Hi: we sailed the San Juans last week. My wife wanted to try camping on the boat (M15). Didn’t work out. She doesn’t like how small it is. I love the M15 and it works out for solo boaters. Should I go to a M17 or is it just as cramped? Problem is, my M15 is in excellent shape and trading up to a M17 could be bad because I’ve read so many stories on this thread about older boats and all the problems. I don’t want to give up a good boat for one with problems. What do you have to watch out for when looking at another boat? Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky) outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> Twitter: @zimosoutdoors "Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
Having an M17 and having been on two different M15s, I will say the M17 is quite a bit roomier. The cockpit, the cabin, the foredeck...amazing how much more volume two feet of length and more beam provides. And, 'roomier' is relative - it's still a 'pocket' cruiser. I would say a first step would be to visit an M17 somewhere in person and feel the difference - your wife as well as you. The main concern with older M17s in particular is swelling in the keel, locking the CB from moving down and up. From the steel punchings used as ballast in early years. They can rust enough to swell enough to do that, if water has gotten into the keel. I don't recall when it switched to lead, someone here probably does. Other than that, just the usual stuff on an older boat, not specific to an M17. Rigging, hardware, wear and tear, etc. cheers, John On 8/10/19 9:10 AM, Peter Zimowsky via montgomery_boats wrote:
Hi: we sailed the San Juans last week. My wife wanted to try camping on the boat (M15). Didn’t work out. She doesn’t like how small it is. I love the M15 and it works out for solo boaters. Should I go to a M17 or is it just as cramped? Problem is, my M15 is in excellent shape and trading up to a M17 could be bad because I’ve read so many stories on this thread about older boats and all the problems. I don’t want to give up a good boat for one with problems. What do you have to watch out for when looking at another boat?
Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky)
outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> Twitter: @zimosoutdoors
"Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
Peter: First questions for you - what was 'to small'? The berth (M15's is larger), no place to sit upright? No private head? No full galley? These are things that an M17 barely will give you nare no better than on the M15. :: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/ On Sat, Aug 10, 2019, 9:11 AM Peter Zimowsky via montgomery_boats < montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote:
Hi: we sailed the San Juans last week. My wife wanted to try camping on the boat (M15). Didn’t work out. She doesn’t like how small it is. I love the M15 and it works out for solo boaters. Should I go to a M17 or is it just as cramped? Problem is, my M15 is in excellent shape and trading up to a M17 could be bad because I’ve read so many stories on this thread about older boats and all the problems. I don’t want to give up a good boat for one with problems. What do you have to watch out for when looking at another boat?
Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky)
outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> Twitter: @zimosoutdoors
"Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
hi: Thanks for info. Maybe a pocket cruiser isn’t for me. Heaven forbid, but do I need a Catalina 22 or something that big? Ugh? Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky) outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> Twitter: @zimosoutdoors "Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
On Aug 10, 2019, at 11:19 AM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter:
First questions for you - what was 'to small'? The berth (M15's is larger), no place to sit upright? No private head? No full galley? These are things that an M17 barely will give you nare no better than on the M15.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com <http://sv-swallow.com/> :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com <http://m17-375.com/> :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/ <http://www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/>
On Sat, Aug 10, 2019, 9:11 AM Peter Zimowsky via montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com <mailto:montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>> wrote: Hi: we sailed the San Juans last week. My wife wanted to try camping on the boat (M15). Didn’t work out. She doesn’t like how small it is. I love the M15 and it works out for solo boaters. Should I go to a M17 or is it just as cramped? Problem is, my M15 is in excellent shape and trading up to a M17 could be bad because I’ve read so many stories on this thread about older boats and all the problems. I don’t want to give up a good boat for one with problems. What do you have to watch out for when looking at another boat?
Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky)
outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/ <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/>> Twitter: @zimosoutdoors
"Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
Peter, I had a Flicka 20. It was a GREAT boat for single or double occupancy. Seaworthy as they come, toilet, stove, lots of storage, HEADROOM and I am 6' tall!. Wait for it......it weighs 6000 pounds. You would probably need a semi rig to haul it up a boat ramp if you could find one steep enough. Every boat is a compromise. I sold the Flicka (very sad day!!) because I wanted to explore "foreign waters" inland. Presently own a 17 and yes, it is not for most women although I once had a partner who was tougher than I was and we loved the boat----together. NOW is the time to take your time and research, research, research. Include your wife in all of that, if she intends to be with you in your nautical adventures. No matter how much fun they may be they will never be fun if your mate is not smiling. Wait for it, again, you are headed for one of the two happiest days in a boat owner's life, the day he finds his "dreamboat". The other day depends on how well you research before the first day. Good luck and fair winds, Tom, Monty 17, 1977, #258, AS-IS <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon> Virus-free. www.avast.com <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=link> <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> On Sat, Aug 10, 2019 at 12:33 PM Peter Zimowsky via montgomery_boats < montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote:
hi: Thanks for info. Maybe a pocket cruiser isn’t for me. Heaven forbid, but do I need a Catalina 22 or something that big? Ugh?
Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky)
outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> Twitter: @zimosoutdoors
"Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
On Aug 10, 2019, at 11:19 AM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter:
First questions for you - what was 'to small'? The berth (M15's is larger), no place to sit upright? No private head? No full galley? These are things that an M17 barely will give you nare no better than on the M15.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com <http://sv-swallow.com/> :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com <http://m17-375.com/> :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/ < http://www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/>
On Sat, Aug 10, 2019, 9:11 AM Peter Zimowsky via montgomery_boats < montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com <mailto: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>> wrote: Hi: we sailed the San Juans last week. My wife wanted to try camping on the boat (M15). Didn’t work out. She doesn’t like how small it is. I love the M15 and it works out for solo boaters. Should I go to a M17 or is it just as cramped? Problem is, my M15 is in excellent shape and trading up to a M17 could be bad because I’ve read so many stories on this thread about older boats and all the problems. I don’t want to give up a good boat for one with problems. What do you have to watch out for when looking at another boat?
Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky)
outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> < http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/ <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/
Twitter: @zimosoutdoors
"Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
It is an adventure, figuring this all out. My wife is new to sailing, and we are testing out how we use the M15 and what she makes of it. Wonderful responsive yet solid boat to learn to sail on, and plenty roomy for two underway- but as soon one is anchored, she does seem to shrink! On a boat so small how one cruises makes all the difference. For two, beach (read lake, here in the nw) cruising with the ability to sprawl out on shore, even if sleeping aboard, is far easier on a boat so small that two puttering aboard is tough (hard to cook when the other person is rocking the boat, literally). I’ve also been thinking hard about a dinghy or some sort, just so one can get off the boat when it seems tight, or pack portable galley to cook ashore. Also, like backpacking, building routines and storage systems so you know where stuff is and aren’t always digging through stuff wondering where the dang x is... I daydream of a way to affordable charter a 20-30’ basic sailboat for those occasional longer trips in the salt- but the charter market seems driven by bigger n fancier yachts. The rest of the time the quick launch and the ability to back into the garage at the end of the day make the M15 perfect for this landlocked sailor... Alex On Sat, Aug 10, 2019 at 10:54 AM Thomas Buzzi <thomaspbuzzi@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter, I had a Flicka 20. It was a GREAT boat for single or double occupancy. Seaworthy as they come, toilet, stove, lots of storage, HEADROOM and I am 6' tall!. Wait for it......it weighs 6000 pounds. You would probably need a semi rig to haul it up a boat ramp if you could find one steep enough. Every boat is a compromise. I sold the Flicka (very sad day!!) because I wanted to explore "foreign waters" inland. Presently own a 17 and yes, it is not for most women although I once had a partner who was tougher than I was and we loved the boat----together. NOW is the time to take your time and research, research, research. Include your wife in all of that, if she intends to be with you in your nautical adventures. No matter how much fun they may be they will never be fun if your mate is not smiling. Wait for it, again, you are headed for one of the two happiest days in a boat owner's life, the day he finds his "dreamboat". The other day depends on how well you research before the first day. Good luck and fair winds, Tom, Monty 17, 1977, #258, AS-IS
< https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaig...
