Hello all, I'm excited to be the new owner of a 1984 Montgomery 15. I live in East Granby, CT and usually sail out of Guilford on Long Island Sound. I have yet to get out for a sail but am hoping to be able sometime in October. Does anyone know if 1984 M-15's have steel ballast in the keel, and whether the centerboard is fiberglass. Mine is well and truly stuck in the up position despite a couple sessions of doing everything I could think of to lower it, and I'd like to understand better what I'm up against. Also, is it allowed to post a boat for sale in this group? (Not the M-15, but my last boat) Thanks very much. David Gilroy
david: welcome to the group! yes, your 84' has both steel centerboard and keel ballast. my M15 was also an '84. what is your hull number? the centerboard is a fiberglass 'shell' with the steel punchings 'encapsulated' in resin. the keel is also filled with steel punchings encapsulated in resin. if you take off the forward v-berth bin (aka 'hatch') cover by removing the screws you will find just forward of the porta-potti bulkhead a 'hump' of steel, fiberglass and resin. this is the 'balance' hump to keep the boat on her lines (the lead M15s don't need this hump as their ballast fits entirely within the keel). if the centerboard will not move when you are in water you need to get to a boat yard and have the boat lifted and put safely 'on the hard' high enough you can get under the hull and look at the situation. get the bottom of the keel at least 2-3 off the ground so you can move the centerboard up/down and remove the board. a boat yard can give suggestion on getting the board unstuck ... there are also many ideas available here ... such as running a thin piece of metal around the board to see if anything is stuck/jammed between the board and trunk. with the board out it will be obvious if water has entered the board and caused it to rust and swell. with the board out look up into the centerboard trunk. look at the walls of the trunk for bulges. if there is anything that looks out of 'true' the swelling may be coming from the keel ballast. you can also look at the keel when the boat is on the trailer. the M15 has a fairly uniform foil/wing shape. any odd bulges again point towards the keel ballast rusting. now ... with the above said the centerboard may just be jammed in place with some small rocks or even the centerboard pendent being jammed between the board and truck wall (can happen if the boat was put on the trailer with the centerboard down or in a grounding that caused the board to rotate into the up position). from the above take a look at your M15 and report back. many more ideas on how you can proceed. i'll be at the annapolis sailboat show 6-10 october, '11, with a Sage 17. after the show i intend to go for a sail near annapolis, then make near NY city stop, and the hudson valley for another sail. :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 - SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com :: Sage Marine - www.sagemarine.com --- On Wed, 9/28/11, David Gilroy <dbakergilroy@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Hello all,
I'm excited to be the new owner of a 1984 Montgomery 15. I live in East Granby, CT and usually sail out of Guilford on Long Island Sound. I have yet to get out for a sail but am hoping to be able sometime in October. Does anyone know if 1984 M-15's have steel ballast in the keel, and whether the centerboard is fiberglass. Mine is well and truly stuck in the up position despite a couple sessions of doing everything I could think of to lower it, and I'd like to understand better what I'm up against.
Also, is it allowed to post a boat for sale in this group? (Not the M-15, but my last boat)
Thanks very much.
David Gilroy
Dear Dave, Thank you very much for your taking the time for such a thorough reply. It's very helpful. I'm going to try working on it while it's on the trailer and if that doesn't work I'll eventually give up and hand it over to a boatyard. Happy sailing! Dave On Sep 29, 2011, at 1:18 AM, W David Scobie wrote:
david:
welcome to the group!
yes, your 84' has both steel centerboard and keel ballast. my M15 was also an '84. what is your hull number?
the centerboard is a fiberglass 'shell' with the steel punchings 'encapsulated' in resin. the keel is also filled with steel punchings encapsulated in resin. if you take off the forward v-berth bin (aka 'hatch') cover by removing the screws you will find just forward of the porta-potti bulkhead a 'hump' of steel, fiberglass and resin. this is the 'balance' hump to keep the boat on her lines (the lead M15s don't need this hump as their ballast fits entirely within the keel).
if the centerboard will not move when you are in water you need to get to a boat yard and have the boat lifted and put safely 'on the hard' high enough you can get under the hull and look at the situation. get the bottom of the keel at least 2-3 off the ground so you can move the centerboard up/down and remove the board.
a boat yard can give suggestion on getting the board unstuck ... there are also many ideas available here ... such as running a thin piece of metal around the board to see if anything is stuck/jammed between the board and trunk.
with the board out it will be obvious if water has entered the board and caused it to rust and swell.
