Re: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 21, Issue 6

4 Nov 2004

      Steve,

Thanks for the information on raising the mast.  The link was very helpfull.

Do you have any experience sailing solo and how to set the sheets for this?
A picture of how the sheets and accompanying fairleads and cam cleats would
be great.

Where are you located?

Norm

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Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 11:10 AM
Subject: montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 21, Issue 6
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Today's Topics:
1. Fwd: M_Boats: New Monty 15 owner introduction (Steve R.)
   2. RE: Sanibel 17 (Todd N. Swift)
   3. Re: RE: Downsizing  (MC  Carpenter)
   4. Re: RE: Downsizing  (Smitty)
   5. Re: RE: Downsizing (David Thomason)
   6. Re: RE: Downsizing  (Doug Kelch)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 08:29:40 -0800 (PST)
From: Steve R. <stever@mail.saabnet.com>
Subject: Fwd: M_Boats: New Monty 15 owner introduction
To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com
Message-ID: <20041104162940.B79ED3951@sitemail.everyone.net>
Content-Type: text/plain
Hi Norm,
Welcome to our group.
About raising the mast, once you have seen it done it is a piece of cake.
There is advice on set-up from Jerry M. on the msog.org website:
http://msog.org/models/m15/m15_setuprig.cfm
I added a line for a jib downhaul.  You may have one now.  It runs back
from the bow fitting through several fairleads and is secured with a clam
cleat on the side of the cabin.  When I lower the jib and remove it, I leave
the downhaul attached to the jib halyard fitting. (There is a small loop in
the end of the downhaul.) The other end of the halyard is of course cleated
off on the mast.
With the mast in the highway travel position, I uncleat the downhaul and
make sure it has some slack.
I have a mast cradle that has a roller.  I untie the front end of the mast
from the trailer support, then roll the mast back and bolt the mast base in.
(I am thinking of going with a slotted tabernacle to eliminate the bolt, as
has been discussed in recent days.)
Now I stand in the cockpit.  I have the jib downhaul line in one hand.  I
take the slack out of the downhaul.  I lift the mast with the other hand.
If I need to stop at any point on the way up, I simply take out the slack
and cleat the downhaul.  The mast stays in place.  I can then reposition to
raise the mast the rest of the way, or untangle anything that is snagged.
When the mast is up, I cleat the downhaul.  Again, the mast stays in place.
I have the forestay coiled up and fastened to the mast with a bungee cord.
I remove the bungee and walk to the bow to fasten the forestay.
It takes a lot longer to write about it than to do it.
When you remove the sails and lower the mast, you just have to do things
in a way so that you will be organized for the next time you go sailing.
For example, I leave the main on the boom.
Good luck.  You have a great place to sail.
steve
Steve R.
M-15 #119
Lexington, KY
--- Norm Bundek "nbundek" <nbundek@earthlink.net> wrote:
Subject: M_Boats: New Monty 15 owner introduction
I  just bought a 1981 Montgomery 15' hull number 172.
<...>
I only need to figure out a way to raise the mast by myself and set up the
sails for single sailing. Any suggestions?
<...>
If  there  are  any  Montgomery's  in  the Ventura area, please
contact me to sail around the area.
Norm Bundek
nbundek@earthlink.net
------------------------------
Message: 2
Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 10:49:23 -0600
From: "Todd N. Swift" <Todd.Swift@loras.edu>
Subject: M_Boats: RE: Sanibel 17
To: <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>
Message-ID:
<A9BEB1C0B000804A92B69C33C07AFB6C01D53978@EXBE03.loras.edu>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Craig et al.,
Yep - it's the one with the offset centerboard (to port). That really
makes the cabin nice for camping. I don't notice a performance
difference on different tacks due to the centerboard, but I'm a fairly
green sailor. I like the short stub keel for getting it on the trailer
and for beaching when we camp on the Mississippi. I suspect the M17 is
considerably faster and better to weather - which is why I'm interested
in them. My boat is Anduin - pictures of her are at www.widgetsailor.com
if you go down and click on Anduin.
I do have one 'speed' experience - take it for what it's worth! Our
sailing club has one overnight race each year down to a campground on
the Mississippi River. We race down (with current) on Saturday, camp,
and sail back (if possible) on Sunday. This year, the Saturday race was
15 miles directly against a fairly strong wind. We couldn't point as
well as a Catalina22 and an Oday222 that we started with so spent most
of our day tacking without making a lot of headway. We eventually gave
up with about 5 miles to go and motored the rest of the way. We would
have been an hour or more slower than the Catalina. However, on Sunday,
we had a strong wind directly against the current so we had a run all
the way back. We started about 20 minutes ahead of most of the smaller
boat fleet and it took them more than 3/4 of the way back to catch us.
