Having rigged my M-17 twice and taken it down once in the last few weeks, I'm wondering if I'm the slowest rigger alive. It took me 3 hours the first time, about the same the second. First two times I had help. So today when I set up to put the boat at a mooring for the summer, I timed myself. It tool me 2:34 hr. - not much improvement. Here's the breakdown: 17 minutes Remove all tie-downs after 1575 mile drive. 11 minutes Position mast and bolt base in tabernacle. 28 minutes Rig A-frame, raise mast. 33 minutes Attach and adjust all standing rigging. 20 minutes Rig trailer tongue extension. 30 minutes Attach boom, main, battens, flake sail, put on sail cover 15 minutes Unrig trailer tongue extension Everything on the boat was well-tied-down for 1575 highway miles, and I took some extra time to adjust the inner shrouds. I simplify rigging by loosening the starboard shrouds 6 turns, and the backstay 10 turns when I take the rig down. That way it should be quick to set it up the next time. However I forgot to tape the inner turnbuckles last time and lost my careful adjustments. Could do away with the A-frame, but the mast with jib and CDI furler weighs 70 lb! I also took some extra time to tape the ends of my battens. The outboard was already on the boat, so didn't need to be handled. Even so, I don't see how I will ever setup in less than 2 hours. What am I missing? I'm reluctant to take this boat anywhere other than my local lake, as it's just too much work! It's a shame because it performs so well on the water! Mark House "Seranita"
Hi Mark, A few suggestions to help you improve your ramp time, so you enjoy sailing more. Don't move forward and aft on deck any more than you have to. Really think through the number of times you have to do this. To that end I carry a small tool pouch with everything I need up and down the deck. Wrenches for tightening the mast bolt and forestay turnbuckle. All the tie downs from travel go in the bag, and are there when I am wrapping up to trailer. Like many M-boat owners we leave the shrouds and back stays attached and adjusted. It might seem very tight to get the mast to and from vertical, but some judicious grinding to radius the after "corner" of the foot of the mast will assist in raising the mast. Something like a 1-1/2" radius seems to work. You might want to do some, try it, and if needed, grind a bit more. There will be some resistance just before the mast goes vertical, then all will be well. The upper and lower shrouds should not be drum tight any way. There should be a slight sag on the lee shrouds when heeling. Sorry I can't quantify this any better. We don't use an A frame to lift the mast. A properly secured bowline to the jib halyard, through a turning block on top of the extended winch post and back to a coaming winch. I can shoulder the mast, while standing on the cockpit seats, take up the line slack, walk the mast up as I move forward to the companionway, and then it will tilt up. The line is in my hand for a safety. I am no iron man type. I am tall, but 55, and with some history of back issues. (Pilates has been my back saving activity). Once the mast is vertical, I leave the line tightened on the winch and cleat it off well on the stern quarter cleat, not the clam cleat for jib sheeting. At that point I can go forward and attach the forestay. We don't have a furler, but do have to hank on the jib of choice. We have a back stay adjuster, so it is loosened right off when taking down the rig. When setting up, we know the number of turns to put onto the forestay turnbuckle, then any required forestay tension is take up with the back stay when underway. This is for beating into the wind. When off the wind, we slack the back stay to allow the jib to fill better. The forestay turnbuckle is adjusted to give some aft mast rake. Ours is about 2'. We used a plumb bob from the main halyard to check this last year. Taking up on the backstay adjuster might give another 2" of rake. Others might chime in here on this point. Another suggestion is to leave the main sail flaked and tied on the boom. Stow it in the cabin this way. If you have a topping lift, attach it to the clew (outer) end of the boom right in hatchway, then you will have one end supported as you slide it out of the cabin and drop the goose neck into the slot on the mast. When taking down the rig, coil your port and starboard shrouds loosely, and hang them from the mast. We use ball bungees to do this. Same for securing the forestay and halyards along the mast. We do not trailer with our 5HP Honda on the motor mount. It goes in the truck bed. I don't fancy stressing the transom, when bouncing down the road. With my wife rigging boom, all sheets, and main halyard, setting up the cockpit, spotting me when raising the mast, and me getting on the boat, staying on the boat until the mast is set, then going back to the ground to receive the rudder from her, and get the motor from the truck, we are 50 minutes. If doing myself, I would be 1 hr 20 min. Have only done this a few times. At most ramps we don't have to use the tongue extension. I think only 3 times in 2 years, at what I would call "rustic" ramps. So think through the motions and try not to cover the same ground on deck twice. That is probably the biggest time saver I can suggest after leaving the standing rigging attached and adjusted. Hope you have a great summer of sailing. Trip or day sail reports are always welcomed on this list. Bill Wickett Makin' Time M17 #622 On Wed, May 25, 2011 at 9:44 PM, Mark House <itsmark@bresnan.net> wrote:
Having rigged my M-17 twice and taken it down once in the last few weeks, I'm wondering if I'm the slowest rigger alive. It took me 3 hours the first time, about the same the second. First two times I had help. So today when I set up to put the boat at a mooring for the summer, I timed myself. It tool me 2:34 hr. - not much improvement. Here's the breakdown:
17 minutes Remove all tie-downs after 1575 mile drive. 11 minutes Position mast and bolt base in tabernacle. 28 minutes Rig A-frame, raise mast. 33 minutes Attach and adjust all standing rigging. 20 minutes Rig trailer tongue extension. 30 minutes Attach boom, main, battens, flake sail, put on sail cover 15 minutes Unrig trailer tongue extension
Everything on the boat was well-tied-down for 1575 highway miles, and I took some extra time to adjust the inner shrouds. I simplify rigging by loosening the starboard shrouds 6 turns, and the backstay 10 turns when I take the rig down. That way it should be quick to set it up the next time. However I forgot to tape the inner turnbuckles last time and lost my careful adjustments. Could do away with the A-frame, but the mast with jib and CDI furler weighs 70 lb! I also took some extra time to tape the ends of my battens. The outboard was already on the boat, so didn't need to be handled. Even so, I don't see how I will ever setup in less than 2 hours.