with the board out look up into the centerboard trunk. look at the walls of the trunk for bulges. if there is anything that looks out of 'true' the swelling may be coming from the keel ballast. you can also look at the keel when the boat is on the trailer. the M15 has a fairly uniform foil/wing shape. any odd bulges again point towards the keel ballast rusting.
now ... with the above said the centerboard may just be jammed in place with some small rocks or even the centerboard pendent being jammed between the board and truck wall (can happen if the boat was put on the trailer with the centerboard down or in a grounding that caused the board to rotate into the up position).
from the above take a look at your M15 and report back. many more ideas on how you can proceed.
i'll be at the annapolis sailboat show 6-10 october, '11, with a Sage 17. after the show i intend to go for a sail near annapolis, then make near NY city stop, and the hudson valley for another sail.
:: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 - SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com :: Sage Marine - www.sagemarine.com
--- On Wed, 9/28/11, David Gilroy <dbakergilroy@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Hello all,
I'm excited to be the new owner of a 1984 Montgomery 15. I live in East Granby, CT and usually sail out of Guilford on Long Island Sound. I have yet to get out for a sail but am hoping to be able sometime in October. Does anyone know if 1984 M-15's have steel ballast in the keel, and whether the centerboard is fiberglass. Mine is well and truly stuck in the up position despite a couple sessions of doing everything I could think of to lower it, and I'd like to understand better what I'm up against.
Also, is it allowed to post a boat for sale in this group? (Not the M-15, but my last boat)
Thanks very much.
David Gilroy
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Dear David, In case I didn't reply to you, here's my reply. Thanks! I appreciate very much the thoroughness of your reply. Having attempted trying all this on my own, I'm going to follow your suggestion and let a boatyard have at it. Will let you know the outcome. Thanks again. Best regards, Dave On Sep 29, 2011, at 1:18 AM, W David Scobie wrote:
david:
welcome to the group!
yes, your 84' has both steel centerboard and keel ballast. my M15 was also an '84. what is your hull number?
the centerboard is a fiberglass 'shell' with the steel punchings 'encapsulated' in resin. the keel is also filled with steel punchings encapsulated in resin. if you take off the forward v-berth bin (aka 'hatch') cover by removing the screws you will find just forward of the porta-potti bulkhead a 'hump' of steel, fiberglass and resin. this is the 'balance' hump to keep the boat on her lines (the lead M15s don't need this hump as their ballast fits entirely within the keel).
if the centerboard will not move when you are in water you need to get to a boat yard and have the boat lifted and put safely 'on the hard' high enough you can get under the hull and look at the situation. get the bottom of the keel at least 2-3 off the ground so you can move the centerboard up/down and remove the board.
a boat yard can give suggestion on getting the board unstuck ... there are also many ideas available here ... such as running a thin piece of metal around the board to see if anything is stuck/jammed between the board and trunk.
with the board out it will be obvious if water has entered the board and caused it to rust and swell.
with the board out look up into the centerboard trunk. look at the walls of the trunk for bulges. if there is anything that looks out of 'true' the swelling may be coming from the keel ballast. you can also look at the keel when the boat is on the trailer. the M15 has a fairly uniform foil/wing shape. any odd bulges again point towards the keel ballast rusting.
now ... with the above said the centerboard may just be jammed in place with some small rocks or even the centerboard pendent being jammed between the board and truck wall (can happen if the boat was put on the trailer with the centerboard down or in a grounding that caused the board to rotate into the up position).
from the above take a look at your M15 and report back. many more ideas on how you can proceed.
i'll be at the annapolis sailboat show 6-10 october, '11, with a Sage 17. after the show i intend to go for a sail near annapolis, then make near NY city stop, and the hudson valley for another sail.
:: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 - SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com :: Sage Marine - www.sagemarine.com
--- On Wed, 9/28/11, David Gilroy <dbakergilroy@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Hello all,
I'm excited to be the new owner of a 1984 Montgomery 15. I live in East Granby, CT and usually sail out of Guilford on Long Island Sound. I have yet to get out for a sail but am hoping to be able sometime in October. Does anyone know if 1984 M-15's have steel ballast in the keel, and whether the centerboard is fiberglass. Mine is well and truly stuck in the up position despite a couple sessions of doing everything I could think of to lower it, and I'd like to understand better what I'm up against.
Also, is it allowed to post a boat for sale in this group? (Not the M-15, but my last boat)
Thanks very much.
