more global warming
I just caught a few minutes of a piece on NPR's "All Things Considered," discussing rising ocean temperatures and how they may relate to increased storm activity. One person made the most accurate statement regarding the "debate" that I've heard. To paraphrase, "People should know that the climate is warming and be prepared for it." Kim
Now that is science! I have said all I am going to on this subject now. I am just going to sit back and enjoy the exchange Bob Bob Moore Commerce CRG - Salt Lake City office 175 East 400 South, Suite 700 Salt Lake City, Utah 84111 Direct: 801-303-5418 Main: 801-322-2000 Fax: 801-322-2040 BMoore@commercecrg.com www.commercecrg.com -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces+bmoore=commercecrg.com@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces+bmoore=commercecrg.com@mailman.xmission.c om] On Behalf Of Kim Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 5:02 PM To: 'Utah Astronomy' Subject: [Utah-astronomy] more global warming I just caught a few minutes of a piece on NPR's "All Things Considered," discussing rising ocean temperatures and how they may relate to increased storm activity. One person made the most accurate statement regarding the "debate" that I've heard. To paraphrase, "People should know that the climate is warming and be prepared for it." Kim _______________________________________________ Utah-Astronomy mailing list Utah-Astronomy@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.utahastronomy.com
I'll tell you one thing, I'll be glad when the Pacific Ocean warms up. Bulky 7mm wetsuits are a drag. Literally. The change won't come fast enough for me. Just think of the volume of business the coast will do when that part of the ocean heats up. I'll be looking forward to a close by tropical dive vacation to a destination such as San Pedro. I'm all for it. Quoting Kim <kimharch@cut.net>:
I just caught a few minutes of a piece on NPR's "All Things Considered," discussing rising ocean temperatures and how they may relate to increased storm activity. One person made the most accurate statement regarding the "debate" that I've heard. To paraphrase, "People should know that the climate is warming and be prepared for it."
Kim
I hear you on the 7mm. I use my dry suite vs the 7mm. I am thinking of a tropical vacation in oooo say anchorage mabye Bob Moore Commerce CRG - Salt Lake City office 175 East 400 South, Suite 700 Salt Lake City, Utah 84111 Direct: 801-303-5418 Main: 801-322-2000 Fax: 801-322-2040 BMoore@commercecrg.com www.commercecrg.com -----Original Message----- From: utah-astronomy-bounces+bmoore=commercecrg.com@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:utah-astronomy-bounces+bmoore=commercecrg.com@mailman.xmission.c om] On Behalf Of diveboss@xmission.com Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 6:22 PM To: utah-astronomy@mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] more global warming I'll tell you one thing, I'll be glad when the Pacific Ocean warms up. Bulky 7mm wetsuits are a drag. Literally. The change won't come fast enough for me. Just think of the volume of business the coast will do when that part of the ocean heats up. I'll be looking forward to a close by tropical dive vacation to a destination such as San Pedro. I'm all for it. Quoting Kim <kimharch@cut.net>:
I just caught a few minutes of a piece on NPR's "All Things Considered," discussing rising ocean temperatures and how they may relate to increased storm activity. One person made the most accurate statement regarding the "debate" that I've heard. To paraphrase, "People should know that the climate is warming and be prepared for it."
Kim
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Kim, damn good call. People are arguing about cause, and in the process, ignoring the effect and possible remediation. Rome is burning while Nero fiddles. Nobody on this list (that I'm aware of, anyway, my apologies if someone here is doing the science) is a practicing environmental scientist with the means to conduct meaningful research on the causes of global warming. Any "debate" here has always been just a case of dueling Websites, always carefully chosen to bolster the poster's personal stance. It goes nowhere, nobody's mind is ever changed. You may as well tell someone that they practice their religion incorrectly. See how far you get when you challenge someone's belief system. Some people deeply involved in this "debate" obviously don't have conventional jobs that require large blocks of time on a daily basis. Heck, I couldn't begin to check out all the Websites mentioned here, on any subject, and can't until I retire! Some of us still have to work for a living. (darnit!) Just dashing-out an opinion once in a while is about the extent of our free Internet time. Yes, changes are coming, and we had better be prepared for them. Millions, perhaps billions of people are going to suffer. Starvation, mass migration, war, inflation, you name it. I've always thought it illustrative that earth is bordered by two planets of opposite extremes. Venus demonstrates a crushingly thick, corrosive, runaway greenhouse effect atmosphere, and Mars has lost almost all of the atmosphere it once had. It's as if both extremes have been placed in plain sight for us to see with our own eyes. Perhaps it's up to us to exercise some wise stewardship and not take anything for granted, lest our eventual fate parallels either Venus' or Mars'. It's time to just stop adding unnecessary emmisions to the atmosphere, period. Playing guessing games or the blame game gets us nowhere and wastes time. If the research isn't sufficient to draw a conclusion, fine, but don't add fuel to the fire regardless, until the facts are truly known. It doesn't hurt to cut emissions while the studies continue. Or am I simply, totally, off the mark here? On 5/22/07, Kim <kimharch@cut.net> wrote:
I just caught a few minutes of a piece on NPR's "All Things Considered," discussing rising ocean temperatures and how they may relate to increased storm activity. One person made the most accurate statement regarding the "debate" that I've heard. To paraphrase, "People should know that the climate is warming and be prepared for it."
