M17 Cockpit drain and water level
On my first sail I noticed that the water level in the cockpit drain was about 1-1.5" below the cockpit sole while at rest or sailing flat. When I motored at near hull speed, the aft end of the boat squatted down somewhat and water came up on the back foot of the cockpit sole. At this point, I have very little "stuff" on the boat; No battery, no water storage, and etc. The only weighty items are the outboard, gas, and the anchors (which I have stored forward now). When I was out swimming, I noticed that the boat sat on her lines fairly parallel to the water with the bottom of the waterline about an inch above the water. Is this what to normally expect in terms of water level in the drain and when motoring? I remember reading in the SCA M17 review that some have plugged the cockpit drain when sailing with several crew. Is this true? Also has anyone found a check valve that might work in this application? Steve Shenkel M17 (unnamed) Arizona
Hi Steve I think your problem is a common one. When I started building the new models, I installed a Whale 1.5 inch check valve inline with the cockpit drains (2). I carried through the fuel tank locker with the hose and check valve. This keeps the locker dry instead of wet. Even with this setup a loaded boat will sometimes 'squat' and allow a little water to back-flow slowly thru the check valve. Bob Campbell on Alina installed some rubber balls that he shoved into the thru hulls when he had several crew on board. What I am doing on some recent boats is offering a positive shut off feature that allows you to open the locker and simply shut the drain off. We just shipped a boat to Annapolis Maryland for Walt Wood to use in his sailing school. He will be having groups on board for sailing lessons and we decided to install these valves on his boat. That boat will be on display during the Annapolis Boat Show, October 6 thru 11 so if anyone wants to see how I did it, please stop by and take a look at say hello. For your information Steve the parts (not counting hose and hose clamps) needed are from West Marine and are: Forespar Marelon 1.5 inch ball valves part number 112425 (2 per boat) then you will need the tailpieces (4 per boat) part number 130229. Go to westmarine.com and take a look at them. Good luck and fair winds. Call me if you need help with anything! I will post Walt's sailing school URL later. He has agreed to show his boat and arrangements can be made for sailing this new Montgomery 17 in Annapolis. Bob Eeg (949) 489-8227 Steve Shenkel wrote:
On my first sail I noticed that the water level in the cockpit drain was about 1-1.5" below the cockpit sole while at rest or sailing flat. When I motored at near hull speed, the aft end of the boat squatted down somewhat and water came up on the back foot of the cockpit sole. At this point, I have very little "stuff" on the boat; No battery, no water storage, and etc. The only weighty items are the outboard, gas, and the anchors (which I have stored forward now). When I was out swimming, I noticed that the boat sat on her lines fairly parallel to the water with the bottom of the waterline about an inch above the water. Is this what to normally expect in terms of water level in the drain and when motoring?
I remember reading in the SCA M17 review that some have plugged the cockpit drain when sailing with several crew. Is this true? Also has anyone found a check valve that might work in this application?
Steve Shenkel
M17 (unnamed)
Arizona
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
Thanks Bob, I will look into this check valve. I assume a check valve/ball valve shutoff combination would also work? Also, the earlier boat has a single central drain and no access. I had considered adding drains with strainers in each corner and some sort of access port, if not a complete opening locker in this space for access to the drain lines and so on. Steve Shenkel M-17 269 Arizona
Didn't someone reverse his drain hoses, so that when heeled to starboard, the submerged starboard exit was connected to the port cockpit entrance, and vise versa, therefore, because the water had further to travel in order to "back up into the cockpit", his cockpit remained dry? I always thought this was a novel solution ... The positive shutoff could be risky, couldn't it, if the cockpit were swamped by a rogue wave? ----- Original Message ----- From: Bob To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Sent: Friday, August 26, 2005 3:15 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: M17 Cockpit drain and water level Hi Steve I think your problem is a common one. When I started building the new models, I installed a Whale 1.5 inch check valve inline with the cockpit drains (2). I carried through the fuel tank locker with the hose and check valve. This keeps the locker dry instead of wet. Even with this setup a loaded boat will sometimes 'squat' and allow a little water to back-flow slowly thru the check valve. Bob Campbell on Alina installed some rubber balls that he shoved into the thru hulls when he had several crew on board. What I am doing on some recent boats is offering a positive shut off feature that allows you to open the locker and simply shut the drain off. We just shipped a boat to Annapolis Maryland for Walt Wood to use in his sailing school. He will be having groups on board for sailing lessons and we decided to install these valves on his boat. That boat will be on display during the Annapolis Boat Show, October 6 thru 11 so if anyone wants to see how I did it, please stop by and take a look at say hello. For your information Steve the parts (not counting hose and hose clamps) needed are from West Marine and are: Forespar Marelon 1.5 inch ball valves part number 112425 (2 per boat) then you will need the tailpieces (4 per boat) part number 130229. Go to westmarine.com and take a look at them. Good luck and fair winds. Call me if you need help with anything! I will post Walt's sailing school URL later. He has agreed to show his boat and arrangements can be made for sailing this new Montgomery 17 in Annapolis. Bob Eeg (949) 489-8227 Steve Shenkel wrote:
On my first sail I noticed that the water level in the cockpit drain was about 1-1.5" below the cockpit sole while at rest or sailing flat. When I motored at near hull speed, the aft end of the boat squatted down somewhat and water came up on the back foot of the cockpit sole. At this point, I have very little "stuff" on the boat; No battery, no water storage, and etc. The only weighty items are the outboard, gas, and the anchors (which I have stored forward now). When I was out swimming, I noticed that the boat sat on her lines fairly parallel to the water with the bottom of the waterline about an inch above the water. Is this what to normally expect in terms of water level in the drain and when motoring?