What am I missing? I'm reluctant to take this boat anywhere other than my local lake, as it's just too much work! It's a shame because it performs so well on the water!
Mark House "Seranita" _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
Leaving the main on the boom and a topping lift are definately time savers Eldor -----Original Message----- From: Bill Wickett <billwick@gmail.com> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Wed, May 25, 2011 9:54 pm Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 Hi Mark, A few suggestions to help you improve your ramp time, so you enjoy sailing ore. Don't move forward and aft on deck any more than you have to. Really think hrough the number of times you have to do this. To that end I carry a small ool pouch with everything I need up and down the deck. Wrenches for ightening the mast bolt and forestay turnbuckle. All the tie downs from ravel go in the bag, and are there when I am wrapping up to trailer. Like many M-boat owners we leave the shrouds and back stays attached and djusted. It might seem very tight to get the mast to and from vertical, but ome judicious grinding to radius the after "corner" of the foot of the mast ill assist in raising the mast. Something like a 1-1/2" radius seems to ork. You might want to do some, try it, and if needed, grind a bit more. here will be some resistance just before the mast goes vertical, then all ill be well. The upper and lower shrouds should not be drum tight any way. here should be a slight sag on the lee shrouds when heeling. Sorry I can't uantify this any better. We don't use an A frame to lift the mast. A properly secured bowline to the ib halyard, through a turning block on top of the extended winch post and ack to a coaming winch. I can shoulder the mast, while standing on the ockpit seats, take up the line slack, walk the mast up as I move forward to he companionway, and then it will tilt up. The line is in my hand for a afety. I am no iron man type. I am tall, but 55, and with some history of ack issues. (Pilates has been my back saving activity). Once the mast is vertical, I leave the line tightened on the winch and cleat t off well on the stern quarter cleat, not the clam cleat for jib sheeting. t that point I can go forward and attach the forestay. We don't have a urler, but do have to hank on the jib of choice. We have a back stay adjuster, so it is loosened right off when taking down he rig. When setting up, we know the number of turns to put onto the orestay turnbuckle, then any required forestay tension is take up with the ack stay when underway. This is for beating into the wind. When off the ind, we slack the back stay to allow the jib to fill better. The forestay urnbuckle is adjusted to give some aft mast rake. Ours is about 2'. We used plumb bob from the main halyard to check this last year. Taking up on the ackstay adjuster might give another 2" of rake. thers might chime in here on this point. Another suggestion is to leave the main sail flaked and tied on the boom. tow it in the cabin this way. If you have a topping lift, attach it to the lew (outer) end of the boom right in hatchway, then you will have one end upported as you slide it out of the cabin and drop the goose neck into the lot on the mast. When taking down the rig, coil your port and starboard shrouds loosely, and ang them from the mast. We use ball bungees to do this. Same for securing he forestay and halyards along the mast. We do not trailer with our 5HP Honda on the motor mount. It goes in the ruck bed. I don't fancy stressing the transom, when bouncing down the oad. With my wife rigging boom, all sheets, and main halyard, setting up the ockpit, spotting me when raising the mast, and me getting on the boat, taying on the boat until the mast is set, then going back to the ground to eceive the rudder from her, and get the motor from the truck, we are 50 inutes. If doing myself, I would be 1 hr 20 min. Have only done this a few imes. At most ramps we don't have to use the tongue extension. I think only 3 imes in 2 years, at what I would call "rustic" ramps. So think through the motions and try not to cover the same ground on deck wice. That is probably the biggest time saver I can suggest after leaving he standing rigging attached and adjusted. Hope you have a great summer of sailing. Trip or day sail reports are always elcomed on this list. Bill Wickett akin' Time M17 #622 On Wed, May 25, 2011 at 9:44 PM, Mark House <itsmark@bresnan.net> wrote:
Having rigged my M-17 twice and taken it down once in the last few weeks, I'm wondering if I'm the slowest rigger alive. It took me 3 hours the first time, about the same the second. First two times I had help. So today when I set up to put the boat at a mooring for the summer, I timed myself. It tool me 2:34 hr. - not much improvement. Here's the breakdown:
17 minutes Remove all tie-downs after 1575 mile drive. 11 minutes Position mast and bolt base in tabernacle. 28 minutes Rig A-frame, raise mast. 33 minutes Attach and adjust all standing rigging. 20 minutes Rig trailer tongue extension. 30 minutes Attach boom, main, battens, flake sail, put on sail cover 15 minutes Unrig trailer tongue extension Everything on the boat was well-tied-down for 1575 highway miles, and I took some extra time to adjust the inner shrouds. I simplify rigging by loosening the starboard shrouds 6 turns, and the backstay 10 turns when I take the rig down. That way it should be quick to set it up the next time. However I forgot to tape the inner turnbuckles last time and lost my careful adjustments. Could do away with the A-frame, but the mast with jib and CDI furler weighs 70 lb! I also took some extra time to tape the ends of my battens. The outboard was already on the boat, so didn't need to be handled. Even so, I don't see how I will ever setup in less than 2 hours. What am I missing? I'm reluctant to take this boat anywhere other than my local lake, as it's just too much work! It's a shame because it performs so well on the water! Mark House "Seranita" _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! ______________________________________________ ttp://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