Quoting Chuck Hards <chuck.hards@gmail.com>:
Nobody on this list (that I'm aware of, anyway, my apologies if someone here is doing the science) is a practicing environmental scientist with the means to conduct meaningful research on the causes of global warming.
Well, no, but I do have some recent experience. Let me shine a different more personal light on the subject. Anyone who has ever been to Blue Lake diving knows that it is a thermal lake. The average temperature of the water is 72-78 degrees year round. The underwater weed beds are thick and healthy. They are teaming with largemouth bass and bluegills. There is a large population of fresh water sponges that grows on everything near the numerous bubbling and rolling thermal hot pots that litter the bottom. It had been 4 years since I last visited the lake, but this past week when I went back out to dive, something had changed. The lake didn't look the same. The walk to the lake was more swamp than I recall. Upon doing a "classic" slip and fall entry into the water it became very apparent that the water temperature had changed. The computer said 57 degrees. Underwater, the horror unfolded as I swam looking for something familiar. The once healthy weed beds were all but gone, and there were no huge blugills or bass. There is a fair population of small fry though, but that is about it. Most of the really big underwater thermal rivers and hot pots are now quiet. I couldn't see any sponges. The bottom of the lake looked like a moonscape and deep with silt. The slightest fin kick brought forth a cloud of thick silt that blocked out the view. Even the depth had changed. In disbelief I did a controlled emergency swimming ascent and through my regulator yelled "Why God why???" And then it hit me, I was in the wrong lake. Okay that's my global warming experience. Anyone care to share?
My experience was similar; I must have forgot to take my medication just like you did. ;) Before you spilled the beans, I was thinking "Oh jeez- if the thermal vents have shut-down, maybe the big quake is imminent..." My last Blue Lake experience was at least 25 years ago; we would give the mask and snorkel to one of our friends who drank WAY too much, then toss the mini-maglight in there after dark and let him go find it. While he was down, we tried to hide his beer, but he could always sniff it out. In the end, he just poured it down the snorkel. He didn't need no stinkin global warmin'. On 5/22/07, diveboss@xmission.com <diveboss@xmission.com> wrote:
Well, no, but I do have some recent experience. Let me shine a different more personal light on the subject. Anyone who has ever been to Blue Lake diving knows that it is a thermal lake. The average temperature of the water is 72-78 degrees year round. The underwater weed beds are thick and healthy. They are teaming with largemouth bass and bluegills. There is a large population of fresh water sponges that grows on everything near the numerous bubbling and rolling thermal hot pots that litter the bottom.
It had been 4 years since I last visited the lake, but this past week when I went back out to dive, something had changed. The lake didn't look the same. The walk to the lake was more swamp than I recall. Upon doing a "classic" slip and fall entry into the water it became very apparent that the water temperature had changed. The computer said 57 degrees. Underwater, the horror unfolded as I swam looking for something familiar. The once healthy weed beds were all but gone, and there were no huge blugills or bass. There is a fair population of small fry though, but that is about it.
Most of the really big underwater thermal rivers and hot pots are now quiet. I couldn't see any sponges. The bottom of the lake looked like a moonscape and deep with silt. The slightest fin kick brought forth a cloud of thick silt that blocked out the view. Even the depth had changed. In disbelief I did a controlled emergency swimming ascent and through my regulator yelled "Why God why???" And then it hit me, I was in the wrong lake. Okay that's my global warming experience. Anyone care to share?
That was a good one. I fell for it hook line and sinker. Speaking of hooks lines and sinkers, where is Blue Lake? I'll be moving back to Utah shortly. It sounds like a good place to fish. diveboss@xmission.com wrote:
Quoting Chuck Hards <chuck.hards@gmail.com>:
Nobody on this list (that I'm aware of, anyway, my apologies if someone here is doing the science) is a practicing environmental scientist with the means to conduct meaningful research on the causes of global warming.
Well, no, but I do have some recent experience. Let me shine a different more personal light on the subject. Anyone who has ever been to Blue Lake diving knows that it is a thermal lake. The average temperature of the water is 72-78 degrees year round. The underwater weed beds are thick and healthy. They are teaming with largemouth bass and bluegills. There is a large population of fresh water sponges that grows on everything near the numerous bubbling and rolling thermal hot pots that litter the bottom.
It had been 4 years since I last visited the lake, but this past week when I went back out to dive, something had changed. The lake didn't look the same. The walk to the lake was more swamp than I recall. Upon doing a "classic" slip and fall entry into the water it became very apparent that the water temperature had changed. The computer said 57 degrees. Underwater, the horror unfolded as I swam looking for something familiar. The once healthy weed beds were all but gone, and there were no huge blugills or bass. There is a fair population of small fry though, but that is about it.
