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Re: When lasers are outlawed, etc...
by Chuck Hards 07 Jan '05

07 Jan '05

Gary, if a laser pointer was truly instrumental in fanning the spark of your interest, then perhaps Kim is vindicated and I bow to the will of the masses. I'd think the star-party movers and shakers would feel gratified as well. Thanks for posting that perspective. > From: "Gary Thompson" <agaryt(a)mstar.net> > To: "Utah Astronomy" > <utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2005 10:17:47 -0700 > Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Re: When lasers are > outlawed, etc... > > Star Parties turned me on to astronomy in the last > few years. Though I > don't have a laser, I percieve them to be very > beneficial in showing a group > of people around the night sky. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

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Re: When lasers are outlawed, etc...
by Chuck Hards 07 Jan '05

07 Jan '05

Kim, respectfully, you can't see the connection because you like using the laser and showing the sky to others. Not a bad thing at all, in fact rather noble and praiseworthy, but not an arguement in favor of laser pointers from my perspective. The long-term benefit is yours because you are doing something you enjoy. The teaching value in terms of retention is very questionable (at best) for the general public. Of the thousands of people who have ever attended a star party, how many actually continued to pursue the interest and/or join the club? A pitifully small percentage, even in the abscence of hard data, judging from the SLAS roster. Why do so many people fight traditional, proven teaching methods in favor of instant gratification, where most of the teaching effort is wasted in the long run? I would rather spend an hour working with one truly interested, committed beginner, than a hundred all-nighters with the general public whom will mostly never look up in wonder again. I would also disagree that having folks look through the "finder" (not exactly what I suggested, but close enough) isn't too time-consuming since they are lined-up at the main eyepiece anyway. Might add what, five or ten more seconds? It's not a race, it's not a contest. The night is long enough for all to have a look. There is time to stop and smell the Rosette... We do agree 100% on the "five-cell flashlight", keep those suckers in the trunk for tire-changes, and off the observing field. Finally, if one sees the lasers being used at "private" star parties, where it is assumed that most or all of the attendees are veterans, there is the proof that it's more of a toy than legitimate tool. I would prefer to keep the lasers under the planetarium dome, but then I'm a firm believer in the KISS principle and low-tech approaches whenever practical. Richard Proenneke is my hero. That's about a dime's worth, man am I getting long-winded in my old age... > From: "Kim Hyatt" <kimharch(a)msn.com> > To: "Utah Astronomy" > <utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Date: Wed, 5 Jan 2005 19:42:03 -0700 > Subject: [Utah-astronomy] Re: When lasers are > outlawed etc... > I can't see any connection between the use > of a laser and how well one learns or does not learn > the nighttime sky. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - 250MB free storage. Do more. Manage less. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250

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Re: When lasers are outlawed etc...
by Chuck Hards 07 Jan '05

07 Jan '05

I was just about to buy a green laser pointer when the Salt Lake incident happened last fall. Recall that I was going to try and aim my red laser at Ann House's house and see if she could see it from across the valley...now I sure am glad that there was an obstruction in the path. I waited a bit to see what the fallout from the airport incident might be, and was about to order one again when this latest story broke. Now I'm not going to get one at all, maybe for years. I realized that I haven't needed one for decades and don't need one now- it's just a trendy gimmick. Want to show someone a particular object? Put a simple tube or gunsight-style finder on your telescope and let folks look through that. Armillery spheres work great for this also; I had one as a kid, and it, along with a set of star charts, performed flawlessly in teaching myself the constellations. Both methods have the added advantage of demonstrating diurnal motion and the effect of latitude on sky orientation and the visibility of the southern sky, as well as using the celestial coordinate system of right ascension and declination if the telescope has an equatorial mount. Folks who make the effort to learn the sky the old-fashioned way will probably be the ones who stick with it the longest and reap the greatest benefits. It's also more FUN and INTERESTING, not a chore at all. Those who want instant gratification won't recall anything as soon as you turn off the laser; you're wasting your time in most instances. I also think that most owners will forget about the laser once the novelty wears off. On another point, I think the big difference between a laser and a searchlight, where the effect can be the same in this instance, is that the laser is easily concealed. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - Get yours free! http://my.yahoo.com

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Rob is having too much fun!
by Chuck Hards 07 Jan '05

07 Jan '05

Great shot, Rob! Unfortunately the weather here is deteriorating rapidly even as I get the old equatorial mount/camera platform cleaned and adjusted this afternoon. Instead of a longer exposure, have you tried stacking multiple short exposures? > From: Rob Ratkowski <ratkwski(a)hawaii.rr.com> > To: Utah Astronomy > <utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2005 07:45:43 -1000 > Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Comet & M-45 > > Thanks Jim, > > > But I have a long way to go. I'm using a pro-sumer > camera not > designed for exposures longer that 30 sec. and w/a > 10 min. exposure > so much heat is generated, the CCD reads this as > photons and the > image is degraded. It was still fun to be out > exposing and enjoying > the cool (60) Hawaiian night. I'll try again > tonite IF it doesn't > rain as predicted. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - Find what you need with new enhanced search. http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250

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Re: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Comet & M-45
by astrodeb＠charter.net 07 Jan '05

