>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com >>>> [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of >>>> Neil Dorf >>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 10:20 PM >>>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >>>> >>>> I use a Ronstan Battlestick for my M15 and like it. I think it's 18" >>>> but not sure. The round golf ball sized, foam encased end is >>>> comfortable and easy to grip. >>>> >>>> Now contemplating Tiller Tamer vs Tiller Clutch...the latter seems to >>>> have a loyal following. >>>> >>>> Neil >>>> >>>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 6:59 PM, Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight >>>> forward got me thing about tiller extensions again. >>>>> >>>>> What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. >>>>> >>>>> Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone >>>> used that one? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks >>>>> Don M15-248 >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 14 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 19:51:31 -0700 >>> From: Daniel Rich <danielgrich(a)gmail.com> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >>> Message-ID: <-3834993404011304567@unknownmsgid> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 >>> >>> Tiller clutch baby! >>> >>> Daniel >>> >>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 7:21 PM, Neil Dorf <ndorf(a)surfbest.net> wrote: >>> >>>> I use a Ronstan Battlestick for my M15 and like it. I think it's 18" >>>> but >>> not sure. The round golf ball sized, foam encased end is comfortable and >>> easy to grip. >>>> >>>> Now contemplating Tiller Tamer vs Tiller Clutch...the latter seems to >>>> have >>> a loyal following. >>>> >>>> Neil >>>> >>>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 6:59 PM, Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight >>>>> forward >>> got me thing about tiller extensions again. >>>>> >>>>> What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. >>>>> >>>>> Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone >>>>> used >>> that one? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks >>>>> Don M15-248 >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 15 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 21:29:44 -0700 >>> From: "Beowulf" <beowulf2(a)cox.net> >>> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >>> Message-ID: <12E6629EA4BE4F9F8FFE5C27EA37EC1F@Mike> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; >>> reply-type=original >>> >>> Hello Don: Just went out and measured my forespar tiller extension and >>> it is >>> >>> 27 inches long and extends out to 47 inches. Had it for 30 years so I am >>> not >>> >>> sure if forespar still makes it in that length. Has worked very well for >>> me >>> as it is useable as far forward as one can sit in the cockpit. I just >>> recently purchased a tiller clutch and have installed it but have not >>> sailed >>> >>> with it yet. >>> >>> Mike Hall >>> M15 167 "Dreki" >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Daniel Rich" <danielgrich(a)gmail.com> >>> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 7:51 PM >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >>> >>> >>>> Tiller clutch baby! >>>> >>>> Daniel >>>> >>>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 7:21 PM, Neil Dorf <ndorf(a)surfbest.net> wrote: >>>> >>>>> I use a Ronstan Battlestick for my M15 and like it. I think it's 18" >>>>> but >>>>> not sure. The round golf ball sized, foam encased end is comfortable >>>>> and >>>>> easy to grip. >>>>> >>>>> Now contemplating Tiller Tamer vs Tiller Clutch...the latter seems to >>>>> have a loyal following. >>>>> >>>>> Neil >>>>> >>>>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 6:59 PM, Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight >>>>>> forward >>> >>>>>> got me thing about tiller extensions again. >>>>>> >>>>>> What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. >>>>>> >>>>>> Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone >>>>>> used that one? >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks >>>>>> Don M15-248 >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 16 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 21:39:14 -0700 >>> From: "Beowulf" <beowulf2(a)cox.net> >>> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: M_Boats: Main sail luff slides >>> Message-ID: <5A4F716F24D546938935F9EE4118AF9C@Mike> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" >>> >>> Hello guys: can someone recommend a company in the Orange Co., CA area >>> that >>> installs main sail luff slides. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Mike Hall >>> M15 167 "Dreki" >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 17 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 21:43:45 -0700 (PDT) >>> From: Stan Susman <stanpfa(a)pacbell.net> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Main sail luff slides >>> Message-ID: >>> <1340772225.33011.YahooMailNeo(a)web184506.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >>> >>> Baxter and Cicero 9496427238 in Costa Mesa >>> >>> >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> From: Beowulf <beowulf2(a)cox.net> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 9:39 PM >>> Subject: M_Boats: Main sail luff slides >>> >>> Hello guys: can someone recommend a company in the Orange Co., CA area >>> that >>> installs main sail luff slides. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Mike Hall >>> M15 167 "Dreki" >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> Message: 18 >>> Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 21:52:44 -0700 (PDT) >>> From: Stan Susman <stanpfa(a)pacbell.net> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >>> Message-ID: >>> <1340772764.28832.YahooMailNeo(a)web184501.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 >>> >>> yes and depth limited to 2 feet >>> >>> >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> From: James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >>> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 3:03 PM >>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >>> >>> Doesn't that measure water temperature too? >>> >>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 2:52 PM, jerry montgomery wrote: >>> >>>> I've always used a P log! >>>> >>>> jerry >>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeffrey Johnston" >>>> <frjeff(a)gmail.com> >>>> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >>> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 2:15 PM >>>> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >>>> >>>> >>>> I've used your spit log for years - with pumpkin seed hulls. >>>> >>>> Off to Tawas Bay (Lake Huron) for a *"Wrinkles"* sail tomorrow. >>>> >>>> Jeff Johnston >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 4:01 PM, James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log".? So much for my patent >>>>> hopes... >>>>> >>>>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved >>>>> doing this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times >>>>> longer. >>>>> in these wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. >>>>>> >>>>>> if you can steer the M15 you are moving.? she will have helm control >>>>> (yes, rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. >>>>>> >>>>>> i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat is >>>>> moving i will spit over the side.? i can then see if the boat is >>>>> moving >>> in >>>>> relation to the spit.? this is better than moving the tiller >>>>> needlessly >>> (as >>>>> noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. >>>>>> >>>>>> i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - >>>>>> >>>>>> * SIT FORWARD.? be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin >>>>>> and >>>>> cockpit.? if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat.? >>>>> if >>>>> you don't have a tiller extension get one.? (FYI, this is how you >>>>> should >>> be >>>>> sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). >>>>>> >>>>>> * sit on the leeward side.? the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 >>>>>> degrees. >>>>> this is especially true in light winds.? the M15 is not at her best >>>>> when >>>>> sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >>>>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> can someone tell me how much wind it >>>>>>> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a >>>>>>> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move ,? the >>>>>>> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it >>>>>>> take >>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>> KLaas >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> *Jeff+* >>>> Mol?n labe! >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. >>>> SPAMfighter has removed 6729 of my spam emails to date. >>>> Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len >>>> >>>> Do you have a slow PC? Try Free scan >>> http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> ------------------------------ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> montgomery_boats mailing list >>> montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com >>> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >>> >>> Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >>> >>> >>> End of montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 112, Issue 9 >>> ************************************************ >>> >>> >> >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2012 21:19:24 -0400 > From: Bill Wickett <billwick(a)gmail.com> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: M_Boats: Gas smell in cabin > Message-ID: > <CAFd5cDnRuFJYq_AAdWyK=t2DS2FKsW=hVet9=1K=jUhJCY=t3A(a)mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > Tom, > > You mentioned the gas smell in the cabin in the discussion on electric > motors. I sealed up the aft cockpit locker. I believe Dave Scobie did as > well and maybe some others. It is open to the boat from under the transom > coaming. Takes a bit of kneeling and bending. I used some 1/4" plywood > ripped and then scribed to the slightly uneven opening width. Just so it > wedged into place. Then set it in with some thickened epoxy and after that > had set up, wetted out some glass fabric strips and laid them over the ply > and thickened fillets. Not too smooth, but it is out of sight. Had to go > back with a couple of dabs of thickened epoxy at the ends to get it all > closed up. > > Sure eliminated the gas smell in the cabin. I found that the cushions even > smelled of gas. Now all that is gone. > > I would question why the factory does not seal off that aft locker as it > is > most often used for gas storage. Bob? Jerry? > > Bill Wickett > Makin' Time M17 #622 > > On Wed, Jun 27, 2012 at 9:03 PM, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: > >> Randy, >> I too have been running a German-built electric outboard on lakes and >> bays >> in my 17, and it is quite nice with the remote control option that lets >> me >> control forward, reverse and speed with one lever while attending to >> other >> things. With the battery removed, I can easily carry the 17 pound motor >> despite some back issues. Mainly, i hated the gas smell that always >> lingered in the cabin, and now it is completely gone. Being green can >> be >> pleasant indeed, if you can afford the initial higher cost per >> horsepower, >> and don't need to travel 20 miles with zero wind. It is kind of like a >> sailboat without a motor, but the device is there if you are in desperate >> need of a kick. >> Tom Jenkins >> M17 Scintilla >> >> >> On Jun 27, 2012, at 1:38 PM, Randy wrote: >> >> > After some 11 years of following threads on engine ideas, I finally >> > made >> a >> > dead weight adjustment. After all, when you are sailing the engine, >> > fuel >> > tank fuel are all dead weight. >> > I went from a 100lb. 9.9 Yamaha outboard to a 3.5hp 35lb >> electric....o.k. so >> > I am an extremist! >> > Still, it sails much better. I also got rid of one of my two deep cycle >> > marine batteries. It also was strapped at the bottom aft corner of the >> boat. >> > So far, it has worked out well in even some pretty testy mountain lake >> > winds. And, as expected, in light winds we are moving along much >> > better! >> > Thanks to all who have finally gotten through this thick skull...now a >> thick >> > "green" skull. >> > >> > Randy >> > M-17 "Fore Play" >> > >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com >> > [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of >> > montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com >> > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 10:53 PM >> > To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com >> > Subject: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 112, Issue 9 >> > >> > Send montgomery_boats mailing list submissions to >> > montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com >> > >> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >> > >> > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >> > montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com >> > >> > You can reach the person managing the list at >> > montgomery_boats-owner(a)mailman.xmission.com >> > >> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> > than >> > "Re: Contents of montgomery_boats digest..." >> > >> > >> > Today's Topics: >> > >> > 1. Re: How much heel on M17 (Tom Jenkins) >> > 2. Re: How much heel on M17 (W David Scobie) >> > 3. Re: How much heel on M17 (John Schinnerer) >> > 4. Re: How much heel on M17 (Tom Jenkins) >> > 5. Re: How much heel on M17 (jerry montgomery) >> > 6. Re: aspens are trembling outside my window (W David Scobie) >> > 7. Re: How much wind (James Poulakis) >> > 8. Re: How much wind (Jeffrey Johnston) >> > 9. Re: How much wind (jerry montgomery) >> > 10. Re: How much wind (James Poulakis) >> > 11. M15 Tiller Extension (Don) >> > 12. Re: M15 Tiller Extension (Neil Dorf) >> > 