Thanx for all of the info on the dinghy subject including, of course, "The M15 IS a dinghy!" There are some might fine boats suggested. I was very impressed with the Pygmy Kayak kits and thought the SeaEagle X series to be a fine choice for an inflatable. What really piqued my interest: the Rubens Nymph, or maybe the plain Nymph plans. I;m sure I wouldn't want to row too far in one but I am thinking either should tow easily and stow on the truck bed for the trip up. On top of that, I could put it together in my itsy-bitsy-teeny-weeny shop this winter (as if I need another project, says the first mate). One thing for certain, I may or may not NEED a dinghy, but I sure WANT one now!
Blake Reimer wrote:
Thanx for all of the info on the dinghy subject including, of course, "The M15 IS a dinghy!" There are some might fine boats suggested. I was very impressed with the Pygmy Kayak kits and thought the SeaEagle X series to be a fine choice for an inflatable. What really piqued my interest: the Rubens Nymph, or maybe the plain Nymph plans. I;m sure I wouldn't want to row too far in one but I am thinking either should tow easily and stow on the truck bed for the trip up. On top of that, I could put it together in my itsy-bitsy-teeny-weeny shop this winter (as if I need another project, says the first mate). One thing for certain, I may or may not NEED a dinghy, but I sure WANT one now! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
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Hi Blake, I've rowed my NYMPH dinghy for hours at a time, and for many happy miles. With a good set of oars it really moves..... Remember to paint a "Plimsoll Mark" on the sides, so that you don't overload it. You can get the drawings and the building instructions from "Dynamite" Payson in Maine. His full address is: Harold H. Payson & Co. Dept. MB, Pleasant Beach Road South Thomaston, ME 04858 Tel. (207) 594-7587 ...and yes, the NYMPH can be built in a very small shop; and two people can easily pick it up; hold it sideways, and it fits through doorways with lots of room to spare. We carried ours on a roof rack on a VW - GTI and later on a VW Jetta wagon. Light weight and easy to pick up and load or unload. I made a saddle to fit over the transom and added skateboard wheels. That way, with the NYMPH upside down, I could lift the bow and put it on the roof rack crossbar without dragging the transom over the blacktop and marring the varnish. Easily built and works very well. If you want to carry it in your truck bed, then you might think of a hull drain fitting, so if it rains, and the dinghy fills up with water, you can then easily get rid of the rain water via the hull drain fitting. Since ours was carried bottom-side up on the roof rack, we never had that sort of a problem. Connie
The recent (No. 59) edition of Small Craft Advisor had a couple articles of interest to me. One was Jerry's discussion of interior layouts ...........sleeping in the cockpit is doable in a lot of places, but anchored out in a mosquito infested backwater during a downpour so hard you can't see the front of the boat will give you an appreciation for a comfortable, dry berth down below! The other was Jan Nicolaisen's article on food options for long term cruising without ice. He presented some interesting and creative options, but unachievable in a lot of places. Short of a health food store or making your own, I don't know where you are going to find whole grain, sour dough rye, buttermilk powder or any nut butters other than peanut. Nothing like that is stocked in our stores, and I doubt you will find stuff like that in the little food stores in small towns along the cruising grounds. I will resort to eating mustard on cabbage on St. Patrick's Day, but that's about it. So what interesting food options do you folks use that does not require refrigeration? I already carry sardines and crackers, red wine, rum (straight from the bottle), etc. I have not yet succumbed to warm beer and the water I'm in is warm enough to swim in unless you go deep, so beer would not appear to be an option (at least for me). I've switched from butter to extra light olive oil. I can eat SPAM, but not the whole can at once. So I still lug around a 48 quart Igloo cooler, and it's in the way all the time. If I could throw that overboard, it would be a relief. Any ideas?