I remember reading in the SCA M17 review that some have plugged the cockpit drain when sailing with several crew. Is this true? Also has anyone found a check valve that might work in this application?
Steve Shenkel
M17 (unnamed)
Arizona
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
_______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
On Aug 26, 2005, at 7:59 AM, Steve Shenkel wrote:
I remember reading in the SCA M17 review that some have plugged the cockpit drain when sailing with several crew. Is this true?
You M17 folks are hardcore! I never would have thought of stuffing crew in there. How do you get 'em to stay put? ;-) Sorry, couldn't resist George
Bungee cord, duct tape, Velcro;;; the usual tools of the marlinspike sailor! However, good point; I had never considered that? Steve _/)
I remember reading in the SCA M17 review that some have plugged the cockpit drain when sailing with several crew. Is this true?
You M17 folks are hardcore! I never would have thought of stuffing crew in there. How do you get 'em to stay put? ;-) Sorry, couldn't resist George _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
From SCA:
Montgomery 10, good shape. Newer trailer. $950. 303-946-6865 or markhannoninc@msn.com _____________ 1973 Montgomery 12 Sailing Dinghy. Full details at http://home.earthlink.net/~m12 . $2,000. West Palm Beach, FL. Contact Tim at m12@earthlink.net _____________ Montgomery 17, compact cruiser, bluewater sailboat, hull #387, fully maintained in pristine condition, with new Honda engine, $8,500 OBO, (917) 796-6456 _____________ As I've mentioned in a previous post, I'm especially interested in what happens with hull 387, as mine is #389 ... _____________ More on the M12: I'm selling the Dink. According to various passersby and the Montgomery Boat List folks, this is a Montgomery Marine 12 foot Sailing Dinghy, hull number 103. It was built in March of 1973, and has a faux-lapstrake, hand-laid fiberglass hull with teak trim. The dink has been a fun boat, but it's time for me to move on to a small powerboat. Email me if you're interested, my name is Tim. Here are the details: Price: $2000 Notes: a.. 1973 Montgomery 12 Sailing Dinghy, hull number 103 a.. dimensions: 12' overall length, 4' 10" beam, 19' mast, ~33" draft with daggerboard down b.. boat, trailer, and mast can fit in a 17' long garage c.. 2003 masthead fitting & sheaves (from Jerry Montgomery's secret stash!) b.. 1998 Continental Trailer, extra set of wheels and tires, very good condition a.. tie-down strap, hitch lock, hitch fits 1-7/8" ball c.. 2002 Kern Ferguson Main and Jib, used very little a.. bronze jib hanks, aluminum main headplate, jiffy reefing on main, storage bag, one old jib included d.. 1999 Standing rigging, bronze turnbuckles e.. 2003 Harken sail handling hardware f.. 2005 running rigging g.. 2003 inspection hatches (3), forward hatch has nylon stowage bag h.. Windex windvane i.. Varnished cypress number/letter boards j.. Remaining paint from recent repainting included for touch-up needs (Petit & Z-Spar) k.. 7' oars with leather wrappings and bronze oar-locks _____________ Bill, This boat is spectacular ... You've got to ask Tim if you can post his pics on your Funtigo site ... Holy smokes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! --Craig, '84 M17 #389; '74 M12 #158
participants (4)
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Bob -
Craig F. Honshell -
George Burmeyer -
Steve Shenkel