need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm
Hello fellow sailors! I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow. Any suggestions for a new one? Many thanks for your collective expertise! Chris
Chris: You want one of these - https://www.harken.com/productdetail.aspx?id=5749&taxid=375 Or - https://www.harken.com/productdetail.aspx?id=5269&taxid=375 The difference between the above are the height/lift of the arm. Get one that closely matches the current one on your M15. Choose a block of the same size as the one that broke to attach to the arm assembly. NOTE: confirm you need a new arm as you may be able to attach a replacement block to the existing arm. If still unsure share a picture of the current fitting (reduce image to under 300k or the email server will not forward the image). :: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred/ On Fri, Oct 11, 2019, 2:11 PM Chris Smith <chris.r.smith@gmail.com> wrote:
Hello fellow sailors!
I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow.
Any suggestions for a new one?
Many thanks for your collective expertise!
Chris
If you can find a local chandlery, maybe they will be able to help you. I will suggest taking your broken block into the store to get as close a match as you can find. Much as I try to avoid the big box of boat stores, West Marine, they do carry an assortment of blocks. Steve M-15 # 335 -----Original Message----- From: Chris Smith Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:10 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm Hello fellow sailors! I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow. Any suggestions for a new one? Many thanks for your collective expertise! Chris
Also check other brands/makers for equivalent function but less expensive hardware. Harken is one of, if not the, the most expensive in my experience. cheers, John On 10/11/19 2:34 PM, Steve Trapp wrote:
If you can find a local chandlery, maybe they will be able to help you. I will suggest taking your broken block into the store to get as close a match as you can find. Much as I try to avoid the big box of boat stores, West Marine, they do carry an assortment of blocks. Steve M-15 # 335
-----Original Message----- From: Chris Smith Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:10 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm
Hello fellow sailors!
I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow.
Any suggestions for a new one?
Many thanks for your collective expertise!
Chris
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
Well worth shopping online, these are pricey. West Marine most likely does have sub assemblies if you want to rebuild it. At least you can touch it and see it before you buy ( if you have one close). Sometimes WM is the last resort. I’m old enough to remember the smell of tar in real chandlerys. Now, the smell of polyethylene and nylon...but I love my little plastic boat. Ed Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 11, 2019, at 2:35 PM, Steve Trapp <stevetrapp@q.com> wrote:
If you can find a local chandlery, maybe they will be able to help you. I will suggest taking your broken block into the store to get as close a match as you can find. Much as I try to avoid the big box of boat stores, West Marine, they do carry an assortment of blocks. Steve M-15 # 335
-----Original Message----- From: Chris Smith Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:10 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm
Hello fellow sailors!
I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow.
Any suggestions for a new one?
Many thanks for your collective expertise!
Chris
Also check https://nautos-usa.com/collections/swivel-bases-1 Similar quality, better prices, and the block is included! Henry Monita On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 9:23 AM Edward Epifani <edepifani@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well worth shopping online, these are pricey. West Marine most likely does have sub assemblies if you want to rebuild it. At least you can touch it and see it before you buy ( if you have one close). Sometimes WM is the last resort. I’m old enough to remember the smell of tar in real chandlerys. Now, the smell of polyethylene and nylon...but I love my little plastic boat. Ed
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 11, 2019, at 2:35 PM, Steve Trapp <stevetrapp@q.com> wrote:
If you can find a local chandlery, maybe they will be able to help you. I will suggest taking your broken block into the store to get as close a match as you can find. Much as I try to avoid the big box of boat stores, West Marine, they do carry an assortment of blocks. Steve M-15 # 335
-----Original Message----- From: Chris Smith Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:10 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm
Hello fellow sailors!
I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow.
Any suggestions for a new one?
Many thanks for your collective expertise!
Chris
-- Sent from Gmail Mobile
Thanks for this source Henry...they have some swivel base jib sheet block/cleat combos that are not bank-breakers. I'm looking for something to improve my jib sheet handling, they have some options I haven't seen from other mfgs. cheers, John On 10/12/19 8:19 AM, Henry Rodriguez wrote:
Also check https://nautos-usa.com/collections/swivel-bases-1
Similar quality, better prices, and the block is included!
