I think we are all very interested in the story of a Montgomery 15 going over but am not sure we are all using the same language. I thought to "turn turtle" meant for a boat to turn completely upside down in the water - keel straight up, mast straight down - and stay that way, sort of like a turtle that is rolled onto its back. I get the impression many of us are not talking about this situation in this discussion when we say "turn turtle". I can easily imagine a boat like a Montgomery 15 being knocked down, loosing its crew, and the cabin filling with water as a result, but that process not resulting in the keel of the boat sticking straight up in the air for an extended period of time. I would imagine the swamped - or at least semi-swamped - boat may still want to right itself over time unless sail, wave, or other forces are acting to keep it in some other orientation. This situation would seem more like a "capsize" to me. Just doing quick internet searches did not turn up precise definitions for "turn turtle" and "capsize" so these very well may be my own definitions. In any event, I wonder if we are all talking about the same thing when we use the term "turn turtle". David GrahBishop CaliforniaMontgomery 15 - Sky
The guy said the boat was upside down with the mast sticking straight down. Bill Ahrens W. A. Ahrens & Associates
On Jun 25, 2015, at 11:53 AM, David Grah via montgomery_boats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote:
I think we are all very interested in the story of a Montgomery 15 going over but am not sure we are all using the same language. I thought to "turn turtle" meant for a boat to turn completely upside down in the water - keel straight up, mast straight down - and stay that way, sort of like a turtle that is rolled onto its back. I get the impression many of us are not talking about this situation in this discussion when we say "turn turtle". I can easily imagine a boat like a Montgomery 15 being knocked down, loosing its crew, and the cabin filling with water as a result, but that process not resulting in the keel of the boat sticking straight up in the air for an extended period of time. I would imagine the swamped - or at least semi-swamped - boat may still want to right itself over time unless sail, wave, or other forces are acting to keep it in some other orientation. This situation would seem more like a "capsize" to me. Just doing quick internet searches did not turn up precise definitions for "turn turtle" and "capsize" so these very well may be my own definitions. In any event, I wonder if we are all talking about the same thing when we use the term "turn turtle". David GrahBishop CaliforniaMontgomery 15 - Sky
Yup. Turtle is upside down, mast down, keel up. That is what happened to Robert. If you missed it he gave a follow up excellent and harrowing description, and sure enough, boat completely upside down with him sitting on a fairly stable hull waiting for help! Daniel On 6/25/2015 11:53 AM, David Grah via montgomery_boats wrote:
I think we are all very interested in the story of a Montgomery 15 going over but am not sure we are all using the same language. I thought to "turn turtle" meant for a boat to turn completely upside down in the water - keel straight up, mast straight down - and stay that way, sort of like a turtle that is rolled onto its back. I get the impression many of us are not talking about this situation in this discussion when we say "turn turtle". I can easily imagine a boat like a Montgomery 15 being knocked down, loosing its crew, and the cabin filling with water as a result, but that process not resulting in the keel of the boat sticking straight up in the air for an extended period of time. I would imagine the swamped - or at least semi-swamped - boat may still want to right itself over time unless sail, wave, or other forces are acting to keep it in some other orientation. This situation would seem more like a "capsize" to me. Just doing quick internet searches did not turn up precise definitions for "turn turtle" and "capsize" so these very well may be my own definitions. In any event, I wonder if we are all talking about the same thing when we use the term "turn turtle". David GrahBishop CaliforniaMontgomery 15 - Sky
this is 'turn turtle' or 'turtled' or 'inverted' - http://i.ytimg.com/vi/gEWBWxcUcJc/hqdefault.jpg this is a 'capsize' or a 'knockdown' - http://i.ytimg.com/vi/w7w1MZ2DNAk/hqdefault.jpg -- :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com On Thu, Jun 25, 2015 at 12:53 PM, David Grah via montgomery_boats < montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> wrote:
I think we are all very interested in the story of a Montgomery 15 going over but am not sure we are all using the same language. I thought to "turn turtle" meant for a boat to turn completely upside down in the water - keel straight up, mast straight down - and stay that way, sort of like a turtle that is rolled onto its back. I get the impression many of us are not talking about this situation in this discussion when we say "turn turtle". I can easily imagine a boat like a Montgomery 15 being knocked down, loosing its crew, and the cabin filling with water as a result, but that process not resulting in the keel of the boat sticking straight up in the air for an extended period of time. I would imagine the swamped - or at least semi-swamped - boat may still want to right itself over time unless sail, wave, or other forces are acting to keep it in some other orientation. This situation would seem more like a "capsize" to me. Just doing quick internet searches did not turn up precise definitions for "turn turtle" and "capsize" so these very well may be my own definitions. In any event, I wonder if we are all talking about the same thing when we use the term "turn turtle". David GrahBishop CaliforniaMontgomery 15 - Sky
participants (4)
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billahrens＠comcast.net -
Daniel Rich -
Dave Scobie -
David Grah