Sleeping on a M17 when there's any wave action is an "acquired" skill. As in when you've acquired enough exhaustion, you'll finally get a little bit of fitful sleep. I guarantee 3 to 4 foot waves will keep you up all night. Not only from the noise (Which some sailors claim is "soothing". I'm from the "it's annoying" school of thought.), but also from the tossing and lurching, which I had the misfortune of enduring one very windy night anchored in Winter Cove in the Gulf Islands. The pitching would be bad enough, but throw in an occasional sideways lurch as the boat sails side to side on her anchor and there is no "rhythm" for your body to adjust to. I have an anchor riding sail, as Tim mentioned trying, and have not found that it makes a great deal of difference. Mounting it on the backstay above the bridle guys puts it too high and too far forward on such a short boat to be very effective. Perhaps another mounting method would help. I've also tried moving the anchor rode to the winch eye down on the bow, rigging a bridle from both bow cleats, raising the centerboard and/or the rudder, all to no avail. It's not a real bad swing on the M17, but no swing at all would be better. Sleeping in the cockpit is much quieter than sleeping inside. The "echo chamber" effect is gone, and the cockpit seats are nice and long, although a little narrow. I lined the sides of the V berth with 1/4" closed cell foam and antimicrobial headliner material over that to try to quiet the "chamber", but it only helped a little. The quarter berth is not fit for man nor beast. I'm slim enough to get my legs down there, but unless you're willing to spend the entire night motionless on your back, without bending your legs or rolling onto your side, it feels like a coffin. Nevertheless, I love cruising on my M17 and sleeping aboard. You just want to find a nice peaceful anchorage to get a good nights sleep. Larry Yake M17 #200 CornDog "In a power boat you get there faster, but in a sailboat you're already there." On Sun, 27 Apr 2008 17:53:26 -0400 (EDT) Joe Murphy <seagray@embarqmail.com> writes:
Tim, Thanks for the info. Do you have a roller at the bow for the anchor rode or do you use one of the chalks? I was anchored out at the Fort Macon light house one weekend and I watched a couple next to me doing exactly what you described. The next morning we got together for coffee and he said he was going to have a small roller put right off the tip of the bow. He emailed me later and told me that it solved 90% of his problem.
Sleeping... Is it possible to sleep in the starboard berth?
Thanks again, Joe
----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim Diebert" <tim@timtone.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 12:45:23 PM (GMT-0500) America/New_York Subject: Re: M_Boats: Comfort and Joy
The stubbiness of the 17 means it will be a lot more frisky in any kind of lumpy water of course. I find that the lapstrakes...the faux laps....tend to make a lot of little noises with even the slightest water action. I drives me wacky to tell you the truth. Another thing I have noticed about the 17 is that she tends to 'sail' when on the hook. Rather than nose to wind she tends to wander back and forth within a 45 degree quadrant. Because of this she can get a slight sideways roll going at times. I am going to try a small riding sail when at anchor for night. My wife an I can both sleep in the V berth....simutaineously. But it is a bit tight. We decided to work on the cockpit tent more and rig a big berth in the cockpit in the future. One in the V berth, one outside. The tent prototype is partway done. When I cruise by myself it is perfectly roomy and suitable for many days no problem. I have also spent over a week with my wife on the boat.....and we are still married...though she has told me it won't be happening again. ~:0)
Cheers, Tim D in BC.
-----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Joe Murphy Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2008 6:05 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: M_Boats: Comfort and Joy
I'm looking at the M17 as a next boat and have taken note on how seaworthy they are. In addition, I'm wondering what you all have to say about
anchoring out. I like doing overnighters in and around the Beaufort NC area
which means a lot of 2-3 foot seas. My experiences have been aboard a NorSea 27.