David Gilroy
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Welcome David, the M-15 is a sweet boat. The good thing about the center board (silver lining view) is that the 15 center board is pretty light and manageable. I had mine out of my 1980(?) M-15 and it is fairly light. Once you get it out. You can see some of the info on center boards on the montgomery photo site and MSOG (not the band). Robbin On 9/28/2011 10:41 PM, David Gilroy wrote:
Hello all,
I'm excited to be the new owner of a 1984 Montgomery 15. I live in East Granby, CT and usually sail out of Guilford on Long Island Sound. I have yet to get out for a sail but am hoping to be able sometime in October. Does anyone know if 1984 M-15's have steel ballast in the keel, and whether the centerboard is fiberglass. Mine is well and truly stuck in the up position despite a couple sessions of doing everything I could think of to lower it, and I'd like to understand better what I'm up against.
Also, is it allowed to post a boat for sale in this group? (Not the M-15, but my last boat)
Thanks very much.
David Gilroy
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When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
Dear Robbin, Thanks very much for the encouragement! And I'll have to get up to speed on the MSOG band. Dave On Sep 29, 2011, at 8:29 AM, robbin roddewig wrote:
Welcome David, the M-15 is a sweet boat. The good thing about the center board (silver lining view) is that the 15 center board is pretty light and manageable. I had mine out of my 1980(?) M-15 and it is fairly light. Once you get it out. You can see some of the info on center boards on the montgomery photo site and MSOG (not the band).
Robbin
On 9/28/2011 10:41 PM, David Gilroy wrote:
Hello all,
I'm excited to be the new owner of a 1984 Montgomery 15. I live in East Granby, CT and usually sail out of Guilford on Long Island Sound. I have yet to get out for a sail but am hoping to be able sometime in October. Does anyone know if 1984 M-15's have steel ballast in the keel, and whether the centerboard is fiberglass. Mine is well and truly stuck in the up position despite a couple sessions of doing everything I could think of to lower it, and I'd like to understand better what I'm up against.
Also, is it allowed to post a boat for sale in this group? (Not the M-15, but my last boat)
Thanks very much.
David Gilroy
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When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
Hi all, So it appears that my new towing beast has an electric brake control. My M-23 dual axle trailer had drum brakes which are a loss (literally the right side has no parts anymore). The brake assemblies need to be replaced. I assumed before buying the beast that this would means surge hydraulic brakes. Maybe discs. But I would like any advice you folks have on going electric (trailer super store has very reasonably priced whole drum brake assemblies) versus hydraulic and disc versus drum. Since the current rusted assembly is drum would putting a whole new drum assembly on be easier? Has anyone done this kind of rehab to trailer brakes? I do car brakes of all kinds but usually am not removing everything, well sometimes but I was much younger then. Would it be a poor idea (as I assume it would) to just rely on the F-350 brakes? Hope to see some of you at Annapolis. Even considering the Good Old Boat Regatta. Robbin M-23 The Other Woman, M-10 Tonka
Robbin, "Would it be a poor idea (as I assume it would) to just rely on the F-350 brakes?" An M-23 is heavy enough that it wouldn't be legal in any state that I know of without trailer brakes. Going without leaves you wide open to pretty serious liability issues if something goes wrong. I've had many trailers over the years that have had both electric and surge brakes. I like electric better. Much more controllable. Rik Sandberg On Thu, Sep 29, 2011 at 7:39 AM, robbin roddewig < robbin.roddewig@verizon.net> wrote:
Hi all, So it appears that my new towing beast has an electric brake control. My M-23 dual axle trailer had drum brakes which are a loss (literally the right side has no parts anymore). The brake assemblies need to be replaced. I assumed before buying the beast that this would means surge hydraulic brakes. Maybe discs. But I would like any advice you folks have on going electric (trailer super store has very reasonably priced whole drum brake assemblies) versus hydraulic and disc versus drum. Since the current rusted assembly is drum would putting a whole new drum assembly on be easier? Has anyone done this kind of rehab to trailer brakes? I do car brakes of all kinds but usually am not removing everything, well sometimes but I was much younger then. Would it be a poor idea (as I assume it would) to just rely on the F-350 brakes?
Hope to see some of you at Annapolis. Even considering the Good Old Boat Regatta.
