Re: Today's perihelion and global warming
Ed Lunt stated a key part of the question. Undoubtedly earthly (and Martian) climate has extreme variations over time. Human collective memory- any kept human records, for that matter- are but the briefest eyeblink. For anyone to think that the climate we historically experience is some kind of natural state of "normalcy" is ridiculously naive. That said, if we are currently experiencing a natural cycle of global warming, it would be just as naive to think that man-made contributions are inconsequential. The evidence is there, in various forms, clearly showing a warming trend over the course of a single lifetime. The implications for the massive populations living in coastal regions are ominous, both in terms of shrinking coastlines and storm frequency and severity. Even relatively minor climate shifts can have serious repercussions in food production. Ecosystems are changing in ways we cannot always predict. It only makes sense to do everything in our power to not accellerate those changes. Even if examinined in purely ecconomic terms, it becomes clear that by ignoring man-made contributions to global warming for short-term ecconomic gain, it will cost vastly more in the long run. We have to think in terms of generations, not simply our own lifetime. The slower the climate changes, the less it affects our collective pocketbooks ("human misery" factor aside). Dismissing the man-made contributions completely is a case of "The Emperors New Clothes". Actually it's probably more simple than that, just plain old greed. "Leave no trace" is more than just a good camping policy. Especially since we have no idea what the "end state" of such change will be. --- Edward Lunt <lunco@yahoo.com> wrote:
I read somewhere, about two years ago, that the polar ice caps on Mars were receding due to higher temperatures on the planet. The suggestion was that if Mars was experiencing global warming, then global warming of the earth was in part, at least, to natural causes.
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There are actually 2 parts to this issue: 1) Other than a few cranks, there's no one who doubts global warming. The question is 'what is causing it?'. There is convincing evidence that at least a good portion of it may be human-caused. There is also geological and astronomical evidence that there are natural cycles at play. Perhaps it's a combination of the two. Perhaps one's working against the other. For some people, it's an intensely political question, so let's set it aside for a sec. 2) This is the important one. What are we going to do about it? Whatever the cause of warming, it's going to affect life on earth. How do we prepare for --and possibly reduce--its effects? Climate change appears to be inevitable--there's evidence for this long before there were people to blame it on. Climate change may mean a net loss of arable land. Can the earth continue to support its current 7 billion or so people? Tropical diseases like malaria will move closer to the poles. With the declining effectiveness of various medications, what does this mean for the health of future generations? One can easily extrapolate other consequences. Pick your poison. All in all, it would appear to be simple practicality to learn to live a little less large. By learning to reduce energy consumption, pollutant generation, water usage, etc, we might better prepare ourselves for changes that now appear to be inevitable. Humans don't appear to be very good at this. This globe is littered with ruined civilizations that managed to outstrip their resources, ignoring every warning sign along the way. It would be nice to be the exception to this rule. -mc
Michael and Chuck; Good points all. It's too bad that issues as important as our environment and our responsibility to care for our natural resources get politicized as they do. I appreciate your responses and have learned something in the process. I did not know that our sun was a variable star. (Guess I never really thought about it). Also, the information about water on Mars was very interesting. In my humble opinion, the sharing of knowledge is the best way of helping all to have a better understanding of the world we live in and how to live in it better. Thanks again. Ed --- Michael Carnes <MichaelCarnes@earthlink.net> wrote:
There are actually 2 parts to this issue:
1) Other than a few cranks, there's no one who doubts global warming. The question is 'what is causing it?'. There is convincing evidence that at least a good portion of it may be human-caused. There is also geological and astronomical evidence that there are natural cycles at play. Perhaps it's a combination of the two. Perhaps one's working against the other. For some people, it's an intensely political question, so let's set it aside for a sec.
2) This is the important one. What are we going to do about it? Whatever the cause of warming, it's going to affect life on earth. How do we prepare for --and possibly reduce--its effects? Climate change appears to be inevitable--there's evidence for this long before there were people to blame it on. Climate change may mean a net loss of arable land. Can the earth continue to support its current 7 billion or so people? Tropical diseases like malaria will move closer to the poles. With the declining effectiveness of various medications, what does this mean for the health of future generations? One can easily extrapolate other consequences. Pick your poison.
All in all, it would appear to be simple practicality to learn to live a little less large. By learning to reduce energy consumption, pollutant generation, water usage, etc, we might better prepare ourselves for changes that now appear to be inevitable. Humans don't appear to be very good at this. This globe is littered with ruined civilizations that managed to outstrip their resources, ignoring every warning sign along the way. It would be nice to be the exception to this rule.
-mc
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participants (3)
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Chuck Hards -
Edward Lunt -
Michael Carnes