13. Re: M15 Tiller Extension (Tod) >> > 14. Re: M15 Tiller Extension (Daniel Rich) >> > 15. Re: M15 Tiller Extension (Beowulf) >> > 16. Main sail luff slides (Beowulf) >> > 17. Re: Main sail luff slides (Stan Susman) >> > 18. Re: How much wind (Stan Susman) >> > >> > >> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > >> > Message: 1 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 11:42:36 -0700 >> > From: Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 >> > Message-ID: <58224808-8687-4D91-9CDE-A19D9A4AF46C(a)gte.net> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 >> > >> > Dave, >> > Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks. Been waiting years to use that >> > word. >> > >> > On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> > >> >> the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15. i find SWEET PEA >> sails >> > better with some heal ... more than a P15 or P19. >> >> >> >> the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from about 10 degrees >> >> one >> > side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 deg. arc) if you try to keep her >> flat >> > as her hull shape 'wants' her to heel. much more 'stable' if you have >> her >> > leaning to one side. >> >> >> >> hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different on the M17 and >> M15, >> > especially the hull shape port and starboard of the keel, and aft of >> > the >> > keel. >> >> >> >> >> >> :: Dave Scobie >> >> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >> >> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> >> >> >> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> Dave, >> >>> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails best flat. I >> >>> assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, but I never checked. What you >> >>> think? >> >>> Tom Jenkins >> >>> M17 Scintilla >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 2 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 11:48:07 -0700 (PDT) >> > From: W David Scobie <wdscobie(a)yahoo.com> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 >> > Message-ID: >> > <1340736487.98898.YahooMailClassic(a)web162704.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 >> > >> > Tom: >> > >> > more roll than yaw. the M15 wants to stay on her course (not yaw) just >> roll >> > ... wobble ;-) ... from port to starboard if you don't have her >> > heeling. >> > >> > M17 isn't doesn't do this as much as the M15. >> > >> > >> > :: Dave Scobie >> > >> > --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >> >> >> >> Dave, >> >> Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks.? Been waiting years to use that >> >> word.? >> >> >> >> On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >> >> >>> the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15.? >> >> i find SWEET PEA sails better with some heal ... more than a >> >> P15 or P19. >> >>> >> >>> the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from >> >> about 10 degrees one side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 deg. arc) >> >> if you try to keep her flat as her hull shape 'wants' her to heel.? >> >> much more 'stable' if you have her leaning to one side. >> >>> >> >>> hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different >> >> on the M17 and M15, especially the hull shape port and starboard of >> >> the keel, and aft of the keel. >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> :: Dave Scobie >> >>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >> >>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> >>> >> >>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >> >> wrote: >> >>>> >> >>>> Dave, >> >>>> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails >> >> best >> >>>> flat.? I assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, >> >> but I >> >>>> never checked.? What you think? >> >>>> Tom Jenkins >> >>>> M17 Scintilla >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 3 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 11:57:18 -0700 >> > From: John Schinnerer <john(a)eco-living.net> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 >> > Message-ID: <4FEA060E.1030905(a)eco-living.net> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed >> > >> > In the world of paddlecraft (canoe and kayak) we'd call that the >> difference >> > between 'primary stability' and 'secondary stability' - sounds like the >> M15 >> > has 'loose' primary stability (wobbles when flat) and distinct >> > secondary >> > stability (sits securely 'on edge' or with a bit of heel). The M17 >> > sounds >> > like it has slightly more primary stability. >> > >> > Terminology...go figure! >> > >> > cheers, >> > John S. >> > >> > On 06/26/2012 11:48 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >> Tom: >> >> >> >> more roll than yaw. the M15 wants to stay on her course (not yaw) >> >> just >> > roll ... wobble ;-) ... from port to starboard if you don't have her >> > heeling. >> >> >> >> M17 isn't doesn't do this as much as the M15. >> >> >> >> >> >> :: Dave Scobie >> >> >> >> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> Dave, >> >>> Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks. Been waiting years to use that >> >>> word. >> >>> >> >>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >>> >> >>>> the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15. >> >>> i find SWEET PEA sails better with some heal ... more than a >> >>> P15 or P19. >> >>>> >> >>>> the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from >> >>> about 10 degrees one side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 deg. arc) >> >>> if you try to keep her flat as her hull shape 'wants' her to heel. >> >>> much more 'stable' if you have her leaning to one side. >> >>>> >> >>>> hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different >> >>> on the M17 and M15, especially the hull shape port and starboard of >> >>> the keel, and aft of the keel. >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> :: Dave Scobie >> >>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >> >>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> >>>> >> >>>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >> >>> wrote: >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Dave, >> >>>>> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails >> >>> best >> >>>>> flat. I assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, >> >>> but I >> >>>>> never checked. What you think? >> >>>>> Tom Jenkins >> >>>>> M17 Scintilla >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> > >> > -- >> > John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design >> > -------------------------------------------- >> > - Eco-Living - >> > Whole Systems Design Services >> > People - Place - Learning - Integration >> > john(a)eco-living.net >> > http://eco-living.net >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 4 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 12:11:40 -0700 >> > From: Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 >> > Message-ID: <20506EB8-AE32-4B5E-846E-13F80DAD41AD(a)gte.net> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 >> > >> > Dave, >> > Got it; not 10 degrees veering of the bow from the average direction of >> > travel. That would be poor tracking. I have not sailed an M15, but >> > as >> > John S. suggests, the M17 is not very "tippy" for its weight. Hey, the >> > aspens are trembling outside my window; time to go sailing instead of >> > sitting in front of the computer. >> > Tom >> > >> > >> > On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:48 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> > >> >> Tom: >> >> >> >> more roll than yaw. the M15 wants to stay on her course (not yaw) >> >> just >> > roll ... wobble ;-) ... from port to starboard if you don't have her >> > heeling. >> >> >> >> M17 isn't doesn't do this as much as the M15. >> >> >> >> >> >> :: Dave Scobie >> >> >> >> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> Dave, >> >>> Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks. Been waiting years >> >>> to use that word. >> >>> >> >>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >>> >> >>>> the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15. >> >>> i find SWEET PEA sails better with some heal ... more than a >> >>> P15 or P19. >> >>>> >> >>>> the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from >> >>> about 10 degrees one side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 >> >>> deg. arc) if you try to keep her flat as her hull shape >> >>> 'wants' her to heel. much more 'stable' if you have >> >>> her leaning to one side. >> >>>> >> >>>> hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different >> >>> on the M17 and M15, especially the hull shape port and >> >>> starboard of the keel, and aft of the keel. >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> :: Dave Scobie >> >>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >> >>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> >>>> >> >>>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >> >>> wrote: >> >>>>> >> >>>>> Dave, >> >>>>> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails >> >>> best >> >>>>> flat. I assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, >> >>> but I >> >>>>> never checked. What you think? >> >>>>> Tom Jenkins >> >>>>> M17 Scintilla >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 5 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 12:35:36 -0700 >> > From: "jerry montgomery" <jerry(a)jerrymontgomery.org> >> > To: <john(a)eco-living.net>, "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 >> > Message-ID: <CB1FB5223DC8446CBE791C095D8A19D1@jerryws10> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; format="flowed"; charset="iso-8859-1"; >> > reply-type="response" >> > >> > John- what do you paddle, out of curiousity? >> > >> > jerry >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: "John Schinnerer" <john(a)eco-living.net> >> > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 11:57 AM >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 >> > >> > >> >> In the world of paddlecraft (canoe and kayak) we'd call that the >> >> difference between 'primary stability' and 'secondary stability' - >> sounds >> >> like the M15 has 'loose' primary stability (wobbles when flat) and >> >> distinct secondary stability (sits securely 'on edge' or with a bit of >> >> heel). The M17 sounds like it has slightly more primary stability. >> >> >> >> Terminology...go figure! >> >> >> >> cheers, >> >> John S. >> >> >> >> On 06/26/2012 11:48 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >>> Tom: >> >>> >> >>> more roll than yaw. the M15 wants to stay on her course (not yaw) >> >>> just >> >>> roll ... wobble ;-) ... from port to starboard if you don't have her >> >>> heeling. >> >>> >> >>> M17 isn't doesn't do this as much as the M15. >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> :: Dave Scobie >> >>> >> >>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >> >>>> >> >>>> Dave, >> >>>> Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks. Been waiting years >> >>>> to use that word. >> >>>> >> >>>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >>>> >> >>>>> the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15. >> >>>> i find SWEET PEA sails better with some heal ... more than a >> >>>> P15 or P19. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from >> >>>> about 10 degrees one side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 >> >>>> deg. arc) if you try to keep her flat as her hull shape >> >>>> 'wants' her to heel. much more 'stable' if you have >> >>>> her leaning to one side. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different >> >>>> on the M17 and M15, especially the hull shape port and >> >>>> starboard of the keel, and aft of the keel. >> >>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>>> :: Dave Scobie >> >>>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >> >>>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> >>>>> >> >>>>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >> >>>> wrote: >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> Dave, >> >>>>>> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails >> >>>> best >> >>>>>> flat. I assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, >> >>>> but I >> >>>>>> never checked. What you think? >> >>>>>> Tom Jenkins >> >>>>>> M17 Scintilla >> >>>>>> >> >>>>>> >> >>>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design >> >> -------------------------------------------- >> >> - Eco-Living - >> >> Whole Systems Design Services >> >> People - Place - Learning - Integration >> >> john(a)eco-living.net >> >> http://eco-living.net >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> > -- >> > I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. >> > SPAMfighter has removed 6728 of my spam emails to date. >> > Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len >> > >> > Do you have a slow PC? Try Free scan >> > http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 6 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 13:02:05 -0700 (PDT) >> > From: W David Scobie <wdscobie(a)yahoo.com> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: aspens are trembling outside my window >> > Message-ID: >> > <1340740925.96334.YahooMailClassic(a)web162701.