That was much more fun!
So the only issue I have with the boat is its speed which is probably as
much a factor of my ability as the boat. I'm never in a hurry, but when
the spring floods come, the current is comparable to our boat speed and
thus we often have a hard time going where we want to go while the
Catalina and oday are just enough faster that they have much more
flexibility on the river.
Todd
Dubuque, IA
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2004 18:20:43 -0500
From: "Craig F. Honshell" <chonshell@ia4u.net>
The Sanibel 17' is a REALLY cool little boat, Todd.  I'd like to hear
more from you.
Is the Sanibel the one with the offset centerboard (not positioned at
the centerline
of the keel)?  How does she perform?  Does the offset board affect
performance?
Thanks.  Fair winds, Craig Honshell, M17 #389
------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 11:55:02 -0500
From: "MC  Carpenter" <southisland2@earthlink.net>
Subject: Re: M_Boats: RE: Downsizing
To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats"
<montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>
Message-ID: <001801c4c28f$08221620$bf17a5d1@mchgb874bibsku>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
I think some of those small boats have water ballast. they may be light
to
transport but how about the righting moment, or basic stability with out a
heavy keel. So I wonder how good they would be in choppy waters of San
Francisco Bay like around Angel Island.  I have never heard of a water
ballast sailboat self rescuing
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Doug Kelch" <doug_kelch@yahoo.com>
To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats"
<montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: M_Boats: RE: Downsizing
...
Mike,
I am an M15 owner and love. I can raise the mast 1
handed with no mechanical advantage at all.  I am 5'
8".
I have a video of Howard Audsley raising and lowering
the mast on his M17 using a line from the winch to the
forestay - one hand on the line and one hand on the
mast.  I could make a copy if you are interested.
I have been on a couple of cruises with the Shallow
water sailors.  They predominantly sail in protected
waters with Dovkies, Bay Hen, Peep Hens, and several
Bolger boats.
In 1 reef conditions (18 kts with gusts to 20+,
protected water with no waves) the M15 towing a 15 ft
light dory was faster than the Peep Hen.  However I
think the Peep Hen is a wonderful boat for it's design
purpose which is a beachable protected water cruising
boat.
The Peep Hen sails pretty well for a high freeboard 14
ft boat and has more cabin space than the M15.
Thanks
Doug Kelch
"Seas the Day"
--- LUDLOWD2@aol.com wrote:
...
Mike
If your going to sail SF bay, you need something
more seaworthy than a sea
pearl or peep hen. Those are warm clime beach boats
(sea pearl was on my short
list until i needed a cabin and portapotti (new
wife). dont regret going with
the M-15. As John said, a little organization and
she will be the easiest boat
ever to rig and launch (my 2 HP honda rides on the
boat). She will take the
steep chop and high winds. Re the cat boat, IMHO the
sloop rig of the M-15 is
better pointing into the wind. Why is my destination
always upwind no matter
what? My suggestion, buy a new M-15.
Good Luck
Don M-15 Sweet Dream
_______________________________________________
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...
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------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 12:13:53 -0600
From: "Smitty" <smith845@wcsonline.net>
Subject: Re: M_Boats: RE: Downsizing
To: "MC Carpenter" <southisland2@earthlink.net>, "For and about
Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>
Message-ID: <005f01c4c29b$847cd730$ae8402d0@D1MJRH41>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
The Sea Pearl will sail well in very rough conditions, however if pushed
hard
enough it will swamp before it turns turtle. I always had a large canoe
air bag
under the rear cockpit, but never had occasion to swamp her to see how it
would
work out. Factory floatation seems to be minimal. If the cover is on the
front
cockpit, she will roll back upright. The aft cockpit is self draining. The
Pearl is best for the skinny water and moderate winds. The water ballast
seems
to work well. The boat is much more stable with full tanks and makes
better
headway in chop with full tanks. It won't point as high as an M boat, I'm
sure.
With empty tanks she will scoot along with the lightest of winds. The
trimaran
version has a slightly larger convertible cabin, but is still rather tiny.
    Smitty
      Del Rio, TX
       (stillwithoutanMboatdepartment)
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "MC Carpenter" <southisland2@earthlink.net>
To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats"
<montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 10:55 AM
Subject: Re: M_Boats: RE: Downsizing
...
I think some of those small boats have water ballast. they may be light
to
transport but how about the righting moment, or basic stability with out
a
heavy keel. So I wonder how good they would be in choppy waters of San
Francisco Bay like around Angel Island.  I have never heard of a water