Henry Monita
On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 9:23 AM Edward Epifani <edepifani@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well worth shopping online, these are pricey. West Marine most likely does have sub assemblies if you want to rebuild it. At least you can touch it and see it before you buy ( if you have one close). Sometimes WM is the last resort. I’m old enough to remember the smell of tar in real chandlerys. Now, the smell of polyethylene and nylon...but I love my little plastic boat. Ed
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 11, 2019, at 2:35 PM, Steve Trapp <stevetrapp@q.com> wrote:
If you can find a local chandlery, maybe they will be able to help you. I will suggest taking your broken block into the store to get as close a match as you can find. Much as I try to avoid the big box of boat stores, West Marine, they do carry an assortment of blocks. Steve M-15 # 335
-----Original Message----- From: Chris Smith Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:10 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm
Hello fellow sailors!
I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow.
Any suggestions for a new one?
Many thanks for your collective expertise!
Chris
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
Hey, some great looking stuff there!! Daniel
On Oct 12, 2019, at 12:08 PM, John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
Thanks for this source Henry...they have some swivel base jib sheet block/cleat combos that are not bank-breakers. I'm looking for something to improve my jib sheet handling, they have some options I haven't seen from other mfgs.
cheers, John
On 10/12/19 8:19 AM, Henry Rodriguez wrote:
Also check https://nautos-usa.com/collections/swivel-bases-1 Similar quality, better prices, and the block is included! Henry Monita On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 9:23 AM Edward Epifani <edepifani@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well worth shopping online, these are pricey. West Marine most likely does have sub assemblies if you want to rebuild it. At least you can touch it and see it before you buy ( if you have one close). Sometimes WM is the last resort. I’m old enough to remember the smell of tar in real chandlerys. Now, the smell of polyethylene and nylon...but I love my little plastic boat. Ed
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 11, 2019, at 2:35 PM, Steve Trapp <stevetrapp@q.com> wrote:
If you can find a local chandlery, maybe they will be able to help you. I will suggest taking your broken block into the store to get as close a match as you can find. Much as I try to avoid the big box of boat stores, West Marine, they do carry an assortment of blocks. Steve M-15 # 335
-----Original Message----- From: Chris Smith Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:10 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm
Hello fellow sailors!
I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow.
Any suggestions for a new one?
Many thanks for your collective expertise!
Chris
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
I use the Nautos swivel base on my M15 and love it, but I use it with a Harken ratchet block as the base I got didn't come with a block. Sincerely, Tyler ----- Original Message ----- From: "Daniel Rich" <danielgrich@gmail.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Saturday, October 12, 2019 12:12:09 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm Hey, some great looking stuff there!! Daniel
On Oct 12, 2019, at 12:08 PM, John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
Thanks for this source Henry...they have some swivel base jib sheet block/cleat combos that are not bank-breakers. I'm looking for something to improve my jib sheet handling, they have some options I haven't seen from other mfgs.
cheers, John
On 10/12/19 8:19 AM, Henry Rodriguez wrote:
Also check https://nautos-usa.com/collections/swivel-bases-1 Similar quality, better prices, and the block is included! Henry Monita On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 9:23 AM Edward Epifani <edepifani@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well worth shopping online, these are pricey. West Marine most likely does have sub assemblies if you want to rebuild it. At least you can touch it and see it before you buy ( if you have one close). Sometimes WM is the last resort. I’m old enough to remember the smell of tar in real chandlerys. Now, the smell of polyethylene and nylon...but I love my little plastic boat. Ed
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 11, 2019, at 2:35 PM, Steve Trapp <stevetrapp@q.com> wrote:
If you can find a local chandlery, maybe they will be able to help you. I will suggest taking your broken block into the store to get as close a match as you can find. Much as I try to avoid the big box of boat stores, West Marine, they do carry an assortment of blocks. Steve M-15 # 335
-----Original Message----- From: Chris Smith Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:10 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm
Hello fellow sailors!
I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow.
Any suggestions for a new one?
Many thanks for your collective expertise!