Virus-free. www.avast.com < https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaig...
<#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
On Sat, Aug 10, 2019 at 12:33 PM Peter Zimowsky via montgomery_boats < montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote:
hi: Thanks for info. Maybe a pocket cruiser isn’t for me. Heaven forbid, but do I need a Catalina 22 or something that big? Ugh?
Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky)
outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> Twitter: @zimosoutdoors
"Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
On Aug 10, 2019, at 11:19 AM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter:
First questions for you - what was 'to small'? The berth (M15's is larger), no place to sit upright? No private head? No full galley? These are things that an M17 barely will give you nare no better than on the M15.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com <http://sv-swallow.com/> :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com <http://m17-375.com/> :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/ < http://www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/>
On Sat, Aug 10, 2019, 9:11 AM Peter Zimowsky via montgomery_boats < montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com <mailto: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>> wrote: Hi: we sailed the San Juans last week. My wife wanted to try camping on the boat (M15). Didn’t work out. She doesn’t like how small it is. I love the M15 and it works out for solo boaters. Should I go to a M17 or is it just as cramped? Problem is, my M15 is in excellent shape and trading up to a M17 could be bad because I’ve read so many stories on this thread about older boats and all the problems. I don’t want to give up a good boat for one with problems. What do you have to watch out for when looking at another boat?
Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky)
outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> < http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/ < http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/
Twitter: @zimosoutdoors
"Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
I am tall (6' 3") so maybe that's why the M17 feels so much roomier to me than the M15...again if you can see one in person sometime, you will have a much clearer sense of it. There is at least room to sit inside, fully upright (even me, just barely, on the settee), move around a bit, space for a portable galley setup, etc. For me, in the M15 it is lie down, or get out in the cockpit (short people I am told can sit up just inside the companionway ;-). So in my experience, M17 much roomier. And, it's still a 17-footer. There are a variety of other 17-18 ft. pocket cruisers...some with larger cabin (thus smaller cockpit). Of those I've seen in person, the M17 is a great balance of roomy cockpit and adequate cabin space. Venture 17 & Vagabond 17 (both a fair bit lighter than the M17); Sanibel 18; Com-Pac, SunCat, Etc. etc. Even a Sage 17 but that is big $$$ since there's no old used ones around. You can go to sailboatdata.com and search only on 17, then 18, then 19, etc. and get reasonable search results showing boats of that length (as long as the length is in the name in the database. Here's 17 for example: https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat?filter%5Bname%5D=17&paginate=25&units=impe... Not to mention all the designs for plan or kit built pocket cruisers... And, there's only so much one can do in 17-18 ft. with decent sailing qualities. If you want something almost as light to tow/launch as M17, with a fair bit more interior space, and also a Lyle Hess design, you could look at a Balboa 20 or Ensenada 20. Same exact hull; Balboa has typical cabin/deck design, Ensenada has high flush deck, tons of space inside. I had an Ensenada 20 for a little while. cheers, John On 8/10/19 10:33 AM, Peter Zimowsky via montgomery_boats wrote:
hi: Thanks for info. Maybe a pocket cruiser isn’t for me. Heaven forbid, but do I need a Catalina 22 or something that big? Ugh?
Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky)
outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> Twitter: @zimosoutdoors
"Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
On Aug 10, 2019, at 11:19 AM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter:
First questions for you - what was 'to small'? The berth (M15's is larger), no place to sit upright? No private head? No full galley? These are things that an M17 barely will give you nare no better than on the M15.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com <http://sv-swallow.com/> :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com <http://m17-375.com/> :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/ <http://www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/>
On Sat, Aug 10, 2019, 9:11 AM Peter Zimowsky via montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com <mailto:montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>> wrote: Hi: we sailed the San Juans last week. My wife wanted to try camping on the boat (M15). Didn’t work out. She doesn’t like how small it is. I love the M15 and it works out for solo boaters. Should I go to a M17 or is it just as cramped? Problem is, my M15 is in excellent shape and trading up to a M17 could be bad because I’ve read so many stories on this thread about older boats and all the problems. I don’t want to give up a good boat for one with problems. What do you have to watch out for when looking at another boat?
Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky)
outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/ <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/>> Twitter: @zimosoutdoors
"Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
Thanks. I think I’m at some kind of turning point in sailing life Pete Sent from my iPhone
On Aug 10, 2019, at 16:00, John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
I am tall (6' 3") so maybe that's why the M17 feels so much roomier to me than the M15...again if you can see one in person sometime, you will have a much clearer sense of it.
There is at least room to sit inside, fully upright (even me, just barely, on the settee), move around a bit, space for a portable galley setup, etc.
For me, in the M15 it is lie down, or get out in the cockpit (short people I am told can sit up just inside the companionway ;-).
So in my experience, M17 much roomier. And, it's still a 17-footer.
There are a variety of other 17-18 ft. pocket cruisers...some with larger cabin (thus smaller cockpit). Of those I've seen in person, the M17 is a great balance of roomy cockpit and adequate cabin space.
Venture 17 & Vagabond 17 (both a fair bit lighter than the M17); Sanibel 18; Com-Pac, SunCat, Etc. etc. Even a Sage 17 but that is big $$$ since there's no old used ones around.
You can go to sailboatdata.com and search only on 17, then 18, then 19, etc. and get reasonable search results showing boats of that length (as long as the length is in the name in the database. Here's 17 for example: https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat?filter%5Bname%5D=17&paginate=25&units=impe...
Not to mention all the designs for plan or kit built pocket cruisers...
And, there's only so much one can do in 17-18 ft. with decent sailing qualities.
If you want something almost as light to tow/launch as M17, with a fair bit more interior space, and also a Lyle Hess design, you could look at a Balboa 20 or Ensenada 20. Same exact hull; Balboa has typical cabin/deck design, Ensenada has high flush deck, tons of space inside. I had an Ensenada 20 for a little while.
cheers, John
On 8/10/19 10:33 AM, Peter Zimowsky via montgomery_boats wrote: hi: Thanks for info. Maybe a pocket cruiser isn’t for me. Heaven forbid, but do I need a Catalina 22 or something that big? Ugh? Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky) outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> Twitter: @zimosoutdoors "Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
On Aug 10, 2019, at 11:19 AM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter:
First questions for you - what was 'to small'? The berth (M15's is larger), no place to sit upright? No private head? No full galley? These are things that an M17 barely will give you nare no better than on the M15.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com <http://sv-swallow.com/> :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com <http://m17-375.com/> :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/ <http://www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/>
On Sat, Aug 10, 2019, 9:11 AM Peter Zimowsky via montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com <mailto:montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>> wrote: Hi: we sailed the San Juans last week. My wife wanted to try camping on the boat (M15). Didn’t work out. She doesn’t like how small it is. I love the M15 and it works out for solo boaters. Should I go to a M17 or is it just as cramped? Problem is, my M15 is in excellent shape and trading up to a M17 could be bad because I’ve read so many stories on this thread about older boats and all the problems. I don’t want to give up a good boat for one with problems. What do you have to watch out for when looking at another boat?
Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky)
outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/ <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/>> Twitter: @zimosoutdoors
"Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
Hi Pete, I went to the M15 from a Catalina 22 because the Catalina was too small for me, but the M15 isn't- the bunk is huge!. The C22 has three bunks but one is too short, one too narrow, and the V-berth too low overhead. Now a Newport 30 is a boat that can really fit a large adult for non-sleeping purposes, but just about anything else I've been in under 30 feet- if you can sleep in it comfortably that's about as good as it gets IMO. Sincerely, Tyler ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Schinnerer" <john@eco-living.net> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Saturday, August 10, 2019 4:00:31 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Disastrous trip Thanks for info I am tall (6' 3") so maybe that's why the M17 feels so much roomier to me than the M15...again if you can see one in person sometime, you will have a much clearer sense of it. There is at least room to sit inside, fully upright (even me, just barely, on the settee), move around a bit, space for a portable galley setup, etc. For me, in the M15 it is lie down, or get out in the cockpit (short people I am told can sit up just inside the companionway ;-). So in my experience, M17 much roomier. And, it's still a 17-footer. There are a variety of other 17-18 ft. pocket cruisers...some with larger cabin (thus smaller cockpit). Of those I've seen in person, the M17 is a great balance of roomy cockpit and adequate cabin space. Venture 17 & Vagabond 17 (both a fair bit lighter than the M17); Sanibel 18; Com-Pac, SunCat, Etc. etc. Even a Sage 17 but that is big $$$ since there's no old used ones around. You can go to sailboatdata.com and search only on 17, then 18, then 19, etc. and get reasonable search results showing boats of that length (as long as the length is in the name in the database. Here's 17 for example: https://sailboatdata.com/sailboat?filter%5Bname%5D=17&paginate=25&units=impe... Not to mention all the designs for plan or kit built pocket cruisers... And, there's only so much one can do in 17-18 ft. with decent sailing qualities. If you want something almost as light to tow/launch as M17, with a fair bit more interior space, and also a Lyle Hess design, you could look at a Balboa 20 or Ensenada 20. Same exact hull; Balboa has typical cabin/deck design, Ensenada has high flush deck, tons of space inside. I had an Ensenada 20 for a little while. cheers, John On 8/10/19 10:33 AM, Peter Zimowsky via montgomery_boats wrote:
hi: Thanks for info. Maybe a pocket cruiser isn’t for me. Heaven forbid, but do I need a Catalina 22 or something that big? Ugh?
Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky)
outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> Twitter: @zimosoutdoors
"Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
On Aug 10, 2019, at 11:19 AM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> wrote:
Peter:
First questions for you - what was 'to small'? The berth (M15's is larger), no place to sit upright? No private head? No full galley? These are things that an M17 barely will give you nare no better than on the M15.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com <http://sv-swallow.com/> :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com <http://m17-375.com/> :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/ <http://www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/>
On Sat, Aug 10, 2019, 9:11 AM Peter Zimowsky via montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com <mailto:montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>> wrote: Hi: we sailed the San Juans last week. My wife wanted to try camping on the boat (M15). Didn’t work out. She doesn’t like how small it is. I love the M15 and it works out for solo boaters. Should I go to a M17 or is it just as cramped? Problem is, my M15 is in excellent shape and trading up to a M17 could be bad because I’ve read so many stories on this thread about older boats and all the problems. I don’t want to give up a good boat for one with problems. What do you have to watch out for when looking at another boat?
Pete Winter Sky (Zimowsky)
outdoors writer and photographer www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/> <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/ <http://www.getoutdoorsnorthwest.com/>> Twitter: @zimosoutdoors
"Be with Tahlequah" Tahlequah, you did this. From the day you lost your baby in the summer of 2018, then your 17-day tour of grief, you've brought the KEY crucial issues to the world to help us save your Orca family.
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
participants (6)
-
Alex Conley -
casioqv＠usermail.com -
Dave Scobie -
John Schinnerer -
Peter Zimowsky -
Thomas Buzzi