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 >> > >> > going sailing on your boat is best idea shared by any of us today!!! >> > :-) >> > >> > >> > :: Dave Scobie >> > >> > --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >> >> >> >> Dave, >> >> Got it; not 10 degrees veering of the bow from the average >> >> direction of travel.? That would be poor >> >> tracking.???I have not sailed an M15, but as >> >> John S. suggests, the M17 is not very "tippy" for its >> >> weight.? Hey, the aspens are trembling outside my >> >> window; time to go sailing instead of sitting in front of >> >> the computer. >> >> Tom >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 7 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 14:01:22 -0700 >> > From: James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >> > Message-ID: <542BA21D-91FF-4789-B5A2-9B96E322BB51(a)comcast.net> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >> > >> > Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log". So much for my patent >> > hopes... >> > >> > On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> > >> >> i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved >> doing >> > this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times longer. in >> these >> > wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. >> >> >> >> if you can steer the M15 you are moving. she will have helm control >> (yes, >> > rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. >> >> >> >> i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat is >> > moving i will spit over the side. i can then see if the boat is moving >> in >> > relation to the spit. this is better than moving the tiller needlessly >> (as >> > noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. >> >> >> >> i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - >> >> >> >> * SIT FORWARD. be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin >> >> and >> > cockpit. if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat. >> > if >> > you don't have a tiller extension get one. (FYI, this is how you >> > should >> be >> > sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). >> >> >> >> * sit on the leeward side. the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 >> >> degrees. >> > this is especially true in light winds. the M15 is not at her best >> > when >> > sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. >> >> >> >> >> >> :: Dave Scobie >> >> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >> >> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> >> >> >> >> >> --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> can someone tell me how much wind it >> >>> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a >> >>> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move , the >> >>> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it >> >>> take >> >>> Thanks >> >>> KLaas >> >>> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 8 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 16:15:07 -0500 >> > From: Jeffrey Johnston <frjeff(a)gmail.com> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >> > Message-ID: >> > < >> CAFS5qAs+spg4m3czePcOjUthh_X77-+5aF9gBBDfdjpFX8rMKQ(a)mail.gmail.com> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 >> > >> > I've used your spit log for years - with pumpkin seed hulls. >> > >> > Off to Tawas Bay (Lake Huron) for a *"Wrinkles"* sail tomorrow. >> > >> > Jeff Johnston >> > >> > >> > >> > On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 4:01 PM, James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >> wrote: >> > >> >> Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log". So much for my patent >> >> hopes... >> >> >> >> On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >> >> >>> i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved >> >> doing this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times >> >> longer. >> >> in these wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. >> >>> >> >>> if you can steer the M15 you are moving. she will have helm control >> >> (yes, rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. >> >>> >> >>> i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat is >> >> moving i will spit over the side. i can then see if the boat is >> >> moving >> in >> >> relation to the spit. this is better than moving the tiller >> >> needlessly >> > (as >> >> noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. >> >>> >> >>> i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - >> >>> >> >>> * SIT FORWARD. be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin >> >>> and >> >> cockpit. if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat. >> if >> >> you don't have a tiller extension get one. (FYI, this is how you >> >> should >> > be >> >> sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). >> >>> >> >>> * sit on the leeward side. the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 >> >>> degrees. >> >> this is especially true in light winds. the M15 is not at her best >> >> when >> >> sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> :: Dave Scobie >> >>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >> >>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: >> >>>> >> >>>> can someone tell me how much wind it >> >>>> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a >> >>>> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move , the >> >>>> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it >> >>>> take >> >>>> Thanks >> >>>> KLaas >> >>>> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> > -- >> > *Jeff+* >> > Mol?n labe! >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 9 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 14:52:26 -0700 >> > From: "jerry montgomery" <jerry(a)jerrymontgomery.org> >> > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >> > Message-ID: <0CD48FC8164349C2AC783D9694EDF838@jerryws10> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; format="flowed"; charset="utf-8"; >> > reply-type="original" >> > >> > I've always used a P log! >> > >> > jerry >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: "Jeffrey Johnston" <frjeff(a)gmail.com> >> > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 2:15 PM >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >> > >> > >> > I've used your spit log for years - with pumpkin seed hulls. >> > >> > Off to Tawas Bay (Lake Huron) for a *"Wrinkles"* sail tomorrow. >> > >> > Jeff Johnston >> > >> > >> > >> > On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 4:01 PM, James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >> wrote: >> > >> >> Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log". So much for my patent >> >> hopes... >> >> >> >> On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >> >> >>> i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved >> >> doing this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times >> >> longer. >> >> in these wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. >> >>> >> >>> if you can steer the M15 you are moving. she will have helm control >> >> (yes, rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. >> >>> >> >>> i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat is >> >> moving i will spit over the side. i can then see if the boat is >> >> moving >> in >> >> relation to the spit. this is better than moving the tiller >> >> needlessly >> >> (as >> >> noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. >> >>> >> >>> i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - >> >>> >> >>> * SIT FORWARD. be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin >> >>> and >> >> cockpit. if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat. >> if >> >> you don't have a tiller extension get one. (FYI, this is how you >> >> should >> >> be >> >> sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). >> >>> >> >>> * sit on the leeward side. the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 >> >>> degrees. >> >> this is especially true in light winds. the M15 is not at her best >> >> when >> >> sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> :: Dave Scobie >> >>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >> >>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: >> >>>> >> >>>> can someone tell me how much wind it >> >>>> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a >> >>>> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move , the >> >>>> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it >> >>>> take >> >>>> Thanks >> >>>> KLaas >> >>>> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> > -- >> > *Jeff+* >> > Mol?n labe! >> > >> > >> > -- >> > I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. >> > SPAMfighter has removed 6729 of my spam emails to date. >> > Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len >> > >> > Do you have a slow PC? Try Free scan >> > http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 10 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 15:03:25 -0700 >> > From: James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >> > Message-ID: <316ED3E4-DC68-475B-A458-3FDECB6C6139(a)comcast.net> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 >> > >> > Doesn't that measure water temperature too? >> > >> > On Jun 26, 2012, at 2:52 PM, jerry montgomery wrote: >> > >> >> I've always used a P log! >> >> >> >> jerry >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeffrey Johnston" >> >> <frjeff(a)gmail.com >> > >> >> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> >> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 2:15 PM >> >> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >> >> >> >> >> >> I've used your spit log for years - with pumpkin seed hulls. >> >> >> >> Off to Tawas Bay (Lake Huron) for a *"Wrinkles"* sail tomorrow. >> >> >> >> Jeff Johnston >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 4:01 PM, James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >> wrote: >> >> >> >>> Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log". So much for my patent >> >>> hopes... >> >>> >> >>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >>> >> >>>> i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved >> >>> doing this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times >> longer. >> >>> in these wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. >> >>>> >> >>>> if you can steer the M15 you are moving. she will have helm control >> >>> (yes, rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. >> >>>> >> >>>> i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat >> >>>> is >> >>> moving i will spit over the side. i can then see if the boat is >> >>> moving >> > in >> >>> relation to the spit. this is better than moving the tiller >> >>> needlessly >> > (as >> >>> noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. >> >>>> >> >>>> i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - >> >>>> >> >>>> * SIT FORWARD. be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin >> and >> >>> cockpit. if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat. >> if >> >>> you don't have a tiller extension get one. (FYI, this is how you >> should >> > be >> >>> sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). >> >>>> >> >>>> * sit on the leeward side. the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 >> degrees. >> >>> this is especially true in light winds. the M15 is not at her best >> when >> >>> sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> :: Dave Scobie >> >>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >> >>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: >> >>>>> >> >>>>> can someone tell me how much wind it >> >>>>> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a >> >>>>> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move , the >> >>>>> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it >> >>>>> take >> >>>>> Thanks >> >>>>> KLaas >> >>>>> >> >>>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> *Jeff+* >> >> Mol?n labe! >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. >> >> SPAMfighter has removed 6729 of my spam emails to date. >> >> Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len >> >> >> >> Do you have a slow PC? Try Free scan >> > http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 11 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 18:59:15 -0700 >> > From: Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> >> > To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com >> > Subject: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >> > Message-ID: <4FEA68F3.2080309(a)gmail.com> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed >> > >> > After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight >> > forward >> > got me thing about tiller extensions again. >> > >> > What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. >> > >> > Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone >> > used that one? >> > >> > Thanks >> > Don M15-248 >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 12 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 19:20:23 -0700 >> > From: Neil Dorf <ndorf(a)surfbest.net> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >> > Message-ID: <B7ADE2EC-6CA6-4FE3-B8AF-C3C8754FC488(a)surfbest.net> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >> > >> > I use a Ronstan Battlestick for my M15 and like it. I think it's 18" >> > but >> not >> > sure. The round golf ball sized, foam encased end is comfortable and >> easy to >> > grip. >> > >> > Now contemplating Tiller Tamer vs Tiller Clutch...the latter seems to >> have a >> > loyal following. >> > >> > Neil >> > >> > On Jun 26, 2012, at 6:59 PM, Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> > >> >> After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight >> >> forward >> > got me thing about tiller extensions again. >> >> >> >> What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. >> >> >> >> Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone >> used >> > that one? >> >> >> >> Thanks >> >> Don M15-248 >> >> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 13 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 22:24:51 -0400 >> > From: "Tod" <htmills(a)zoominternet.net> >> > To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >> > Message-ID: <00d101cd540c$08177c30$18467490$@net> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >> > >> > BuscaBrisas came with a Davis Tiller Tamer, and I wouldn't wish that on >> > anyone. >> > >> > Tod >> > >> >> -----Original Message----- >> >> From: montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com >> >> [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of >> >> Neil Dorf >> >> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 10:20 PM >> >> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> >> Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >> >> >> >> I use a Ronstan Battlestick for my M15 and like it. I think it's 18" >> >> but not sure. The round golf ball sized, foam encased end is >> >> comfortable and easy to grip. >> >> >> >> Now contemplating Tiller Tamer vs Tiller Clutch...the latter seems to >> >> have a loyal following. >> >> >> >> Neil >> >> >> >> On Jun 26, 2012, at 6:59 PM, Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >>> After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight >> >> forward got me thing about tiller extensions again. >> >>> >> >>> What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. >> >>> >> >>> Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone >> >> used that one? >> >>> >> >>> Thanks >> >>> Don M15-248 >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 14 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 19:51:31 -0700 >> > From: Daniel Rich <danielgrich(a)gmail.com> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >> > Message-ID: <-3834993404011304567@unknownmsgid> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 >> > >> > Tiller clutch baby! >> > >> > Daniel >> > >> > On Jun 26, 2012, at 7:21 PM, Neil Dorf <ndorf(a)surfbest.net> wrote: >> > >> >> I use a Ronstan Battlestick for my M15 and like it. I think it's 18" >> >> but >> > not sure. The round golf ball sized, foam encased end is comfortable >> > and >> > easy to grip. >> >> >> >> Now contemplating Tiller Tamer vs Tiller Clutch...the latter seems to >> have >> > a loyal following. >> >> >> >> Neil >> >> >> >> On Jun 26, 2012, at 6:59 PM, Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >>> After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight >> forward >> > got me thing about tiller extensions again. >> >>> >> >>> What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. >> >>> >> >>> Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone >> used >> > that one? >> >>> >> >>> Thanks >> >>> Don M15-248 >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 15 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 21:29:44 -0700 >> > From: "Beowulf" <beowulf2(a)cox.net> >> > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >> > Message-ID: <12E6629EA4BE4F9F8FFE5C27EA37EC1F@Mike> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; >> > reply-type=original >> > >> > Hello Don: Just went out and measured my forespar tiller extension and >> it is >> > >> > 27 inches long and extends out to 47 inches. Had it for 30 years so I >> > am >> not >> > >> > sure if forespar still makes it in that length. Has worked very well >> > for >> me >> > as it is useable as far forward as one can sit in the cockpit. I just >> > recently purchased a tiller clutch and have installed it but have not >> sailed >> > >> > with it yet. >> > >> > Mike Hall >> > M15 167 "Dreki" >> > >> > >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: "Daniel Rich" <danielgrich(a)gmail.com> >> > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 7:51 PM >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension >> > >> > >> >> Tiller clutch baby! >> >> >> >> Daniel >> >> >> >> On Jun 26, 2012, at 7:21 PM, Neil Dorf <ndorf(a)surfbest.net> wrote: >> >> >> >>> I use a Ronstan Battlestick for my M15 and like it. I think it's 18" >> but >> >>> not sure. The round golf ball sized, foam encased end is comfortable >> and >> >>> easy to grip. >> >>> >> >>> Now contemplating Tiller Tamer vs Tiller Clutch...the latter seems to >> >>> have a loyal following. >> >>> >> >>> Neil >> >>> >> >>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 6:59 PM, Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> >> >>>> After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight >> forward >> > >> >>>> got me thing about tiller extensions again. >> >>>> >> >>>> What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. >> >>>> >> >>>> Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone >> >>>> used that one? >> >>>> >> >>>> Thanks >> >>>> Don M15-248 >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>> >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 16 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 21:39:14 -0700 >> > From: "Beowulf" <beowulf2(a)cox.net> >> > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: M_Boats: Main sail luff slides >> > Message-ID: <5A4F716F24D546938935F9EE4118AF9C@Mike> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" >> > >> > Hello guys: can someone recommend a company in the Orange Co., CA area >> that >> > installs main sail luff slides. >> > >> > Thanks, >> > >> > Mike Hall >> > M15 167 "Dreki" >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 17 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 21:43:45 -0700 (PDT) >> > From: Stan Susman <stanpfa(a)pacbell.net> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: Main sail luff slides >> > Message-ID: >> > <1340772225.33011.YahooMailNeo(a)web184506.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii >> > >> > Baxter and Cicero 9496427238 in Costa Mesa >> > >> > >> > >> > ________________________________ >> > From: Beowulf <beowulf2(a)cox.net> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 9:39 PM >> > Subject: M_Boats: Main sail luff slides >> > >> > Hello guys: can someone recommend a company in the Orange Co., CA area >> that >> > installs main sail luff slides. >> > >> > Thanks, >> > >> > Mike Hall >> > M15 167 "Dreki" >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > Message: 18 >> > Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 21:52:44 -0700 (PDT) >> > From: Stan Susman <stanpfa(a)pacbell.net> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >> > Message-ID: >> > <1340772764.28832.YahooMailNeo(a)web184501.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> >> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 >> > >> > yes and depth limited to 2 feet >> > >> > >> > >> > ________________________________ >> > From: James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 3:03 PM >> > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >> > >> > Doesn't that measure water temperature too? >> > >> > On Jun 26, 2012, at 2:52 PM, jerry montgomery wrote: >> > >> >> I've always used a P log! >> >> >> >> jerry >> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeffrey Johnston" >> >> <frjeff(a)gmail.com >> > >> >> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >> > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> >> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 2:15 PM >> >> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind >> >> >> >> >> >> I've used your spit log for years - with pumpkin seed hulls. >> >> >> >> Off to Tawas Bay (Lake Huron) for a *"Wrinkles"* sail tomorrow. >> >> >> >> Jeff Johnston >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 4:01 PM, James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> >> wrote: >> >> >> >>> Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log".? So much for my patent >> >>> hopes... >> >>> >> >>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >>> >> >>>> i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved >> >>> doing this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times >> longer. >> >>> in these wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. >> >>>> >> >>>> if you can steer the M15 you are moving.? she will have helm control >> >>> (yes, rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. >> >>>> >> >>>> i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat >> >>>> is >> >>> moving i will spit over the side.? i can then see if the boat is >> >>> moving >> > in >> >>> relation to the spit.? this is better than moving the tiller >> >>> needlessly >> > (as >> >>> noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. >> >>>> >> >>>> i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - >> >>>> >> >>>> * SIT FORWARD.? be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin >> and >> >>> cockpit.? if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the >> >>> boat.? >> if >> >>> you don't have a tiller extension get one.? (FYI, this is how you >> should >> > be >> >>> sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). >> >>>> >> >>>> * sit on the leeward side.? the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 >> degrees. >> >>> this is especially true in light winds.? the M15 is not at her best >> when >> >>> sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> :: Dave Scobie >> >>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >> >>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> >>>> >> >>>> >> >>>> --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: >> >>>>> >> >>>>> can someone tell me how much wind it >> >>>>> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a >> >>>>> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move ,? the >> >>>>> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it >> >>>>> take >> >>>>> Thanks >> >>>>> KLaas >> >>>>> >> >>>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> *Jeff+* >> >> Mol?n labe! >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. >> >> SPAMfighter has removed 6729 of my spam emails to date. >> >> Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len >> >> >> >> Do you have a slow PC? Try Free scan >> > http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> > ------------------------------ >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > montgomery_boats mailing list >> > montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com >> > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats >> > >> > Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! >> > >> > >> > End of montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 112, Issue 9 >> > ************************************************ >> > >> > >> >> >> > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2012 21:29:41 -0400 > From: "Kevin Lynch" <kevnstephanie(a)verizon.net> > To: <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: M_Boats: Tiller Clutch > Message-ID: <F25CB98779B5469CBDF5050472A2A2F6@KevnStephHP> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > I like the Tiller Clutch although sometimes I accidentally flick it on and > don?t realize it but it is easily over ridden in an emergency. Another > added benefit is that you can?t lose your rudder if you bump bottom which > I almost did twice before adding my Tiller Clutch. It popped right out of > the gudgeons. If I didn?t have a good grip on it it would have been gone. > > Kevin Lynch > M15 #200, Wee Fun > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2012 21:52:13 -0500 > From: Ted Weidenbach <weid0069(a)umn.edu> > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: M_Boats: Rudder Finishes > Message-ID: <61684E48-D214-4FC8-B0EF-9D6F86B044C9(a)umn.edu> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > I kept this thread because I was doing the same thing. I just finished > putting on my 8th coat of epifanes varnish and am wondering how long I > should wait till I put the rudder back together. > > Do I have to wait a week or so until it is FULLY hard? Or can I put it > back together this Saturday and go for my first sail on my boat ever!? > > -Ted > > > > On Apr 21, 2012, at 1:02 PM, jerry montgomery wrote: > >> If you are going to trailer sail it, I'd sand it down and reshape it, >> then give it several coats of spar varnish. >> >> If keeping it under water, sand it down and re-shape it, then several >> coats of epoxy; if you need antifouling, sand and prime the epoxy. It'll >> last all summer easily. >> >> jerry >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Howard Audsley" >> <haudsley(a)tranquility.net> >> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" >> <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> >> Sent: Saturday, April 21, 2012 9:24 AM >> Subject: M_Boats: Rudder Finishes >> >> >> I have the original solid mahogany rudder that came with my 1978 M17, but >> also have a fairly new replacement that I got from Bob E. and it is also >> of the solid mahogany type. The new one came with a clear finish that has >> help up for the past few years, but is now fading and needs to be touched >> up or replaced. The entire rudder was coated with this finish. >> >> Almost ALL clear finishes specify they are not for use below the >> waterline. If the boat is trailer sailed, I presume a short dunking of a >> few days doesn't hurt and a person could use one of the polyurethane >> finishes such as Interlux Goldspar.....that is what I use on my tiller. >> Somewhere around 7 or 8 coats it starts looking like it was dipped in >> glass. >> >> But if the boat is left in the water for weeks or months on end, what >> then? >> >> For the old rudder, I sanded off all the finish and paint, repaired some >> damage, then glassed it to a few inches above the water line. That got >> several coats of epoxy over the glass cloth, and was then hit with a hard >> finish bottom paint. The problem with glassing it and sealing it up, if >> water ever does get in, it stays in. >> >> So what is the recommended coating for these solid mahogany wooden >> rudders? >> >> >> -- >> I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. >> We are a community of 7 million users fighting spam. >> SPAMfighter has removed 6389 of my spam emails to date. >> Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len >> >> The Professional version does not have this message >> >> >> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > montgomery_boats mailing list > montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats > > Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! > > > End of montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 112, Issue 12 > *************************************************