Chris
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
John, I like swivel cams for the jib sheets because you can cross trim the sheet easily from the windward side. I’m currently using a pair of Ronstan RF58 cams with the bullseye removed and replaced with an eye strap holding a swivel block. https://www.westmarine.com/buy/ronstan--medium-bulls-eye-fairlead-cleat-for-... I would prefer to use the Ronstan RF60 https://www.westmarine.com/buy/ronstan--ultimate-swivel-cam-base--3734183 because of the ball bearing base but the price is a killer. The Nautos HT-4967 looks promising. https://nautos-usa.com/collections/swivel-bases-1/products/ht4967-swivel-bas... If you do order anything from Nautos you can use discount code NAUTOSVIP for 5% off. Henry On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 2:09 PM John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
Thanks for this source Henry...they have some swivel base jib sheet block/cleat combos that are not bank-breakers. I'm looking for something to improve my jib sheet handling, they have some options I haven't seen from other mfgs.
cheers, John
On 10/12/19 8:19 AM, Henry Rodriguez wrote:
Also check https://nautos-usa.com/collections/swivel-bases-1
Similar quality, better prices, and the block is included!
Henry Monita
On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 9:23 AM Edward Epifani <edepifani@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well worth shopping online, these are pricey. West Marine most likely does have sub assemblies if you want to rebuild it. At least you can touch it and see it before you buy ( if you have one close). Sometimes WM is the last resort. I’m old enough to remember the smell of tar in real chandlerys. Now, the smell of polyethylene and nylon...but I love my little plastic boat. Ed
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 11, 2019, at 2:35 PM, Steve Trapp <stevetrapp@q.com> wrote:
If you can find a local chandlery, maybe they will be able to help you. I will suggest taking your broken block into the store to get as close a match as you can find. Much as I try to avoid the big box of boat stores, West Marine, they do carry an assortment of blocks. Steve M-15 # 335
-----Original Message----- From: Chris Smith Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:10 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm
Hello fellow sailors!
I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow.
Any suggestions for a new one?
Many thanks for your collective expertise!
Chris
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
-- Sent from Gmail Mobile
Exactly...trimming the jib sheets more quickly easily safely. Needs to be done a lot in swirly wind lake sailing. Unfortunately they also add at least one more place the released jib sheet can hang up when tacking... Why did you replace the bullseye with a swivel block? Do you have a pic? I re-positioned the oversize cam cleats some prior owner had put on my M17 so that they are fairly close behind the winches and angle partially into the cockpit. So I can sheet in somewhat just by pulling thru them. But can't release them from across cockpit in most cases. And it's still not optimal, and better one side than the other due to winch rotation being same on both sides so the line comes off winch to cam at a better angle one side. I know a guy with a Wharram Tiki 21 who actually set up his jib sheets to run to the windward side - that is, the active sheet is led via a few blocks cross-deck to the windward side. A bit easier to do without it getting in the way, on a cat. Basically jibs are a PITA. I am not having one on any other boats I may build or acquire...balanced lug, cat yawl, etc. The jib drive power on an M17 is awesome but the big jib is a pain to tack, and I mostly sail lakes with shifty winds so there is a fair bit of tacking and just trimming. cheers, John On 10/12/19 1:20 PM, Henry Rodriguez wrote:
John,
I like swivel cams for the jib sheets because you can cross trim the sheet easily from the windward side. I’m currently using a pair of Ronstan RF58 cams with the bullseye removed and replaced with an eye strap holding a swivel block. https://www.westmarine.com/buy/ronstan--medium-bulls-eye-fairlead-cleat-for-...
I would prefer to use the Ronstan RF60 https://www.westmarine.com/buy/ronstan--ultimate-swivel-cam-base--3734183 because of the ball bearing base but the price is a killer.
The Nautos HT-4967 looks promising. https://nautos-usa.com/collections/swivel-bases-1/products/ht4967-swivel-bas...
If you do order anything from Nautos you can use discount code NAUTOSVIP for 5% off.
Henry
On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 2:09 PM John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
Thanks for this source Henry...they have some swivel base jib sheet block/cleat combos that are not bank-breakers. I'm looking for something to improve my jib sheet handling, they have some options I haven't seen from other mfgs.
cheers, John
On 10/12/19 8:19 AM, Henry Rodriguez wrote:
Also check https://nautos-usa.com/collections/swivel-bases-1
Similar quality, better prices, and the block is included!