Robbin M-23 The Other Woman, M-10 Tonka
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Rik and Robbin, On one occasion I started down a steep 9 mile grade with my 5 ton Nor'Sea 27 rig, not knowing that the surge brake reservoir was dry. Fortunately, my Ford F250 has a manual transmission, so I was able to pump the brakes and shift into low gear to creep down the hill. I was preparing to aim at a good place to ditch the rig and jump, but the pickup discs were big enough to save the day. M23s are significantly lighter, but I would not wish my thrilling brakeless ride on anyone. Tom Jenkins M17 Scintilla On Sep 29, 2011, at 9:32 AM, Rik Sandberg wrote:
Robbin,
"Would it be a poor idea (as I assume it would) to just rely on the F-350 brakes?"
An M-23 is heavy enough that it wouldn't be legal in any state that I know of without trailer brakes. Going without leaves you wide open to pretty serious liability issues if something goes wrong.
I've had many trailers over the years that have had both electric and surge brakes. I like electric better. Much more controllable.
Rik Sandberg
On Thu, Sep 29, 2011 at 7:39 AM, robbin roddewig < robbin.roddewig@verizon.net> wrote:
Hi all, So it appears that my new towing beast has an electric brake control. My M-23 dual axle trailer had drum brakes which are a loss (literally the right side has no parts anymore). The brake assemblies need to be replaced. I assumed before buying the beast that this would means surge hydraulic brakes. Maybe discs. But I would like any advice you folks have on going electric (trailer super store has very reasonably priced whole drum brake assemblies) versus hydraulic and disc versus drum. Since the current rusted assembly is drum would putting a whole new drum assembly on be easier? Has anyone done this kind of rehab to trailer brakes? I do car brakes of all kinds but usually am not removing everything, well sometimes but I was much younger then. Would it be a poor idea (as I assume it would) to just rely on the F-350 brakes?
Hope to see some of you at Annapolis. Even considering the Good Old Boat Regatta.
Robbin M-23 The Other Woman, M-10 Tonka
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Congratulations David I have a 1984 M-15. Mine is steel, you could check with a magnet if yours is. I am in New Jersey close the the GWB there is a ramp there if one day you want to try the Hudson river. Orlando Velez ________________________________ From: David Gilroy <dbakergilroy@sbcglobal.net> To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2011 10:41 PM Subject: M_Boats: New to Montgomery Hello all, I'm excited to be the new owner of a 1984 Montgomery 15. I live in East Granby, CT and usually sail out of Guilford on Long Island Sound. I have yet to get out for a sail but am hoping to be able sometime in October. Does anyone know if 1984 M-15's have steel ballast in the keel, and whether the centerboard is fiberglass. Mine is well and truly stuck in the up position despite a couple sessions of doing everything I could think of to lower it, and I'd like to understand better what I'm up against. Also, is it allowed to post a boat for sale in this group? (Not the M-15, but my last boat) Thanks very much. David Gilroy _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
Hi David, In addition to what Dave Scobie said I have been able to free my board up by diving under with a snorkle and mask and wiggling the bd. You can only grip about 1/4 inch of the board and it may take 15 - 20 dives before it starts to come free. My M15 is also a 1984 or so, maybe an 86. Hull number 310. I finally discovered that it was jamming up due to little rocks dropping off of my shoes and washing down the cockpit drain with the board up. The drain is through the CB trunk and the little stones would jam between the board and the CB wall when trailering. The CB fit in the trunk is very close by design and you cannot actually see a bulge in the trunk wall. You should make a wooden gauge and run it through the CB trunk once you get the board down. I can't remember the exact size of the opening but maybe Bob Eeg or Jerry can refresh my memory. I did end up sanding a little gel coat off of both sides of the board to make it slightly thinner for a looser fit. The board does rattle a bit under certain wave / angle of attack situations. Thanks Doug Kelch M15 G #310 Seas the Day ________________________________ From: David Gilroy <dbakergilroy@sbcglobal.net> To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Sent: Wednesday, September 28, 2011 7:41 PM Subject: M_Boats: New to Montgomery Hello all, I'm excited to be the new owner of a 1984 Montgomery 15. I live in East Granby, CT and usually sail out of Guilford on Long Island Sound. I have yet to get out for a sail but am hoping to be able sometime in October. Does anyone know if 1984 M-15's have steel ballast in the keel, and whether the centerboard is fiberglass. Mine is well and truly stuck in the up position despite a couple sessions of doing everything I could think of to lower it, and I'd like to understand better what I'm up against. Also, is it allowed to post a boat for sale in this group? (Not the M-15, but my last boat) Thanks very much. David Gilroy _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
participants (7)
-
David Gilroy -
Doug Kelch -
Orlando Velez -
Rik Sandberg -
robbin roddewig -
Tom Jenkins -
W David Scobie