"Jeremy (cheeky)" <cheekyjeremy@earthlink.net> writes: What a joke, Andy and Stewart for all we love them are not a large box office draw and could not charge prices that big name acts can charge. Stings tickets for this upcoming tour are actually a lot less than they were for BND and they are pretty reasonable when compared to similar size acts. Once again, it seems that this list is full of whiners that will complain no matter what happens. ----------- Jeremy, As far as NY is concerned, the tickets for the new tour are NOT a lot less expensive than BND. They're MORE expensive. If you wish to argue this point further, then I have the ticket stubs to prove it. I am beyond offended at your arrogrant dismissal of valid criticism about price-gouging as a "list full of whiners". If anything, I can turn it around and call you a sad, blind, hyper-obsessive fanatic that's too immersed in the ritual of worshipping a fading pop star whose new album sold so poorly that he had to desperately resort to an abundance of corporate sponsorship and gouging the loyal fans he had left. Open your eyes and face facts. Sting isn't chart-worthy and isn't winning any new fans anymore. His management team has no choice but to bleed the loyal fans that have stuck with him since day one. Don't get me started on the "fan club" and the calculated profit scheme that surrounded the Hammerstein "fan club" show and the rigged Ticketmaster auction. I used to like the guy a lot more, but the marketing machine has lowered my enthusiasm. You cannot deny that the ticket prices are ridiculously inflated to the point of being comical. If I'm a whiner, then you're an apologist. And not a very good one at that. There is ZERO justification for Sting's management's price-gouging. Pardon me for thinking for myself. I still love the music, but I have better things to do with my hard-earned cash. I'm with Heather--I'll wait for the inevitable DVD. Brian -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web - Check your email from the web at http://mail2web.com/ .
Brian, If you are way beyond offended by my comments, then you take things a little too seriously for your own good. My comments are based on the last 10 years on this list. Just looking at the Sacred Love era we have seen complaints about the album, about the tracks released in what countries, it then progressed into a character assassination of Kipper. Then as the promo shows were announced there were screams of unfair over each show that was announced. Let's go one by one.... 1. Paris was announced, and the Americans in general were complaining that the Europeans "always" get the good shows while the Americans get shafted, then there was an almost mockery of the fan club because they seemed to have more tickets than some of you expected them to have. Jokes abound about "so called exclusive" fanclub bollocks. People then complained that they rushed out to buy these tickets because they thought they were exclusive to find out that a few weeks later they were still available. Then people proceeded to to complain that the 60 dollars for the tickets was too much. Stings opening shows on the BND tour were face value 250, 275 and 300 dollars. 2. Hammerstein, New York was announced and the people on the west coast started to complain that New York gets all the good shows and the West Coast gets fuck all. Then people complained when the allocation was sold out in one day, they complained that the fan club should have had more tickets, yet when they had more (as in Paris) you mocked them. 3. Tour dates get announced, and the ticket prices in general were around 60 dollars-90 dollars across the board (excluding New York) and you are all complaining again. Please note that these prices are less than the BND tour was when he did the jaunt through the small venues at the beginning of the tour. There is no point comparing the early show prices to the arena show prices, as when he comes through the 2nd time, the tickets will be lower as they were the last tour. As I went to over 50 shows on the BND tour, I can assure you that this is the case. Just take the opening weeks of the BND tour. We had 3 shows in Vegas, the first two were almost 300 per show and the 3rd show was 300 dollars. The LA shows followed at roughly 250-265 per show for the 4 nights. These are far more expensive than the current shows. 4. Comparing the prices that Andy (who?) and Stewart (who?) charge is ludicrous, they are totally unknown to everyone other than the old Police fans and a small smattering of faithfuls. I love them both, but their marketability is zero compared to stings, therefore compare stings ticket prices to The Eagles, or Paul McCartney and you'll see his prices are far less than his peers. This list has its share of complainers, but I can't understand why they bother to sit on this list year after year claiming that they hate the albums, hate the tours, wont buy another cd etc, yet linger around. Next we'll be complaining that Sting doesn't play Buttplug, Indiana on this tour and how he is letting down his faithful 3 fans there. Jeremy