BTW, I tend to watch the carbs, especially sugar, so pop tarts and chemical donuts are out, as are most breakfast cereals. One of my favorite morning meals is a breakfast burrito on whole wheat tortillas. But that means an egg or two, some peppers and onions and some kind of sausage.......breakfast, italian or chorizo. And a squirt of cheese from a can. Some coffee with that and I'm ready to face the day. But it also means I'm cooking and cleaning for at least half an hour in the morning. On some days, that can be a factor, but for most....what's the rush? On Aug 10, 2009, at 9:14 AM, Howard Audsley wrote:
The recent (No. 59) edition of Small Craft Advisor had a couple articles of interest to me.
One was Jerry's discussion of interior layouts ...........sleeping in the cockpit is doable in a lot of places, but anchored out in a mosquito infested backwater during a downpour so hard you can't see the front of the boat will give you an appreciation for a comfortable, dry berth down below!
The other was Jan Nicolaisen's article on food options for long term cruising without ice. He presented some interesting and creative options, but unachievable in a lot of places. Short of a health food store or making your own, I don't know where you are going to find whole grain, sour dough rye, buttermilk powder or any nut butters other than peanut. Nothing like that is stocked in our stores, and I doubt you will find stuff like that in the little food stores in small towns along the cruising grounds. I will resort to eating mustard on cabbage on St. Patrick's Day, but that's about it.
So what interesting food options do you folks use that does not require refrigeration? I already carry sardines and crackers, red wine, rum (straight from the bottle), etc. I have not yet succumbed to warm beer and the water I'm in is warm enough to swim in unless you go deep, so beer would not appear to be an option (at least for me). I've switched from butter to extra light olive oil. I can eat SPAM, but not the whole can at once.
So I still lug around a 48 quart Igloo cooler, and it's in the way all the time. If I could throw that overboard, it would be a relief.
Any ideas?
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Howard Audsley wrote:
The recent (No. 59) edition of Small Craft Advisor had a couple articles of interest to me.
One was Jerry's discussion of interior layouts ...........sleeping in the cockpit is doable in a lot of places, but anchored out in a mosquito infested backwater during a downpour so hard you can't see the front of the boat will give you an appreciation for a comfortable, dry berth down below!
The other was Jan Nicolaisen's article on food options for long term cruising without ice. He presented some interesting and creative options, but unachievable in a lot of places. Short of a health food store or making your own, I don't know where you are going to find whole grain, sour dough rye, buttermilk powder or any nut butters other than peanut. Nothing like that is stocked in our stores, and I doubt you will find stuff like that in the little food stores in small towns along the cruising grounds. I will resort to eating mustard on cabbage on St. Patrick's Day, but that's about it.
So what interesting food options do you folks use that does not require refrigeration? I already carry sardines and crackers, red wine, rum (straight from the bottle), etc. I have not yet succumbed to warm beer and the water I'm in is warm enough to swim in unless you go deep, so beer would not appear to be an option (at least for me). I've switched from butter to extra light olive oil. I can eat SPAM, but not the whole can at once.
So I still lug around a 48 quart Igloo cooler, and it's in the way all the time. If I could throw that overboard, it would be a relief.
Any ideas?
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet!
Hi Howard, For starters: cans of tuna fish (or the new pouches which I think are even smaller in quantity than are the cans) canned spaghetti / or similar product try a camping out fitters such as EMI, or Cabela's and see what sort of provisions they have that don't require refrigeration. The hunters / fishermen / backpackers all have the same problems. Connie
Howard, If you don't mind cooking, but just don't like the cooler option, you can order items through REI which has a full?line of dried foods.? I don't like the cooler option either, but the alternative is even worse, so I make the best of it.? I freeze jugs of water a few days before my sailing weekend and use them as my ice source, and as they melt, they provide nice cold water for those hot afternoons!!? Skip -----Original Message----- From: Conbert H. Benneck <chbenneck@sbcglobal.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Mon, Aug 10, 2009 10:49 am Subject: Re: M_Boats: No Ice Food Options Howard Audsley wrote:?