1 0

Main sail luff slides
by Beowulf 28 Jun '12

28 Jun '12

Hello guys: can someone recommend a company in the Orange Co., CA area that installs main sail luff slides. Thanks, Mike Hall M15 167 "Dreki"

2 2

PNW Montgomery / Potter Rendezvous
by shipwrecked55＠yahoo.com 28 Jun '12

28 Jun '12

Oregon sailors, mark your calender for July 14th. I'm trying to put together a day of sailing for all Montgomery and Potter owners. Fern Ridge Res. ten miles west of Eugene is known for great sailing. Steady winds out of the west make for some great sailing. You can expect close to a hundred sail boats on any given weekend during the summer. This is a lake that sail boats own!! Not alot of ski boats or jet skis. Maybe we can talk Jerry M. into trailering a boat up north. How about it Jerry? Terry

12 14

M15 in Portland area?
by dennis olmstead 28 Jun '12

28 Jun '12

Hi, I'm new to the listserv and not yet a Montgomery owner. I would really like to see one up close. If there is an owner of a M15, or M17 for that matter, that would be willing to show me their boat I would really appreciate it. Dennis Portland, OR dennis.olmstead(a)comcast.net

3 2

Rudder Finishes
by Howard Audsley 28 Jun '12

28 Jun '12

I have the original solid mahogany rudder that came with my 1978 M17, but also have a fairly new replacement that I got from Bob E. and it is also of the solid mahogany type. The new one came with a clear finish that has help up for the past few years, but is now fading and needs to be touched up or replaced. The entire rudder was coated with this finish. Almost ALL clear finishes specify they are not for use below the waterline. If the boat is trailer sailed, I presume a short dunking of a few days doesn't hurt and a person could use one of the polyurethane finishes such as Interlux Goldspar.....that is what I use on my tiller. Somewhere around 7 or 8 coats it starts looking like it was dipped in glass. But if the boat is left in the water for weeks or months on end, what then? For the old rudder, I sanded off all the finish and paint, repaired some damage, then glassed it to a few inches above the water line. That got several coats of epoxy over the glass cloth, and was then hit with a hard finish bottom paint. The problem with glassing it and sealing it up, if water ever does get in, it stays in. So what is the recommended coating for these solid mahogany wooden rudders?

