Hi all. I have been focusing on luminance-only images lately. I am enjoying just running the camera all night on a single object and collecting as much data as possible. I ran the camera last night on the Hercules Galaxy Cluster (Abell 2151). This area of the sky is packed with galaxies in just about every orientation and form. If you look closely, the entire image is simply filled with galaxies. This image is fun to peruse. Take a look, here: http://www.allred-astro.com/gpage8.html Be sure to click in a few times to get the full version. Cheers, Tyler
HO-LY MACKEREL! ________________________________ From: Tyler Allred <tylerallred@earthlink.net> To: utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com Sent: Fri, May 14, 2010 10:46:35 PM Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Abell 2151 - The Hercules Cluster Hi all. I have been focusing on luminance-only images lately. I am enjoying just running the camera all night on a single object and collecting as much data as possible. I ran the camera last night on the Hercules Galaxy Cluster (Abell 2151). This area of the sky is packed with galaxies in just about every orientation and form. If you look closely, the entire image is simply filled with galaxies. This image is fun to peruse. Take a look, here: http://www.allred-astro.com/gpage8.html Be sure to click in a few times to get the full version. Cheers, Tyler _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
I love these kinds of images, very impressive and well done. It's hard not to feel small when you look at an image like this. Bob -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Tyler Allred Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 10:47 PM To: utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Abell 2151 - The Hercules Cluster Hi all. I have been focusing on luminance-only images lately. I am enjoying just running the camera all night on a single object and collecting as much data as possible. I ran the camera last night on the Hercules Galaxy Cluster (Abell 2151). This area of the sky is packed with galaxies in just about every orientation and form. If you look closely, the entire image is simply filled with galaxies. This image is fun to peruse. Take a look, here: http://www.allred-astro.com/gpage8.html Be sure to click in a few times to get the full version. Cheers, Tyler _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
Looks like a couple of interacting galaxies in the lower left center. Bob -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Tyler Allred Sent: Friday, May 14, 2010 10:47 PM To: utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Abell 2151 - The Hercules Cluster Hi all. I have been focusing on luminance-only images lately. I am enjoying just running the camera all night on a single object and collecting as much data as possible. I ran the camera last night on the Hercules Galaxy Cluster (Abell 2151). This area of the sky is packed with galaxies in just about every orientation and form. If you look closely, the entire image is simply filled with galaxies. This image is fun to peruse. Take a look, here: http://www.allred-astro.com/gpage8.html Be sure to click in a few times to get the full version. Cheers, Tyler _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
That IS fun to scrutinize and make out all those little wispy goodies... Mind blowing really. Nice! --- On Fri, 5/14/10, Tyler Allred <tylerallred@earthlink.net> wrote:
From: Tyler Allred <tylerallred@earthlink.net> Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Abell 2151 - The Hercules Cluster To: utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com Date: Friday, May 14, 2010, 10:46 PM Hi all.
I have been focusing on luminance-only images lately. I am enjoying just running the camera all night on a single object and collecting as much data as possible. I ran the camera last night on the Hercules Galaxy Cluster (Abell 2151). This area of the sky is packed with galaxies in just about every orientation and form. If you look closely, the entire image is simply filled with galaxies.
This image is fun to peruse. Take a look, here:
http://www.allred-astro.com/gpage8.html
Be sure to click in a few times to get the full version.
Cheers,
Tyler
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Hi Friends, This article has me worried about the wonderful opportunities for astronomy at Bryce. I suspect a strip mine only ten miles away would kick up enough dust to degrade the seeing. What do you think? -- Joe http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700034412/Utahs-first-strip-mine.html
Yes, I do believe this will put Bryce at risk as well as the area around it. Funny things about it as the article alludes to. What worries me more are the comments that people are leaving behind. Wrong place to mine. I hope the Feds refuse to allow the company to expand and that they perhaps step in on this one since it threatens Bryce. On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 11:45 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com>wrote:
Hi Friends, This article has me worried about the wonderful opportunities for astronomy at Bryce. I suspect a strip mine only ten miles away would kick up enough dust to degrade the seeing. What do you think? -- Joe
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700034412/Utahs-first-strip-mine.html
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No comment! Yes, I do believe this will put Bryce at risk as well as the area around
it. Funny things about it as the article alludes to. What worries me more are the comments that people are leaving behind. Wrong place to mine. I hope the Feds refuse to allow the company to expand and that they perhaps step in on this one since it threatens Bryce.
