Outhaul and reef point boom hardware
I am planning to add an outhaul and second reef point hardware to my M15, and have some questions: -What is the recommended way to mount hardware to the boom? I don't want to have stainless rivets fail from galvanic corrosion. I've thought about using plastic shoulder bushings and bolts, but that wouldn't let the hardware mount perfectly flush. -Does anyone have hardware recommendations for the reef point and outhaul? -Is an internal outhaul worthwhile? Sincerely, Tyler Davis, CA M15 #157 "Defiant"
I'll second the question about attaching hardware to boom. My mainsheet block attachment point on the boom appears to have been moved forward. There are two sets of what I take to be prior attachment points aft of where it is now. I want to put it back to original location. The stainless strap that the block mounts to looks to be riveted on using aluminum rivets. Also I have multiple reef point hardware on the boom, curious to compare current mounting method to others' experiences. cheers, John S. On 10/21/2015 01:39 PM, Tyler Backman wrote:
I am planning to add an outhaul and second reef point hardware to my M15, and have some questions:
-What is the recommended way to mount hardware to the boom? I don't want to have stainless rivets fail from galvanic corrosion. I've thought about using plastic shoulder bushings and bolts, but that wouldn't let the hardware mount perfectly flush.
-Does anyone have hardware recommendations for the reef point and outhaul?
-Is an internal outhaul worthwhile?
Sincerely, Tyler Davis, CA M15 #157 "Defiant"
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
I am redoing my boom and found that aluminum rivets that are 30plus years old are as good as when they went in. The ss contact with them did not cause any corrosion. I prefer aluminum pop rivets because they are strong enough and any corrosion will be seen outside the boom since the aluminum/ss contact happens where you can see it. Tom B On Wed, Oct 21, 2015 at 5:53 PM, John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
I'll second the question about attaching hardware to boom.
My mainsheet block attachment point on the boom appears to have been moved forward. There are two sets of what I take to be prior attachment points aft of where it is now. I want to put it back to original location. The stainless strap that the block mounts to looks to be riveted on using aluminum rivets.
Also I have multiple reef point hardware on the boom, curious to compare current mounting method to others' experiences.
cheers, John S.
On 10/21/2015 01:39 PM, Tyler Backman wrote:
I am planning to add an outhaul and second reef point hardware to my M15, and have some questions:
-What is the recommended way to mount hardware to the boom? I don't want to have stainless rivets fail from galvanic corrosion. I've thought about using plastic shoulder bushings and bolts, but that wouldn't let the hardware mount perfectly flush.
-Does anyone have hardware recommendations for the reef point and outhaul?
-Is an internal outhaul worthwhile?
Sincerely, Tyler Davis, CA M15 #157 "Defiant"
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
my M17, a 1983, has stainless rivets for the hardware on boom and mast that are holding just fine. The prior owners of the 17 kept her on a buoy in Quartermaster Harbor, Vashon Island, Puget Sound for nine months a year for over 20 years ... plenty of saltwater soaking. the hardware on my old M15, a 1984, was also SS and just fine (though sheet was dry stored and spent at least half her life in Utah). the issue with aluminum is it isn't as strong as stainless. is this an issue for the M15 and M17? lots of heated debate about this on this listproc three or so years ago. a challenge when using stainless is most hand riveters don't have the strength to 'pop the rivet. at Sage Marine i use a pneumatic pop rivet gun when building the Sage 17 and Sage 15 masts & booms. Jerry converted the Glesser's M15's boom to a internal 2:1 outhaul. works great. internal frees up space on the boom (small booms on these small boats). the outhaul is really only effective with a loose foot main ... just too much resistance to adjusting draft when the main has a bolt rope foot. I'm going to be building a new boom for an M15 owner in December with a 2:1 outhaul (boom to be delivered at the Wrinkleboat Ran-Tan in January). i will be taking pictures and detailing the project on the Sage Marine blog; or i could take pictures of the Glessers' boom to give you an overview on how to convert a boom built by Jerry 'back in the day'. here is a link to how the Sage 17 boom is put together, including the outhaul - https://sagemarineblog.wordpress.com/2015/03/12/building-a-boom/ -- :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com
On 10/21/2015 01:39 PM, Tyler Backman wrote:
I am planning to add an outhaul and second reef point hardware to my M15, and have some questions:
-What is the recommended way to mount hardware to the boom? I don't want to have stainless rivets fail from galvanic corrosion. I've thought about using plastic shoulder bushings and bolts, but that wouldn't let the hardware mount perfectly flush.