x-authenticated : Sender SMTP authenticated by smtp.gotrain.org X-XM-SPF: eid=;;;mid=;;;hst=mx02.mta.xmission.com;;;ipi.54.158.25;;;frm=bill@gotrain.org;;;spf=none X-XM-DomainKey: sender_domain=gotrain.org;;;sender=bill@gotrain.org;;;status=error X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 69.54.158.25 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: bill@gotrain.org X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.3.1 (2010-03-16) on sa01.xmission.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.5 required=8.0 tests�YES_05,DCC_CHECK_NEGATIVE, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE,T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD,T_TM2_M_HEADER_IN_MSG autolearn=disabled version=3.3.1 X-Spam-Report: * -0.0 T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD Envelope sender domain matches handover relay * domain * 0.0 T_TM2_M_HEADER_IN_MSG BODY: T_TM2_M_HEADER_IN_MSG * -0.5 BAYES_05 BODY: Bayes spam probability is 1 to 5% * [score: 0.0499] * 0.0 MIME_QP_LONG_LINE RAW: Quoted-printable line longer than 76 chars * -0.0 DCC_CHECK_NEGATIVE Not listed in DCC * [sa01 1397; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1] X-Spam-DCC: XMission; sa01 1397; Body=1 Fuz1=1 Fuz2=1 X-Spam-Combo: ;For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> X-Spam-Relay-Country: US US Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 X-Spam-Flag: No X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.2.1 (built Fri, 06 Aug 2010 16:31:04 -0600) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on mx02.mta.xmission.com) Mark, Quit timing yourself, and you'll save thirty minutes right there. Also, do your setup without a helper, and that'll save you another thirty minutes. More, if it's your wife who's helping. Seriously, I would try to find another 17 owner, and watch them rig and launch. Time each step, and take notes on how each step is done. You should be able to save another hour with the tips you pick up. With a bit of practice, you should be able to rig and launch in a leisurely hour and a half. Good luck. T Bill Day M15 363 "Gee Whiz!" On May 25, 2011, at 8:44 PM, "Mark House" <itsmark@bresnan.net> wrote:
Having rigged my M-17 twice and taken it down once in the last few weeks, I'm wondering if I'm the slowest rigger alive. It took me 3 hours the first time, about the same the second. First two times I had help. So today when I set up to put the boat at a mooring for the summer, I timed myself. It tool me 2:34 hr. - not much improvement. Here's the breakdown:
17 minutes Remove all tie-downs after 1575 mile drive. 11 minutes Position mast and bolt base in tabernacle. 28 minutes Rig A-frame, raise mast. 33 minutes Attach and adjust all standing rigging. 20 minutes Rig trailer tongue extension. 30 minutes Attach boom, main, battens, flake sail, put on sail cover 15 minutes Unrig trailer tongue extension
Everything on the boat was well-tied-down for 1575 highway miles, and I took some extra time to adjust the inner shrouds. I simplify rigging by loosening the starboard shrouds 6 turns, and the backstay 10 turns when I take the rig down. That way it should be quick to set it up the next time. However I forgot to tape the inner turnbuckles last time and lost my careful adjustments. Could do away with the A-frame, but the mast with jib and CDI furler weighs 70 lb! I also took some extra time to tape the ends of my battens. The outboard was already on the boat, so didn't need to be handled. Even so, I don't see how I will ever setup in less than 2 hours.
What am I missing? I'm reluctant to take this boat anywhere other than my local lake, as it's just too much work! It's a shame because it performs so well on the water!
Mark House "Seranita" _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
Bill, A couple of years ago I had the privilege of rigging my M15 next to Gary Oberbeck who was rigging his M17 at Lake Pleasant Phoenix AZ there is a difference and after I was done I helped him. I do have a tongue extension on the trailer and I only use it when the ramp does not go deep quickly. I don't mind getting the rear end of my Ford Sport Trac wet. Hope things go more smoothly as the M17 becomes more familiar to you Mark. Bill M15 Desert Dawn Phoenix On Wed, May 25, 2011 at 8:07 PM, Bill Day <bill@gotrain.org> wrote:
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Mark,
Quit timing yourself, and you'll save thirty minutes right there.
Also, do your setup without a helper, and that'll save you another thirty minutes. More, if it's your wife who's helping.
Seriously, I would try to find another 17 owner, and watch them rig and launch. Time each step, and take notes on how each step is done. You should be able to save another hour with the tips you pick up.
With a bit of practice, you should be able to rig and launch in a leisurely hour and a half.
Good luck. T Bill Day M15 363 "Gee Whiz!"