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 11:45 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com>wrote:
Hi Friends, This article has me worried about the wonderful opportunities for astronomy at Bryce. I suspect a strip mine only ten miles away would kick up enough dust to degrade the seeing. What do you think? -- Joe
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700034412/Utahs-first-strip-mine.html
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Another article on this from last fall in the DNews at http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705345869/Environmental-groups-challenge-... "David Nimkin, southwest regional director for the National Parks Conservation Association, also opposes the permit because of the impact it will have on the park. He asserts that the clean air, night skies and views would be threatened *by dust and light pollution generated by the mine*." Strip mining operates 24/7 and the lights used at night look like Las Vegas if you have ever seen this back east. Not a good thing for the skies at Bryce. Here is a M 4600 working at night and as the narrator says at the beginning "lights up like daytime." Imagine several of these machines operating that close to Bryce, I do think it will have an impact. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpRVgVHXOco On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 1:34 PM, <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote:
No comment!
Yes, I do believe this will put Bryce at risk as well as the area around
it. Funny things about it as the article alludes to. What worries me more are the comments that people are leaving behind. Wrong place to mine. I hope the Feds refuse to allow the company to expand and that they perhaps step in on this one since it threatens Bryce.
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 11:45 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com>wrote:
Hi Friends, This article has me worried about the wonderful opportunities for astronomy at Bryce. I suspect a strip mine only ten miles away would kick up enough dust to degrade the seeing. What do you think? -- Joe
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700034412/Utahs-first-strip-mine.html
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We humans sure seem determined to ruin everything of beauty on this planet. My friend in Fla. says he can SMELL the oil in the gulf, and he's 10 miles from the coast. --- On Sun, 5/23/10, Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Sunday, May 23, 2010, 3:23 PM Another article on this from last fall in the DNews at http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705345869/Environmental-groups-challenge-...
"David Nimkin, southwest regional director for the National Parks Conservation Association, also opposes the permit because of the impact it will have on the park. He asserts that the clean air, night skies and views would be threatened *by dust and light pollution generated by the mine*."
Strip mining operates 24/7 and the lights used at night look like Las Vegas if you have ever seen this back east. Not a good thing for the skies at Bryce.
Here is a M 4600 working at night and as the narrator says at the beginning "lights up like daytime." Imagine several of these machines operating that close to Bryce, I do think it will have an impact.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpRVgVHXOco
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 1:34 PM, <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote:
No comment!
Yes, I do believe this will put Bryce at risk as well as the area around
it. Funny things about it as the article alludes to. What worries me more are the comments that people are leaving behind. Wrong place to mine. I hope the Feds refuse to allow the company to expand and that they perhaps step in on this one since it threatens Bryce.
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 11:45 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com>wrote:
Hi Friends, This article has me worried about the wonderful opportunities for astronomy at Bryce. I suspect a strip mine only ten miles away would kick up enough dust to degrade the seeing. What do you think? -- Joe
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700034412/Utahs-first-strip-mine.html
Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
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Is he sure he's not smelling Biloxi? ;o) On 5/23/10, Richard Tenney <retenney@yahoo.com> wrote:
We humans sure seem determined to ruin everything of beauty on this planet. My friend in Fla. says he can SMELL the oil in the gulf, and he's 10 miles from the coast.
My biggest problem is this will not go to power for Utah, it will go to California so they can circumvent clean air regulation. Tourism is important to S Utah this can only hurt that.
Don't forget BP has assured us the environmental harm is exaggerated. We get what we deserve, explain it to your children and grandchildren. We humans sure seem determined to ruin everything of beauty on this
planet. My friend in Fla. says he can SMELL the oil in the gulf, and he's 10 miles from the coast.
--- On Sun, 5/23/10, Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Sunday, May 23, 2010, 3:23 PM Another article on this from last fall in the DNews at http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705345869/Environmental-groups-challenge-...
"David Nimkin, southwest regional director for the National Parks Conservation Association, also opposes the permit because of the impact it will have on the park. He asserts that the clean air, night skies and views would be threatened *by dust and light pollution generated by the mine*."
Strip mining operates 24/7 and the lights used at night look like Las Vegas if you have ever seen this back east. Not a good thing for the skies at Bryce.
Here is a M 4600 working at night and as the narrator says at the beginning "lights up like daytime." Imagine several of these machines operating that close to Bryce, I do think it will have an impact.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpRVgVHXOco
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 1:34 PM, <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote:
No comment!
