Re: [Utah-astronomy] Natural Bridges Saturday Night
Dan, You are right, a Star Party can happen without board supervision. We are talking about Star Parties that the club organizes and invites the public. I would say I have been involved with more informal than formal star parties. SLAS welcomes all members and non-members and by no means tries to regulate where members go. Many want to have group events and mingle with others, we try to accommodate this with new moon events. Erik --- outwest112@yahoo.com wrote: From: daniel turner <outwest112@yahoo.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Natural Bridges Saturday Night Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 13:35:03 -0700 (PDT) This has morphed into a discussion of SLAS and I'm OK with that but I hope people don't get offended when I express my opinion on this. Star parties do not require board member supervision. They really don't even need club affiation. It just requires some one with a telescope set up in a place where some one else can find them. If you go to a National Park and just take your telescope, ask if you can set it up where others can share the view. Star Parties can be spontaneous. This is the spirit of Side Walk Astonomy. It's much better than the turf wars that we go through to try and come up with a schedule. And indeed many people are doing just this. Rob and I met a family at Wolf Creek with an Orion Dob from the Planetarium. They were like others I have met on forest service or BLM land. They have a telescope, are interested in astronomy, they are a joy to be with, and they would never even consider joining SLAS. Maybe we don't get recognition because we don't deserve it. DT _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://gallery.utahastronomy.com Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
I'll offer one more post on this subject then keep my mouth - uh, keyboard quiet. I offered to do a SLAS-sanctioned/sponsored event in a nearby National Park a couple of years ago. I committed to organize the event and received not a single offer for help from any other SLAS member or even non-SLAS member. The park was no further away than Bryce Canyon or Capitol Reef. When a conflict with my work came up and I had to bail, the NP contact was very unhappy with me. (Yes, I'm afraid I do put work ahead of astronomy.) Fortunately, the weather didn't cooperate that weekend so it wasn't as big a flop as it could have been. So NO, I do NOT support a more aggressive or more extensive star party schedule for SLAS than what we've been doing for the past few years. In fact, I think double-booking for anything such as this weekend's simultaneous star parties at This is the Place and SPOC is a big mistake. I make this observation from personal experience, and not just the bad experience to which I referred above. This issue has been debated for years, including during all the time that I served on the Board. Double-booking and scheduling two or three events each week has NEVER worked. SLAS-sponsored events become an obligation to all SLAS members, but only a relative few take the responsibility seriously. So, let's stick to what we do well and not expand official SLAS events beyond those that have been consistently well-supported in the past. I don't recall that "sidewalk astronomy" is anywhere in our constitution. Those of us who enjoy such informal activities are not at all limited if SLAS doesn't formally schedule, sanction or support them. Regards...and apologies if my SHOUTING has offended anyone, Kim -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of zaurak@digis.net Sent: Friday, September 05, 2008 9:04 AM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Natural Bridges Saturday Night Dan, You are right, a Star Party can happen without board supervision. We are talking about Star Parties that the club organizes and invites the public. I would say I have been involved with more informal than formal star parties. SLAS welcomes all members and non-members and by no means tries to regulate where members go. Many want to have group events and mingle with others, we try to accommodate this with new moon events. Erik --- outwest112@yahoo.com wrote: From: daniel turner <outwest112@yahoo.com> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Natural Bridges Saturday Night Date: Thu, 4 Sep 2008 13:35:03 -0700 (PDT) This has morphed into a discussion of SLAS and I'm OK with that but I hope people don't get offended when I express my opinion on this. Star parties do not require board member supervision. They really don't even need club affiation. It just requires some one with a telescope set up in a place where some one else can find them. If you go to a National Park and just take your telescope, ask if you can set it up where others can share the view. Star Parties can be spontaneous. This is the spirit of Side Walk Astonomy. It's much better than the turf wars that we go through to try and come up with a schedule. And indeed many people are doing just this. Rob and I met a family at Wolf Creek with an Orion Dob from the Planetarium. They were like others I have met on forest service or BLM land. They have a telescope, are interested in astronomy, they are a joy to be with, and they would never even consider joining SLAS. Maybe we don't get recognition because we don't deserve it. DT _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://gallery.utahastronomy.com Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://gallery.utahastronomy.com Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.6.16/1653 - Release Date: 9/5/2008 6:57 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 270.6.16/1653 - Release Date: 9/5/2008 6:57 AM
This is a healthy discussion. I have not been offended by anything said so far, nor a I likely to be. I don't take myself that serious. I guess the question of star party policy ties in to the bigger picture of where SLAS fits into the astronomy community and how this has changed over time. SLAS has a lot of emotional investment in SPOC as well as the money that was spent there. New ideas that may compete with SPOC for our attention are greeted with resistance. Events outside of SPOC, new or old, are viewed with suspicion if not actively undermined. That includes the "This is the Place" venue and the special star parties. Yet to make SLAS a "SPOC first" club is a serios mistake in my opinion. People don't want to drive to SPOC, stand in long lines and have the doors closed on them at 11 pm. People these days have the option of buying their own telescope and after a short learning curve they no longer need the observatory. They may go to SPOC to set up on the lawn a few times but they soon find that they can go anywhere in Utah where it's dark and on their own time. I believe the era of good mass produced telescopes is making the observatory and even large group star parties much less important. The National Park star parties have their own issues besides the driving distances. Their size cam be intimidating and some of the staff seem to have control issues. They are attended by people who only get out a few times a year and so service a smaller group who might not go to other events. They don't really compete with SPOC directly. The special star parties have undergone a change since I joined the club. We now do them for money and that changes the whole dynamic of the events. The going rate is $50 a telescope and sometimes there is a set number minimum or maximum that needs to be met. This has moved us away from charity events like cancer and diabetes and toward sites like Sundance, Solitude, and corporate groups like Discovey. I've met some one who would like to compete with us for school parties by offering a lower price. He thinks our prices are too high. I've seen charity events canceled because other clubs consider the event the be "their customer" and we were "poaching". My preference would be to do these events for free. I certainly alway did them for free and if the money is gone maybe the spirit of giving would come back. In closing I feel that cutting back or not considering events outside of SPOC would be a mistake. The world has moved beyond "brick and mortar astronomy" (Chuck Hard's term for it). People have options that they didn't have 40 years ago when SLAS was started. DT
participants (3)
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daniel turner -
Kim -
zaurak＠digis.net