-Does anyone have hardware recommendations for the reef point and outhaul?
-Is an internal outhaul worthwhile?
Sincerely, Tyler Davis, CA M15 #157 "Defiant"
Sounds like a good endorsement, and it hasn’t been a problem with galvanic corrosion. I have used the simple tap and drill method. Very satisfying also to tap the hole and screw in a machine screw. Makes me feel like I know what I am doing. I have a drill bit for #8 and #10 screws, and a tap for them also. Must have cost all of $15 for the whole thing. It is easy to find online what size drill bit you need for those 2 sizes. I keep them in my boat kit. Daniel Rich M15 #208 "Kestrel" danielgrich@gmail.com
On Oct 21, 2015, at 5:17 PM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> wrote:
my M17, a 1983, has stainless rivets for the hardware on boom and mast that are holding just fine. The prior owners of the 17 kept her on a buoy in Quartermaster Harbor, Vashon Island, Puget Sound for nine months a year for over 20 years ... plenty of saltwater soaking. the hardware on my old M15, a 1984, was also SS and just fine (though sheet was dry stored and spent at least half her life in Utah).
the issue with aluminum is it isn't as strong as stainless. is this an issue for the M15 and M17? lots of heated debate about this on this listproc three or so years ago.
a challenge when using stainless is most hand riveters don't have the strength to 'pop the rivet. at Sage Marine i use a pneumatic pop rivet gun when building the Sage 17 and Sage 15 masts & booms.
Jerry converted the Glesser's M15's boom to a internal 2:1 outhaul. works great. internal frees up space on the boom (small booms on these small boats). the outhaul is really only effective with a loose foot main ... just too much resistance to adjusting draft when the main has a bolt rope foot.
I'm going to be building a new boom for an M15 owner in December with a 2:1 outhaul (boom to be delivered at the Wrinkleboat Ran-Tan in January). i will be taking pictures and detailing the project on the Sage Marine blog; or i could take pictures of the Glessers' boom to give you an overview on how to convert a boom built by Jerry 'back in the day'.
here is a link to how the Sage 17 boom is put together, including the outhaul -
https://sagemarineblog.wordpress.com/2015/03/12/building-a-boom/
-- :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com
On 10/21/2015 01:39 PM, Tyler Backman wrote:
I am planning to add an outhaul and second reef point hardware to my M15, and have some questions:
-What is the recommended way to mount hardware to the boom? I don't want to have stainless rivets fail from galvanic corrosion. I've thought about using plastic shoulder bushings and bolts, but that wouldn't let the hardware mount perfectly flush.
-Does anyone have hardware recommendations for the reef point and outhaul?
-Is an internal outhaul worthwhile?
Sincerely, Tyler Davis, CA M15 #157 "Defiant"
for 'tap and screw' you can coat the threads with Loctite or coat the treads with a little bedding compound. will help assure the machine screws don't come loose and also puts some barrier between the metals. -- :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com On Wed, Oct 21, 2015 at 6:22 PM, Daniel Rich <danielgrich@gmail.com> wrote:
Sounds like a good endorsement, and it hasn’t been a problem with galvanic corrosion.
I have used the simple tap and drill method. Very satisfying also to tap the hole and screw in a machine screw. Makes me feel like I know what I am doing. I have a drill bit for #8 and #10 screws, and a tap for them also. Must have cost all of $15 for the whole thing. It is easy to find online what size drill bit you need for those 2 sizes. I keep them in my boat kit.