Yes, I do believe this will put Bryce at risk as well as the area around
it. Funny things about it as the article alludes to. What worries me more are the comments that people are leaving behind. Wrong place to mine. I hope the Feds refuse to allow the company to expand and that they perhaps step in on this one since it threatens Bryce.
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 11:45 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com>wrote:
Hi Friends, This article has me worried about the wonderful opportunities for astronomy at Bryce. I suspect a strip mine only ten miles away would kick up enough dust to degrade the seeing. What do you think? -- Joe
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700034412/Utahs-first-strip-mine.html
Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
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I am curious who is the end customer since I have been told that California only allows natural gas generation for new power projects. I think we need a buffer area around all the national parks and ten miles is not enough. I am just as worried about light pollution as dust. Is the operation going to be 24 hours a day? The federal regulations for reclaiming strip mines are very stringent and you are required to restore the land to its natural state with before and after photographs and replanting native vegetation but I am not sure if the State requirements are as strict and there are no significant requirements for private land. -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of erikhansen@thebluezone.net Sent: Monday, May 24, 2010 9:20 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce
My biggest problem is this will not go to power for Utah, it will go to California so they can circumvent clean air regulation. Tourism is important to S Utah this can only hurt that.
Don't forget BP has assured us the environmental harm is exaggerated. We get what we deserve, explain it to your children and grandchildren. We humans sure seem determined to ruin everything of beauty on this
planet. My friend in Fla. says he can SMELL the oil in the gulf, and he's 10 miles from the coast.
--- On Sun, 5/23/10, Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Sunday, May 23, 2010, 3:23 PM Another article on this from last fall in the DNews at
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705345869/Environmental-groups-challenge- strip-mining-permit-near-Bryce-Canyon-National-Park.html
"David Nimkin, southwest regional director for the National Parks Conservation Association, also opposes the permit because of the impact it will have on the park. He asserts that the clean air, night skies and views would be threatened *by dust and light pollution generated by the mine*."
Strip mining operates 24/7 and the lights used at night look like Las Vegas if you have ever seen this back east. Not a good thing for the skies at Bryce.
Here is a M 4600 working at night and as the narrator says at the beginning "lights up like daytime." Imagine several of these machines operating that close to Bryce, I do think it will have an impact.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpRVgVHXOco
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 1:34 PM, <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote:
No comment!
Yes, I do believe this will put Bryce at risk as well as the area around
it. Funny things about it as the article alludes to. What worries me more are the comments that people are leaving behind. Wrong place to mine. I hope the Feds refuse to allow the company to expand and that they perhaps step in on this one since it threatens Bryce.
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 11:45 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com>wrote:
Hi Friends, This article has me worried about the wonderful opportunities for astronomy at Bryce. I suspect a strip mine only ten miles away would kick up enough dust to degrade the seeing. What do you think? -- Joe
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700034412/Utahs-first-strip-mine.html
Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
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Don, You are correct about the reclamation requirements. The states requirements, mirror the federal ones imposed by the Office of Surface Mining (OSM). If this mine goes into operation, I am quite certain that it would operate 24 hours/day and light pollution will be an issue as well as dust. They normally operate 24 hours/day because the capitol cost of the equipment can then be spread over more tons produced thus reducing capitol cost/ton. When shooting overburden and coal, significant amounts of dust become airborne and this could impact the seeing. When they shoot what is called a pre-split, a row of blast holes at the in-mined edge of the shot block is shot un-stemmed which forms a crack in the overburden by which the main shot breaks to. This pre-split blast puts a curtain of dust straight up for several hundred feet. If the wind is blowing the direction of Bryce Canyon, it would impact the transparency. Normally shots happen in mid-afternoon near shift change (3 to 4 PM) and never at night. The active areas of strip mines are well lit up. Also, dragline booms have lights all the way to the top of the boom which usually spans up to 300 feet off the ground. I have never seen any shielding on the lights to cast the beam downward. Rodger -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Don J. Colton Sent: Monday, May 24, 2010 9:39 AM To: 'Utah Astronomy' Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce I am curious who is the end customer since I have been told that California only allows natural gas generation for new power projects. I think we need a buffer area around all the national parks and ten miles is not enough. I am just as worried about light pollution as dust. Is the operation going to be 24 hours a day? The federal regulations for reclaiming strip mines are very stringent and you are required to restore the land to its natural state with before and after photographs and replanting native vegetation but I am not sure if the State requirements are as strict and there are no significant requirements for private land. -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of erikhansen@thebluezone.net Sent: Monday, May 24, 2010 9:20 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce
My biggest problem is this will not go to power for Utah, it will go to California so they can circumvent clean air regulation. Tourism is important to S Utah this can only hurt that.