On May 25, 2011, at 8:44 PM, "Mark House" <itsmark@bresnan.net> wrote:
Having rigged my M-17 twice and taken it down once in the last few weeks, I'm wondering if I'm the slowest rigger alive. It took me 3 hours the first time, about the same the second. First two times I had help. So today when I set up to put the boat at a mooring for the summer, I timed myself. It tool me 2:34 hr. - not much improvement. Here's the breakdown:
17 minutes Remove all tie-downs after 1575 mile drive. 11 minutes Position mast and bolt base in tabernacle. 28 minutes Rig A-frame, raise mast. 33 minutes Attach and adjust all standing rigging. 20 minutes Rig trailer tongue extension. 30 minutes Attach boom, main, battens, flake sail, put on sail cover 15 minutes Unrig trailer tongue extension
Everything on the boat was well-tied-down for 1575 highway miles, and I took some extra time to adjust the inner shrouds. I simplify rigging by loosening the starboard shrouds 6 turns, and the backstay 10 turns when I take the rig down. That way it should be quick to set it up the next time. However I forgot to tape the inner turnbuckles last time and lost my careful adjustments. Could do away with the A-frame, but the mast with jib and CDI furler weighs 70 lb! I also took some extra time to tape the ends of my battens. The outboard was already on the boat, so didn't need to be handled. Even so, I don't see how I will ever setup in less than 2 hours.
What am I missing? I'm reluctant to take this boat anywhere other than my local lake, as it's just too much work! It's a shame because it performs so well on the water!
Mark House "Seranita" _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
I will second what Bill said regarding how to rig the boat. I can do it in 50 minutes alone, 35 with some help. I am 39 but no strong-man, but nothing I do requires a lot of strength. Some things I do: a) I keep the shrouds and backstay connected, don't touch them. The previous owner must have ground the base of the mast, as it goes up easily this way. b) I had a local shop here set up a vertical steel bar that extends the winch support on the trailer, and goes about 1 foot above the front pulpit, and I had them weld an eye there. What I do is I attach one end of my main sheet to the eye and one end to the forestay, after the mast base has been positioned in the tabernacle and the bolt was put in (but the nut is still somewhat loose). Using the 3-1 purchase of the forestay makes it relatively easy to raise the mast: I raise the mast by pulling up on the forestay a bit, then tighthen with the main sheet; repeat. After it's gone up to about 30 degrees you can just pull it up easily with the main sheet. What's nice about the system is that I am all the time at the bow of the boat, so when the mast is straight all I have to do is connect the forestay. (Also, even if something terrible went wrong and the mast came crashing down, it wouldn't hit anyone.) The only thing I have to be careful with is making sure the metal triangle in the backstay comes up the right way, which is achieved by lowering the backstay to the ground, behind the boat, before raising the mast. c) I never used the trailer tongue extension. In fact I sold it, it was way too heavy and I would never have been able to rig it alone. With my 3.5L Honda Odyssey I have no problem launching at all the ramps I ever go to. d) As Bill said, you have to have a good plan on the order in which you do things. First time I rigged it also took me 2.5 hours (and when lowering the mast I managed to drop it!! Luckily no one was harmed.) The biggest saving for me was installing the mast-raising system described above and using it well, and finding a set system of using ball bungees for packing the shrouds. Right now I walk around the boat and do most things I can do once, then hop in the boat and raise the mast, rig the boom, and get the sails on, throw out of the boat the bumpers, dock lines, and the bronze bar supporting the rudder, get out of the boat and install the rudder, bumpers, bow lines and I am ready to launch. With a boat cover (from Sailor's Tailor) which takes about 5 mins. to take down and 10 to put up, I count on about 45min. - 1 hour to rig, and about 1:30 to derig and put the boat away. For me that's still a lot, (I trailer sail, so rig and derig each time I go sailing) but it's surely better than what you have. Andrei.
Thanks, Andrei and Bill. Leaving the backstay and shrouds attached would be a significant time saver for me. I also like the idea of the tool bag, and leaving the main on the boom. Unfortunately, I need the whole 11 ft. tongue extension for the ramp at our State Park Marina. When it was the standard length, I nearly floated my Honda Pilot to get the boat to float off! I'll try some of these ideas this fall when I put her away for the winter. I've not yet seen a ramp that was steep enough that I could forget the extension - must be nice! Thanks for the helpful info. I'm amazed how much good info this chat group generates! Mark House ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andrei Caldararu" <andreic@math.wisc.edu> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2011 9:16 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17
I will second what Bill said regarding how to rig the boat. I can do it in 50 minutes alone, 35 with some help. I am 39 but no strong-man, but nothing I do requires a lot of strength.
Some things I do:
a) I keep the shrouds and backstay connected, don't touch them. The previous owner must have ground the base of the mast, as it goes up easily this way. b) I had a local shop here set up a vertical steel bar that extends the winch support on the trailer, and goes about 1 foot above the front pulpit, and I had them weld an eye there. What I do is I attach one end of my main sheet to the eye and one end to the forestay, after the mast base has been positioned in the tabernacle and the bolt was put in (but the nut is still somewhat loose). Using the 3-1 purchase of the forestay makes it relatively easy to raise the mast: I raise the mast by pulling up on the forestay a bit, then tighthen with the main sheet; repeat. After it's gone up to about 30 degrees you can just pull it up easily with the main sheet. What's nice about the system is that I am all the time at the bow of the boat, so when the mast is straight all I have to do is connect the forestay. (Also, even if something terrible went wrong and the mast came crashing down, it wouldn't hit anyone.) The only thing I have to be careful with is making sure the metal triangle in the backstay comes up the right way, which is achieved by lowering the backstay to the ground, behind the boat, before raising the mast. c) I never used the trailer tongue extension. In fact I sold it, it was way too heavy and I would never have been able to rig it alone. With my 3.5L Honda Odyssey I have no problem launching at all the ramps I ever go to. d) As Bill said, you have to have a good plan on the order in which you do things. First time I rigged it also took me 2.5 hours (and when lowering the mast I managed to drop it!! Luckily no one was harmed.) The biggest saving for me was installing the mast-raising system described above and using it well, and finding a set system of using ball bungees for packing the shrouds. Right now I walk around the boat and do most things I can do once, then hop in the boat and raise the mast, rig the boom, and get the sails on, throw out of the boat the bumpers, dock lines, and the bronze bar supporting the rudder, get out of the boat and install the rudder, bumpers, bow lines and I am ready to launch.