8 14

Tiller Clutch
by Kevin Lynch 28 Jun '12

28 Jun '12

I like the Tiller Clutch although sometimes I accidentally flick it on and don’t realize it but it is easily over ridden in an emergency. Another added benefit is that you can’t lose your rudder if you bump bottom which I almost did twice before adding my Tiller Clutch. It popped right out of the gudgeons. If I didn’t have a good grip on it it would have been gone. Kevin Lynch M15 #200, Wee Fun

1 0

M-17 weight adjustment
by Randy 28 Jun '12

28 Jun '12

After some 11 years of following threads on engine ideas, I finally made a dead weight adjustment. After all, when you are sailing the engine, fuel tank fuel are all dead weight. I went from a 100lb. 9.9 Yamaha outboard to a 3.5hp 35lb electric....o.k. so I am an extremist! Still, it sails much better. I also got rid of one of my two deep cycle marine batteries. It also was strapped at the bottom aft corner of the boat. So far, it has worked out well in even some pretty testy mountain lake winds. And, as expected, in light winds we are moving along much better! Thanks to all who have finally gotten through this thick skull...now a thick "green" skull. Randy M-17 "Fore Play" -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 10:53 PM To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 112, Issue 9 Send montgomery_boats mailing list submissions to montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to montgomery_boats-request(a)mailman.xmission.com You can reach the person managing the list at montgomery_boats-owner(a)mailman.xmission.com When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of montgomery_boats digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: How much heel on M17 (Tom Jenkins) 2. Re: How much heel on M17 (W David Scobie) 3. Re: How much heel on M17 (John Schinnerer) 4. Re: How much heel on M17 (Tom Jenkins) 5. Re: How much heel on M17 (jerry montgomery) 6. Re: aspens are trembling outside my window (W David Scobie) 7. Re: How much wind (James Poulakis) 8. Re: How much wind (Jeffrey Johnston) 9. Re: How much wind (jerry montgomery) 10. Re: How much wind (James Poulakis) 11. M15 Tiller Extension (Don) 12. Re: M15 Tiller Extension (Neil Dorf) 13. Re: M15 Tiller Extension (Tod) 14. Re: M15 Tiller Extension (Daniel Rich) 15. Re: M15 Tiller Extension (Beowulf) 16. Main sail luff slides (Beowulf) 17. Re: Main sail luff slides (Stan Susman) 18. Re: How much wind (Stan Susman) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 11:42:36 -0700 From: Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 Message-ID: <58224808-8687-4D91-9CDE-A19D9A4AF46C(a)gte.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Dave, Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks. Been waiting years to use that word. On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: > the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15. i find SWEET PEA sails better with some heal ... more than a P15 or P19. > > the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from about 10 degrees one side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 deg. arc) if you try to keep her flat as her hull shape 'wants' her to heel. much more 'stable' if you have her leaning to one side. > > hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different on the M17 and M15, especially the hull shape port and starboard of the keel, and aft of the keel. > > > :: Dave Scobie > :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com > > --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >> >> Dave, >> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails best flat. I >> assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, but I never checked. What you >> think? >> Tom Jenkins >> M17 Scintilla >> >> > ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 11:48:07 -0700 (PDT) From: W David Scobie <wdscobie(a)yahoo.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 Message-ID: <1340736487.98898.YahooMailClassic(a)web162704.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Tom: more roll than yaw. the M15 wants to stay on her course (not yaw) just roll ... wobble ;-) ... from port to starboard if you don't have her heeling. M17 isn't doesn't do this as much as the M15. :: Dave Scobie --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: > > Dave, > Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks.? Been waiting years to use that > word.? > > On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: > > > the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15.? > i find SWEET PEA sails better with some heal ... more than a > P15 or P19. > > > > the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from > about 10 degrees one side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 deg. arc) > if you try to keep her flat as her hull shape 'wants' her to heel.? > much more 'stable' if you have her leaning to one side. > > > > hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different > on the M17 and M15, especially the hull shape port and starboard of > the keel, and aft of the keel. > > > > > > :: Dave Scobie > > :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred > > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com > > > > --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> > wrote: > >> > >> Dave, > >> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails > best > >> flat.? I assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, > but I > >> never checked.? What you think? > >> Tom Jenkins > >> M17 Scintilla > >> > >> > > > > > ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 11:57:18 -0700 From: John Schinnerer <john(a)eco-living.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 Message-ID: <4FEA060E.1030905(a)eco-living.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed In the world of paddlecraft (canoe and kayak) we'd call that the difference between 'primary stability' and 'secondary stability' - sounds like the M15 has 'loose' primary stability (wobbles when flat) and distinct secondary stability (sits securely 'on edge' or with a bit of heel). The M17 sounds like it has slightly more primary stability. Terminology...go figure! cheers, John S. On 06/26/2012 11:48 AM, W David Scobie wrote: > Tom: > > more roll than yaw. the M15 wants to stay on her course (not yaw) just roll ... wobble ;-) ... from port to starboard if you don't have her heeling. > > M17 isn't doesn't do this as much as the M15. > > > :: Dave Scobie > > --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >> >> Dave, >> Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks. Been waiting years to use that >> word. >> >> On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >>> the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15. >> i find SWEET PEA sails better with some heal ... more than a >> P15 or P19. >>> >>> the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from >> about 10 degrees one side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 deg. arc) >> if you try to keep her flat as her hull shape 'wants' her to heel. >> much more 'stable' if you have her leaning to one side. >>> >>> hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different >> on the M17 and M15, especially the hull shape port and starboard of >> the keel, and aft of the keel. >>> >>> >>> :: Dave Scobie >>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>> >>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >> wrote: >>>> >>>> Dave, >>>> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails >> best >>>> flat. I assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, >> but I >>>> never checked. What you think? >>>> Tom Jenkins >>>> M17 Scintilla >>>> >>>> >>> >> >> >> > -- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john(a)eco-living.net http://eco-living.net ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 12:11:40 -0700 From: Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 Message-ID: <20506EB8-AE32-4B5E-846E-13F80DAD41AD(a)gte.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Dave, Got it; not 10 degrees veering of the bow from the average direction of travel. That would be poor tracking. I have not sailed an M15, but as John S. suggests, the M17 is not very "tippy" for its weight. Hey, the aspens are trembling outside my window; time to go sailing instead of sitting in front of the computer. Tom On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:48 AM, W David Scobie wrote: > Tom: > > more roll than yaw. the M15 wants to stay on her course (not yaw) just roll ... wobble ;-) ... from port to starboard if you don't have her heeling. > > M17 isn't doesn't do this as much as the M15. > > > :: Dave Scobie > > --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >> >> Dave, >> Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks. Been waiting years >> to use that word. >> >> On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >>> the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15. >> i find SWEET PEA sails better with some heal ... more than a >> P15 or P19. >>> >>> the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from >> about 10 degrees one side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 >> deg. arc) if you try to keep her flat as her hull shape >> 'wants' her to heel. much more 'stable' if you have >> her leaning to one side. >>> >>> hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different >> on the M17 and M15, especially the hull shape port and >> starboard of the keel, and aft of the keel. >>> >>> >>> :: Dave Scobie >>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>> >>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >> wrote: >>>> >>>> Dave, >>>> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails >> best >>>> flat. I assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, >> but I >>>> never checked. What you think? >>>> Tom Jenkins >>>> M17 Scintilla >>>> >>>> >>> >> >> >> > ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 12:35:36 -0700 From: "jerry montgomery" <jerry(a)jerrymontgomery.org> To: <john(a)eco-living.net>, "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 Message-ID: <CB1FB5223DC8446CBE791C095D8A19D1@jerryws10> Content-Type: text/plain; format="flowed"; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type="response" John- what do you paddle, out of curiousity? jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Schinnerer" <john(a)eco-living.