Good Morning! Long time fellow sailors! I've been sailing the Chesapeake on my M23 for the past 3 seasons and she loves that body of water. I do however, need to bite the bullet and consider roller furling as going forward on that boat in weather on the Bay is not fun. Can any other M23 owners that have furlers give me their 2 cents on what brand and set up you use/recommend? Thanks! Theo M23 #026 Sails Increase Rock Hall, MD
Theo: I'm not a M23 owner but I've worked with furlers a fair amount and have them on my boat/home. The Schaefer Snapfurl is an excellent unit. Far superior to the CDI. :: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site! On Thu, Oct 28, 2021, 8:15 AM Theo Petron <lapstrake1979@gmail.com> wrote:
Good Morning! Long time fellow sailors! I've been sailing the Chesapeake on my M23 for the past 3 seasons and she loves that body of water. I do however, need to bite the bullet and consider roller furling as going forward on that boat in weather on the Bay is not fun. Can any other M23 owners that have furlers give me their 2 cents on what brand and set up you use/recommend? Thanks!
Theo M23 #026 Sails Increase Rock Hall, MD
Scrubbed my M-15 in the rain today, did it today because there is no freshwater faucet at the marina, not at the launch ramp or elsewhere to scrub a boat after outhauling it from the salt water at Swantown Marina in Olympia, therefore rain served as the available alternative.
Scrubbed my M-15 in the rain today, did it today because there is no freshwater faucet at the marina, not at the launch ramp or elsewhere to scrub a boat after outhauling it from the salt water at Swantown Marina in Olympia on South Puget Sound, therefore rain served as the available alternative. Steve Mi-15 # 335
Why are you having to go forward, are you swapping out headsails for different conditions? On my M15 after rigging a jib downhaul with a length of paracord, I don't need to go forward to raise or lower the jib unless I want to swap out the jib for a different size, which is rarely necessary. I just wanted to make sure you *really* need the furler. I'm not a fan of them myself, they add a lot of complexity and reduce performance. In principle they let you reef the jib, but the ones I've tried that really doesn't work- the partially furled jib shape is so terrible shape wise that it's pretty much the same as dropping the jib entirely performance wise. The main advantage I've seen is that they are a bit faster and easier to furl/unfurl vs hanking on and raising a jib, which is nice if you want to get on the water quickly... although a jib bag allowing you to leave the jib hanked on is probably almost as good. Sincerely, Tyler ----- Original Message ----- From: "Theo Petron" <lapstrake1979@gmail.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2021 8:14:59 AM Subject: M_Boats: Roller Furling for M23 Good Morning! Long time fellow sailors! I've been sailing the Chesapeake on my M23 for the past 3 seasons and she loves that body of water. I do however, need to bite the bullet and consider roller furling as going forward on that boat in weather on the Bay is not fun. Can any other M23 owners that have furlers give me their 2 cents on what brand and set up you use/recommend? Thanks! Theo M23 #026 Sails Increase Rock Hall, MD
About the sail shape on a reefing furler... There's a difference between a plain furler, and a reefing furler setup. A big part of that is a jib designed for reefing vs. one that is not. A plain furler is only designed to furl the sail - all out, or all in. In general, and especially if the sail is not built for reefing, it will give poor sail shape if used to reef the jib. A reefing furler combined with a sail cut and luff-padded for reefing is another story. I've got that on my M17 for some years now and quite happy with it. A reefing furler will have some kind of foil or extrusion around the forestay. It's not just a wire you wrap the jib around. And the jib needs to be cut suitably and have padding on the luff to keep good shape when reefing it. Works great for my needs anyhow. Whatever small performance hit there is from a bit of extra turbulence at the jib luff is for me far outweighed by being able to suit jib size to conditions quickly and safely from the cockpit. cheers, John On 10/28/21 1:59 PM, casioqv@usermail.com wrote:
Why are you having to go forward, are you swapping out headsails for different conditions?
On my M15 after rigging a jib downhaul with a length of paracord, I don't need to go forward to raise or lower the jib unless I want to swap out the jib for a different size, which is rarely necessary.
I just wanted to make sure you *really* need the furler. I'm not a fan of them myself, they add a lot of complexity and reduce performance. In principle they let you reef the jib, but the ones I've tried that really doesn't work- the partially furled jib shape is so terrible shape wise that it's pretty much the same as dropping the jib entirely performance wise. The main advantage I've seen is that they are a bit faster and easier to furl/unfurl vs hanking on and raising a jib, which is nice if you want to get on the water quickly... although a jib bag allowing you to leave the jib hanked on is probably almost as good.
Sincerely, Tyler
----- Original Message ----- From: "Theo Petron" <lapstrake1979@gmail.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2021 8:14:59 AM Subject: M_Boats: Roller Furling for M23
Good Morning! Long time fellow sailors! I've been sailing the Chesapeake on my M23 for the past 3 seasons and she loves that body of water. I do however, need to bite the bullet and consider roller furling as going forward on that boat in weather on the Bay is not fun. Can any other M23 owners that have furlers give me their 2 cents on what brand and set up you use/recommend? Thanks!