With a boat cover (from Sailor's Tailor) which takes about 5 mins. to take down and 10 to put up, I count on about 45min. - 1 hour to rig, and about 1:30 to derig and put the boat away. For me that's still a lot, (I trailer sail, so rig and derig each time I go sailing) but it's surely better than what you have.
Andrei.
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Another thing I do when launching: I back off slowly into the lake, with the boat unattached to the trailer and a friend holding the dock lines. When the boat starts to wiggle I hit the brakes, that makes the boat float away, and I can go back up with the car and the trailer. Andrei.
Mark It shouldn't be necessary to loosen or adjust the shrouds at all after they are set right, set and forget. A simple backstay adjuster would probably be a help. I have been trailering probably 35 years and yes the Monty with CDI is more difficult then the Venture 21 without a roller. Eldor M17 Motu iti -----Original Message----- From: Mark House <itsmark@bresnan.net> To: Montgomery Sailboats Chat <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Wed, May 25, 2011 8:45 pm Subject: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 Having rigged my M-17 twice and taken it down once in the last few weeks, I'm ondering if I'm the slowest rigger alive. It took me 3 hours the first time, bout the same the second. First two times I had help. So today when I set up o put the boat at a mooring for the summer, I timed myself. It tool me 2:34 r. - not much improvement. Here's the breakdown: 17 minutes Remove all tie-downs after 1575 mile drive. 1 minutes Position mast and bolt base in tabernacle. 8 minutes Rig A-frame, raise mast. 3 minutes Attach and adjust all standing rigging. 0 minutes Rig trailer tongue extension. 0 minutes Attach boom, main, battens, flake sail, put on sail cover 5 minutes Unrig trailer tongue extension Everything on the boat was well-tied-down for 1575 highway miles, and I took ome extra time to adjust the inner shrouds. I simplify rigging by loosening he starboard shrouds 6 turns, and the backstay 10 turns when I take the rig own. That way it should be quick to set it up the next time. However I forgot o tape the inner turnbuckles last time and lost my careful adjustments. Could o away with the A-frame, but the mast with jib and CDI furler weighs 70 lb! I lso took some extra time to tape the ends of my battens. The outboard was lready on the boat, so didn't need to be handled. Even so, I don't see how I ill ever setup in less than 2 hours. What am I missing? I'm reluctant to take this boat anywhere other than my local ake, as it's just too much work! It's a shame because it performs so well on he water! Mark House Seranita" ______________________________________________ ttp://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
The fastest way to set up an M17 is to trade it for an M15. The M17, no matter how you set it up, is not the easiest boat to launch and retrieve. The M15, on the other hand, is a dream. tjs
Tom: You're absolutely right! I sailed the Florida 120 with a very nice M-15, which was single-handed by Dave Amundson from Texas. It performed extremely well. It's rig is much simpler, and it's not nearly as heavy. I love my M-17, but I'm 65 and thinking seriously if I need to downsize! I have owned 11 different sailboats in the last 47 years, and the M-17 performs as well as the best. I did like the San Juan 23, which passed everything on Galveston Bay less than 28 ft. long. But maybe the M-17 is better. Mark House ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom Smith" <openboatt@gmail.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2011 1:43 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17
The fastest way to set up an M17 is to trade it for an M15. The M17, no matter how you set it up, is not the easiest boat to launch and retrieve.
The M15, on the other hand, is a dream.