Daniel Rich M15 #208 "Kestrel" danielgrich@gmail.com
On Oct 21, 2015, at 5:17 PM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> wrote:
my M17, a 1983, has stainless rivets for the hardware on boom and mast that are holding just fine. The prior owners of the 17 kept her on a buoy in Quartermaster Harbor, Vashon Island, Puget Sound for nine months a year for over 20 years ... plenty of saltwater soaking. the hardware on my old M15, a 1984, was also SS and just fine (though sheet was dry stored and spent at least half her life in Utah).
the issue with aluminum is it isn't as strong as stainless. is this an issue for the M15 and M17? lots of heated debate about this on this listproc three or so years ago.
a challenge when using stainless is most hand riveters don't have the strength to 'pop the rivet. at Sage Marine i use a pneumatic pop rivet gun when building the Sage 17 and Sage 15 masts & booms.
Jerry converted the Glesser's M15's boom to a internal 2:1 outhaul. works great. internal frees up space on the boom (small booms on these small boats). the outhaul is really only effective with a loose foot main ... just too much resistance to adjusting draft when the main has a bolt rope foot.
I'm going to be building a new boom for an M15 owner in December with a 2:1 outhaul (boom to be delivered at the Wrinkleboat Ran-Tan in January). i will be taking pictures and detailing the project on the Sage Marine blog; or i could take pictures of the Glessers' boom to give you an overview on how to convert a boom built by Jerry 'back in the day'.
here is a link to how the Sage 17 boom is put together, including the outhaul -
https://sagemarineblog.wordpress.com/2015/03/12/building-a-boom/
-- :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com
On 10/21/2015 01:39 PM, Tyler Backman wrote:
I am planning to add an outhaul and second reef point hardware to my M15, and have some questions:
-What is the recommended way to mount hardware to the boom? I don't want to have stainless rivets fail from galvanic corrosion. I've thought about using plastic shoulder bushings and bolts, but that wouldn't let the hardware mount perfectly flush.
-Does anyone have hardware recommendations for the reef point and outhaul?
-Is an internal outhaul worthwhile?
Sincerely, Tyler Davis, CA M15 #157 "Defiant"
I've installed cheek blocks and cleats for both reefing and outhaul to the boom by drilling holes, tapping them with #10 threads with a tapping drill, and screwing on the hardware with #10 stainless bolts. Easy to do, and trouble-free afterward. I used the same procedure to move the mainsheet bail forward when I installed a longer tiller. Rick M17 #633 Lynne L On Wednesday, October 21, 2015, John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
I'll second the question about attaching hardware to boom.
My mainsheet block attachment point on the boom appears to have been moved forward. There are two sets of what I take to be prior attachment points aft of where it is now. I want to put it back to original location. The stainless strap that the block mounts to looks to be riveted on using aluminum rivets.
Also I have multiple reef point hardware on the boom, curious to compare current mounting method to others' experiences.
cheers, John S.
On 10/21/2015 01:39 PM, Tyler Backman wrote:
I am planning to add an outhaul and second reef point hardware to my M15, and have some questions:
-What is the recommended way to mount hardware to the boom? I don't want to have stainless rivets fail from galvanic corrosion. I've thought about using plastic shoulder bushings and bolts, but that wouldn't let the hardware mount perfectly flush.
-Does anyone have hardware recommendations for the reef point and outhaul?
-Is an internal outhaul worthwhile?
Sincerely, Tyler Davis, CA M15 #157 "Defiant"
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
I have too. The problem is that over the long haul one can get galvanic corrosion from the two disparate metals, which causes the aluminum side on the spar to get brittle. The fitting could fail suddenly. JudyB once game me some good advice about this, but I forgot!! There is some kind of stuff in a tube that electricians use to isolate the metals. So painting the threads with that stuff should reduce or eliminate the problem. Somebody on this list will know what that is! Daniel Rich M15 #208 "Kestrel" danielgrich@gmail.com
On Oct 21, 2015, at 5:06 PM, Rick Davies <jdavies104@gmail.com> wrote:
I've installed cheek blocks and cleats for both reefing and outhaul to the boom by drilling holes, tapping them with #10 threads with a tapping drill, and screwing on the hardware with #10 stainless bolts. Easy to do, and trouble-free afterward. I used the same procedure to move the mainsheet bail forward when I installed a longer tiller.