Theo M23 #026 Sails Increase Rock Hall, MD
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
I agree with all Tyler’s comments concerning roller fullering. I sailed a Tanzer 22 many years starting on Puget Sound, Chesapeake, and Lake Ontario with only a jib. Then owned a new Catalina 320 with roller fullering that worked good but had problems. Boat that size roller fullering a must but never comes down or up. I bought my M17 three years ago and it had a roller fuller. The first time l launched boat, wife and I, was a horror story and by standers had to help us. Heavy is an understatement especially getting mast in step. Went into Marina. Second season same problem and I stopped trying and went to a Marina for help. Didn’t sail much first season because of broken shoulder. Second year more sailing but never liked the roller for all the reasons Tyler gave. I do not like marinas but because of roller fuller forget trailering. The boat was used for racing on Chesapeake. This season I will trailer and use only a jib and a 130 if I want it. Simplicity is the only way. I’ve been sailing a Drascombe Lugger I bought at factory in England 40 years ago. It’s been all over Europe, plus all the places I had the Tanzer. It has a very simple roller fuller and never an issue. I bought the M17 for cabin. I’ve added a number of things to my M17 making it easy for single handing but as I type this I am off and on about just selling. What stops me is I have put a lot of money into it making upgrades. It’s a 2005 and returned to better than new as far as I am concerned. So far the M17 is not what I expected but have enjoyed working on it at the expense of sailing. I know it was designed for the regatta world which for me means crew. I will only sail singlehanded and have no interest in a crew. Charlie Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 29, 2021, at 1:01 AM, John Schinnerer via montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote:
About the sail shape on a reefing furler...
There's a difference between a plain furler, and a reefing furler setup. A big part of that is a jib designed for reefing vs. one that is not.
A plain furler is only designed to furl the sail - all out, or all in. In general, and especially if the sail is not built for reefing, it will give poor sail shape if used to reef the jib.
A reefing furler combined with a sail cut and luff-padded for reefing is another story.
I've got that on my M17 for some years now and quite happy with it.
A reefing furler will have some kind of foil or extrusion around the forestay. It's not just a wire you wrap the jib around. And the jib needs to be cut suitably and have padding on the luff to keep good shape when reefing it.
Works great for my needs anyhow. Whatever small performance hit there is from a bit of extra turbulence at the jib luff is for me far outweighed by being able to suit jib size to conditions quickly and safely from the cockpit.
cheers, John
On 10/28/21 1:59 PM, casioqv@usermail.com wrote: Why are you having to go forward, are you swapping out headsails for different conditions? On my M15 after rigging a jib downhaul with a length of paracord, I don't need to go forward to raise or lower the jib unless I want to swap out the jib for a different size, which is rarely necessary. I just wanted to make sure you *really* need the furler. I'm not a fan of them myself, they add a lot of complexity and reduce performance. In principle they let you reef the jib, but the ones I've tried that really doesn't work- the partially furled jib shape is so terrible shape wise that it's pretty much the same as dropping the jib entirely performance wise. The main advantage I've seen is that they are a bit faster and easier to furl/unfurl vs hanking on and raising a jib, which is nice if you want to get on the water quickly... although a jib bag allowing you to leave the jib hanked on is probably almost as good. Sincerely, Tyler ----- Original Message ----- From: "Theo Petron" <lapstrake1979@gmail.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Thursday, October 28, 2021 8:14:59 AM Subject: M_Boats: Roller Furling for M23 Good Morning! Long time fellow sailors! I've been sailing the Chesapeake on my M23 for the past 3 seasons and she loves that body of water. I do however, need to bite the bullet and consider roller furling as going forward on that boat in weather on the Bay is not fun. Can any other M23 owners that have furlers give me their 2 cents on what brand and set up you use/recommend? Thanks! Theo M23 #026 Sails Increase Rock Hall, MD
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
Charlie: M17 designed for regatta sailing not for single handing? I don't understand your comment. Please add some detail so I can better understand your point of view. Thanks. :: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site! On Fri, Oct 29, 2021, 6:25 AM Charles Adams via montgomery_boats < montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote:
I agree with all Tyler’s comments concerning roller fullering. I sailed a Tanzer 22 many years starting on Puget Sound, Chesapeake, and Lake Ontario with only a jib. Then owned a new Catalina 320 with roller fullering that worked good but had problems. Boat that size roller fullering a must but never comes down or up. I bought my M17 three years ago and it had a roller fuller. The first time l launched boat, wife and I, was a horror story and by standers had to help us. Heavy is an understatement especially getting mast in step. Went into Marina. Second season same problem and I stopped trying and went to a Marina for help. Didn’t sail much first season because of broken shoulder. Second year more sailing but never liked the roller for all the reasons Tyler gave. I do not like marinas but because of roller fuller forget trailering. The boat was used for racing on Chesapeake. This season I will trailer and use only a jib and a 130 if I want it.
Simplicity is the only way. I’ve been sailing a Drascombe Lugger I bought at factory in England 40 years ago. It’s been all over Europe, plus all the places I had the Tanzer. It has a very simple roller fuller and never an issue.
I bought the M17 for cabin. I’ve added a number of things to my M17 making it easy for single handing but as I type this I am off and on about just selling. What stops me is I have put a lot of money into it making upgrades. It’s a 2005 and returned to better than new as far as I am concerned. So far the M17 is not what I expected but have enjoyed working on it at the expense of sailing. I know it was designed for the regatta world which for me means crew. I will only sail singlehanded and have no interest in a crew.
Charlie
participants (6)
-
casioqv＠usermail.com -
Charles Adams -
Dave Scobie -
John Schinnerer -
Steve Trapp -
Theo Petron