The typical "dark-sky", hardcore observer/imager site is usually not affiliated formally with it's parent club, or if it is, it's a separate division. It is composed of mostly retired members, older members whose children have grown, or childless younger people. What they end up with is more of a property owner's association than an astro-club. The site is private property, subdivided into smaller plots that the individual owners are free to use as they see fit, within the rules of the asscociation. There is usually a one-time buy-in cost, and yearly maintenance fees, taxes, and utilities in some cases. In the case of the Polaris association, individual members have built cabins or set up trailers on their plots. Each member has his or her own piece of ground. Some clubs do have "dark sky" observatories, but what they end up with is SPOC with a dark sky. It's still a publicly-attended site. I think what we are talking about is closer to the Polaris model, right? Do we want merely a secure site to bring our own telescopes, or a big scope in a building that everyone has to share? Just exactly what are we talking about re: a dark-sky site? We need a common vision, first and foremost. Chuck