The recent (No. 59) edition of Small Craft Advisor had a couple > articles of interest to me.? ? One was Jerry's discussion of interior layouts ...........sleeping in > the cockpit is doable in a lot of places, but anchored out in a > mosquito infested backwater during a downpour so hard you can't see > the front of the boat will give you an appreciation for a > comfortable, dry berth down below!? ? The other was Jan Nicolaisen's article on food options for long term > cruising without ice. He presented some interesting and creative > options, but unachievable in a lot of places. Short of a health food > store or making your own, I don't know where you are going to find > whole grain, sour dough rye, buttermilk powder or any nut butters > other than peanut. Nothing like that is stocked in our stores, and I > doubt you will find stuff like that in the little food stores in small > towns along the cruising grounds. I will resort to eating mustard on > cabbage on St. Patrick's Day, but that's about it.? ? So what interesting food options do you folks use that does not > require refrigeration? I already carry sardines and crackers, red > wine, rum (straight from the bottle), etc. I have not yet succumbed to > warm beer and the water I'm in is warm enough to swim in unless you go > deep, so beer would not appear to be an option (at least for me). > I've switched from butter to extra light olive oil. I can eat SPAM, > but not the whole can at once.? ? So I still lug around a 48 quart Igloo cooler, and it's in the way all > the time. If I could throw that overboard, it would be a relief.? ? Any ideas?? ? ? _______________________________________________? http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats? ? Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet!? ? Hi Howard,? ? For starters:? ? cans of tuna fish (or the new pouches which I think are even smaller in quantity than are the cans)? ? canned spaghetti / or similar product? ? try a camping out fitters such as EMI, or Cabela's and see what sort of provisions they have that don't require refrigeration. The hunters / fishermen / backpackers all have the same problems.? ? Connie? ? _______________________________________________? http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats? ? Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet!?
Yup......I failed to mention those. There is tuna and a limited selection of other canned fish and other meats, such as vienna sausage, canned chicken, some beef. Freeze dried beef, jerky, etc. I carry a dry food tub on the boat, and I think it has a can of Hormel Chili in it right now. I've wondered about dragging along a chunk of country cured ham. Then there is the packaged mixes like the Lipton stuff. Red beans and rice, etc. One downside to a lot of those is dealing with the packaging. Do that often enough and you can start accumulating a good size pile of trash to drag around. I was along on a scout trip to Philmont, so lived out of a backpack for 10 days, not to mention all the other backpacking we did before and after. They (Philmont) and we used a lot of freeze dried stuff (so you don't have to carry the weight of the water on your back). They worked, but you would tire of that pretty quick. Those pemican bars were filling to say the least, but also known to cause gastric distress in some. When we weren't backpacking, the motto of the adults was to eat better on a campout than we did at home, or there wasn't much reason to go on a campout. So we would serve KC strips, baked potatoes, salads, cobblers, etc. I've tended to carry that philosophy over to boating (I don't have to carry it on my back), so I'm known to eat like that on the boat most of the time. But that means that cooler goes too. Trying to find some middle ground here.
Hi Howard,
For starters:
cans of tuna fish (or the new pouches which I think are even smaller in quantity than are the cans)
canned spaghetti / or similar product
try a camping out fitters such as EMI, or Cabela's and see what sort of provisions they have that don't require refrigeration. The hunters / fishermen / backpackers all have the same problems.