tjs
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I sail an M17 now as well Mark, and there is no all-around better performing sailboat on this planet for my money. But having owned an M15 for some years, they are tough to beat for ease of use and fun. We sail our M17 out of a slip on a large lake. We keep the boat in the water for about 6 months then stow her in the barn for the winter. It's perfect for that. But if I become more mobile, I'll jump to an M15 in a heartbeat. tjs
I am not yet over the hill, however I am climbing the hill and I can clearly see the top. With that in mind it's clear to me that rigging a boat over 16' needs to be easier or I will not be able to enjoy time on Golden Pond so to speak. I believe there are existing technology's that will allow some of us old and semi old farts to continue to enjoy this pastime for a long time and on top of that I don't think we need to give up any current or even future performance improvements. So stand by, I'll probably break a few parts here or there feeling my way through this, but I think I'll end up with one of the easiest boats to rig, and launch and also have one of the fastest M-17s on earth. I know, my boat should be shinny by now, but I'm still cutting and bonding crap on. So with limited time at hand I will continue toward this goal and all the support I need is for some of my friends to say, Hey how's it coming.... And that's the end of my little story Stan --- On Thu, 5/26/11, Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> wrote: From: Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2011, 12:43 PM The fastest way to set up an M17 is to trade it for an M15. The M17, no matter how you set it up, is not the easiest boat to launch and retrieve. The M15, on the other hand, is a dream. tjs _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
There is some question where the crest of the hill is.. some go over earlier than others. Bill Ahrens Race Chairman Emeritus Tucson Sailing Club -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Stan Susman Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2011 10:57 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 I am not yet over the hill, however I am climbing the hill and I can clearly see the top. With that in mind it's clear to me that rigging a boat over 16' needs to be easier or I will not be able to enjoy time on Golden Pond so to speak. I believe there are existing technology's that will allow some of us old and semi old farts to continue to enjoy this pastime for a long time and on top of that I don't think we need to give up any current or even future performance improvements. So stand by, I'll probably break a few parts here or there feeling my way through this, but I think I'll end up with one of the easiest boats to rig, and launch and also have one of the fastest M-17s on earth. I know, my boat should be shinny by now, but I'm still cutting and bonding crap on. So with limited time at hand I will continue toward this goal and all the support I need is for some of my friends to say, Hey how's it coming.... And that's the end of my little story Stan --- On Thu, 5/26/11, Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> wrote: From: Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2011, 12:43 PM The fastest way to set up an M17 is to trade it for an M15. The M17, no matter how you set it up, is not the easiest boat to launch and retrieve. The M15, on the other hand, is a dream. tjs _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3662 - Release Date: 05/26/11
What hill? jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Ahrens" <billahrens@comcast.net> To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 11:02 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 There is some question where the crest of the hill is.. some go over earlier than others. Bill Ahrens Race Chairman Emeritus Tucson Sailing Club -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Stan Susman Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2011 10:57 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 I am not yet over the hill, however I am climbing the hill and I can clearly see the top. With that in mind it's clear to me that rigging a boat over 16' needs to be easier or I will not be able to enjoy time on Golden Pond so to speak. I believe there are existing technology's that will allow some of us old and semi old farts to continue to enjoy this pastime for a long time and on top of that I don't think we need to give up any current or even future performance improvements. So stand by, I'll probably break a few parts here or there feeling my way through this, but I think I'll end up with one of the easiest boats to rig, and launch and also have one of the fastest M-17s on earth. I know, my boat should be shinny by now, but I'm still cutting and bonding crap on. So with limited time at hand I will continue toward this goal and all the support I need is for some of my friends to say, Hey how's it coming.... And that's the end of my little story Stan --- On Thu, 5/26/11, Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> wrote: From: Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2011, 12:43 PM The fastest way to set up an M17 is to trade it for an M15. The M17, no matter how you set it up, is not the easiest boat to launch and retrieve. The M15, on the other hand, is a dream. tjs _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3662 - Release Date: 05/26/11 _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
The risk is that if you don't know where the hill is, you may be on it! Bill Ahrens Race Chairman Emeritus Tucson Sailing Club -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of jerry Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 11:43 AM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 What hill? jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Ahrens" <billahrens@comcast.net> To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 11:02 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 There is some question where the crest of the hill is.. some go over earlier than others. Bill Ahrens Race Chairman Emeritus Tucson Sailing Club -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Stan Susman Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2011 10:57 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 I am not yet over the hill, however I am climbing the hill and I can clearly see the top. With that in mind it's clear to me that rigging a boat over 16' needs to be easier or I will not be able to enjoy time on Golden Pond so to speak. I believe there are existing technology's that will allow some of us old and semi old farts to continue to enjoy this pastime for a long time and on top of that I don't think we need to give up any current or even future performance improvements. So stand by, I'll probably break a few parts here or there feeling my way through this, but I think I'll end up with one of the easiest boats to rig, and launch and also have one of the fastest M-17s on earth. I know, my boat should be shinny by now, but I'm still cutting and bonding crap on. So with limited time at hand I will continue toward this goal and all the support I need is for some of my friends to say, Hey how's it coming.... And that's the end of my little story Stan --- On Thu, 5/26/11, Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> wrote: From: Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2011, 12:43 PM The fastest way to set up an M17 is to trade it for an M15. The M17, no matter how you set it up, is not the easiest boat to launch and retrieve. The M15, on the other hand, is a dream. tjs _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3662 - Release Date: 05/26/11 _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3663 - Release Date: 05/27/11