Henry Monita
On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 9:23 AM Edward Epifani <edepifani@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well worth shopping online, these are pricey. West Marine most likely does have sub assemblies if you want to rebuild it. At least you can touch it and see it before you buy ( if you have one close). Sometimes WM is the last resort. I’m old enough to remember the smell of tar in real chandlerys. Now, the smell of polyethylene and nylon...but I love my little plastic boat. Ed
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 11, 2019, at 2:35 PM, Steve Trapp <stevetrapp@q.com> wrote:
If you can find a local chandlery, maybe they will be able to help you. I will suggest taking your broken block into the store to get as close a match as you can find. Much as I try to avoid the big box of boat stores, West Marine, they do carry an assortment of blocks. Steve M-15 # 335
-----Original Message----- From: Chris Smith Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:10 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm
Hello fellow sailors!
I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow.
Any suggestions for a new one?
Many thanks for your collective expertise!
Chris
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
-- Sent from Gmail Mobile
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
That is one reason I am building the SCAMP. Obviously a dinghy compared with an M17. But I am hopeful for the ease of rigging with a light non-stayed mast, and one simple sail without the jib. We shall see. Daniel Rich
On Oct 12, 2019, at 4:17 PM, John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
Exactly...trimming the jib sheets more quickly easily safely. Needs to be done a lot in swirly wind lake sailing.
Unfortunately they also add at least one more place the released jib sheet can hang up when tacking...
Why did you replace the bullseye with a swivel block? Do you have a pic?
I re-positioned the oversize cam cleats some prior owner had put on my M17 so that they are fairly close behind the winches and angle partially into the cockpit. So I can sheet in somewhat just by pulling thru them. But can't release them from across cockpit in most cases. And it's still not optimal, and better one side than the other due to winch rotation being same on both sides so the line comes off winch to cam at a better angle one side.
I know a guy with a Wharram Tiki 21 who actually set up his jib sheets to run to the windward side - that is, the active sheet is led via a few blocks cross-deck to the windward side. A bit easier to do without it getting in the way, on a cat.
Basically jibs are a PITA. I am not having one on any other boats I may build or acquire...balanced lug, cat yawl, etc.
The jib drive power on an M17 is awesome but the big jib is a pain to tack, and I mostly sail lakes with shifty winds so there is a fair bit of tacking and just trimming.
cheers, John
On 10/12/19 1:20 PM, Henry Rodriguez wrote:
John, I like swivel cams for the jib sheets because you can cross trim the sheet easily from the windward side. I’m currently using a pair of Ronstan RF58 cams with the bullseye removed and replaced with an eye strap holding a swivel block. https://www.westmarine.com/buy/ronstan--medium-bulls-eye-fairlead-cleat-for-... I would prefer to use the Ronstan RF60 https://www.westmarine.com/buy/ronstan--ultimate-swivel-cam-base--3734183 because of the ball bearing base but the price is a killer. The Nautos HT-4967 looks promising. https://nautos-usa.com/collections/swivel-bases-1/products/ht4967-swivel-bas... If you do order anything from Nautos you can use discount code NAUTOSVIP for 5% off. Henry On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 2:09 PM John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
Thanks for this source Henry...they have some swivel base jib sheet block/cleat combos that are not bank-breakers. I'm looking for something to improve my jib sheet handling, they have some options I haven't seen from other mfgs.
cheers, John
On 10/12/19 8:19 AM, Henry Rodriguez wrote:
Also check https://nautos-usa.com/collections/swivel-bases-1
Similar quality, better prices, and the block is included!
Henry Monita
On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 9:23 AM Edward Epifani <edepifani@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well worth shopping online, these are pricey. West Marine most likely does have sub assemblies if you want to rebuild it. At least you can touch it and see it before you buy ( if you have one close). Sometimes WM is the last resort. I’m old enough to remember the smell of tar in real chandlerys. Now, the smell of polyethylene and nylon...but I love my little plastic boat. Ed
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 11, 2019, at 2:35 PM, Steve Trapp <stevetrapp@q.com> wrote:
If you can find a local chandlery, maybe they will be able to help you. I will suggest taking your broken block into the store to get as close a match as you can find. Much as I try to avoid the big box of boat stores, West Marine, they do carry an assortment of blocks. Steve M-15 # 335
-----Original Message----- From: Chris Smith Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:10 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm
Hello fellow sailors!
I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow.
Any suggestions for a new one?
Many thanks for your collective expertise!
