Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action?
Robert wrote:
Getting involved in these types of activities is express[ly] prohibited by the club's constitution in Article X.
Robert, my reading is that Article X is that it is a standard IRS 501(c)(3) disclaimer provision that provides that SLAS may undertake some activity ``influencing legislation,'' as long as it is not a ``substantial part of the [club's] activities.'' My understanding of IRS Code 501(c)(3) restrictions are not intended complete bar against influencing legislation that are directly related to a non-profit's scientific-educational pursuits. But again, this is my understanding of the matter, and it is a question that a lawyer could easily resolve. Respectfully Robert, you are misreading Article X. Article X does not state that it is a complete bar that strictly prohibits any club activity that influences legislation. Clear Skies - Canopus56 Article X of the SLAS Constitution states: The Society is organized as an educational and scientific organization and will take part only in activities that are scientific/educational in nature. No substantial part of the activities of the Society shall be carrying on of propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation and the Society shall not participate in or intervene in (including the publishing or distribution of statements) any political campaign on behalf on any candidate for public office. Notwithstanding any other provisions of these articles, the Society shall not carry on any other activities not permitted to be carried on by a corporation exempt from Federal Income Tax under section 501 (c) (3) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954 (or the corresponding provision of any future United States Internal Revenue Law).
Does SLAS have a "refund window"? While this issue may have some real scientific and educational ramifications and while I am not an attorney thank God. I think what you have asked in Q1 and Q2 goes against the basic intent of Article X of the clubs constitution. There may be plenty of legal wiggleroom but if you ask me this issue at this time is as "political" as they get. The club, in my opinion should stay out of it. Your opinion may vary. Steve
Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2011 15:09:21 -0800 From: canopus56@yahoo.com To: utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action?
Robert wrote:
Getting involved in these types of activities is express[ly] prohibited by the club's constitution in Article X.
Robert, my reading is that Article X is that it is a standard IRS 501(c)(3) disclaimer provision that provides that SLAS may undertake some activity ``influencing legislation,'' as long as it is not a ``substantial part of the [club's] activities.'' My understanding of IRS Code 501(c)(3) restrictions are not intended complete bar against influencing legislation that are directly related to a non-profit's scientific-educational pursuits. But again, this is my understanding of the matter, and it is a question that a lawyer could easily resolve.
Respectfully Robert, you are misreading Article X. Article X does not state that it is a complete bar that strictly prohibits any club activity that influences legislation.
Clear Skies - Canopus56
Article X of the SLAS Constitution states:
The Society is organized as an educational and scientific organization and will take part only in activities that are scientific/educational in nature. No substantial part of the activities of the Society shall be carrying on of propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation and the Society shall not participate in or intervene in (including the publishing or distribution of statements) any political campaign on behalf on any candidate for public office. Notwithstanding any other provisions of these articles, the Society shall not carry on any other activities not permitted to be carried on by a corporation exempt from Federal Income Tax under section 501 (c) (3) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954 (or the corresponding provision of any future United States Internal Revenue Law).
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
One member one vote, put it to a vote.
Does SLAS have a "refund window"? While this issue may have some real scientific and educational ramifications and while I am not an attorney thank God. I think what you have asked in Q1 and Q2 goes against the basic intent of Article X of the clubs constitution. There may be plenty of legal wiggleroom but if you ask me this issue at this time is as "political" as they get. The club, in my opinion should stay out of it. Your opinion may vary. Steve
Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2011 15:09:21 -0800 From: canopus56@yahoo.com To: utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action?
Robert wrote:
Getting involved in these types of activities is express[ly] prohibited by the club's constitution in Article X.
Robert, my reading is that Article X is that it is a standard IRS 501(c)(3) disclaimer provision that provides that SLAS may undertake some activity ``influencing legislation,'' as long as it is not a ``substantial part of the [club's] activities.'' My understanding of IRS Code 501(c)(3) restrictions are not intended complete bar against influencing legislation that are directly related to a non-profit's scientific-educational pursuits. But again, this is my understanding of the matter, and it is a question that a lawyer could easily resolve.
Respectfully Robert, you are misreading Article X. Article X does not state that it is a complete bar that strictly prohibits any club activity that influences legislation.
