With the weather being so (relatively) nice today I was able to do my first Sun viewing in a while. Not much on offer in the way of sunspots but several prominences all around the limb including one huge one blasting off the northern limb. I have a pair of 10x50 which I recently equipped with solar filters from Orion. Crisp views. I like the yellow color and they showed last week's sunspots very nicely. So now I'm thinking about similar filters for my 11x80. But would there be any advantage to 11x80 white light views of the Sun over 10x50. More light gathering to be sure but, heck, we're talking the Sun here. No shortage of light even in 10x50. And I can't imagine I'd get that much more with 11 power vs 10 power. But binocular minds far superior to mine live on this list. Hence my question. Should I go with 11x80 solar filters? Many thanks, patrick
It would seem that 80 mm would be better for night time but little advantage for solar viewing in white light. If you are using them to track sunspots another set a solar filters seems somewhat a waste. 11 x 80 gets hard to hand hold.
With the weather being so (relatively) nice today I was able to do my
first Sun viewing in a while.
Not much on offer in the way of sunspots but several prominences all around the limb including one huge one blasting off the northern limb.
I have a pair of 10x50 which I recently equipped with solar filters from Orion. Crisp views. I like the yellow color and they showed last week's sunspots very nicely.
So now I'm thinking about similar filters for my 11x80.
But would there be any advantage to 11x80 white light views of the Sun over 10x50.
More light gathering to be sure but, heck, we're talking the Sun here. No shortage of light even in 10x50.
And I can't imagine I'd get that much more with 11 power vs 10 power.
But binocular minds far superior to mine live on this list. Hence my question. Should I go with 11x80 solar filters?
Many thanks,
patrick _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
You would get increased resolution, which would be of value for h-alpha but probably not much for sunspots. -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Patrick Wiggins Sent: Saturday, April 03, 2010 3:21 PM To: utah astronomy utah astronomy listserve Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Bino question With the weather being so (relatively) nice today I was able to do my first Sun viewing in a while. Not much on offer in the way of sunspots but several prominences all around the limb including one huge one blasting off the northern limb. I have a pair of 10x50 which I recently equipped with solar filters from Orion. Crisp views. I like the yellow color and they showed last week's sunspots very nicely. So now I'm thinking about similar filters for my 11x80. But would there be any advantage to 11x80 white light views of the Sun over 10x50. More light gathering to be sure but, heck, we're talking the Sun here. No shortage of light even in 10x50. And I can't imagine I'd get that much more with 11 power vs 10 power. But binocular minds far superior to mine live on this list. Hence my question. Should I go with 11x80 solar filters? Many thanks, patrick _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php Visit the Wiki: http://www.utahastronomy.com
Actually increased resolution will show you smaller sunspots, but it's up to you to decide if tinier sunspots are worth the extra weight of larger aperture. I have Baader white-light filters for my 70mm binos (both 15x and 20x), but for the sun, I think a 20x50mm bino would be just about right. There are no exit-pupil concerns for daytime viewing. H-alpha resolution on the sun is limited more by the bandpass of the filter than aperture. Some of you may recall my PSO (Pocket Solar Observatory) which is merely a 12x25mm bino equipped with Baader solar filters in lathe-turned plastic cells. My "grab and go" white light setup. I'll take a photo of it soon and post it to the SLAS Gallery, if anyone is interested. On Sat, Apr 3, 2010 at 10:35 PM, Craig Smith <cs2560@gmail.com> wrote:
You would get increased resolution, which would be of value for h-alpha but probably not much for sunspots.
Thanks Erik, Craig and Chuck, I think I'll stick with the 10x50 and save the 11x80 for after dark. patrick On 05 Apr 2010, at 09:09, Chuck Hards wrote:
Actually increased resolution will show you smaller sunspots, but it's up to you to decide if tinier sunspots are worth the extra weight of larger aperture. I have Baader white-light filters for my 70mm binos (both 15x and 20x), but for the sun, I think a 20x50mm bino would be just about right. There are no exit-pupil concerns for daytime viewing.
H-alpha resolution on the sun is limited more by the bandpass of the filter than aperture.
Some of you may recall my PSO (Pocket Solar Observatory) which is merely a 12x25mm bino equipped with Baader solar filters in lathe-turned plastic cells. My "grab and go" white light setup.
I'll take a photo of it soon and post it to the SLAS Gallery, if anyone is interested.
On Sat, Apr 3, 2010 at 10:35 PM, Craig Smith <cs2560@gmail.com> wrote:
You would get increased resolution, which would be of value for h-alpha but probably not much for sunspots.
One day I was at Vaughn's, who owns a .4 A filter and has an 80mm F30. I brought the clubs .5 A filter and the 50mm F30. We switched the filters between scopes, the .4 on the 50mm clearly out preformed the .5 on the 80mm. It also seemed to me the performance of the .4 was the same on the 50mm vs the 80mm. Vaughn also agreed.