Don't forget BP has assured us the environmental harm is exaggerated. We get what we deserve, explain it to your children and grandchildren. We humans sure seem determined to ruin everything of beauty on this
planet. My friend in Fla. says he can SMELL the oil in the gulf, and he's 10 miles from the coast.
--- On Sun, 5/23/10, Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Sunday, May 23, 2010, 3:23 PM Another article on this from last fall in the DNews at
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705345869/Environmental-groups-challenge- strip-mining-permit-near-Bryce-Canyon-National-Park.html
"David Nimkin, southwest regional director for the National Parks Conservation Association, also opposes the permit because of the impact it will have on the park. He asserts that the clean air, night skies and views would be threatened *by dust and light pollution generated by the mine*."
Strip mining operates 24/7 and the lights used at night look like Las Vegas if you have ever seen this back east. Not a good thing for the skies at Bryce.
Here is a M 4600 working at night and as the narrator says at the beginning "lights up like daytime." Imagine several of these machines operating that close to Bryce, I do think it will have an impact.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpRVgVHXOco
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 1:34 PM, <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote:
No comment!
Yes, I do believe this will put Bryce at risk as well as the area around
it. Funny things about it as the article alludes to. What worries me more are the comments that people are leaving behind. Wrong place to mine. I hope the Feds refuse to allow the company to expand and that they perhaps step in on this one since it threatens Bryce.
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 11:45 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com>wrote:
Hi Friends, This article has me worried about the wonderful opportunities for astronomy at Bryce. I suspect a strip mine only ten miles away would kick up enough dust to degrade the seeing. What do you think? -- Joe
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700034412/Utahs-first-strip-mine.html
Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
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"I am curious who is the end customer since I have been told that California only allows natural gas generation for new power projects."
Don, I am sure that is a correct statement, but it probably means projects within their borders. Outside of the state, our most recent coal plants (delta and four corners) were built for California demand not Utah. I recall the four corners pollution was the first visible from space, that has hurt the skies in SW Utah, the haze greatly increased. The selling point are jobs, but I would think jobs could be created by other means, S Utah would be great for solar. These plants are of much greater benefit to California (we should at least tax the power going to California rather heavily) than Utah for they allow continued unsustainable growth there. California should be increasing use of solar panels on roofs and develop other things as well (wind and tidal power) I believe the statement is a half truth of half lie, take your pick. Erik I am curious who is the end customer since I have been told that
California only allows natural gas generation for new power projects.
I think we need a buffer area around all the national parks and ten miles is not enough. I am just as worried about light pollution as dust. Is the operation going to be 24 hours a day?
The federal regulations for reclaiming strip mines are very stringent and you are required to restore the land to its natural state with before and after photographs and replanting native vegetation but I am not sure if the State requirements are as strict and there are no significant requirements for private land.
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of erikhansen@thebluezone.net Sent: Monday, May 24, 2010 9:20 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce
My biggest problem is this will not go to power for Utah, it will go to California so they can circumvent clean air regulation. Tourism is important to S Utah this can only hurt that.
Don't forget BP has assured us the environmental harm is exaggerated.
We get what we deserve, explain it to your children and grandchildren.
We humans sure seem determined to ruin everything of beauty on this
planet. My friend in Fla. says he can SMELL the oil in the gulf, and he's 10 miles from the coast.
--- On Sun, 5/23/10, Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Sunday, May 23, 2010, 3:23 PM Another article on this from last fall in the DNews at
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705345869/Environmental-groups-challenge- strip-mining-permit-near-Bryce-Canyon-National-Park.html
"David Nimkin, southwest regional director for the National Parks Conservation Association, also opposes the permit because of the impact it will have on the park. He asserts that the clean air, night skies and views would be threatened *by dust and light pollution generated by the mine*."
Strip mining operates 24/7 and the lights used at night look like Las Vegas if you have ever seen this back east. Not a good thing for the skies at Bryce.
Here is a M 4600 working at night and as the narrator says at the beginning "lights up like daytime." Imagine several of these machines operating that close to Bryce, I do think it will have an impact.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpRVgVHXOco
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 1:34 PM, <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote:
No comment!