Connie
Hi Howard, I also fondly remember my dreams of a cheeseburger in paradise after living on the freeze dried food for a couple of weeks - both Philmont and a 14 day canoe trip above Ely Mn. I find the freeze dried food to be very expensive and very high in sodium sooo. I compromise on the 1 week trips and have switched to a much smaller cooler that only holds frozen protein - individual packed servings of some kind of fish, or shrimp. I include some frozen cooked shrimp in sandwich bags for lunches. These only last about 3 days at best. Fresh vegetables, fruit and eggs(turn every two days and they are good for a month) keep extremely well if they have not been refrigerated and good air circulation so the moisture does not collect and cause rot. There is pre-cooked bacon that needs no refrigeration that lasts for quite a while as well. So I have a hearty breakfast on the boat (and at home) while I am waiting for the wind to pick up - a two egg omelet, bacon, oatmeal with blueberrys, a couple of oranges and two mugs of green tea. This kind of breakfast can be done for two or 3 weeks with no refrigeration. lunch is thawed pre-cooked shimp that I can eat on the fly with some kind of cracker. When that runs out I switch to Penut butter and jelly sandwichs. Dinners after the frozen food runs out is pretty much the one pot fare that is described in numerous places - still fresh vegetable with rice or pasta and can of protien - salmon, ham or shrimp. The new pre-cooked chicken breasts/salmon in foil pouches are decent. For extended two week trips away from civilization my menu stays about the same as the last 4 described for the 1 week trip. I do add some vegetarian stir fry conglomerations with various nuts added for protien. All in all it is not bad fare. Thanks Doug Kelch --- On Mon, 8/10/09, Howard Audsley <haudsley@tranquility.net> wrote: From: Howard Audsley <haudsley@tranquility.net> Subject: Re: M_Boats: No Ice Food Options To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission..com> Date: Monday, August 10, 2009, 11:17 AM Yup......I failed to mention those. There is tuna and a limited selection of other canned fish and other meats, such as vienna sausage, canned chicken, some beef. Freeze dried beef, jerky, etc. I carry a dry food tub on the boat, and I think it has a can of Hormel Chili in it right now. I've wondered about dragging along a chunk of country cured ham. Then there is the packaged mixes like the Lipton stuff. Red beans and rice, etc. One downside to a lot of those is dealing with the packaging. Do that often enough and you can start accumulating a good size pile of trash to drag around.
I'll be honest. I had to bounce back and forth between Jan Niclolaisen's article and Google to translate most of the food stuff she presented. Although most of what she presented sounded intriguing, living where we do, we don't have access to a whole foods store. So I still have to fall back on my old backpacking experiences and bring them on board Seafrog. The big advantage is a bigger "pack" and switching from a nylon tent to a fiberglass one. So, think outside the box on cooking in our Monty's. Check out the backpacker's cookbooks. They too have the same limitations that we have... no refrigeration and no coolers. I have a ancient copy of the "One Pot Gourmet" and "Trail Cooking" that I still get recipes from. Another recent book I'm ordering is Chef in Your Backpack. I'll let you all know if I find some neat stuff. One thing I discovered some time ago is that just about anything you can bake in an oven you can bake on a stove using a covered frypan. Here's the tip. After mixing your cake in a zip lock bag, instead of emptying it in the pan, cut a tiny piece off the corner and squeaze it out in a lowly heat greased pan and cover. Kinda looks like funnel cake. The more random pattern the better for heat circulation and baking affect. This is especially effective if you want to make pineapple upside down cake or cinnamon buns. Just put all the gooey stuff in the bottom of the pan and ooze out the batter. Try it at home and experiment with the heat. If your fry pan gets too hot make a baffle for it. a few sandwich layers of tin foil; the lid cut from a large tin can; a piece of flashing. I have a backpacker's oven that works well but I'm hesitant to put in on a rolling boat. One of the most versitle things I've found for breakfast is Quaker 100. You can eat it right out the box like granola; make a hot breafast with hot water and powdered milk (about the only way I can take powdered milk); or cold with Parmalot, a retort package of milk that comes in skim, 2%, and whole. So depending of the weather or sea conditions, you can have a good breakfast. Joe Seafrog M17 ----- Original Message ----- From: "Howard Audsley" <haudsley@tranquility.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 10:14 AM Subject: M_Boats: No Ice Food Options
The recent (No. 59) edition of Small Craft Advisor had a couple articles of interest to me.
One was Jerry's discussion of interior layouts ...........sleeping in the cockpit is doable in a lot of places, but anchored out in a mosquito infested backwater during a downpour so hard you can't see the front of the boat will give you an appreciation for a comfortable, dry berth down below!