Only one hill to worry about.. ..Boot Hill... Joe ----- Original Message ----- From: jerry To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 2:42 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 What hill? jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Ahrens" <billahrens@comcast.net> To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 11:02 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 There is some question where the crest of the hill is.. some go over earlier than others. Bill Ahrens Race Chairman Emeritus Tucson Sailing Club -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Stan Susman Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2011 10:57 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 I am not yet over the hill, however I am climbing the hill and I can clearly see the top. With that in mind it's clear to me that rigging a boat over 16' needs to be easier or I will not be able to enjoy time on Golden Pond so to speak. I believe there are existing technology's that will allow some of us old and semi old farts to continue to enjoy this pastime for a long time and on top of that I don't think we need to give up any current or even future performance improvements. So stand by, I'll probably break a few parts here or there feeling my way through this, but I think I'll end up with one of the easiest boats to rig, and launch and also have one of the fastest M-17s on earth. I know, my boat should be shinny by now, but I'm still cutting and bonding crap on. So with limited time at hand I will continue toward this goal and all the support I need is for some of my friends to say, Hey how's it coming.... And that's the end of my little story Stan --- On Thu, 5/26/11, Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> wrote: From: Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2011, 12:43 PM The fastest way to set up an M17 is to trade it for an M15. The M17, no matter how you set it up, is not the easiest boat to launch and retrieve. The M15, on the other hand, is a dream. tjs _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3662 - Release Date: 05/26/11 _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
LOL - different strokes for different folks. As I approach the top of the hill I up-sized :-) I have cruised my M15 extensively for several years and the damp and cold Pacific NW and the cold desert nights in the West are getting to me. So I opted for creature comfort and ease of launching. Due to $ limitations I decided to defer buying my first choice of the Sage until there is a used market. Someone needs to outsail Jerry in this Sage and I will make him an offer just after the loss :-). I opted for an 18 1/2 foot Sandpiper for its open interior, shallow draft (10", beachable), 3/4 rig with no back stay, and low position on the trailer. I will try the 4 part block and tackle off of high pole on the front of the trailer for the mast raising. When I look at the M17 or Sage on its trailer the deck is way up there. I have fallen off of my M15 in the driveway and that hurt enough. I would hate to take a tumble from way up there. The Sandpiper deck is a good 3 ft closer to the ground than the M17 when on the trailer. Thanks Doug ________________________________ From: Bill Ahrens <billahrens@comcast.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Fri, May 27, 2011 11:02:00 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 There is some question where the crest of the hill is.. some go over earlier than others. Bill Ahrens Race Chairman Emeritus Tucson Sailing Club -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Stan Susman Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2011 10:57 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 I am not yet over the hill, however I am climbing the hill and I can clearly see the top. With that in mind it's clear to me that rigging a boat over 16' needs to be easier or I will not be able to enjoy time on Golden Pond so to speak. I believe there are existing technology's that will allow some of us old and semi old farts to continue to enjoy this pastime for a long time and on top of that I don't think we need to give up any current or even future performance improvements. So stand by, I'll probably break a few parts here or there feeling my way through this, but I think I'll end up with one of the easiest boats to rig, and launch and also have one of the fastest M-17s on earth. I know, my boat should be shinny by now, but I'm still cutting and bonding crap on. So with limited time at hand I will continue toward this goal and all the support I need is for some of my friends to say, Hey how's it coming.... And that's the end of my little story Stan --- On Thu, 5/26/11, Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> wrote: From: Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2011, 12:43 PM The fastest way to set up an M17 is to trade it for an M15. The M17, no matter how you set it up, is not the easiest boat to launch and retrieve. The M15, on the other hand, is a dream. tjs _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3662 - Release Date: 05/26/11 _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
Dave and I will square off in the Monterey race and despite his proclamations he hasn't got a prayer. I lied about the lead ballast in my boat and actually used depleted uranium, which is not only WAY faster, especially at the start (it's proven) but it's handy when cruising because it eliminates the need for an anchor lite because it causes the boat to glow in the dark. jerry ----- Original Message ----- From: "Doug Kelch" <doug_kelch@yahoo.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 11:57 AM Subject: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17- over the hill
LOL - different strokes for different folks.
As I approach the top of the hill I up-sized :-)
I have cruised my M15 extensively for several years and the damp and cold Pacific NW and the cold desert nights in the West are getting to me. So I opted for creature comfort and ease of launching.
Due to $ limitations I decided to defer buying my first choice of the Sage until there is a used market. Someone needs to outsail Jerry in this Sage and I will make him an offer just after the loss :-).
I opted for an 18 1/2 foot Sandpiper for its open interior, shallow draft (10", beachable), 3/4 rig with no back stay, and low position on the trailer. I will try the 4 part block and tackle off of high pole on the front of the trailer for the mast raising.
When I look at the M17 or Sage on its trailer the deck is way up there. I have fallen off of my M15 in the driveway and that hurt enough. I would hate to take a tumble from way up there. The Sandpiper deck is a good 3 ft closer to the ground than the M17 when on the trailer.
Thanks
Doug
________________________________ From: Bill Ahrens <billahrens@comcast.net> To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Fri, May 27, 2011 11:02:00 AM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17
There is some question where the crest of the hill is.. some go over earlier than others.
Bill Ahrens Race Chairman Emeritus Tucson Sailing Club
-----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Stan Susman Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2011 10:57 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17
I am not yet over the hill, however I am climbing the hill and I can clearly see the top. With that in mind it's clear to me that rigging a boat over 16' needs to be easier or I will not be able to enjoy time on Golden Pond so to speak. I believe there are existing technology's that will allow some of us old and semi old farts to continue to enjoy this pastime for a long time and on top of that I don't think we need to give up any current or even future performance improvements. So stand by, I'll probably break a few parts here or there feeling my way through this, but I think I'll end up with one of the easiest boats to rig, and launch and also have one of the fastest M-17s on earth. I know, my boat should be shinny by now, but I'm still cutting and bonding crap on. So with limited time at hand I will continue toward this goal and all the support I need is for some of my friends to say, Hey how's it coming.... And that's the end of my little story
Stan
--- On Thu, 5/26/11, Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> wrote:
From: Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2011, 12:43 PM
The fastest way to set up an M17 is to trade it for an M15. The M17, no matter how you set it up, is not the easiest boat to launch and retrieve.