Jeremy, As I originally stated, you're an apologist. And you're terrible at it. You tactfully ignored the point of my message. Perhaps you should read it again: http://mailman.xmission.com/pipermail/police/2003-November/003840.html Otherwise, here's a quick summary: a. Sting's tickets are overpriced. b. People with valid criticism are not "whiners". c. You are unfair in dismissing them as such. Yes, this is a Sting/Police list. That doesn't mean it has to be a Sting love-fest. People have valid complaints about the "Sacred Love era". It WAS a pain for many people to spend extra for bonus tracks. And no, not everybody has your extensive knowledge into how the record labels work and why there were different versions of the release. So cut them some slack unless you can explain it patiently to them. And if they still feel cheated, it wouldn't kill you to respect that. Not everybody had the time/money like you to fly to Japan just to get the new CD on the day of release, either. Ahem. Yes, people have issues with Kipper. Some would argue (myself included) that his influence on Sting's music has diminished the qualities that drew us to it in the first place. Some (myself included) would just say that he sucks. But this isn't about Kipper. This isn't about the Sacred Love tracklisting. This is originally about an overpriced ticket scheme and long-time Sting *fans* feeling upset about that. We're here because we love Sting and his music. People have every right to complain if they feel disappointed. Nobody signs up to a fanlist JUST to complain. What people say -positve or negative- is valid, especially if they can elaborate on their points. I personally didn't care about the location of the fanclub shows. I was annoyed at the fanclub's shadiness of "ticket allotments". They played on the anxiousness of the fans to get tickets, made it look like they were all gone to ARTIFICIALLY increase demand, then made it look like you could still get in by participating in a bogus "auction" (and made extra $$$ in the process). Didn't extra tickets suddenly turn up elsewhere? I think any "mocking" that happened there was well and truly earned. And I'm sorry that all of this perturbs your sensitive ears. Maybe after 50 nearly identical BND shows, you can't take the noise so well. Yeah, I'm irritated that the new show is so expensive. I've seen huge, elaborate theater productions for a fraction of the cost (yes, even TOURING productions). You still haven't justified the price structure. I don't know if you can. Instead, you pick on other lesser points that had nothing to do with my original message. And even though I'm a massive Sting fan, it's just not worth being taken advantage of financially. I'm the first to support live music, but $165 PLUS "service charges" is comical. I love Sting, but I suppose I've more important financial priorities these days...buying a home, starting a family. It's part of an exciting new concept called "getting a life". Brian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeremy (cheeky)" <cheekyjeremy@earthlink.net> To: <bjacob@nyc.rr.com>; <police@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2003 7:19 PM Subject: Re: "A list full of whiners"???
Brian, If you are way beyond offended by my comments, then you take things a little too seriously for your own good. My comments are based on the last 10 years on this list. Just looking at the Sacred Love era we have seen complaints about the album, about the tracks released in what countries, it then progressed into a character assassination of Kipper. Then as the promo shows were announced there were screams of unfair over each show that was announced. Let's go one by one....
1. Paris was announced, and the Americans in general were complaining that the Europeans "always" get the good shows while the Americans get shafted, then there was an almost mockery of the fan club because they seemed to have more tickets than some of you expected them to have. Jokes abound about "so called exclusive" fanclub bollocks. People then complained that they rushed out to buy these tickets because they thought they were exclusive to find out that a few weeks later they were still available. Then people proceeded to to complain that the 60 dollars for the tickets was too much. Stings opening shows on the BND tour were face value 250, 275 and 300 dollars.
2. Hammerstein, New York was announced and the people on the west coast started to complain that New York gets all the good shows and the West Coast gets fuck all. Then people complained when the allocation was sold out in one day, they complained that the fan club should have had more tickets, yet when they had more (as in Paris) you mocked them.
3. Tour dates get announced, and the ticket prices in general were around 60 dollars-90 dollars across the board (excluding New York) and you are all complaining again. Please note that these prices are less than the BND tour was when he did the jaunt through the small venues at the beginning of the tour. There is no point comparing the early show prices to the arena show prices, as when he comes through the 2nd time, the tickets will be lower as they were the last tour. As I went to over 50 shows on the BND tour, I can assure you that this is the case. Just take the opening weeks of the BND tour. We had 3 shows in Vegas, the first two were almost 300 per show and the 3rd show was 300 dollars. The LA shows followed at roughly 250-265 per show for the 4 nights. These are far more expensive than the current shows.
4. Comparing the prices that Andy (who?) and Stewart (who?) charge is ludicrous, they are totally unknown to everyone other than the old Police fans and a small smattering of faithfuls. I love them both, but their marketability is zero compared to stings, therefore compare stings ticket prices to The Eagles, or Paul McCartney and you'll see his prices are far less than his peers.
This list has its share of complainers, but I can't understand why they bother to sit on this list year after year claiming that they hate the albums, hate the tours, wont buy another cd etc, yet linger around.
Next we'll be complaining that Sting doesn't play Buttplug, Indiana on this tour and how he is letting down his faithful 3 fans there.
