since I started this thread and the ensuing war I would point out that everyone, that means even racist pigs, deserve the right to explain their position. If we are going to be tolerant of every one (for lack of a better phrase), you can't love all races, orientations, religions, etc then suddenly heap hate ontop of the ignorant ones. I have met dudes w/ SS and swaztika's tattood on the back of their skull and tried to listen to them... you have to listen to them in order to understand them. Listening will not make you one of them, in fact, it may give you a better understanding and... if necessary the means to defeat them.... lemme know what you think of my belief.... I'm glad we are having a good heated debate. Matt, the instigator On really romantic nights of self, I go salsa dancing with my confusion. - Speed Levitch _________________________________________________________________ Check your PC for viruses with the FREE McAfee online computer scan. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963