It is hard to imagine that 1x more mag would make any difference is resolution, in white light. Another 10x seems like it would. Actually increased resolution will show you smaller sunspots, but it's up
to you to decide if tinier sunspots are worth the extra weight of larger aperture. I have Baader white-light filters for my 70mm binos (both 15x and 20x), but for the sun, I think a 20x50mm bino would be just about right. There are no exit-pupil concerns for daytime viewing.
H-alpha resolution on the sun is limited more by the bandpass of the filter than aperture.
Some of you may recall my PSO (Pocket Solar Observatory) which is merely a 12x25mm bino equipped with Baader solar filters in lathe-turned plastic cells. My "grab and go" white light setup.
I'll take a photo of it soon and post it to the SLAS Gallery, if anyone is interested.
On Sat, Apr 3, 2010 at 10:35 PM, Craig Smith <cs2560@gmail.com> wrote:
You would get increased resolution, which would be of value for h-alpha but probably not much for sunspots.
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The seeing during the day is never diffraction-limited; it's usually a boiling mess. This is the reason seasoned solar observers like to work before the ground heats up, typically before about 10 AM during the warm months of the year. Also why many solar observatories are surrounded by water or at very high altitude. Increased aperture for the amateur rarely, if ever, yields noticeable resolution gains when the air is the determining factor. 50mm of aperture is almost always plenty for the sun. The PST is a great little scope, showing many H-a details. But notice that for just a bit tighter filter bandbass, you have to spend considerably more money. Remember that most set-ups like this need to be "tuned"; the PST has an adjustment for this and sometimes a bit of tweaking will improve the contrast of details immensely. I'll be out at SPOC tonght for a refresher, if I can get out there before sunset, I'll bring my PST for a peek at the sun. On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 9:44 AM, <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote:
One day I was at Vaughn's, who owns a .4 A filter and has an 80mm F30. I brought the clubs .5 A filter and the 50mm F30. We switched the filters between scopes, the .4 on the 50mm clearly out preformed the .5 on the 80mm. It also seemed to me the performance of the .4 was the same on the 50mm vs the 80mm. Vaughn also agreed.
It is hard to imagine that 1x more mag would make any difference is resolution, in white light. Another 10x seems like it would.
To me it seems the PST came out after the last solar maximum. Their has not really been enough solar activity in H-Alpha light to really compare the performance of PST's vs Day Star. The PST is a good scope and price does it make more accessible to amateurs.The difference between .4 A and .5 A was really profound in brightness and contrast. Smaller aperture can also be less affected by "bad air", bigger scopes also frequently "shake" noticeably in a breeze. All in all I do prefer smaller apertures for solar viewing. One of the best views I ever had in H-alpha was 3-4 hours before sunset, but my observatory is surrounded by big grassy lawns. Where we have our sun parties has a lot of asphalt nearby.
I am looking forward to increased activity on the sun, it has been pretty dull for quite a few years now. The seeing during the day is never diffraction-limited; it's usually a
boiling mess. This is the reason seasoned solar observers like to work before the ground heats up, typically before about 10 AM during the warm months of the year. Also why many solar observatories are surrounded by water or at very high altitude. Increased aperture for the amateur rarely, if ever, yields noticeable resolution gains when the air is the determining factor. 50mm of aperture is almost always plenty for the sun.
The PST is a great little scope, showing many H-a details. But notice that for just a bit tighter filter bandbass, you have to spend considerably more money.
Remember that most set-ups like this need to be "tuned"; the PST has an adjustment for this and sometimes a bit of tweaking will improve the contrast of details immensely.
I'll be out at SPOC tonght for a refresher, if I can get out there before sunset, I'll bring my PST for a peek at the sun.
On Tue, Apr 6, 2010 at 9:44 AM, <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote:
One day I was at Vaughn's, who owns a .4 A filter and has an 80mm F30. I brought the clubs .5 A filter and the 50mm F30. We switched the filters between scopes, the .4 on the 50mm clearly out preformed the .5 on the 80mm. It also seemed to me the performance of the .4 was the same on the 50mm vs the 80mm. Vaughn also agreed.
It is hard to imagine that 1x more mag would make any difference is resolution, in white light. Another 10x seems like it would.
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Erik, you can always make an effective comparison using just solar granulation or surface features- you don't need huge sunspot formations or prominences. This is always present, even at solar minimum. It's rarely, if ever, visible in the PST. The PST was designed around a price point. It's a cool little solar scope for the money, but if someone wanted to get a bit more serious about solar observation, I'd recommend the Coronado SolarMax 60, or a DayStar. Of course, you'll spend a lot more money! The PST fills the bill for me. On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 11:51 AM, <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote:
To me it seems the PST came out after the last solar maximum. Their has not really been enough solar activity in H-Alpha light to really compare the performance of PST's vs Day Star.