Most of the really big underwater thermal rivers and hot pots are now quiet. I couldn't see any sponges. The bottom of the lake looked like a moonscape and deep with silt. The slightest fin kick brought forth a cloud of thick silt that blocked out the view. Even the depth had changed. In disbelief I did a controlled emergency swimming ascent and through my regulator yelled "Why God why???" And then it hit me, I was in the wrong lake. Okay that's my global warming experience. Anyone care to share?
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It's south of Wendover. I occasionally see hotel and casino folks out at the lake catching Tuesday nights "sea food" special. Quoting Lockman <lockman@aznex.net>:
That was a good one. I fell for it hook line and sinker. Speaking of hooks lines and sinkers, where is Blue Lake? I'll be moving back to Utah shortly. It sounds like a good place to fish.
diveboss@xmission.com wrote:
Quoting Chuck Hards <chuck.hards@gmail.com>:
Nobody on this list (that I'm aware of, anyway, my apologies if someone here is doing the science) is a practicing environmental scientist with the means to conduct meaningful research on the causes of global warming.
Well, no, but I do have some recent experience. Let me shine a different more personal light on the subject. Anyone who has ever been to Blue Lake diving knows that it is a thermal lake. The average temperature of the water is 72-78 degrees year round. The underwater weed beds are thick and healthy. They are teaming with largemouth bass and bluegills. There is a large population of fresh water sponges that grows on everything near the numerous bubbling and rolling thermal hot pots that litter the bottom.
It had been 4 years since I last visited the lake, but this past week when I went back out to dive, something had changed. The lake didn't look the same. The walk to the lake was more swamp than I recall. Upon doing a "classic" slip and fall entry into the water it became very apparent that the water temperature had changed. The computer said 57 degrees. Underwater, the horror unfolded as I swam looking for something familiar. The once healthy weed beds were all but gone, and there were no huge blugills or bass. There is a fair population of small fry though, but that is about it.
Most of the really big underwater thermal rivers and hot pots are now quiet. I couldn't see any sponges. The bottom of the lake looked like a moonscape and deep with silt. The slightest fin kick brought forth a cloud of thick silt that blocked out the view. Even the depth had changed. In disbelief I did a controlled emergency swimming ascent and through my regulator yelled "Why God why???" And then it hit me, I was in the wrong lake. Okay that's my global warming experience. Anyone care to share?
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Is it un Utah or Nevada? diveboss@xmission.com wrote:
It's south of Wendover. I occasionally see hotel and casino folks out at the lake catching Tuesday nights "sea food" special.
Quoting Lockman <lockman@aznex.net>:
That was a good one. I fell for it hook line and sinker. Speaking of hooks lines and sinkers, where is Blue Lake? I'll be moving back to Utah shortly. It sounds like a good place to fish.
diveboss@xmission.com wrote:
Quoting Chuck Hards <chuck.hards@gmail.com>:
Nobody on this list (that I'm aware of, anyway, my apologies if someone here is doing the science) is a practicing environmental scientist with the means to conduct meaningful research on the causes of global warming.
Well, no, but I do have some recent experience. Let me shine a different more personal light on the subject. Anyone who has ever been to Blue Lake diving knows that it is a thermal lake. The average temperature of the water is 72-78 degrees year round. The underwater weed beds are thick and healthy. They are teaming with largemouth bass and bluegills. There is a large population of fresh water sponges that grows on everything near the numerous bubbling and rolling thermal hot pots that litter the bottom.
It had been 4 years since I last visited the lake, but this past week when I went back out to dive, something had changed. The lake didn't look the same. The walk to the lake was more swamp than I recall. Upon doing a "classic" slip and fall entry into the water it became very apparent that the water temperature had changed. The computer said 57 degrees. Underwater, the horror unfolded as I swam looking for something familiar. The once healthy weed beds were all but gone, and there were no huge blugills or bass. There is a fair population of small fry though, but that is about it.
Most of the really big underwater thermal rivers and hot pots are now quiet. I couldn't see any sponges. The bottom of the lake looked like a moonscape and deep with silt. The slightest fin kick brought forth a cloud of thick silt that blocked out the view. Even the depth had changed. In disbelief I did a controlled emergency swimming ascent and through my regulator yelled "Why God why???" And then it hit me, I was in the wrong lake. Okay that's my global warming experience. Anyone care to share?
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I agree with what Chuck is saying here. This debate isn't going to change the minds of those who have already formed conclusions. Then again there have been the posts from members welcoming the information because they haven't had access to one side or the other's information. Since there seems to be more than just those actually debating who are interested I say let the debate continue. There have been many threads on this site for which I had no personal interest. In those cases I would just note the subject and delete the message without reading it. Those of us who aren't interested in the debate could just do this. Chuck Hards wrote:
Nobody on this list (that I'm aware of, anyway, my apologies if someone here is doing the science) is a practicing environmental scientist with the means to conduct meaningful research on the causes of global warming. Any "debate" here has always been just a case of dueling Websites, always carefully chosen to bolster the poster's personal stance. It goes nowhere, nobody's mind is ever changed. You may as well tell someone that they practice their religion incorrectly. See how far you get when you challenge someone's belief system.
participants (6)
-
Bob Moore -
Chuck Hards -
diveboss＠xmission.com -
Joe Bauman -
Kim -
Lockman