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 11:57 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much heel on M17 > In the world of paddlecraft (canoe and kayak) we'd call that the > difference between 'primary stability' and 'secondary stability' - sounds > like the M15 has 'loose' primary stability (wobbles when flat) and > distinct secondary stability (sits securely 'on edge' or with a bit of > heel). The M17 sounds like it has slightly more primary stability. > > Terminology...go figure! > > cheers, > John S. > > On 06/26/2012 11:48 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> Tom: >> >> more roll than yaw. the M15 wants to stay on her course (not yaw) just >> roll ... wobble ;-) ... from port to starboard if you don't have her >> heeling. >> >> M17 isn't doesn't do this as much as the M15. >> >> >> :: Dave Scobie >> >> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: >>> >>> Dave, >>> Your "wobble" is a "yaw", methinks. Been waiting years >>> to use that word. >>> >>> On Jun 26, 2012, at 11:19 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >>> >>>> the M17 likes to be a bit more flat than the M15. >>> i find SWEET PEA sails better with some heal ... more than a >>> P15 or P19. >>>> >>>> the M15 will 'wobble' port to starboard some, from >>> about 10 degrees one side to 10 degrees other side (ie, 20 >>> deg. arc) if you try to keep her flat as her hull shape >>> 'wants' her to heel. much more 'stable' if you have >>> her leaning to one side. >>>> >>>> hull shapes, when looking closely, are very different >>> on the M17 and M15, especially the hull shape port and >>> starboard of the keel, and aft of the keel. >>>> >>>> >>>> :: Dave Scobie >>>> :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >>>> :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >>>> >>>> --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Dave, >>>>> My first little boat was a Potter 14, which sails >>> best >>>>> flat. I assumed an M17 likes to be flat too, >>> but I >>>>> never checked. What you think? >>>>> Tom Jenkins >>>>> M17 Scintilla >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >> > > -- > John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design > -------------------------------------------- > - Eco-Living - > Whole Systems Design Services > People - Place - Learning - Integration > john(a)eco-living.net > http://eco-living.net > > > > -- I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. SPAMfighter has removed 6728 of my spam emails to date. Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len Do you have a slow PC? Try Free scan http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 13:02:05 -0700 (PDT) From: W David Scobie <wdscobie(a)yahoo.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: aspens are trembling outside my window Message-ID: <1340740925.96334.YahooMailClassic(a)web162701.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 going sailing on your boat is best idea shared by any of us today!!! :-) :: Dave Scobie --- On Tue, 6/26/12, Tom Jenkins <tjenk(a)gte.net> wrote: > > Dave, > Got it; not 10 degrees veering of the bow from the average > direction of travel.? That would be poor > tracking.???I have not sailed an M15, but as > John S. suggests, the M17 is not very "tippy" for its > weight.? Hey, the aspens are trembling outside my > window; time to go sailing instead of sitting in front of > the computer. > Tom > > ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 14:01:22 -0700 From: James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind Message-ID: <542BA21D-91FF-4789-B5A2-9B96E322BB51(a)comcast.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log". So much for my patent hopes... On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: > i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved doing this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times longer. in these wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. > > if you can steer the M15 you are moving. she will have helm control (yes, rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. > > i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat is moving i will spit over the side. i can then see if the boat is moving in relation to the spit. this is better than moving the tiller needlessly (as noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. > > i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - > > * SIT FORWARD. be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin and cockpit. if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat. if you don't have a tiller extension get one. (FYI, this is how you should be sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). > > * sit on the leeward side. the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 degrees. this is especially true in light winds. the M15 is not at her best when sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. > > > :: Dave Scobie > :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com > > > --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: >> >> can someone tell me how much wind it >> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a >> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move , the >> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it >> take >> Thanks >> KLaas >> > ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 16:15:07 -0500 From: Jeffrey Johnston <frjeff(a)gmail.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind Message-ID: <CAFS5qAs+spg4m3czePcOjUthh_X77-+5aF9gBBDfdjpFX8rMKQ(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 I've used your spit log for years - with pumpkin seed hulls. Off to Tawas Bay (Lake Huron) for a *"Wrinkles"* sail tomorrow. Jeff Johnston On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 4:01 PM, James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> wrote: > Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log". So much for my patent > hopes... > > On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: > > > i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved > doing this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times longer. > in these wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. > > > > if you can steer the M15 you are moving. she will have helm control > (yes, rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. > > > > i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat is > moving i will spit over the side. i can then see if the boat is moving in > relation to the spit. this is better than moving the tiller needlessly (as > noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. > > > > i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - > > > > * SIT FORWARD. be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin and > cockpit. if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat. if > you don't have a tiller extension get one. (FYI, this is how you should be > sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). > > > > * sit on the leeward side. the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 degrees. > this is especially true in light winds. the M15 is not at her best when > sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. > > > > > > :: Dave Scobie > > :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred > > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com > > > > > > --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: > >> > >> can someone tell me how much wind it > >> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a > >> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move , the > >> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it > >> take > >> Thanks > >> KLaas > >> > > > > > -- *Jeff+* Mol?n labe! ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 14:52:26 -0700 From: "jerry montgomery" <jerry(a)jerrymontgomery.org> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind Message-ID: <0CD48FC8164349C2AC783D9694EDF838@jerryws10> Content-Type: text/plain; format="flowed"; charset="utf-8"; reply-type="original" I've always used a P log! jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeffrey Johnston" <frjeff(a)gmail.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 2:15 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind I've used your spit log for years - with pumpkin seed hulls. Off to Tawas Bay (Lake Huron) for a *"Wrinkles"* sail tomorrow. Jeff Johnston On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 4:01 PM, James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> wrote: > Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log". So much for my patent > hopes... > > On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: > > > i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved > doing this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times longer. > in these wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. > > > > if you can steer the M15 you are moving. she will have helm control > (yes, rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. > > > > i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat is > moving i will spit over the side. i can then see if the boat is moving in > relation to the spit. this is better than moving the tiller needlessly > (as > noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. > > > > i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - > > > > * SIT FORWARD. be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin and > cockpit. if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat. if > you don't have a tiller extension get one. (FYI, this is how you should > be > sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). > > > > * sit on the leeward side. the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 degrees. > this is especially true in light winds. the M15 is not at her best when > sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. > > > > > > :: Dave Scobie > > :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred > > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com > > > > > > --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: > >> > >> can someone tell me how much wind it > >> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a > >> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move , the > >> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it > >> take > >> Thanks > >> KLaas > >> > > > > > -- *Jeff+* Mol?n labe! -- I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. SPAMfighter has removed 6729 of my spam emails to date. Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len Do you have a slow PC? Try Free scan http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 15:03:25 -0700 From: James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind Message-ID: <316ED3E4-DC68-475B-A458-3FDECB6C6139(a)comcast.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Doesn't that measure water temperature too? On Jun 26, 2012, at 2:52 PM, jerry montgomery wrote: > I've always used a P log! > > jerry > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeffrey Johnston" <frjeff(a)gmail.com> > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 2:15 PM > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind > > > I've used your spit log for years - with pumpkin seed hulls. > > Off to Tawas Bay (Lake Huron) for a *"Wrinkles"* sail tomorrow. > > Jeff Johnston > > > > On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 4:01 PM, James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> wrote: > >> Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log". So much for my patent >> hopes... >> >> On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >> > i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved >> doing this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times longer. >> in these wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. >> > >> > if you can steer the M15 you are moving. she will have helm control >> (yes, rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. >> > >> > i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat is >> moving i will spit over the side. i can then see if the boat is moving in >> relation to the spit. this is better than moving the tiller needlessly (as >> noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. >> > >> > i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - >> > >> > * SIT FORWARD. be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin and >> cockpit. if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat. if >> you don't have a tiller extension get one. (FYI, this is how you should be >> sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). >> > >> > * sit on the leeward side. the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 degrees. >> this is especially true in light winds. the M15 is not at her best when >> sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. >> > >> > >> > :: Dave Scobie >> > :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >> > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> > >> > >> > --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: >> >> >> >> can someone tell me how much wind it >> >> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a >> >> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move , the >> >> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it >> >> take >> >> Thanks >> >> KLaas >> >> >> > >> >> >> > > > -- > *Jeff+* > Mol?n labe! > > > -- > I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. > SPAMfighter has removed 6729 of my spam emails to date. > Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len > > Do you have a slow PC? Try Free scan http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen > > > ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 18:59:15 -0700 From: Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> To: montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension Message-ID: <4FEA68F3.2080309(a)gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight forward got me thing about tiller extensions again. What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone used that one? Thanks Don M15-248 ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 19:20:23 -0700 From: Neil Dorf <ndorf(a)surfbest.