Clear Skies - Canopus56
Article X of the SLAS Constitution states:
The Society is organized as an educational and scientific organization and will take part only in activities that are scientific/educational in nature. No substantial part of the activities of the Society shall be carrying on of propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation and the Society shall not participate in or intervene in (including the publishing or distribution of statements) any political campaign on behalf on any candidate for public office. Notwithstanding any other provisions of these articles, the Society shall not carry on any other activities not permitted to be carried on by a corporation exempt from Federal Income Tax under section 501 (c) (3) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954 (or the corresponding provision of any future United States Internal Revenue Law).
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
I don't think I am - respectfully. I don't see how this is scientific or educational or directly affect SLAS (it directly affects Bryce, not SLAS), nor do I see how trying to influence legislation or taking what will surely be viewed as a political position by many members is in SLAS's best interest. The proper organization to address this is the IDA. If you feel strongly, I urge you to get involved with the IDA. As individuals I encourage you and anyone else to get directly involved, attend meetings and hearings, write letters and otherwise make your position known as an individual. Personally I have attended many hearings and meetings on things I feel strongly about and have had chances to ask questions and make my points known and understood by decision makers and I believe I have been able to influence policy and decisions. I think you could surely do the same. If you feel differently you can contact Roger and ask that this be put on the agenda for the Board meeting next week. Bob -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Canopus56 Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2011 4:09 PM To: Utah Astronomy List Serv Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action? Robert wrote:
Getting involved in these types of activities is express[ly] prohibited by the club's constitution in Article X.
Robert, my reading is that Article X is that it is a standard IRS 501(c)(3) disclaimer provision that provides that SLAS may undertake some activity ``influencing legislation,'' as long as it is not a ``substantial part of the [club's] activities.'' My understanding of IRS Code 501(c)(3) restrictions are not intended complete bar against influencing legislation that are directly related to a non-profit's scientific-educational pursuits. But again, this is my understanding of the matter, and it is a question that a lawyer could easily resolve. Respectfully Robert, you are misreading Article X. Article X does not state that it is a complete bar that strictly prohibits any club activity that influences legislation. Clear Skies - Canopus56 Article X of the SLAS Constitution states: The Society is organized as an educational and scientific organization and will take part only in activities that are scientific/educational in nature. No substantial part of the activities of the Society shall be carrying on of propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation and the Society shall not participate in or intervene in (including the publishing or distribution of statements) any political campaign on behalf on any candidate for public office. Notwithstanding any other provisions of these articles, the Society shall not carry on any other activities not permitted to be carried on by a corporation exempt from Federal Income Tax under section 501 (c) (3) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954 (or the corresponding provision of any future United States Internal Revenue Law). _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
Hi Friends, This meeting is strictly an informational open house, according to the BLM's Utah web site. I've been to those before. BLM people stand around and folks roam from one official to another asking questions. A written comment can be given to someone there or one can be mailed in to the BLM until some time in January (I seem to remember it's Jan. 6) but the meeting Wednesday will not involve taking verbal statements. Second, the proposed agency action is not legislation. It's a decision that is made under laws already legislated. If SLAS wishes to express concern about light, dust and noise pollution in an area where we host astronomy programs at least yearly, I don't think there's anything in our regulations to prevent that. But who knows? As Robert said, it would be easy enough for a lawyer to give us a quick answer. My gut reaction is that we will never get consensus on the issue of development vs. light pollution within the club, and any position taken by the majority would be certain to rile the others. Maybe it's not worth the hassle and bad feelings. Probably it would be wisest if those who are concerned write their own comments to the BLM, without worrying about a club position. It should be enough to say I am an avid sky-watcher, etc. Another thing to remember is that the BLM expects to hear about technical deficiencies we may perceive in the draft EIS. One suggestion that sounded good to me -- but I need to read the DEIS closer to make sure of this -- is that the BLM does not think it needs a programmatic EIS on light pollution. If that's the case, maybe they should have one. Best wishes, Joe ________________________________ From: Robert Taylor <robtaylorslc@gmail.com> To: 'Utah Astronomy' <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2011 5:05 PM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action? I don't think I am - respectfully. I don't see how this is scientific or educational or directly affect SLAS (it directly affects Bryce, not SLAS), nor do I see how trying to influence legislation or taking what will surely be viewed as a political position by many members is in SLAS's best interest. The proper organization to address this is the IDA. If you feel strongly, I urge you to get involved with the IDA. As individuals I encourage you and anyone else to get directly involved, attend meetings and hearings, write letters and otherwise make your position known as an individual. Personally I have attended many hearings and meetings on things I feel strongly about and have had chances to ask questions and make my points known and understood by decision makers and I believe I have been able to influence policy and decisions. I think you could surely do the same. If you feel differently you can contact Roger and ask that this be put on the agenda for the Board meeting next week. Bob -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Canopus56 Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2011 4:09 PM To: Utah Astronomy List Serv Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action? Robert wrote:
Getting involved in these types of activities is express[ly] prohibited by the club's constitution in Article X.