Chris
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
-- Sent from Gmail Mobile
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
I know what you mean about swirly wind lake sailing. Small bays mean tacking every few minutes. And the convoluted shorelines bend the wind in different directions every few hundred yards. I replaced the bullseye on the swivel cleat with a block with the idea of reducing friction for when I choose not to use the winches, which is most of the time. I already had the blocks and eye straps on hand so I figured I had nothing to lose. I’m not sure if it makes any real difference other than in my head. The cage type fairleads on the cleat are a bit overkill too since the cam itself swivels to line up with the direction of pull. Again, stuff I had on hand from Chiquita. https://nautos-usa.com/products/91185-fairlead-for-big-cam-cleat-91025-or-91... I’ll be replacing them with either the original Ronstan fairleads or simple eye straps like these. https://nautos-usa.com/collections/cam-cleats-fairleads/products/91056-fairl... I added a pair of aluminum Clamcleats on wedge risers a bit aft of the swivel cams since this picture was taken. I use them as sheet anchors for my drifter sheets, bypassing the swivel cams. I almost never use the winches while singlehanding with the jib or Genoa or even the storm jib. Just trim and release from the high side. If the wind is strong enough to require the extra power I take it as a sign that I have too much sail up. I sailed my VN23 cutter for many decades without sheet winches. I do use the winches with the drifter, hence the clamcleats. The drifter has its own sheets. I think Gary O has a cross sheeting setup on his M17 using turning blocks to cabin top winches. Gary? Henry On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 6:18 PM John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
Exactly...trimming the jib sheets more quickly easily safely. Needs to be done a lot in swirly wind lake sailing.
Unfortunately they also add at least one more place the released jib sheet can hang up when tacking...
Why did you replace the bullseye with a swivel block? Do you have a pic?
I re-positioned the oversize cam cleats some prior owner had put on my M17 so that they are fairly close behind the winches and angle partially into the cockpit. So I can sheet in somewhat just by pulling thru them. But can't release them from across cockpit in most cases. And it's still not optimal, and better one side than the other due to winch rotation being same on both sides so the line comes off winch to cam at a better angle one side.
I know a guy with a Wharram Tiki 21 who actually set up his jib sheets to run to the windward side - that is, the active sheet is led via a few blocks cross-deck to the windward side. A bit easier to do without it getting in the way, on a cat.
Basically jibs are a PITA. I am not having one on any other boats I may build or acquire...balanced lug, cat yawl, etc.
The jib drive power on an M17 is awesome but the big jib is a pain to tack, and I mostly sail lakes with shifty winds so there is a fair bit of tacking and just trimming.
cheers, John
On 10/12/19 1:20 PM, Henry Rodriguez wrote:
John,
I like swivel cams for the jib sheets because you can cross trim the sheet easily from the windward side. I’m currently using a pair of Ronstan RF58 cams with the bullseye removed and replaced with an eye strap holding a swivel block.
https://www.westmarine.com/buy/ronstan--medium-bulls-eye-fairlead-cleat-for-...
I would prefer to use the Ronstan RF60
https://www.westmarine.com/buy/ronstan--ultimate-swivel-cam-base--3734183
because of the ball bearing base but the price is a killer.
The Nautos HT-4967 looks promising.
https://nautos-usa.com/collections/swivel-bases-1/products/ht4967-swivel-bas...
If you do order anything from Nautos you can use discount code NAUTOSVIP for 5% off.
Henry
On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 2:09 PM John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net>
wrote:
Thanks for this source Henry...they have some swivel base jib sheet block/cleat combos that are not bank-breakers. I'm looking for something to improve my jib sheet handling, they have some options I haven't seen from other mfgs.
cheers, John
On 10/12/19 8:19 AM, Henry Rodriguez wrote:
Also check https://nautos-usa.com/collections/swivel-bases-1
Similar quality, better prices, and the block is included!
Henry Monita
On Sat, Oct 12, 2019 at 9:23 AM Edward Epifani <edepifani@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well worth shopping online, these are pricey. West Marine most likely does have sub assemblies if you want to rebuild it. At least you can touch
it
and see it before you buy ( if you have one close). Sometimes WM is the last resort. I’m old enough to remember the smell of tar in real chandlerys. Now, the smell of polyethylene and nylon...but I love my little plastic boat. Ed
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 11, 2019, at 2:35 PM, Steve Trapp <stevetrapp@q.com> wrote:
If you can find a local chandlery, maybe they will be able to help you. I will suggest taking your broken block into the store to get as close a match as you can find. Much as I try to avoid the big box of boat stores, West Marine, they do carry an assortment of blocks. Steve M-15 # 335
-----Original Message----- From: Chris Smith Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:10 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm
Hello fellow sailors!