The other was Jan Nicolaisen's article on food options for long term cruising without ice. He presented some interesting and creative options, but unachievable in a lot of places. Short of a health food store or making your own, I don't know where you are going to find whole grain, sour dough rye, buttermilk powder or any nut butters other than peanut. Nothing like that is stocked in our stores, and I doubt you will find stuff like that in the little food stores in small towns along the cruising grounds. I will resort to eating mustard on cabbage on St. Patrick's Day, but that's about it.
So what interesting food options do you folks use that does not require refrigeration? I already carry sardines and crackers, red wine, rum (straight from the bottle), etc. I have not yet succumbed to warm beer and the water I'm in is warm enough to swim in unless you go deep, so beer would not appear to be an option (at least for me). I've switched from butter to extra light olive oil. I can eat SPAM, but not the whole can at once.
So I still lug around a 48 quart Igloo cooler, and it's in the way all the time. If I could throw that overboard, it would be a relief.
Any ideas?
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet!
Howard Audsley wrote:
The recent (No. 59) edition of Small Craft Advisor had a couple articles of interest to me.
One was Jerry's discussion of interior layouts ...........sleeping in the cockpit is doable in a lot of places, but anchored out in a mosquito infested backwater during a downpour so hard you can't see the front of the boat will give you an appreciation for a comfortable, dry berth down below!
The other was Jan Nicolaisen's article on food options for long term cruising without ice. He presented some interesting and creative options, but unachievable in a lot of places. Short of a health food store or making your own, I don't know where you are going to find whole grain, sour dough rye, buttermilk powder or any nut butters other than peanut. Nothing like that is stocked in our stores, and I doubt you will find stuff like that in the little food stores in small towns along the cruising grounds. I will resort to eating mustard on cabbage on St. Patrick's Day, but that's about it.
So what interesting food options do you folks use that does not require refrigeration? I already carry sardines and crackers, red wine, rum (straight from the bottle), etc. I have not yet succumbed to warm beer and the water I'm in is warm enough to swim in unless you go deep, so beer would not appear to be an option (at least for me). I've switched from butter to extra light olive oil. I can eat SPAM, but not the whole can at once.
So I still lug around a 48 quart Igloo cooler, and it's in the way all the time. If I could throw that overboard, it would be a relief.
Any ideas?
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
Remember, there is no privacy on the Internet!
Howard, Another thought.... Years ago on a car trip to Denver we stopped at a large truck stop for some food and a look-see. As I recall, they had all sorts of "goodies" that could be used by the Messing About in Boats crowd. I saw 12 volt coffee makers; hair driers and I don't know what else. They also had small portions of food. It might be worthwhile to go to a big truck stop and do some investigation as to what is available for trucker's use, and which would also be most useful for us boaters as well. Happy snooping and discovery Connie
Yesterday I got out in Bogue Sound for what was supposed to be 5-10mph winds out of the SSW. But by the time I got out there it was more like 20+ coming out more from the west which meant my sailing was going to be close reach one way and broad reaching the other. I had a good time going to windward. Very impressed with keeping pretty tight on the wind. But going downwind got me out of my comfort zone. A couple of times I got spun around quicker than I can say "spun around". I had the centerboard up (as I recalled from an earlier post). So my question is.. what should I do or look for to keep this from happening? I didn't feel over canvassed, but perhaps I should have put in a reef or two?? Thanks for any advice. Joe Scary in Seafrog M17
Over canvassed more than likely. Reduce. Broad reaching should be your easiest point of sail. I'll bet even one reef would have made all the difference in the world, Joe. t On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 10:53 AM, Joe Murphy<seagray@embarqmail.com> wrote:
Yesterday I got out in Bogue Sound for what was supposed to be 5-10mph winds out of the SSW. But by the time I got out there it was more like 20+ coming out more from the west which meant my sailing was going to be close reach one way and broad reaching the other. I had a good time going to windward. Very impressed with keeping pretty tight on the wind. But going downwind got me out of my comfort zone. A couple of times I got spun around quicker than I can say "spun around". I had the centerboard up (as I recalled from an earlier post). So my question is.. what should I do or look for to keep this from happening? I didn't feel over canvassed, but perhaps I should have put in a reef or two?? Thanks for any advice. Joe Scary in Seafrog M17
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Thanks. I was also running with a 2kt current with 2' seas so I was thinking that the lift from behind was knocking me off my line, but reducing sail would have more than likely settled her down. Joe ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Smith" <openboatt@gmail.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 2:40 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Following Seas Over canvassed more than likely. Reduce. Broad reaching should be your easiest point of sail. I'll bet even one reef would have made all the difference in the world, Joe. t On Mon, Aug 10, 2009 at 10:53 AM, Joe Murphy<seagray@embarqmail.com> wrote:
Yesterday I got out in Bogue Sound for what was supposed to be 5-10mph winds out of the SSW. But by the time I got out there it was more like 20+ coming out more from the west which meant my sailing was going to be close reach one way and broad reaching the other. I had a good time going to windward. Very impressed with keeping pretty tight on the wind. But going downwind got me out of my comfort zone. A couple of times I got spun around quicker than I can say "spun around". I had the centerboard up (as I recalled from an earlier post). So my question is.. what should I do or look for to keep this from happening? I didn't feel over canvassed, but perhaps I should have put in a reef or two?? Thanks for any advice. Joe Scary in Seafrog M17
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Joe, Reefing the main not only lowers the sail area's center of effort but also moves it inboard - which is where you want it when running or broad reaching in high wind. Even so, sea state has a lot to do with this too. If you're getting rocked so much that the rudder is coming out of the water then your lateral resistance suddenly shifts WAY forward and your boat becomes a ballerina. Having had Spirit for only one year I do not consider myself an expert on M-17 handling. But afternoon runs down San Francisco Bay get very windy and choppy and I have never experienced a spin-out with a an 80% jib up and a reef (or two) in my main. Jim M-17 "Spirit" On Aug 10, 2009, at 10:53 AM, Joe Murphy wrote:
Yesterday I got out in Bogue Sound for what was supposed to be 5-10mph winds out of the SSW. But by the time I got out there it was more like 20+ coming out more from the west which meant my sailing was going to be close reach one way and broad reaching the other. I had a good time going to windward. Very impressed with keeping pretty tight on the wind. But going downwind got me out of my comfort zone. A couple of times I got spun around quicker than I can say "spun around". I had the centerboard up (as I recalled from an earlier post). So my question is.. what should I do or look for to keep this from happening? I didn't feel over canvassed, but perhaps I should have put in a reef or two?? Thanks for any advice. Joe Scary in Seafrog M17
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Thanks. I guess I'm one of those dumbies that waits too long to reef... Won't happen again! Joe Seafrog M17 ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Poulakis" <picfo@comcast.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 4:18 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Following Seas
Joe, Reefing the main not only lowers the sail area's center of effort but also moves it inboard - which is where you want it when running or broad reaching in high wind. Even so, sea state has a lot to do with this too. If you're getting rocked so much that the rudder is coming out of the water then your lateral resistance suddenly shifts WAY forward and your boat becomes a ballerina.
Having had Spirit for only one year I do not consider myself an expert on M-17 handling. But afternoon runs down San Francisco Bay get very windy and choppy and I have never experienced a spin-out with a an 80% jib up and a reef (or two) in my main.