Robert, my reading is that Article X is that it is a standard IRS 501(c)(3) disclaimer provision that provides that SLAS may undertake some activity ``influencing legislation,'' as long as it is not a ``substantial part of the [club's] activities.'' My understanding of IRS Code 501(c)(3) restrictions are not intended complete bar against influencing legislation that are directly related to a non-profit's scientific-educational pursuits. But again, this is my understanding of the matter, and it is a question that a lawyer could easily resolve. Respectfully Robert, you are misreading Article X. Article X does not state that it is a complete bar that strictly prohibits any club activity that influences legislation. Clear Skies - Canopus56 Article X of the SLAS Constitution states: The Society is organized as an educational and scientific organization and will take part only in activities that are scientific/educational in nature. No substantial part of the activities of the Society shall be carrying on of propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation and the Society shall not participate in or intervene in (including the publishing or distribution of statements) any political campaign on behalf on any candidate for public office. Notwithstanding any other provisions of these articles, the Society shall not carry on any other activities not permitted to be carried on by a corporation exempt from Federal Income Tax under section 501 (c) (3) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954 (or the corresponding provision of any future United States Internal Revenue Law). _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
On 12/6/11, Joe Bauman <josephmbauman@yahoo.com> wrote:
My gut reaction is that we will never get consensus on the issue of development vs. light pollution within the club, and any position taken by the majority would be certain to rile the others.
Or the MINORITY, Joe, or ANY fraction you care to toss out there without backing data. Or with it. It doesn't affect my argument. I do agree that it's best to not go down the political road with the club, on any issue. Thank you for your wise post.
Does the majority of SLAS not support Dark Skies?
Hi Friends, This meeting is strictly an informational open house,
according to the BLM's Utah web site. I've been to those before. BLM people stand around and folks roam from one official to another asking questions. A written comment can be given to someone there or one can be mailed in to the BLM until some time in January (I seem to remember it's Jan. 6) but the meeting Wednesday will not involve taking verbal statements. Second, the proposed agency action is not legislation. It's a decision that is made under laws already legislated. If SLAS wishes to express concern about light, dust and noise pollution in an area where we host astronomy programs at least yearly, I don't think there's anything in our regulations to prevent that. But who knows? As Robert said, it would be easy enough for a lawyer to give us a quick answer.
My gut reaction is that we will never get consensus on the issue of development vs. light pollution within the club, and any position taken by the majority would be certain to rile the others. Maybe it's not worth the hassle and bad feelings. Probably it would be wisest if those who are concerned write their own comments to the BLM, without worrying about a club position. It should be enough to say I am an avid sky-watcher, etc.
Another thing to remember is that the BLM expects to hear about technical deficiencies we may perceive in the draft EIS. One suggestion that sounded good to me -- but I need to read the DEIS closer to make sure of this -- is that the BLM does not think it needs a programmatic EIS on light pollution. If that's the case, maybe they should have one. Best wishes, Joe
________________________________ From: Robert Taylor <robtaylorslc@gmail.com> To: 'Utah Astronomy' <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2011 5:05 PM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action?
I don't think I am - respectfully.
I don't see how this is scientific or educational or directly affect SLAS (it directly affects Bryce, not SLAS), nor do I see how trying to influence legislation or taking what will surely be viewed as a political position by many members is in SLAS's best interest.