Jeremy
Amazing that people complain about Sting charging top price of $90 at most venues for an intimate show, less than 6000 seats where everyone has a great view, when talentless people are charging 5 times as much at venues seating 10 times the size of these Sting shows. I am so proud of Sting for allowing a full spectrum of audience members to attend his shows, you can buy a ticket for $40 in Miami, Sting is selling himself short this tour. The man is way too talented to be selling shows this cheap but it sucks that fans still complain. Why not try buying a Michael Jackson or $2000 Barbara Steisand ticket? Sheeesh! Trini Brian Jacob <bjacob@nyc.rr.com> wrote:Jeremy, As I originally stated, you're an apologist. And you're terrible at it. You tactfully ignored the point of my message. Perhaps you should read it again: http://mailman.xmission.com/pipermail/police/2003-November/003840.html Otherwise, here's a quick summary: a. Sting's tickets are overpriced. b. People with valid criticism are not "whiners". c. You are unfair in dismissing them as such. Yes, this is a Sting/Police list. That doesn't mean it has to be a Sting love-fest. People have valid complaints about the "Sacred Love era". It WAS a pain for many people to spend extra for bonus tracks. And no, not everybody has your extensive knowledge into how the record labels work and why there were different versions of the release. So cut them some slack unless you can explain it patiently to them. And if they still feel cheated, it wouldn't kill you to respect that. Not everybody had the time/money like you to fly to Japan just to get the new CD on the day of release, either. Ahem. Yes, people have issues with Kipper. Some would argue (myself included) that his influence on Sting's music has diminished the qualities that drew us to it in the first place. Some (myself included) would just say that he sucks. But this isn't about Kipper. This isn't about the Sacred Love tracklisting. This is originally about an overpriced ticket scheme and long-time Sting *fans* feeling upset about that. We're here because we love Sting and his music. People have every right to complain if they feel disappointed. Nobody signs up to a fanlist JUST to complain. What people say -positve or negative- is valid, especially if they can elaborate on their points. I personally didn't care about the location of the fanclub shows. I was annoyed at the fanclub's shadiness of "ticket allotments". They played on the anxiousness of the fans to get tickets, made it look like they were all gone to ARTIFICIALLY increase demand, then made it look like you could still get in by participating in a bogus "auction" (and made extra $$$ in the process). Didn't extra tickets suddenly turn up elsewhere? I think any "mocking" that happened there was well and truly earned. And I'm sorry that all of this perturbs your sensitive ears. Maybe after 50 nearly identical BND shows, you can't take the noise so well. Yeah, I'm irritated that the new show is so expensive. I've seen huge, elaborate theater productions for a fraction of the cost (yes, even TOURING productions). You still haven't justified the price structure. I don't know if you can. Instead, you pick on other lesser points that had nothing to do with my original message. And even though I'm a massive Sting fan, it's just not worth being taken advantage of financially. I'm the first to support live music, but $165 PLUS "service charges" is comical. I love Sting, but I suppose I've more important financial priorities these days...buying a home, starting a family. It's part of an exciting new concept called "getting a life". Brian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeremy (cheeky)" To: ; Sent: Tuesday, November 18, 2003 7:19 PM Subject: Re: "A list full of whiners"???
Brian, If you are way beyond offended by my comments, then you take things a little too seriously for your own good. My comments are based on the last 10 years on this list. Just looking at the Sacred Love era we have seen complaints about the album, about the tracks released in what countries, it then progressed into a character assassination of Kipper. Then as the promo shows were announced there were screams of unfair over each show that was announced. Let's go one by one....
1. Paris was announced, and the Americans in general were complaining that the Europeans "always" get the good shows while the Americans get shafted, then there was an almost mockery of the fan club because they seemed to have more tickets than some of you expected them to have. Jokes abound about "so called exclusive" fanclub bollocks. People then complained that they rushed out to buy these tickets because they thought they were exclusive to find out that a few weeks later they were still available. Then people proceeded to to complain that the 60 dollars for the tickets was too much. Stings opening shows on the BND tour were face value 250, 275 and 300 dollars.
2. Hammerstein, New York was announced and the people on the west coast started to complain that New York gets all the good shows and the West Coast gets fuck all. Then people complained when the allocation was sold out in one day, they complained that the fan club should have had more tickets, yet when they had more (as in Paris) you mocked them.