ballast sailboat self rescuing
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Doug Kelch" <doug_kelch@yahoo.com>
To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats"
<montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: M_Boats: RE: Downsizing
...
Mike,
I am an M15 owner and love. I can raise the mast 1
handed with no mechanical advantage at all.  I am 5'
8".
I have a video of Howard Audsley raising and lowering
the mast on his M17 using a line from the winch to the
forestay - one hand on the line and one hand on the
mast.  I could make a copy if you are interested.
I have been on a couple of cruises with the Shallow
water sailors.  They predominantly sail in protected
waters with Dovkies, Bay Hen, Peep Hens, and several
Bolger boats.
In 1 reef conditions (18 kts with gusts to 20+,
protected water with no waves) the M15 towing a 15 ft
light dory was faster than the Peep Hen.  However I
think the Peep Hen is a wonderful boat for it's design
purpose which is a beachable protected water cruising
boat.
The Peep Hen sails pretty well for a high freeboard 14
ft boat and has more cabin space than the M15.
Thanks
Doug Kelch
"Seas the Day"
--- LUDLOWD2@aol.com wrote:
...
Mike
If your going to sail SF bay, you need something
more seaworthy than a sea
pearl or peep hen. Those are warm clime beach boats
(sea pearl was on my short
list until i needed a cabin and portapotti (new
wife). dont regret going with
the M-15. As John said, a little organization and
she will be the easiest boat
ever to rig and launch (my 2 HP honda rides on the
boat). She will take the
steep chop and high winds. Re the cat boat, IMHO the
sloop rig of the M-15 is
better pointing into the wind. Why is my destination
always upwind no matter
what? My suggestion, buy a new M-15.
Good Luck
Don M-15 Sweet Dream
_______________________________________________
http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
...
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Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com
_______________________________________________
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------------------------------
Message: 5
Date: Thu, 04 Nov 2004 13:32:30 -0500
From: "David Thomason" <thomasond2@michigan.gov>
Subject: Re: M_Boats: RE: Downsizing
To: <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>
Message-ID: <s18a2f7d.015@gwia02.state.mi.us>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
The Discovery Channel had an interesting episode of the Myth Buster's
last night in which they managed to raise a sailboat of about 30 foot
using ping pong balls pumped into the cabin.  I only caught the last few
minutes, so I'm not real sure of the size of the boat.  Apparently, the
"myth" that you could do such a thing was inspired by an old Donald Duck
comic book.  It took about 25,000 balls to "salvage" the boat...  Some
folks have way too much time on their hands!  I wonder how many
ping-pong balls will fit into the cabin of an M15?  M17?  Nor'sea 27???
...
...
...
smith845@wcsonline.net 11/04/04 01:13PM >>>
The Sea Pearl will sail well in very rough conditions, however if pushed
hard
enough it will swamp before it turns turtle. I always had a large canoe
air bag
under the rear cockpit, but never had occasion to swamp her to see how
it would
work out. Factory floatation seems to be minimal. If the cover is on the
front
cockpit, she will roll back upright. The aft cockpit is self draining.
The
Pearl is best for the skinny water and moderate winds. The water ballast
seems
to work well. The boat is much more stable with full tanks and makes
better
headway in chop with full tanks. It won't point as high as an M boat,
I'm sure.
With empty tanks she will scoot along with the lightest of winds. The
trimaran
version has a slightly larger convertible cabin, but is still rather
tiny.
    Smitty
      Del Rio, TX
       (stillwithoutanMboatdepartment)
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "MC Carpenter" <southisland2@earthlink.net>
To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats"
<montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 10:55 AM
Subject: Re: M_Boats: RE: Downsizing
...
I think some of those small boats have water ballast. they may be
light to
transport but how about the righting moment, or basic stability with
out a
heavy keel. So I wonder how good they would be in choppy waters of San
Francisco Bay like around Angel Island.  I have never heard of a water
ballast sailboat self rescuing
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Doug Kelch" <doug_kelch@yahoo.com>
To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats"
<montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: M_Boats: RE: Downsizing
...
Mike,
I am an M15 owner and love. I can raise the mast 1
handed with no mechanical advantage at all.  I am 5'
8".
I have a video of Howard Audsley raising and lowering
the mast on his M17 using a line from the winch to the
forestay - one hand on the line and one hand on the
mast.  I could make a copy if you are interested.
I have been on a couple of cruises with the Shallow
water sailors.  They predominantly sail in protected
waters with Dovkies, Bay Hen, Peep Hens, and several