The proper organization to address this is the IDA. If you feel strongly, I urge you to get involved with the IDA. As individuals I encourage you and anyone else to get directly involved, attend meetings and hearings, write letters and otherwise make your position known as an individual. Personally I have attended many hearings and meetings on things I feel strongly about and have had chances to ask questions and make my points known and understood by decision makers and I believe I have been able to influence policy and decisions. I think you could surely do the same.
If you feel differently you can contact Roger and ask that this be put on the agenda for the Board meeting next week.
Bob
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Canopus56 Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2011 4:09 PM To: Utah Astronomy List Serv Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action?
Robert wrote:
Getting involved in these types of activities is express[ly] prohibited by the club's constitution in Article X.
Robert, my reading is that Article X is that it is a standard IRS 501(c)(3) disclaimer provision that provides that SLAS may undertake some activity ``influencing legislation,'' as long as it is not a ``substantial part of the [club's] activities.'' My understanding of IRS Code 501(c)(3) restrictions are not intended complete bar against influencing legislation that are directly related to a non-profit's scientific-educational pursuits. But again, this is my understanding of the matter, and it is a question that a lawyer could easily resolve.
Respectfully Robert, you are misreading Article X. Article X does not state that it is a complete bar that strictly prohibits any club activity that influences legislation.
Clear Skies - Canopus56
Article X of the SLAS Constitution states:
The Society is organized as an educational and scientific organization and will take part only in activities that are scientific/educational in nature. No substantial part of the activities of the Society shall be carrying on of propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation and the Society shall not participate in or intervene in (including the publishing or distribution of statements) any political campaign on behalf on any candidate for public office. Notwithstanding any other provisions of these articles, the Society shall not carry on any other activities not permitted to be carried on by a corporation exempt from Federal Income Tax under section 501 (c) (3) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954 (or the corresponding provision of any future United States Internal Revenue Law).
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
Hi Erik, I think the majority does support dark skies, as I do. But personally I'd prefer that the club act on controversial issues only when it's a consensus, not just a majority -- otherwise there are too many hard feelings. This organization is mostly social and friendship is important to many of us. I doubt that the BLM would smack its collective forehead and say, "Why didn't we think of that?" just because the group took a position. I suspect a dozen or more individual comments would have more impact (though maybe nothing could make a difference). Anyway, my feeling is that we shouldn't risk damaging our basic function -- which I see as enjoying and learning about astronomy in a friendly atmosphere. Best wishes, Joe ________________________________ From: "erikhansen@thebluezone.net" <erikhansen@thebluezone.net> To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Wednesday, December 7, 2011 10:19 AM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action?
Does the majority of SLAS not support Dark Skies?
Hi Friends, This meeting is strictly an informational open house,
according to the BLM's Utah web site. I've been to those before. BLM people stand around and folks roam from one official to another asking questions. A written comment can be given to someone there or one can be mailed in to the BLM until some time in January (I seem to remember it's Jan. 6) but the meeting Wednesday will not involve taking verbal statements. Second, the proposed agency action is not legislation. It's a decision that is made under laws already legislated. If SLAS wishes to express concern about light, dust and noise pollution in an area where we host astronomy programs at least yearly, I don't think there's anything in our regulations to prevent that. But who knows? As Robert said, it would be easy enough for a lawyer to give us a quick answer.
My gut reaction is that we will never get consensus on the issue of development vs. light pollution within the club, and any position taken by the majority would be certain to rile the others. Maybe it's not worth the hassle and bad feelings. Probably it would be wisest if those who are concerned write their own comments to the BLM, without worrying about a club position. It should be enough to say I am an avid sky-watcher, etc.
Another thing to remember is that the BLM expects to hear about technical deficiencies we may perceive in the draft EIS. One suggestion that sounded good to me -- but I need to read the DEIS closer to make sure of this -- is that the BLM does not think it needs a programmatic EIS on light pollution. If that's the case, maybe they should have one. Best wishes, Joe
________________________________ From: Robert Taylor <robtaylorslc@gmail.com> To: 'Utah Astronomy' <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2011 5:05 PM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action?
I don't think I am - respectfully.
I don't see how this is scientific or educational or directly affect SLAS (it directly affects Bryce, not SLAS), nor do I see how trying to influence legislation or taking what will surely be viewed as a political position by many members is in SLAS's best interest.
