Not at all, imho. But it's quite apparent that he's always five minutes late, as someone (funnily) said. However, I think that he manages to come up with something of his own, even if the ideas are someone else's (which they are!)

I agree that Patton's music is derivative, and zorn is an obvious source of inspiration. It's true, MP ain't no genius that breaks new ground. He's just a hell of a musician,. with a great sense for melody and sound. And the fact that such excellent bands, as Fantomas or Bungle, are possible in convention (more or less) created by Zorn only shows JZ's greatness: his ideas aren't one-offs, there's room ror genuine invention. The Fantomas show in spring was incredible. The painkiller one I saw some three weeks ago was uninteresting in comparison, in fact, it was pretty average. (I do not mean to diss Painkiller, just emphasize the quality of Patton's work) Marcin G.

case, the interest wanes the more I listen to it. I didn't like the idea of Hamid Drake sitting in at the beginning, and it proved to be quite good after all, but I'm sure Yoshida will work out a hundred times better (anyways, that's a very personal impression: I prefer Yoshida to Drake by far, sorry)

I've been unimpressed by Totsuya Yoshida at the show I saw - his playing didn't make sense for the band. Maybe it was my mood, or he may have had a night off. mg

Lets's gace it: THE drummer for the band would be circa'72-74 Al Foster... mg

The truth is that I don't find Yoshida is a very good improviser, either, but his muscular sound could have fitted Painkiller better than Drake's upbeat funk stuff. For instance, I like Yoshida & Fujii's duo "Toh-Kichi", but imho, the weakest parts of the performance are those in which Tatsuya is drawn to Fujii's terrain and not the other way round. I think he moves much better in notated environments like Ruins'. Even if I like "Saisoro" w/ Bailey, the drums sound a bit cheesy and derivative and perhaps that's what Yoshida sounds like with Painkiller. Anyway, I'd love to check myself!

Best,

Efrén del Valle

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let's hope it gets bootlegged!!! :D Andrew np: Meshuggah - "I" (for the 1millionth time) :D -----Original Message----- From: zorn-list-bounces+andrewm=mail.selc.com.au@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:zorn-list-bounces+andrewm=mail.selc.com.au@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Efrén del Valle Sent: Wednesday, 21 July 2004 7:00 PM To: Marcin G; zsteiner@butler.edu; Kurt Gottschalk Cc: zorn-list@mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: RE: zorn-list Digest, Vol 8, Issue 194 Hi Marcin et al,

The painkiller one I saw some three weeks ago was uninteresting in comparison, in fact, it was pretty average. (I do not mean to diss Painkiller, just emphasize the quality of Patton's work) Marcin G.

First time I heard Painkiller's Sept. 2003 show at Tonic with Patton on board I liked the direction the band had taken, but after repeated listenings, I really think it pales in comparison with past PK. It all sounds more structured now, cleaner, but in my case, the interest wanes the more I listen to it. I didn't like the idea of Hamid Drake sitting in at the beginning, and it proved to be quite good after all, but I'm sure Yoshida will work out a hundred times better (anyways, that's a very personal impression: I prefer Yoshida to Drake by far, sorry) Although it has been critizised in some places, "Talisman" finds, imho, a very good balance between the more extreme Painkiller and its most contemplative, dubbish side. Best, Efrén del Valle n.p: Rowe/Lehn/Schmicker "Rabbit Run" (Erstwhile) ______________________________________________ Yahoo! lanza su nueva tecnología de búsquedas ¿te atreves a comparar? http://busquedas.yahoo.es _______________________________________________ zorn-list mailing list zorn-list@mailman.xmission.com To UNSUBSCRIBE or Change Your Subscription Options, go to the webpage below http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/zorn-list