Bolger boats.
In 1 reef conditions (18 kts with gusts to 20+,
protected water with no waves) the M15 towing a 15 ft
light dory was faster than the Peep Hen.  However I
think the Peep Hen is a wonderful boat for it's design
purpose which is a beachable protected water cruising
boat.
The Peep Hen sails pretty well for a high freeboard 14
ft boat and has more cabin space than the M15.
Thanks
Doug Kelch
"Seas the Day"
--- LUDLOWD2@aol.com wrote:
...
Mike
If your going to sail SF bay, you need something
more seaworthy than a sea
pearl or peep hen. Those are warm clime beach boats
(sea pearl was on my short
list until i needed a cabin and portapotti (new
wife). dont regret going with
the M-15. As John said, a little organization and
she will be the easiest boat
ever to rig and launch (my 2 HP honda rides on the
boat). She will take the
steep chop and high winds. Re the cat boat, IMHO the
sloop rig of the M-15 is
better pointing into the wind. Why is my destination
always upwind no matter
what? My suggestion, buy a new M-15.
Good Luck
Don M-15 Sweet Dream
_______________________________________________
http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
...
...
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com
_______________________________________________
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------------------------------
Message: 6
Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 11:09:50 -0800 (PST)
From: Doug Kelch <doug_kelch@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: M_Boats: RE: Downsizing
To: MC Carpenter <southisland2@earthlink.net>, For and about
Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>
Message-ID: <20041104190955.65747.qmail@web13524.mail.yahoo.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
MC,
Like the Sea Pearl the Peep Hen is very unlikely to
turn turtle with the assistance of some pretty big
waves.  With the high freeboard it will float on it's
side and take no water into the cockpit.
One of the characteristics of many Bolger designs is
the high freeboard and it's safety aspects.
The recent Birdwatcher design articles in Messing
about in boats talks to the issue very well.  Just
don't take any river/inland lake boats out into the
big wave waters of SF Bay, Great Lakes, the exposed
portions Chesapeake Bay or offshore without a reliable
forecast (no such thing).
Thanks
Doug
--- MC  Carpenter <southisland2@earthlink.net> wrote:
...
I think some of those small boats have water
ballast. they may be light to
transport but how about the righting moment, or
basic stability with out a
heavy keel. So I wonder how good they would be in
choppy waters of San
Francisco Bay like around Angel Island.  I have
never heard of a water
ballast sailboat self rescuing
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Doug Kelch" <doug_kelch@yahoo.com>
To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats"
<montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 9:59 AM
Subject: Re: M_Boats: RE: Downsizing
...
Mike,
I am an M15 owner and love. I can raise the mast 1
handed with no mechanical advantage at all.  I am
5'
8".
I have a video of Howard Audsley raising and
lowering
the mast on his M17 using a line from the winch to
the
forestay - one hand on the line and one hand on
the
mast.  I could make a copy if you are interested.
I have been on a couple of cruises with the
Shallow
water sailors.  They predominantly sail in
protected
waters with Dovkies, Bay Hen, Peep Hens, and
several
Bolger boats.
In 1 reef conditions (18 kts with gusts to 20+,
protected water with no waves) the M15 towing a 15
ft
light dory was faster than the Peep Hen.  However
I
think the Peep Hen is a wonderful boat for it's
design
purpose which is a beachable protected water
cruising
boat.
The Peep Hen sails pretty well for a high
freeboard 14
ft boat and has more cabin space than the M15.
Thanks
Doug Kelch
"Seas the Day"
--- LUDLOWD2@aol.com wrote:
...
Mike
If your going to sail SF bay, you need something
more seaworthy than a sea
pearl or peep hen. Those are warm clime beach
boats
(sea pearl was on my short
list until i needed a cabin and portapotti (new
wife). dont regret going with
the M-15. As John said, a little organization and
she will be the easiest boat
ever to rig and launch (my 2 HP honda rides on
the
boat). She will take the
steep chop and high winds. Re the cat boat, IMHO
the
sloop rig of the M-15 is
better pointing into the wind. Why is my
destination
always upwind no matter
what? My suggestion, buy a new M-15.
Good Luck
Don M-15 Sweet Dream
_______________________________________________
http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
...
...
...
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com
_______________________________________________
http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
...
_______________________________________________
http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
...
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com
------------------------------
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End of montgomery_boats Digest, Vol 21, Issue 6
***********************************************

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