Jim M-17 "Spirit"
On Aug 10, 2009, at 10:53 AM, Joe Murphy wrote:
Yesterday I got out in Bogue Sound for what was supposed to be 5-10mph winds out of the SSW. But by the time I got out there it was more like 20+ coming out more from the west which meant my sailing was going to be close reach one way and broad reaching the other. I had a good time going to windward. Very impressed with keeping pretty tight on the wind. But going downwind got me out of my comfort zone. A couple of times I got spun around quicker than I can say "spun around". I had the centerboard up (as I recalled from an earlier post). So my question is.. what should I do or look for to keep this from happening? I didn't feel over canvassed, but perhaps I should have put in a reef or two?? Thanks for any advice. Joe Scary in Seafrog M17
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It is very easy to carry too much sail when off the wind because everything seems calmer because the apparent wind is less and you don't have the cue from heeling. One time I was sailing back across Lake Erie and had a nice pleasant very fast run all the way from Leamington (Ontario) to the SW corner of Kelley's Island. At that point, I had to head up a bit and promptly had to switch from the 155 + full main down to the 80% and a reefed main. It was fun while it lasted! Hull speed the whole way! Most of the trip was in the lee of Pelee Island, so the water was pretty flat. Had there been larger waves then steering would've been much more difficult and it would've become apparent that I was overcanvassed. Tod Mills M17 #408, 1987 galley model BuscaBrisas
-----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Joe Murphy Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 9:29 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Following Seas
Thanks. I guess I'm one of those dumbies that waits too long to reef... Won't happen again! Joe Seafrog M17 ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Poulakis" <picfo@comcast.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 4:18 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Following Seas
Joe, Reefing the main not only lowers the sail area's center of effort but also moves it inboard - which is where you want it when running or broad reaching in high wind. Even so, sea state has a lot to do with this too. If you're getting rocked so much that the rudder is coming out of the water then your lateral resistance suddenly shifts WAY forward and your boat becomes a ballerina.
Having had Spirit for only one year I do not consider myself an expert on M-17 handling. But afternoon runs down San Francisco Bay get very windy and choppy and I have never experienced a spin-out with a an 80% jib up and a reef (or two) in my main.
Jim M-17 "Spirit"
On Aug 10, 2009, at 10:53 AM, Joe Murphy wrote:
Yesterday I got out in Bogue Sound for what was supposed to be 5- 10mph winds out of the SSW. But by the time I got out there it was more like 20+ coming out more from the west which meant my sailing was going to be close reach one way and broad reaching the other. I had a good time going to windward. Very impressed with keeping pretty tight on the wind. But going downwind got me out of my comfort zone. A couple of times I got spun around quicker than I can say "spun around". I had the centerboard up (as I recalled from an earlier post). So my question is.. what should I do or look for to keep this from happening? I didn't feel over canvassed, but perhaps I should have put in a reef or two?? Thanks for any advice. Joe Scary in Seafrog M17
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Well the verdict is in and it's unanimous. Reef, reef, reef. Thanks to all for answering. Joe Seafrog M17 ----- Original Message ----- From: <htmills@zoominternet.net> To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 11:12 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Following Seas
It is very easy to carry too much sail when off the wind because everything seems calmer because the apparent wind is less and you don't have the cue from heeling.
One time I was sailing back across Lake Erie and had a nice pleasant very fast run all the way from Leamington (Ontario) to the SW corner of Kelley's Island. At that point, I had to head up a bit and promptly had to switch from the 155 + full main down to the 80% and a reefed main. It was fun while it lasted! Hull speed the whole way! Most of the trip was in the lee of Pelee Island, so the water was pretty flat. Had there been larger waves then steering would've been much more difficult and it would've become apparent that I was overcanvassed.
Tod Mills M17 #408, 1987 galley model BuscaBrisas
-----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Joe Murphy Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 9:29 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Following Seas
Thanks. I guess I'm one of those dumbies that waits too long to reef... Won't happen again! Joe Seafrog M17 ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Poulakis" <picfo@comcast.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 4:18 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Following Seas
Joe, Reefing the main not only lowers the sail area's center of effort but also moves it inboard - which is where you want it when running or broad reaching in high wind. Even so, sea state has a lot to do with this too. If you're getting rocked so much that the rudder is coming out of the water then your lateral resistance suddenly shifts WAY forward and your boat becomes a ballerina.