For the last few years all that has been visible in H-Alpha is granulation it looks like an Orange and very uniform through out. Their have been no other surface features visible during this minimum. Prominences viewed from the top can be spectacular, during maximum prominences are everywhere not just on limb. I am reserving my judgement on PST until we are at maximum.
SLAS members are fortunate to have access to PST's and a .5 Daystar. The Daystar is more tuneable than the PST, although onband viewing is most pleasing to me. Erik, you can always make an effective comparison using just solar
granulation or surface features- you don't need huge sunspot formations or prominences. This is always present, even at solar minimum. It's rarely, if ever, visible in the PST.
The PST was designed around a price point. It's a cool little solar scope for the money, but if someone wanted to get a bit more serious about solar observation, I'd recommend the Coronado SolarMax 60, or a DayStar. Of course, you'll spend a lot more money! The PST fills the bill for me.
On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 11:51 AM, <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote:
To me it seems the PST came out after the last solar maximum. Their has not really been enough solar activity in H-Alpha light to really compare the performance of PST's vs Day Star.
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I'm interested in seeing how the Denkmeier Solar Spectrum 60 - PST upgrade works. It has a good writeup in the latest Astronomy Technology Today magazine. It looks like the current pricing for the upgrade is $599. Hopefully, some additional reviews will show up. It also appears that Denkmeier has a PST binoviewer product. There appears to be a bit of info here: http://deepskybinoviewer.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_... Clear skies, Dale. -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of erikhansen@TheBlueZone.net Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 2010 3:52 PM To: Utah Astronomy Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Bino question
For the last few years all that has been visible in H-Alpha is granulation it looks like an Orange and very uniform through out. Their have been no other surface features visible during this minimum. Prominences viewed from the top can be spectacular, during maximum prominences are everywhere not just on limb. I am reserving my judgement on PST until we are at maximum.
SLAS members are fortunate to have access to PST's and a .5 Daystar. The Daystar is more tuneable than the PST, although onband viewing is most pleasing to me. Erik, you can always make an effective comparison using just solar
granulation or surface features- you don't need huge sunspot formations or prominences. This is always present, even at solar minimum. It's rarely, if ever, visible in the PST.
The PST was designed around a price point. It's a cool little solar scope for the money, but if someone wanted to get a bit more serious about solar observation, I'd recommend the Coronado SolarMax 60, or a DayStar. Of course, you'll spend a lot more money! The PST fills the bill for me.
On Wed, Apr 7, 2010 at 11:51 AM, <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> wrote:
To me it seems the PST came out after the last solar maximum. Their has not really been enough solar activity in H-Alpha light to really compare the performance of PST's vs Day Star.
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This is cool, Dale, thanks for calling it to our attention. I may do some experimenting with various Barlows and my inexpensive (non-Denk) bino viewer. The SS60 upgrade looks tempting, but it's pretty pricey for a single-object accessory, IMO, on top of the investment in the PST itself. I guess if you are really interested in solar observation, though, that's justification enough. On Mon, Apr 12, 2010 at 9:21 AM, Dale Hooper <Dale.Hooper@sdl.usu.edu>wrote:
I'm interested in seeing how the Denkmeier Solar Spectrum 60 - PST upgrade works. It has a good writeup in the latest Astronomy Technology Today magazine. It looks like the current pricing for the upgrade is $599. Hopefully, some additional reviews will show up.
It also appears that Denkmeier has a PST binoviewer product. There appears to be a bit of info here: http://deepskybinoviewer.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=category.display&category_...
I'm not a "seasoned solar observer", I just attend SLAS solar events and look through other people's telescopes. It's always entertaining and I haven't decided what I want to buy for myself yet. The very best white light view I have seen was through Ed Erikson's SCT with a full aperture Orion filter. This view had more detail than anything I've seen on the internet. Maybe Ed just caught a moment of good seeing. David Blackham brings his 10" dob with a full aperture filter to the Jordan River Solar events, I look forward to using it as the solar cycle heats up. For H-alpha, there is Tom Watson's 90mm which he will let you "tune" for either prominaces or for surface granularity. Mike Morrison's 60mm is a very close second but Mike has sprung for the "double stack" filters. His pockets are deeper than most. Bill Cowles, Ron Ford and many others also have good gear worth looking through. It's worth a trip to a SLAS public solar party. DT
participants (6)
-
Chuck Hards -
Craig Smith -
Dale Hooper -
daniel turner -
erikhansen＠TheBlueZone.net -
Patrick Wiggins