The M15, on the other hand, is a dream.
tjs
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When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3662 - Release Date: 05/26/11
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Ok ,sorry for this as I don't want to get away from boats. When you slip over the hill, would a parachute help slow the fall? --- On Fri, 5/27/11, Bill Ahrens <billahrens@comcast.net> wrote: From: Bill Ahrens <billahrens@comcast.net> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Friday, May 27, 2011, 11:02 AM There is some question where the crest of the hill is.. some go over earlier than others. Bill Ahrens Race Chairman Emeritus Tucson Sailing Club -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Stan Susman Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2011 10:57 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 I am not yet over the hill, however I am climbing the hill and I can clearly see the top. With that in mind it's clear to me that rigging a boat over 16' needs to be easier or I will not be able to enjoy time on Golden Pond so to speak. I believe there are existing technology's that will allow some of us old and semi old farts to continue to enjoy this pastime for a long time and on top of that I don't think we need to give up any current or even future performance improvements. So stand by, I'll probably break a few parts here or there feeling my way through this, but I think I'll end up with one of the easiest boats to rig, and launch and also have one of the fastest M-17s on earth. I know, my boat should be shinny by now, but I'm still cutting and bonding crap on. So with limited time at hand I will continue toward this goal and all the support I need is for some of my friends to say, Hey how's it coming.... And that's the end of my little story Stan --- On Thu, 5/26/11, Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> wrote: From: Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2011, 12:43 PM The fastest way to set up an M17 is to trade it for an M15. The M17, no matter how you set it up, is not the easiest boat to launch and retrieve. The M15, on the other hand, is a dream. tjs _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3662 - Release Date: 05/26/11 _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
Only a golden one, but they're not easy to come by. Rick M-17 #633 Lynne L -- Sent from my Palm Pre On May 27, 2011 8:31 PM, Stan Susman <stanpfa@pacbell.net> wrote: Ok ,sorry for this as I don't want to get away from boats. When you slip over the hill, would a parachute help slow the fall? --- On Fri, 5/27/11, Bill Ahrens <billahrens@comcast.net> wrote: From: Bill Ahrens <billahrens@comcast.net> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Friday, May 27, 2011, 11:02 AM There is some question where the crest of the hill is.. some go over earlier than others. Bill Ahrens Race Chairman Emeritus Tucson Sailing Club -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Stan Susman Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2011 10:57 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 I am not yet over the hill, however I am climbing the hill and I can clearly see the top. With that in mind it's clear to me that rigging a boat over 16' needs to be easier or I will not be able to enjoy time on Golden Pond so to speak. I believe there are existing technology's that will allow some of us old and semi old farts to continue to enjoy this pastime for a long time and on top of that I don't think we need to give up any current or even future performance improvements. So stand by, I'll probably break a few parts here or there feeling my way through this, but I think I'll end up with one of the easiest boats to rig, and launch and also have one of the fastest M-17s on earth. I know, my boat should be shinny by now, but I'm still cutting and bonding crap on. So with limited time at hand I will continue toward this goal and all the support I need is for some of my friends to say, Hey how's it coming.... And that's the end of my little story Stan --- On Thu, 5/26/11, Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> wrote: From: Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2011, 12:43 PM The fastest way to set up an M17 is to trade it for an M15. The M17, no matter how you set it up, is not the easiest boat to launch and retrieve. The M15, on the other hand, is a dream. tjs _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3662 - Release Date: 05/26/11 _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
Boats? Bill Ahrens Race Chairman Emeritus Tucson Sailing Club -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Stan Susman Sent: Friday, May 27, 2011 5:32 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 Ok ,sorry for this as I don't want to get away from boats. When you slip over the hill, would a parachute help slow the fall? --- On Fri, 5/27/11, Bill Ahrens <billahrens@comcast.net> wrote: From: Bill Ahrens <billahrens@comcast.net> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 To: "'For and about Montgomery Sailboats'" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Friday, May 27, 2011, 11:02 AM There is some question where the crest of the hill is.. some go over earlier than others. Bill Ahrens Race Chairman Emeritus Tucson Sailing Club -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Stan Susman Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2011 10:57 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 I am not yet over the hill, however I am climbing the hill and I can clearly see the top. With that in mind it's clear to me that rigging a boat over 16' needs to be easier or I will not be able to enjoy time on Golden Pond so to speak. I believe there are existing technology's that will allow some of us old and semi old farts to continue to enjoy this pastime for a long time and on top of that I don't think we need to give up any current or even future performance improvements. So stand by, I'll probably break a few parts here or there feeling my way through this, but I think I'll end up with one of the easiest boats to rig, and launch and also have one of the fastest M-17s on earth. I know, my boat should be shinny by now, but I'm still cutting and bonding crap on. So with limited time at hand I will continue toward this goal and all the support I need is for some of my friends to say, Hey how's it coming.... And that's the end of my little story Stan --- On Thu, 5/26/11, Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> wrote: From: Tom Smith <openboatt@gmail.com> Subject: Re: M_Boats: Setting Up the M-17 To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Date: Thursday, May 26, 2011, 12:43 PM The fastest way to set up an M17 is to trade it for an M15. The M17, no matter how you set it up, is not the easiest boat to launch and retrieve. The M15, on the other hand, is a dream. tjs _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3662 - Release Date: 05/26/11 _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! ----- No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 10.0.1375 / Virus Database: 1509/3664 - Release Date: 05/27/11
participants (13)
-
Andrei Caldararu -
Bill Ahrens -
Bill Day -
Bill Kaiser -
Bill Wickett -
Doug Kelch -
eisenee＠aol.com -
jerry -
Joe Murphy -
John Davies -
Mark House -
Stan Susman -
Tom Smith