The proper organization to address this is the IDA. If you feel strongly, I urge you to get involved with the IDA. As individuals I encourage you and anyone else to get directly involved, attend meetings and hearings, write letters and otherwise make your position known as an individual. Personally I have attended many hearings and meetings on things I feel strongly about and have had chances to ask questions and make my points known and understood by decision makers and I believe I have been able to influence policy and decisions. I think you could surely do the same.
If you feel differently you can contact Roger and ask that this be put on the agenda for the Board meeting next week.
Bob
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Canopus56 Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2011 4:09 PM To: Utah Astronomy List Serv Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action?
Robert wrote:
Getting involved in these types of activities is express[ly] prohibited by the club's constitution in Article X.
Robert, my reading is that Article X is that it is a standard IRS 501(c)(3) disclaimer provision that provides that SLAS may undertake some activity ``influencing legislation,'' as long as it is not a ``substantial part of the [club's] activities.'' My understanding of IRS Code 501(c)(3) restrictions are not intended complete bar against influencing legislation that are directly related to a non-profit's scientific-educational pursuits. But again, this is my understanding of the matter, and it is a question that a lawyer could easily resolve.
Respectfully Robert, you are misreading Article X. Article X does not state that it is a complete bar that strictly prohibits any club activity that influences legislation.
Clear Skies - Canopus56
Article X of the SLAS Constitution states:
The Society is organized as an educational and scientific organization and will take part only in activities that are scientific/educational in nature. No substantial part of the activities of the Society shall be carrying on of propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation and the Society shall not participate in or intervene in (including the publishing or distribution of statements) any political campaign on behalf on any candidate for public office. Notwithstanding any other provisions of these articles, the Society shall not carry on any other activities not permitted to be carried on by a corporation exempt from Federal Income Tax under section 501 (c) (3) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954 (or the corresponding provision of any future United States Internal Revenue Law).
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
The same law applies to the IDA and they have effectively "educated" legislatures on the issue.
I don't think I am - respectfully.
I don't see how this is scientific or educational or directly affect SLAS (it directly affects Bryce, not SLAS), nor do I see how trying to influence legislation or taking what will surely be viewed as a political position by many members is in SLAS's best interest.
The proper organization to address this is the IDA. If you feel strongly, I urge you to get involved with the IDA. As individuals I encourage you and anyone else to get directly involved, attend meetings and hearings, write letters and otherwise make your position known as an individual. Personally I have attended many hearings and meetings on things I feel strongly about and have had chances to ask questions and make my points known and understood by decision makers and I believe I have been able to influence policy and decisions. I think you could surely do the same.
If you feel differently you can contact Roger and ask that this be put on the agenda for the Board meeting next week.
Bob
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Canopus56 Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2011 4:09 PM To: Utah Astronomy List Serv Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action?
Robert wrote:
Getting involved in these types of activities is express[ly] prohibited by the club's constitution in Article X.
Robert, my reading is that Article X is that it is a standard IRS 501(c)(3) disclaimer provision that provides that SLAS may undertake some activity ``influencing legislation,'' as long as it is not a ``substantial part of the [club's] activities.'' My understanding of IRS Code 501(c)(3) restrictions are not intended complete bar against influencing legislation that are directly related to a non-profit's scientific-educational pursuits. But again, this is my understanding of the matter, and it is a question that a lawyer could easily resolve.
Respectfully Robert, you are misreading Article X. Article X does not state that it is a complete bar that strictly prohibits any club activity that influences legislation.
Clear Skies - Canopus56
Article X of the SLAS Constitution states:
The Society is organized as an educational and scientific organization and will take part only in activities that are scientific/educational in nature. No substantial part of the activities of the Society shall be carrying on of propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation and the Society shall not participate in or intervene in (including the publishing or distribution of statements) any political campaign on behalf on any candidate for public office. Notwithstanding any other provisions of these articles, the Society shall not carry on any other activities not permitted to be carried on by a corporation exempt from Federal Income Tax under section 501 (c) (3) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954 (or the corresponding provision of any future United States Internal Revenue Law).
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
_______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
The key words are "no substantial", it does not prohibit.
I don't think I am - respectfully.
I don't see how this is scientific or educational or directly affect SLAS (it directly affects Bryce, not SLAS), nor do I see how trying to influence legislation or taking what will surely be viewed as a political position by many members is in SLAS's best interest.