I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow.
Any suggestions for a new one?
Many thanks for your collective expertise!
Chris
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
-- Sent from Gmail Mobile
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
-- Sent from Gmail Mobile
Thanks for the pic and other links, very helpful in thinking about my setup. In particular this... On 10/12/19 7:57 PM, Henry Rodriguez wrote:
I almost never use the winches while singlehanding with the jib or Genoa or even the storm jib. Just trim and release from the high side. If the wind is strong enough to require the extra power I take it as a sign that I have too much sail up.
I don't use the winches for winching, either...I put a couple wraps on them and then to the cleat, but I don't even keep a winch handle handy in the cockpit. If I need to sheet in and can't pull by hand, I just head up quickly to soften the jib, sheet in, fall off to course again. I am now thinking (out loud here), from your comment above, why do I bother with winches myself? Partly habit I think from sailing regularly on a couple of larger sailing club boats some years ago. There was crew (like me) to wo/man the winches, and they were necessary in anything beyond light air. Already, when I am in a particularly swirly spot, like getting in or out of a cove, I do skip the winch and just hand-hold the jib sheets for quick trim and/or tack while getting to steadier wind. Plus I now have a new higher cut cruising/reefing jib, so I have to put my jib sheet blocks considerably further aft than with the OEM 'deck sweeper' genoa. To get them to the winches without crossing over themselves I put a second set of blocks forward on toe rail to lead to winches. Which works, but adds another place for sheets to catch or tangle, and another couple pieces of hardware to keep track of. And the wraps on the winch put loops in the sheet that sometimes run to and jam in the block...especially when tacking in a hurry, throwing the sheet off the winch without un-looping the loops. So you've got me thinking - if the geometry works out right, I may be able to skip the winches AND the second set of leading blocks on toe rail, and just run the sheets from the aft blocks direct to the eye (or turning block of some kind like your customization) on swivel cams. I am gonna do some measuring and experimenting...that would be great if it works. Simpler to rig, and to use. Meanwhile I thought about how you replaced the eye with the stand-up block - the pic helps - it would reduce friction, especially when change of sheet angle at eye/block is large. Which it would be in my case, with the sheet coming from a block aft on the toe rail to the swivel on the coaming, and then across cockpit to me on the windward side. 75-85 degrees most of the time probably. The Ronstan unit with the stainless center in the nylon eye is probably less friction than the sharper bend around the wire eye on the Nautos unit (OK for small turning angles but not large ones). And a block like your setup is probably the least friction. Always something to improve... :-) cheers, John -- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
This is my current jib sheeting arrangement. Henry On Sun, Oct 13, 2019, 1:19 AM John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
Thanks for the pic and other links, very helpful in thinking about my setup. In particular this...
On 10/12/19 7:57 PM, Henry Rodriguez wrote:
I almost never use the winches while singlehanding with the jib or Genoa or even the storm jib. Just trim and release from the high side. If the wind is strong enough to require the extra power I take it as a sign that I have too much sail up.
I don't use the winches for winching, either...I put a couple wraps on them and then to the cleat, but I don't even keep a winch handle handy in the cockpit. If I need to sheet in and can't pull by hand, I just head up quickly to soften the jib, sheet in, fall off to course again.
I am now thinking (out loud here), from your comment above, why do I bother with winches myself? Partly habit I think from sailing regularly on a couple of larger sailing club boats some years ago. There was crew (like me) to wo/man the winches, and they were necessary in anything beyond light air.
Already, when I am in a particularly swirly spot, like getting in or out of a cove, I do skip the winch and just hand-hold the jib sheets for quick trim and/or tack while getting to steadier wind.
Plus I now have a new higher cut cruising/reefing jib, so I have to put my jib sheet blocks considerably further aft than with the OEM 'deck sweeper' genoa. To get them to the winches without crossing over themselves I put a second set of blocks forward on toe rail to lead to winches. Which works, but adds another place for sheets to catch or tangle, and another couple pieces of hardware to keep track of.
And the wraps on the winch put loops in the sheet that sometimes run to and jam in the block...especially when tacking in a hurry, throwing the sheet off the winch without un-looping the loops.