Yes, I do believe this will put Bryce at risk as well as the area around
it. Funny things about it as the article alludes to. What worries me more are the comments that people are leaving behind. Wrong place to mine. I hope the Feds refuse to allow the company to expand and that they perhaps step in on this one since it threatens Bryce.
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 11:45 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com>wrote:
Hi Friends, This article has me worried about the wonderful opportunities for astronomy at Bryce. I suspect a strip mine only ten miles away would kick up enough dust to degrade the seeing. What do you think? -- Joe
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700034412/Utahs-first-strip-mine.html
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It is true that the coal fired power plants provide power to California but I have been told that any new projects providing power to California, even from outside that state, must be natural gas. -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of erikhansen@thebluezone.net Sent: Monday, May 24, 2010 10:23 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce
"I am curious who is the end customer since I have been told that California only allows natural gas generation for new power projects."
Don, I am sure that is a correct statement, but it probably means projects within their borders. Outside of the state, our most recent coal plants (delta and four corners) were built for California demand not Utah. I recall the four corners pollution was the first visible from space, that has hurt the skies in SW Utah, the haze greatly increased. The selling point are jobs, but I would think jobs could be created by other means, S Utah would be great for solar. These plants are of much greater benefit to California (we should at least tax the power going to California rather heavily) than Utah for they allow continued unsustainable growth there. California should be increasing use of solar panels on roofs and develop other things as well (wind and tidal power) I believe the statement is a half truth of half lie, take your pick. Erik I am curious who is the end customer since I have been told that
California only allows natural gas generation for new power projects.
I think we need a buffer area around all the national parks and ten miles is not enough. I am just as worried about light pollution as dust. Is the operation going to be 24 hours a day?
The federal regulations for reclaiming strip mines are very stringent and you are required to restore the land to its natural state with before and after photographs and replanting native vegetation but I am not sure if the State requirements are as strict and there are no significant requirements for private land.
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of erikhansen@thebluezone.net Sent: Monday, May 24, 2010 9:20 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce
My biggest problem is this will not go to power for Utah, it will go to California so they can circumvent clean air regulation. Tourism is important to S Utah this can only hurt that.
Don't forget BP has assured us the environmental harm is exaggerated.
We get what we deserve, explain it to your children and grandchildren.
We humans sure seem determined to ruin everything of beauty on this
planet. My friend in Fla. says he can SMELL the oil in the gulf, and he's 10 miles from the coast.
--- On Sun, 5/23/10, Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Sunday, May 23, 2010, 3:23 PM Another article on this from last fall in the DNews at
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705345869/Environmental-groups-challenge-
strip-mining-permit-near-Bryce-Canyon-National-Park.html
"David Nimkin, southwest regional director for the National Parks Conservation Association, also opposes the permit because of the impact it will have on the park. He asserts that the clean air, night skies and views would be threatened *by dust and light pollution generated by the mine*."
Strip mining operates 24/7 and the lights used at night look like Las Vegas if you have ever seen this back east. Not a good thing for the skies at Bryce.
Here is a M 4600 working at night and as the narrator says at the beginning "lights up like daytime." Imagine several of these machines operating that close to Bryce, I do think it will have an impact.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpRVgVHXOco
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 1:34 PM, <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote:
No comment!
Yes, I do believe this will put Bryce at risk as well as the area around
it. Funny things about it as the article alludes to. What worries me more are the comments that people are leaving behind. Wrong place to mine. I hope the Feds refuse to allow the company to expand and that they perhaps step in on this one since it threatens Bryce.
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 11:45 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com>wrote:
Hi Friends, This article has me worried about the wonderful opportunities for astronomy at Bryce. I suspect a strip mine only ten miles away would kick up enough dust to degrade the seeing. What do you think? -- Joe
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700034412/Utahs-first-strip-mine.html
Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
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Don is right about California restrictions on plants outside their borders. The expansion of the IPP coal-fired plant near Lynndyl, Millard Count, was canceled because California is the recipient of most of the electricity from the plant -- and after a new law, California would not allow importation of new power from a coal-fired plant anywhere, even in Utah. -- Joe --- On Mon, 5/24/10, erikhansen@thebluezone.net <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote: From: erikhansen@thebluezone.net <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Monday, May 24, 2010, 10:22 AM
"I am curious who is the end customer since I have been told that California only allows natural gas generation for new power projects."