07 Jan '05

Great picture Rob! What lens did you use? I drove out to Ivins last night about 8:30 and got a wonderful view through my 15 X 70 binos. I wish I would have had time to shoot through both my film and digital cameras but the temperature was reading 31 degrees. That's cold for St. George. The comet did look green and I saw a hint of a tail. The comet was almost directly overhead way above the light pollution from St. George. I think I love the winter milky way more than the summer milky way. Now the clouds have rolled in again but that comet was very bright last night. Thanks for the heads-up Patrick! Debbie > > From: Rob Ratkowski <ratkwski(a)hawaii.rr.com> > Date: 2005/01/07 Fri AM 10:45:43 MST > To: Utah Astronomy <utah-astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com> > Subject: Re: [Utah-astronomy] Comet & M-45 > > Thanks Jim, > > > But I have a long way to go. I'm using a pro-sumer camera not > designed for exposures longer that 30 sec. and w/a 10 min. exposure > so much heat is generated, the CCD reads this as photons and the > image is degraded. It was still fun to be out exposing and enjoying > the cool (60) Hawaiian night. I'll try again tonite IF it doesn't > rain as predicted. > > > > Aloha > Rob > > _______________________________________________ > Utah-Astronomy mailing list > Utah-Astronomy(a)mailman.xmission.com > http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/utah-astronomy > Visit the Photo Gallery: http://www.utahastronomy.com >

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Clearing skys
by Jim Gibson 06 Jan '05

06 Jan '05

The skys are clear over Dugway. Chances are we will get a look at the comet tonight. --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail - You care about security. So do we.

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Cooking Under the Sun
by Dale Hooper 06 Jan '05

06 Jan '05

Congratulations to OAS member Jeremy Mathews for having his Letter to the Editor, (Cooking Under the Sun, pg 12) published in the Feb 2005 Sky & Tel.

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When lasers are outlawed, only outlaws will have lasers
by Chuck Hards 06 Jan '05

06 Jan '05

I'm sort-of glad I haven't bought that "high-powered" green laser pointer yet...sooner or later purchase records will be used to track-down possible culprits. Time for a "concealed carry" laser permit! I found this on the AOL homepage; note he was using it to "look at stars"(!): Man Charged With Aiming Laser at Aircraft By WAYNE PARRY, AP NEWARK, N.J. (Jan. 4) - Federal authorities Tuesday used the Patriot Act to charge a man with pointing a laser beam at an airplane overhead and temporarily blinding the pilot and co-pilot. The FBI acknowledged the incident had no connection to terrorism but called David Banach's actions "foolhardy and negligent.'' Banach, 38, admitted to federal agents that he pointed the light beam at a jet and a helicopter over his home near Teterboro Airport last week, authorities said. Initially, he claimed his daughter aimed the device at the helicopter, they said. He is the first person arrested after a recent rash of reports around the nation of laser beams hitting airplanes. Banach was charged only in connection with the jet. He was accused of interfering with the operator of a mass transportation vehicle and making false statements to the FBI, and was released on $100,000 bail. He could get up to 25 years in prison and fines of up to $500,000. Banach's lawyer, Gina Mendola-Longarzo, said her client was simply using the hand-held device to look at stars with his daughter on the family's deck. She said Banach bought the device on the Internet for $100 for his job testing fiber-optic cable. More on the Laser Scare · Nashville-Chicago Incident May Have Been Prank "He wasn't trying to harm any person, any aircraft or anything like that,'' she said. The jet, a chartered Cessna Citation, was coming in for a landing last Wednesday with six people aboard when a green light beam struck the windshield three times at about 3,000 feet, according to court documents. The flash temporarily blinded both the pilot and co-pilot, but they were later able to land the plane safely, authorities said. "Not only was the safety of the pilot and passengers placed in jeopardy by Banach's actions, so were countless innocent civilians on the ground in this densely populated area,'' said Joseph Billy, agent in charge of the FBI's Newark bureau. Then, on Friday, a helicopter carrying Port Authority detectives was hit by a laser beam as its crew surveyed the area to try to pinpoint the origin of the original beam. According to the FBI, the Patriot Act does not describe helicopters as "mass transportation vehicles.'' As for why Banach was not charged with some other offense over the helicopter incident, Michael Drewniak, a spokesman for the U.S. attorney's office, did not immediately return calls for comment. A few hours after the helicopter was hit by the laser, FBI agents canvassed Banach's neighborhood, trying to find the source of the beams. Banach told the agents it was his daughter who shined the laser at the helicopter, according to court papers. Similar incidents have been reported in Colorado Springs, Colorado, Cleveland, Washington, Houston and Medford, Oregon, raising fears that the light beams could temporarily blind cockpit crews and lead to accidents. Last month, the FBI and the Homeland Security Department sent a memo to law enforcement agencies saying there is evidence that terrorists have explored using lasers as weapons. But federal officials have said there is no evidence any the current incidents represent a terrorist plot. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? The all-new My Yahoo! - What will yours do? http://my.yahoo.com

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'Fastest Aussie On Earth'
by Patrick Wiggins 06 Jan '05

06 Jan '05

This guy is either really brave or a candidate for the Darwin Awards. http://www.aussieinvader.com/ Hmmm, now that I think about it, he could have put the thing on a ramp and competed for the X-Prize. Patrick

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RE: [Utah-astronomy] 'Fastest Aussie On Earth'
by Dale Hooper 05 Jan '05

05 Jan '05

If I'm not mistaken - the right rear wheel in the bottom picture - is airborne! That wouldn't exactly give me warm fuzzies at 800 km/hr. ________________________________ From: utah-astronomy-bounces+dale.hooper=sdl.usu.edu(a)mailman.xmission.com on behalf of Patrick Wiggins Sent: Wed 1/5/2005 10:10 PM To: utah astronomy listserve Subject: [Utah-astronomy] 'Fastest Aussie On Earth' This guy is either really brave or a candidate for the Darwin Awards. http://www.aussieinvader.com/ Hmmm, now that I think about it, he could have put the thing on a ramp and competed for the X-Prize. Patrick

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