Having had Spirit for only one year I do not consider myself an expert on M-17 handling. But afternoon runs down San Francisco Bay get very windy and choppy and I have never experienced a spin-out with a an 80% jib up and a reef (or two) in my main.
Jim M-17 "Spirit"
On Aug 10, 2009, at 10:53 AM, Joe Murphy wrote:
Yesterday I got out in Bogue Sound for what was supposed to be 5- 10mph winds out of the SSW. But by the time I got out there it was more like 20+ coming out more from the west which meant my sailing was going to be close reach one way and broad reaching the other. I had a good time going to windward. Very impressed with keeping pretty tight on the wind. But going downwind got me out of my comfort zone. A couple of times I got spun around quicker than I can say "spun around". I had the centerboard up (as I recalled from an earlier post). So my question is.. what should I do or look for to keep this from happening? I didn't feel over canvassed, but perhaps I should have put in a reef or two?? Thanks for any advice. Joe Scary in Seafrog M17
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Yes, no wimps around here! jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joe Murphy" <seagray@embarqmail.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2009 7:56 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Following Seas
Well the verdict is in and it's unanimous. Reef, reef, reef. Thanks to all for answering. Joe Seafrog M17
----- Original Message ----- From: <htmills@zoominternet.net> To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 11:12 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Following Seas
It is very easy to carry too much sail when off the wind because everything seems calmer because the apparent wind is less and you don't have the cue from heeling.
One time I was sailing back across Lake Erie and had a nice pleasant very fast run all the way from Leamington (Ontario) to the SW corner of Kelley's Island. At that point, I had to head up a bit and promptly had to switch from the 155 + full main down to the 80% and a reefed main. It was fun while it lasted! Hull speed the whole way! Most of the trip was in the lee of Pelee Island, so the water was pretty flat. Had there been larger waves then steering would've been much more difficult and it would've become apparent that I was overcanvassed.
Tod Mills M17 #408, 1987 galley model BuscaBrisas
-----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Joe Murphy Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 9:29 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Following Seas
Thanks. I guess I'm one of those dumbies that waits too long to reef... Won't happen again! Joe Seafrog M17 ----- Original Message ----- From: "James Poulakis" <picfo@comcast.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Monday, August 10, 2009 4:18 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Following Seas
Joe, Reefing the main not only lowers the sail area's center of effort but also moves it inboard - which is where you want it when running or broad reaching in high wind. Even so, sea state has a lot to do with this too. If you're getting rocked so much that the rudder is coming out of the water then your lateral resistance suddenly shifts WAY forward and your boat becomes a ballerina.
Having had Spirit for only one year I do not consider myself an expert on M-17 handling. But afternoon runs down San Francisco Bay get very windy and choppy and I have never experienced a spin-out with a an 80% jib up and a reef (or two) in my main.
Jim M-17 "Spirit"
On Aug 10, 2009, at 10:53 AM, Joe Murphy wrote:
Yesterday I got out in Bogue Sound for what was supposed to be 5- 10mph winds out of the SSW. But by the time I got out there it was more like 20+ coming out more from the west which meant my sailing was going to be close reach one way and broad reaching the other. I had a good time going to windward. Very impressed with keeping pretty tight on the wind. But going downwind got me out of my comfort zone. A couple of times I got spun around quicker than I can say "spun around". I had the centerboard up (as I recalled from an earlier post). So my question is.. what should I do or look for to keep this from happening? I didn't feel over canvassed, but perhaps I should have put in a reef or two?? Thanks for any advice. Joe Scary in Seafrog M17
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No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 8.5.392 / Virus Database: 270.13.49/2294 - Release Date: 08/10/09 06:10:00
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participants (10)
-
Blake Reimer -
Conbert H. Benneck -
Doug Kelch -
Howard Audsley -
htmills＠zoominternet.net -
James Poulakis -
jerry -
Joe Murphy -
Tom Smith -
wcampion＠aol.com