Of course the point is you can get an M15 in the water and sailing pretty fast. Most of us on this list have done time rigging larger boats, and it's a pita. Thus we exult in our newfound freedom. Grant us our small pleasures Steven, and be prepared to get smoked if you ever say something stupid. t Tom Smith & Jane VanWinkle M15/345--Chukar M17/064--Unnamed