Thanks much, Joe
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Hahahahaha. Sounds like a night I spent in a poorly chosen spot last Fall. A front rolled in and I was sailing so fast and making great distance that I decided to stay out and anchor. I opted for a permanent mooring over a more sheltered location. Bad choice. Same deal. I actually had to wedge myself between compression post and the stbd ceiling with anything soft. I woke up more than once because I was rolled far enough to knock my coconut on the post. I spent a lot of time staring at the deck head. I tried to read but got pissed off with that too. At one point I slid open the hatch to check lines and it was bloody snowing.....and howling. The minute it was light enough I slipped that spot and started for home. Sailed hard for about an hour....then the wind died and a couple of hours later it was sunny and still like a mill pond. Had to motor all day to get home. -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Larry E Yake Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 7:32 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Comfort and Joy Sleeping on a M17 when there's any wave action is an "acquired" skill. As in when you've acquired enough exhaustion, you'll finally get a little bit of fitful sleep. I guarantee 3 to 4 foot waves will keep you up all night. Not only from the noise (Which some sailors claim is "soothing". I'm from the "it's annoying" school of thought.), but also from the tossing and lurching, which I had the misfortune of enduring one very windy night anchored in Winter Cove in the Gulf Islands. The pitching would be bad enough, but throw in an occasional sideways lurch as the boat sails side to side on her anchor and there is no "rhythm" for your body to adjust to. I have an anchor riding sail, as Tim mentioned trying, and have not found that it makes a great deal of difference. Mounting it on the backstay above the bridle guys puts it too high and too far forward on such a short boat to be very effective. Perhaps another mounting method would help. I've also tried moving the anchor rode to the winch eye down on the bow, rigging a bridle from both bow cleats, raising the centerboard and/or the rudder, all to no avail. It's not a real bad swing on the M17, but no swing at all would be better. Sleeping in the cockpit is much quieter than sleeping inside. The "echo chamber" effect is gone, and the cockpit seats are nice and long, although a little narrow. I lined the sides of the V berth with 1/4" closed cell foam and antimicrobial headliner material over that to try to quiet the "chamber", but it only helped a little. The quarter berth is not fit for man nor beast. I'm slim enough to get my legs down there, but unless you're willing to spend the entire night motionless on your back, without bending your legs or rolling onto your side, it feels like a coffin. Nevertheless, I love cruising on my M17 and sleeping aboard. You just want to find a nice peaceful anchorage to get a good nights sleep. Larry Yake M17 #200 CornDog "In a power boat you get there faster, but in a sailboat you're already there." On Sun, 27 Apr 2008 17:53:26 -0400 (EDT) Joe Murphy <seagray@embarqmail.com> writes:
Tim, Thanks for the info. Do you have a roller at the bow for the anchor rode or do you use one of the chalks? I was anchored out at the Fort Macon light house one weekend and I watched a couple next to me doing exactly what you described. The next morning we got together for coffee and he said he was going to have a small roller put right off the tip of the bow. He emailed me later and told me that it solved 90% of his problem.
Sleeping... Is it possible to sleep in the starboard berth?
Thanks again, Joe
----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim Diebert" <tim@timtone.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 12:45:23 PM (GMT-0500) America/New_York Subject: Re: M_Boats: Comfort and Joy
The stubbiness of the 17 means it will be a lot more frisky in any kind of lumpy water of course. I find that the lapstrakes...the faux laps....tend to make a lot of little noises with even the slightest water action. I drives me wacky to tell you the truth. Another thing I have noticed about the 17 is that she tends to 'sail' when on the hook. Rather than nose to wind she tends to wander back and forth within a 45 degree quadrant. Because of this she can get a slight sideways roll going at times. I am going to try a small riding sail when at anchor for night. My wife an I can both sleep in the V berth....simutaineously. But it is a bit tight. We decided to work on the cockpit tent more and rig a big berth in the cockpit in the future. One in the V berth, one outside. The tent prototype is partway done. When I cruise by myself it is perfectly roomy and suitable for many days no problem. I have also spent over a week with my wife on the boat.....and we are still married...though she has told me it won't be happening again. ~:0)
Cheers, Tim D in BC.
-----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Joe Murphy Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2008 6:05 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: M_Boats: Comfort and Joy
I'm looking at the M17 as a next boat and have taken note on how seaworthy they are. In addition, I'm wondering what you all have to say about
anchoring out. I like doing overnighters in and around the Beaufort NC area
which means a lot of 2-3 foot seas. My experiences have been aboard a NorSea 27.