The proper organization to address this is the IDA. If you feel strongly, I urge you to get involved with the IDA. As individuals I encourage you and anyone else to get directly involved, attend meetings and hearings, write letters and otherwise make your position known as an individual. Personally I have attended many hearings and meetings on things I feel strongly about and have had chances to ask questions and make my points known and understood by decision makers and I believe I have been able to influence policy and decisions. I think you could surely do the same.
If you feel differently you can contact Roger and ask that this be put on the agenda for the Board meeting next week.
Bob
-----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Canopus56 Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2011 4:09 PM To: Utah Astronomy List Serv Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action?
Robert wrote:
Getting involved in these types of activities is express[ly] prohibited by the club's constitution in Article X.
Robert, my reading is that Article X is that it is a standard IRS 501(c)(3) disclaimer provision that provides that SLAS may undertake some activity ``influencing legislation,'' as long as it is not a ``substantial part of the [club's] activities.'' My understanding of IRS Code 501(c)(3) restrictions are not intended complete bar against influencing legislation that are directly related to a non-profit's scientific-educational pursuits. But again, this is my understanding of the matter, and it is a question that a lawyer could easily resolve.
Respectfully Robert, you are misreading Article X. Article X does not state that it is a complete bar that strictly prohibits any club activity that influences legislation.
Clear Skies - Canopus56
Article X of the SLAS Constitution states:
The Society is organized as an educational and scientific organization and will take part only in activities that are scientific/educational in nature. No substantial part of the activities of the Society shall be carrying on of propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation and the Society shall not participate in or intervene in (including the publishing or distribution of statements) any political campaign on behalf on any candidate for public office. Notwithstanding any other provisions of these articles, the Society shall not carry on any other activities not permitted to be carried on by a corporation exempt from Federal Income Tax under section 501 (c) (3) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954 (or the corresponding provision of any future United States Internal Revenue Law).
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As an author of the constitution, may I state that the purpose of Article X was never to assure compliance with 501 (c)(3). The purpose of article X was to eliminate political activity from the club. It should be obvious that there are very strongly held opinions on topics such as the Alton Coal Mine. The intent of Article X is to remove the tension caused by political activity and its divisiveness from club activities so that the purpose of the club could be more fully enjoyed. That purpose is astronomy. The IDA is a good place to go to participate in political activity and the Alton Coal Mine effects on seeing at Bryce Canyon. Please keep the club focused on astronomy. ________________________________ From: Canopus56 <canopus56@yahoo.com> To: Utah Astronomy List Serv <utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, December 6, 2011 4:09 PM Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Alton Mine Hearing is tomorrow, Wed. 12-7 - SLAS formal action? Robert wrote:
Getting involved in these types of activities is express[ly] prohibited by the club's constitution in Article X.
Robert, my reading is that Article X is that it is a standard IRS 501(c)(3) disclaimer provision that provides that SLAS may undertake some activity ``influencing legislation,'' as long as it is not a ``substantial part of the [club's] activities.'' My understanding of IRS Code 501(c)(3) restrictions are not intended complete bar against influencing legislation that are directly related to a non-profit's scientific-educational pursuits. But again, this is my understanding of the matter, and it is a question that a lawyer could easily resolve. Respectfully Robert, you are misreading Article X. Article X does not state that it is a complete bar that strictly prohibits any club activity that influences legislation. Clear Skies - Canopus56 Article X of the SLAS Constitution states: The Society is organized as an educational and scientific organization and will take part only in activities that are scientific/educational in nature. No substantial part of the activities of the Society shall be carrying on of propaganda or otherwise attempting to influence legislation and the Society shall not participate in or intervene in (including the publishing or distribution of statements) any political campaign on behalf on any candidate for public office. Notwithstanding any other provisions of these articles, the Society shall not carry on any other activities not permitted to be carried on by a corporation exempt from Federal Income Tax under section 501 (c) (3) of the Internal Revenue Code of 1954 (or the corresponding provision of any future United States Internal Revenue Law). _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.slas.us/gallery2/main.php
participants (7)
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Brent Watson -
Canopus56 -
Chuck Hards -
erikhansen＠thebluezone.net -
Joe Bauman -
Robert Taylor -
Steve Fisher