So you've got me thinking - if the geometry works out right, I may be able to skip the winches AND the second set of leading blocks on toe rail, and just run the sheets from the aft blocks direct to the eye (or turning block of some kind like your customization) on swivel cams.
I am gonna do some measuring and experimenting...that would be great if it works. Simpler to rig, and to use.
Meanwhile I thought about how you replaced the eye with the stand-up block - the pic helps - it would reduce friction, especially when change of sheet angle at eye/block is large. Which it would be in my case, with the sheet coming from a block aft on the toe rail to the swivel on the coaming, and then across cockpit to me on the windward side. 75-85 degrees most of the time probably.
The Ronstan unit with the stainless center in the nylon eye is probably less friction than the sharper bend around the wire eye on the Nautos unit (OK for small turning angles but not large ones). And a block like your setup is probably the least friction.
Always something to improve... :-)
cheers, John
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
When I changed ours, I shamelessly copied Daniel Rich’s set up. Monty15Mike
On Oct 12, 2019, at 10:23 AM, Edward Epifani <edepifani@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well worth shopping online, these are pricey. West Marine most likely does have sub assemblies if you want to rebuild it. At least you can touch it and see it before you buy ( if you have one close). Sometimes WM is the last resort. I’m old enough to remember the smell of tar in real chandlerys. Now, the smell of polyethylene and nylon...but I love my little plastic boat. Ed
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 11, 2019, at 2:35 PM, Steve Trapp <stevetrapp@q.com> wrote:
If you can find a local chandlery, maybe they will be able to help you. I will suggest taking your broken block into the store to get as close a match as you can find. Much as I try to avoid the big box of boat stores, West Marine, they do carry an assortment of blocks. Steve M-15 # 335
-----Original Message----- From: Chris Smith Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:10 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm
Hello fellow sailors!
I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow.
Any suggestions for a new one?
Many thanks for your collective expertise!
Chris
Ha! Thanks. No shame in that! For my SCAMP that is nearing completion I am going with a similar setup, but this time trying the Ronstan versions as they are cheaper, and just for the fun of it. The swivel cam is the RONRF7 <https://www.mauriprosailing.com/us/product/ronstan-swivelling-mainsheet-cam-unit.html>, and the ratchet block is the Series 40 <https://www.mauriprosailing.com/us/product/ronstan-series-40-rtm-orbitblockmanual-single-swivel.html>. These cost a bit less than the Harken versions. I have them now, and they are really nice. Note that the ratchet block is a bit small, and smaller than the similar Harken version. Accommodates 9 mm line, so if your mainsheet is larger than that, could be a problem for that ratchet block. My main for the SCAMP is 3/8 inch, so fits fine when I checked. But I really love that kind of control. Just feels right in the hands. Daniel SCAMP #330
On Oct 12, 2019, at 9:44 AM, Mike Z <speedernut2@gmail.com> wrote:
When I changed ours, I shamelessly copied Daniel Rich’s set up.
Monty15Mike
On Oct 12, 2019, at 10:23 AM, Edward Epifani <edepifani@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well worth shopping online, these are pricey. West Marine most likely does have sub assemblies if you want to rebuild it. At least you can touch it and see it before you buy ( if you have one close). Sometimes WM is the last resort. I’m old enough to remember the smell of tar in real chandlerys. Now, the smell of polyethylene and nylon...but I love my little plastic boat. Ed
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 11, 2019, at 2:35 PM, Steve Trapp <stevetrapp@q.com> wrote:
If you can find a local chandlery, maybe they will be able to help you. I will suggest taking your broken block into the store to get as close a match as you can find. Much as I try to avoid the big box of boat stores, West Marine, they do carry an assortment of blocks. Steve M-15 # 335
-----Original Message----- From: Chris Smith Sent: Friday, October 11, 2019 2:10 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: need new mainsheet ratchet block & cam arm
Hello fellow sailors!
I have an older m15 that needs a new mainsheet block. The current one attaches to the step in front of the cabin (as most do) but the bearing housing has split. I epoxied it back together but it has started to split again. It still works, but it sure makes me nervous in a blow.
Any suggestions for a new one?
Many thanks for your collective expertise!
Chris
participants (9)
-
casioqv＠usermail.com -
Chris Smith -
Daniel Rich -
Dave Scobie -
Edward Epifani -
Henry Rodriguez -
John Schinnerer -
Mike Z -
Steve Trapp