Rick M17 #633 Lynne L
On Wednesday, October 21, 2015, John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
I'll second the question about attaching hardware to boom.
My mainsheet block attachment point on the boom appears to have been moved forward. There are two sets of what I take to be prior attachment points aft of where it is now. I want to put it back to original location. The stainless strap that the block mounts to looks to be riveted on using aluminum rivets.
Also I have multiple reef point hardware on the boom, curious to compare current mounting method to others' experiences.
cheers, John S.
On 10/21/2015 01:39 PM, Tyler Backman wrote:
I am planning to add an outhaul and second reef point hardware to my M15, and have some questions:
-What is the recommended way to mount hardware to the boom? I don't want to have stainless rivets fail from galvanic corrosion. I've thought about using plastic shoulder bushings and bolts, but that wouldn't let the hardware mount perfectly flush.
-Does anyone have hardware recommendations for the reef point and outhaul?
-Is an internal outhaul worthwhile?
Sincerely, Tyler Davis, CA M15 #157 "Defiant"
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
I use plastic milk bottle material to separate the stainless steel fitting from resting on the aluminum spar. I also use aluminum rivets .A dab of caulk under the head before you pop rivet the rivet will give you years of safe use. I have removed aluminum pop rivets from my Monty 17 boom that were in there for over 30 years with no protection against the ss fitting they held to the boom and the rivets had no corrosion on them at all. Aluminum is plenty strong for the forces you will encounter sailing your 15. Good luck, Tom B On Wed, Oct 21, 2015 at 3:39 PM, Tyler Backman <casioqv@usermail.com> wrote:
I am planning to add an outhaul and second reef point hardware to my M15, and have some questions:
-What is the recommended way to mount hardware to the boom? I don't want to have stainless rivets fail from galvanic corrosion. I've thought about using plastic shoulder bushings and bolts, but that wouldn't let the hardware mount perfectly flush.
-Does anyone have hardware recommendations for the reef point and outhaul?
-Is an internal outhaul worthwhile?
Sincerely, Tyler Davis, CA M15 #157 "Defiant"
Look up Roger's reefing refinement. I have used this for years and it eliminates a cleat and simplifies handling excess line while reefed. I agree with using aluminum rivets. My boat has 20 yrs of good use with no problems. M15 G #310 "Seas The Day" On Oct 21, 2015 4:42 PM, "Thomas Buzzi" <thomaspbuzzi@gmail.com> wrote:
I use plastic milk bottle material to separate the stainless steel fitting from resting on the aluminum spar. I also use aluminum rivets .A dab of caulk under the head before you pop rivet the rivet will give you years of safe use. I have removed aluminum pop rivets from my Monty 17 boom that were in there for over 30 years with no protection against the ss fitting they held to the boom and the rivets had no corrosion on them at all. Aluminum is plenty strong for the forces you will encounter sailing your 15. Good luck, Tom B
On Wed, Oct 21, 2015 at 3:39 PM, Tyler Backman <casioqv@usermail.com> wrote:
I am planning to add an outhaul and second reef point hardware to my M15, and have some questions:
-What is the recommended way to mount hardware to the boom? I don't want to have stainless rivets fail from galvanic corrosion. I've thought about using plastic shoulder bushings and bolts, but that wouldn't let the hardware mount perfectly flush.
-Does anyone have hardware recommendations for the reef point and outhaul?
-Is an internal outhaul worthwhile?
Sincerely, Tyler Davis, CA M15 #157 "Defiant"
participants (7)
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Daniel Rich -
Dave Scobie -
Douglas Kelch -
John Schinnerer -
Rick Davies -
Thomas Buzzi -
Tyler Backman