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension Message-ID: <B7ADE2EC-6CA6-4FE3-B8AF-C3C8754FC488(a)surfbest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I use a Ronstan Battlestick for my M15 and like it. I think it's 18" but not sure. The round golf ball sized, foam encased end is comfortable and easy to grip. Now contemplating Tiller Tamer vs Tiller Clutch...the latter seems to have a loyal following. Neil On Jun 26, 2012, at 6:59 PM, Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> wrote: > After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight forward got me thing about tiller extensions again. > > What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. > > Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone used that one? > > Thanks > Don M15-248 > > ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 22:24:51 -0400 From: "Tod" <htmills(a)zoominternet.net> To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension Message-ID: <00d101cd540c$08177c30$18467490$@net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" BuscaBrisas came with a Davis Tiller Tamer, and I wouldn't wish that on anyone. Tod > -----Original Message----- > From: montgomery_boats-bounces(a)mailman.xmission.com > [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of > Neil Dorf > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 10:20 PM > To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats > Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension > > I use a Ronstan Battlestick for my M15 and like it. I think it's 18" > but not sure. The round golf ball sized, foam encased end is > comfortable and easy to grip. > > Now contemplating Tiller Tamer vs Tiller Clutch...the latter seems to > have a loyal following. > > Neil > > On Jun 26, 2012, at 6:59 PM, Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> wrote: > > > After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight > forward got me thing about tiller extensions again. > > > > What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. > > > > Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone > used that one? > > > > Thanks > > Don M15-248 > > > > > ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 19:51:31 -0700 From: Daniel Rich <danielgrich(a)gmail.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension Message-ID: <-3834993404011304567@unknownmsgid> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Tiller clutch baby! Daniel On Jun 26, 2012, at 7:21 PM, Neil Dorf <ndorf(a)surfbest.net> wrote: > I use a Ronstan Battlestick for my M15 and like it. I think it's 18" but not sure. The round golf ball sized, foam encased end is comfortable and easy to grip. > > Now contemplating Tiller Tamer vs Tiller Clutch...the latter seems to have a loyal following. > > Neil > > On Jun 26, 2012, at 6:59 PM, Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> wrote: > >> After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight forward got me thing about tiller extensions again. >> >> What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. >> >> Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone used that one? >> >> Thanks >> Don M15-248 >> >> > ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 21:29:44 -0700 From: "Beowulf" <beowulf2(a)cox.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension Message-ID: <12E6629EA4BE4F9F8FFE5C27EA37EC1F@Mike> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Hello Don: Just went out and measured my forespar tiller extension and it is 27 inches long and extends out to 47 inches. Had it for 30 years so I am not sure if forespar still makes it in that length. Has worked very well for me as it is useable as far forward as one can sit in the cockpit. I just recently purchased a tiller clutch and have installed it but have not sailed with it yet. Mike Hall M15 167 "Dreki" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Daniel Rich" <danielgrich(a)gmail.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 7:51 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: M15 Tiller Extension > Tiller clutch baby! > > Daniel > > On Jun 26, 2012, at 7:21 PM, Neil Dorf <ndorf(a)surfbest.net> wrote: > >> I use a Ronstan Battlestick for my M15 and like it. I think it's 18" but >> not sure. The round golf ball sized, foam encased end is comfortable and >> easy to grip. >> >> Now contemplating Tiller Tamer vs Tiller Clutch...the latter seems to >> have a loyal following. >> >> Neil >> >> On Jun 26, 2012, at 6:59 PM, Don <sailmonty15(a)gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> After reading recent posts that the M15 sails better with weight forward >>> got me thing about tiller extensions again. >>> >>> What are other M15 sailer's using and how is it working out. >>> >>> Forespar has a 24 inch extension for a reasonable price. Has anyone >>> used that one? >>> >>> Thanks >>> Don M15-248 >>> >>> >> > ------------------------------ Message: 16 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 21:39:14 -0700 From: "Beowulf" <beowulf2(a)cox.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: M_Boats: Main sail luff slides Message-ID: <5A4F716F24D546938935F9EE4118AF9C@Mike> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hello guys: can someone recommend a company in the Orange Co., CA area that installs main sail luff slides. Thanks, Mike Hall M15 167 "Dreki" ------------------------------ Message: 17 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 21:43:45 -0700 (PDT) From: Stan Susman <stanpfa(a)pacbell.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Main sail luff slides Message-ID: <1340772225.33011.YahooMailNeo(a)web184506.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Baxter and Cicero 9496427238 in Costa Mesa ________________________________ From: Beowulf <beowulf2(a)cox.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 9:39 PM Subject: M_Boats: Main sail luff slides Hello guys: can someone recommend a company in the Orange Co., CA area that installs main sail luff slides. Thanks, Mike Hall M15 167 "Dreki" ------------------------------ Message: 18 Date: Tue, 26 Jun 2012 21:52:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Stan Susman <stanpfa(a)pacbell.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind Message-ID: <1340772764.28832.YahooMailNeo(a)web184501.mail.ne1.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 yes and depth limited to 2 feet ________________________________ From: James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 3:03 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind Doesn't that measure water temperature too? On Jun 26, 2012, at 2:52 PM, jerry montgomery wrote: > I've always used a P log! > > jerry > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeffrey Johnston" <frjeff(a)gmail.com> > To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Sent: Tuesday, June 26, 2012 2:15 PM > Subject: Re: M_Boats: How much wind > > > I've used your spit log for years - with pumpkin seed hulls. > > Off to Tawas Bay (Lake Huron) for a *"Wrinkles"* sail tomorrow. > > Jeff Johnston > > > > On Tue, Jun 26, 2012 at 4:01 PM, James Poulakis <picfo(a)comcast.net> wrote: > >> Damn, I thought I had invented the "Spit Log".? So much for my patent >> hopes... >> >> On Jun 26, 2012, at 8:17 AM, W David Scobie wrote: >> >> > i sailed my M15 when there were no cat's paws on the water ... loved >> doing this as i would sail right by boats two, three, four times longer. >> in these wind conditions the M15 will out-sail the M17 and M23. >> > >> > if you can steer the M15 you are moving.? she will have helm control >> (yes, rather slow to respond) even is she is 'barely moving'. >> > >> > i admit that this is a bit disgusting ... if i'm not sure the boat is >> moving i will spit over the side.? i can then see if the boat is moving in >> relation to the spit.? this is better than moving the tiller needlessly (as >> noted above) ... as tiller movement slows the boat. >> > >> > i recommend two things when sailing in light winds on the M15 - >> > >> > * SIT FORWARD.? be sitting at the bulkhead that separates the cabin and >> cockpit.? if you sit aft you drag the transom and slow/stop the boat.? if >> you don't have a tiller extension get one.? (FYI, this is how you should be >> sitting on the M15 when sailing regardless of the wind speed). >> > >> > * sit on the leeward side.? the M15 sails best heeling at 5-10 degrees. >> this is especially true in light winds.? the M15 is not at her best when >> sailing 'flat' ... even when the wind is 'up'. >> > >> > >> > :: Dave Scobie >> > :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred >> > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com >> > >> > >> > --- On Mon, 6/25/12, Klaas <santaklaas(a)telus.net> wrote: >> >> >> >> can someone tell me how much wind it >> >> takes to move a Monty 15 . Where I sail there is always a >> >> tide , so I can't tell what is making me move ,? the >> >> wind or the tide . But Im wondering how much wind does it >> >> take >> >> Thanks >> >> KLaas >> >> >> > >> >> >> > > > -- > *Jeff+* > Mol?n labe! > > > -- > I am using the free version of SPAMfighter. > SPAMfighter has removed 6729 of my spam emails to date. > Get the free SPAMfighter here: http://www.spamfighter.com/len > > Do you have a slow PC? Try Free scan http://www.spamfighter.com/SLOW-PCfighter?cid=sigen > > > ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ montgomery_boats mailing list montgomery_boats(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet! End of montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 112, Issue 9 ************************************************

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Tiller Clutch again
by Tom Jenkins 27 Jun '12

27 Jun '12

The Tiller Clutch gets some good comments from you out there, but I wonder if the line would make it difficult to access the motor quickly, or make it difficult to steer sitting aft when the forward seats are occupied by guests or crew. Tom Jenkins M17

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