Thanks much, Joe
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
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Somebody had a bow roller once I remember. Whoever bought Riceman's boat from MT. They removed it I remember. Who was that? Was that you Todd? t
Yes, that was Busca that had a bow roller. I just didn't feel the need for it, so I took it off. On the foredeck I have two cleats side-by-side and run the anchor rode through a chock at the gunwale and over to a cleat. Two cleats are nice if you raft up, as one gets full pretty quickly. Tod -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Tom Smith Sent: Monday, April 28, 2008 11:07 AM To: 'For and about Montgomery Sailboats' Subject: Re: M_Boats: Comfort and Joy Somebody had a bow roller once I remember. Whoever bought Riceman's boat from MT. They removed it I remember. Who was that? Was that you Todd? t _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.23.5/1400 - Release Date: 4/27/2008 9:39 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.23.5/1400 - Release Date: 4/27/2008 9:39 AM
Larry, Any of these sexy round hulls designed by Lyle Hess and fellow travelers gets lift off the sides when the wind blows over them, so there will be some interesting nocturnal motion. Admittedly, my experience has been with the NS 27 that does some crazy stuff when the wind, tide, and swells come from different directions. My standard solution has been to anchor bow to the waves with fore and aft rodes cinched up tight, and ignore the wind. The current has an effect, but these shoal-draft boats tend to tilt a few degrees and stabilize (unless you have a crazy 15 knot tide, where maybe you should not be anchoring). If you just ride on a bow anchor in nasty conditions, you will understand why the Nor'Sea aft cabin, for example, has carpet to the ceiling. All that said, I have watched numerous fin-keeled ugh boats rock almost to the spreaders in similar conditions, so don't single out the Montgomerys. Anchoring out in wind and waves is a last resort, when you can't kind find a more protected spot. Tom Jenkins M17 Scintilla -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Larry E Yake Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 7:32 PM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: M_Boats: Comfort and Joy Sleeping on a M17 when there's any wave action is an "acquired" skill. As in when you've acquired enough exhaustion, you'll finally get a little bit of fitful sleep. I guarantee 3 to 4 foot waves will keep you up all night. Not only from the noise (Which some sailors claim is "soothing". I'm from the "it's annoying" school of thought.), but also from the tossing and lurching, which I had the misfortune of enduring one very windy night anchored in Winter Cove in the Gulf Islands. The pitching would be bad enough, but throw in an occasional sideways lurch as the boat sails side to side on her anchor and there is no "rhythm" for your body to adjust to. I have an anchor riding sail, as Tim mentioned trying, and have not found that it makes a great deal of difference. Mounting it on the backstay above the bridle guys puts it too high and too far forward on such a short boat to be very effective. Perhaps another mounting method would help. I've also tried moving the anchor rode to the winch eye down on the bow, rigging a bridle from both bow cleats, raising the centerboard and/or the rudder, all to no avail. It's not a real bad swing on the M17, but no swing at all would be better. Sleeping in the cockpit is much quieter than sleeping inside. The "echo chamber" effect is gone, and the cockpit seats are nice and long, although a little narrow. I lined the sides of the V berth with 1/4" closed cell foam and antimicrobial headliner material over that to try to quiet the "chamber", but it only helped a little. The quarter berth is not fit for man nor beast. I'm slim enough to get my legs down there, but unless you're willing to spend the entire night motionless on your back, without bending your legs or rolling onto your side, it feels like a coffin. Nevertheless, I love cruising on my M17 and sleeping aboard. You just want to find a nice peaceful anchorage to get a good nights sleep. Larry Yake M17 #200 CornDog "In a power boat you get there faster, but in a sailboat you're already there." On Sun, 27 Apr 2008 17:53:26 -0400 (EDT) Joe Murphy <seagray@embarqmail.com> writes:
Tim, Thanks for the info. Do you have a roller at the bow for the anchor rode or do you use one of the chalks? I was anchored out at the Fort Macon light house one weekend and I watched a couple next to me doing exactly what you described. The next morning we got together for coffee and he said he was going to have a small roller put right off the tip of the bow. He emailed me later and told me that it solved 90% of his problem.
Sleeping... Is it possible to sleep in the starboard berth?
Thanks again, Joe
----- Original Message ----- From: "Tim Diebert" <tim@timtone.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Sunday, April 27, 2008 12:45:23 PM (GMT-0500) America/New_York Subject: Re: M_Boats: Comfort and Joy
The stubbiness of the 17 means it will be a lot more frisky in any kind of lumpy water of course. I find that the lapstrakes...the faux laps....tend to make a lot of little noises with even the slightest water action. I drives me wacky to tell you the truth. Another thing I have noticed about the 17 is that she tends to 'sail' when on the hook. Rather than nose to wind she tends to wander back and forth within a 45 degree quadrant. Because of this she can get a slight sideways roll going at times. I am going to try a small riding sail when at anchor for night. My wife an I can both sleep in the V berth....simutaineously. But it is a bit tight. We decided to work on the cockpit tent more and rig a big berth in the cockpit in the future. One in the V berth, one outside. The tent prototype is partway done. When I cruise by myself it is perfectly roomy and suitable for many days no problem. I have also spent over a week with my wife on the boat.....and we are still married...though she has told me it won't be happening again. ~:0)
Cheers, Tim D in BC.
-----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Joe Murphy Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2008 6:05 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: M_Boats: Comfort and Joy
I'm looking at the M17 as a next boat and have taken note on how seaworthy they are. In addition, I'm wondering what you all have to say about
anchoring out. I like doing overnighters in and around the Beaufort NC area
which means a lot of 2-3 foot seas. My experiences have been aboard a NorSea 27.
Thanks much, Joe
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
-- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.524 / Virus Database: 269.23.5/1399 - Release Date: 4/26/2008 2:17 PM
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participants (5)
-
htmills＠zoominternet.net -
Larry E Yake -
Tim Diebert -
Tom Jenkins -
Tom Smith