Don, I am sure that is a correct statement, but it probably means projects within their borders. Outside of the state, our most recent coal plants (delta and four corners) were built for California demand not Utah. I recall the four corners pollution was the first visible from space, that has hurt the skies in SW Utah, the haze greatly increased. The selling point are jobs, but I would think jobs could be created by other means, S Utah would be great for solar. These plants are of much greater benefit to California (we should at least tax the power going to California rather heavily) than Utah for they allow continued unsustainable growth there. California should be increasing use of solar panels on roofs and develop other things as well (wind and tidal power) I believe the statement is a half truth of half lie, take your pick. Erik I am curious who is the end customer since I have been told that
California only allows natural gas generation for new power projects.
I think we need a buffer area around all the national parks and ten miles is not enough. I am just as worried about light pollution as dust. Is the operation going to be 24 hours a day?
The federal regulations for reclaiming strip mines are very stringent and you are required to restore the land to its natural state with before and after photographs and replanting native vegetation but I am not sure if the State requirements are as strict and there are no significant requirements for private land.
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of erikhansen@thebluezone.net Sent: Monday, May 24, 2010 9:20 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce
My biggest problem is this will not go to power for Utah, it will go to California so they can circumvent clean air regulation. Tourism is important to S Utah this can only hurt that.
Don't forget BP has assured us the environmental harm is exaggerated.
We get what we deserve, explain it to your children and grandchildren.
We humans sure seem determined to ruin everything of beauty on this
planet. My friend in Fla. says he can SMELL the oil in the gulf, and he's 10 miles from the coast.
--- On Sun, 5/23/10, Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Jay Eads <jayleads@gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Threat to Bryce To: "Utah Astronomy" <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Sunday, May 23, 2010, 3:23 PM Another article on this from last fall in the DNews at
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705345869/Environmental-groups-challenge- strip-mining-permit-near-Bryce-Canyon-National-Park.html
"David Nimkin, southwest regional director for the National Parks Conservation Association, also opposes the permit because of the impact it will have on the park. He asserts that the clean air, night skies and views would be threatened *by dust and light pollution generated by the mine*."
Strip mining operates 24/7 and the lights used at night look like Las Vegas if you have ever seen this back east. Not a good thing for the skies at Bryce.
Here is a M 4600 working at night and as the narrator says at the beginning "lights up like daytime." Imagine several of these machines operating that close to Bryce, I do think it will have an impact.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fpRVgVHXOco
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 1:34 PM, <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote:
No comment!
Yes, I do believe this will put Bryce at risk as well as the area around
it. Funny things about it as the article alludes to. What worries me more are the comments that people are leaving behind. Wrong place to mine. I hope the Feds refuse to allow the company to expand and that they perhaps step in on this one since it threatens Bryce.
On Sun, May 23, 2010 at 11:45 AM, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com>wrote:
Hi Friends, This article has me worried about the wonderful opportunities for astronomy at Bryce. I suspect a strip mine only ten miles away would kick up enough dust to degrade the seeing. What do you think? -- Joe
http://www.deseretnews.com/article/700034412/Utahs-first-strip-mine.html
Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
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Folks, I hate to break it to you, but anywhere near anything marketable is at risk. It's only a matter of time. The only solution is ZPG, worldwide, and a sustainable, non-growth oriented world ecconomy. The hard-core capitalists are seething at that thought. But hey, the planet is only capable of supporting so much. Sooner or later, we have to: 1. Level-off the population and forget "growth" as a way to sustain ecconomies. or 2. Make space travel commonplace and start mining the rest of the solar system. This should keep us going for a few millennia. or 3. Do the lemming thing and prove Malthus correct. Take your pick. Waving a political document won't change the choices.
Wow and more wow Tyler, Dale ________________________________ From: Tyler Allred <tylerallred@earthlink.net> To: utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com Sent: Fri, May 14, 2010 10:46:35 PM Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Abell 2151 - The Hercules Cluster Hi all. I have been focusing on luminance-only images lately. I am enjoying just running the camera all night on a single object and collecting as much data as possible. I ran the camera last night on the Hercules Galaxy Cluster (Abell 2151). This area of the sky is packed with galaxies in just about every orientation and form. If you look closely, the entire image is simply filled with galaxies. This image is fun to peruse. Take a look, here: http://www.allred-astro.com/gpage8.html Be sure to click in a few times to get the full version. Cheers, Tyler _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
participants (10)
-
Chuck Hards -
Dale Wilson -
Don J. Colton -
erikhansen＠thebluezone.net -
Jay Eads -
Joe Bauman -
Richard Tenney -
Robert Taylor -
Rodger C. Fry -
Tyler Allred