3. Tour dates get announced, and the ticket prices in general were around 60 dollars-90 dollars across the board (excluding New York) and you are all complaining again. Please note that these prices are less than the BND tour was when he did the jaunt through the small venues at the beginning of the tour. There is no point comparing the early show prices to the arena show prices, as when he comes through the 2nd time, the tickets will be lower as they were the last tour. As I went to over 50 shows on the BND tour, I can assure you that this is the case. Just take the opening weeks of the BND tour. We had 3 shows in Vegas, the first two were almost 300 per show and the 3rd show was 300 dollars. The LA shows followed at roughly 250-265 per show for the 4 nights. These are far more expensive than the current shows.
4. Comparing the prices that Andy (who?) and Stewart (who?) charge is ludicrous, they are totally unknown to everyone other than the old Police fans and a small smattering of faithfuls. I love them both, but their marketability is zero compared to stings, therefore compare stings ticket prices to The Eagles, or Paul McCartney and you'll see his prices are far less than his peers.
This list has its share of complainers, but I can't understand why they bother to sit on this list year after year claiming that they hate the albums, hate the tours, wont buy another cd etc, yet linger around.
Next we'll be complaining that Sting doesn't play Buttplug, Indiana on this tour and how he is letting down his faithful 3 fans there.
Jeremy
_______________________________________________ Police mailing list Police@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/police --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Protect your identity with Yahoo! Mail AddressGuard
You tactfully ignored the point of my message. Perhaps you should read again: a. Sting's tickets are overpriced ** Brian, I do not feel the tickets are overpriced when taken in context of the current market. While I agree that the New York tickets are higher than the rest, they are still well in line with what the market charges these days. The ticket prices for the rest of the shows however are relatively low compared to the market. The front rows range from 60-90 bucks while others are available for 40 bucks. I am sorry, but this is just not a lot of money for what shows cost these days. As I have said before, sometimes these things are about choices. If you are telling me that you cannot afford 40 bucks or 90 bucks over the course of a 3 year tour, then I do not believe you. There are some people that can't afford it, but you are not one of them. When you look at the market for tickets, and look at similar sized acts, Stings prices are reasonable to lower end of the scale. This is fact, McCartney, Eagles, Stones, Fleetwood Mac etc all charge more than Sting. As far as whining goes, of course people are welcome to do it, but it gets tired and it is a sad product of the society that we live in. People these days have an appalling lack of accountability and just sue and complain left and right. The Eagles even wrote the song "Get over it" about this Yes it is a discussion forum, and yes you are all welcome to complain, but it just feels that lately it is complaining for complaining sake. Jeremy
Paul McCartney I can understand - I mean the man is a living legend... How many people would give their right arm to see the Beatles lives? It's not possible any more, but McCartney is the closest you're ever going to get.... He's also been in the business for 40 years. With regard to the other artists you mention - look at how many mouths need feeding. You're comparing a solo artist with groups - big groups who have been around a lot longer than Sting. Sure, Sting has to pay the band, but they aren't going to demand as the main members of the Eagles, Stones, Fleetwood Mac etc.... And for your information, The Eagles on their last tour here, were priced around the same as Sting when he last toured here... And while we're on the subject of whiners... Whining about them - doesn't that make you a whiner? J. -----Original Message----- From: police-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:police-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Jeremy (cheeky) Sent: 19 November 2003 05:52 To: Brian Jacob; police@mailman.xmission.com Subject: [Police] Re: "A list full of whiners"??? You tactfully ignored the point of my message. Perhaps you should read again: a. Sting's tickets are overpriced ** Brian, I do not feel the tickets are overpriced when taken in context of the current market. While I agree that the New York tickets are higher than the rest, they are still well in line with what the market charges these days. The ticket prices for the rest of the shows however are relatively low compared to the market. The front rows range from 60-90 bucks while others are available for 40 bucks. I am sorry, but this is just not a lot of money for what shows cost these days. As I have said before, sometimes these things are about choices. If you are telling me that you cannot afford 40 bucks or 90 bucks over the course of a 3 year tour, then I do not believe you. There are some people that can't afford it, but you are not one of them. When you look at the market for tickets, and look at similar sized acts, Stings prices are reasonable to lower end of the scale. This is fact, McCartney, Eagles, Stones, Fleetwood Mac etc all charge more than Sting. As far as whining goes, of course people are welcome to do it, but it gets tired and it is a sad product of the society that we live in. People these days have an appalling lack of accountability and just sue and complain left and right. The Eagles even wrote the song "Get over it" about this Yes it is a discussion forum, and yes you are all welcome to complain, but it just feels that lately it is complaining for complaining sake. Jeremy _______________________________________________ Police mailing list Police@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/police
participants (5)
-
bjacob＠pop-server.nyc.rr.com -
Brian Jacob -
Jason Sheldon -
Jeremy (cheeky) -
Trini