Re: M_Boats: M-23 under weigh(way)
Thomas, Robbin, and quality M-folks, I have used the Loos gauges to measure shroud and stay tension on both my M17 and M23. I thought I was doing everything correctly with German precision until I read a report that most of those measurement tools are fairly inaccurate. I would set tension at 10% of breaking strength (as per instructions). It always seemed to me that the rig was too tight. Well, my new formula is to set tension by feel. I do still use the gauges to balance shrouds side to side, bit I am definitely tuning my rig softer. It fits in with my easy going, relaxed, don't rush me state of mind. As always, I'll watch the rig under sail. I'll be checking the slack of the inner shrouds under a hard beat to weather. Adjust as necessary, and check again after several times out. Now, if I could only measure voltage and current by feeling a conductor!!! It would lighten my tool bag on service calls. Bones ____________________________________________________________ Penny Stock Jumping 3000% Sign up to the #1 voted penny stock newsletter for free today! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/4df161de772d181d70st05vuc
Bones, thanks for sharing that. I did in fact buy a Loos gauge from West Marine in a moment of extravagance after getting the M-23 mast up feeling I was doing the right thing after years of winging it. I had no feel at all for tension so I guess that gauge is still useful but I will try to use it with some flexibility. Yes the shrouds and stays seem very tight and I only got them to the lower end or approaching the lower end of the recommended range. This tendency to softer tension will fit with my addled, squishy brain so it becomes part of a larger life style as well. I have been successful at roughly measuring the voltage and current in conductors but it is not a particularly pleasant sensation! I have dropped back to a voltmeter but I can also calculate currents and voltages in conductors using various numerical Electromagnetics programs :). It is a nasty side effect of my night job. Thanks again, Robbin On 6/9/2011 8:12 PM, bownez@juno.com wrote:
Thomas, Robbin, and quality M-folks, I have used the Loos gauges to measure shroud and stay tension on both my M17 and M23. I thought I was doing everything correctly with German precision until I read a report that most of those measurement tools are fairly inaccurate. I would set tension at 10% of breaking strength (as per instructions). It always seemed to me that the rig was too tight. Well, my new formula is to set tension by feel. I do still use the gauges to balance shrouds side to side, bit I am definitely tuning my rig softer. It fits in with my easy going, relaxed, don't rush me state of mind. As always, I'll watch the rig under sail. I'll be checking the slack of the inner shrouds under a hard beat to weather. Adjust as necessary, and check again after several times out. Now, if I could only measure voltage and current by feeling a conductor!!! It would lighten my tool bag on service calls. Bones ____________________________________________________________ Penny Stock Jumping 3000% Sign up to the #1 voted penny stock newsletter for free today! http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL3141/4df161de772d181d70st05vuc _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
I'm still at a loss for finding the right amount of tension on shrouds and stays. Jerry has chimed in a number of times with his sage advice but it ends up in my ears the same way that a good friend of mine tunes his guitar. I ask him where he starts and he simply says that you start by finding the right pitch. Oh... So I try and make the shrouds balanced side to side with the tops a tad tighter than the lowers. But just like tuning the guitar, it's that starting point that eludes me. Joe Seafrog M17 #651 ps Turns out I'm tone deaf....
Snug but not fiddle (or guitar) string tight. The may appear a little slack on the lee side of the mast when sailing. Yes, I know, it's a little like the recipe that says add flour until you reach the right consistency and cook until done. ~~~_/)~~~Gary Hyde 2005 M17 #637 sailboat 'Hydeaway 2' On Jun 10, 2011, at 8:55 AM, Joe Murphy wrote:
I'm still at a loss for finding the right amount of tension on shrouds and stays. Jerry has chimed in a number of times with his sage advice but it ends up in my ears the same way that a good friend of mine tunes his guitar. I ask him where he starts and he simply says that you start by finding the right pitch. Oh... So I try and make the shrouds balanced side to side with the tops a tad tighter than the lowers. But just like tuning the guitar, it's that starting point that eludes me.
Joe Seafrog M17 #651 ps Turns out I'm tone deaf.... _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats
When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
Joe, I follow the recommendations in a video produced by Brian Toss of Port Townsend. His numbers are consistent with those that appear on the Loos web site. I use a Loos gauge to measure the tension. I've been using the following numbers for several years with good results. Lower Shroud 10% of breaking strength (210 lbs) 25 on Loos gauge Upper Shroud 15% of breaking strength ( 315 lbs) 32 on Loos gauge Forestay 12% of breaking strength ( 396 lbs) 41 on Loos gauge Backstay 15% of breaking strength ( 315 lbs) 32 on Loos gauge This assumes that the forestay is 5/32 and all the rest are 1/8 Rich Makela M-17 #233 - Harmony -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Joe Murphy Sent: Friday, June 10, 2011 10:56 AM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: M_Boats: Shrouds and Stays Tension I'm still at a loss for finding the right amount of tension on shrouds and stays. Jerry has chimed in a number of times with his sage advice but it ends up in my ears the same way that a good friend of mine tunes his guitar. I ask him where he starts and he simply says that you start by finding the right pitch. Oh... So I try and make the shrouds balanced side to side with the tops a tad tighter than the lowers. But just like tuning the guitar, it's that starting point that eludes me. Joe Seafrog M17 #651 ps Turns out I'm tone deaf.... _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
Thanks for posting these. This is what I was looking for! TH Thomas Howe Mailto:Thomas@TEHowe.com O --------(\ ---------- ~ (\ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ (\ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Rich Makela Sent: Friday, June 10, 2011 6:20 PM To: 'For and about Montgomery Sailboats' Subject: Re: M_Boats: Shrouds and Stays Tension Joe, I follow the recommendations in a video produced by Brian Toss of Port Townsend. His numbers are consistent with those that appear on the Loos web site. I use a Loos gauge to measure the tension. I've been using the following numbers for several years with good results. Lower Shroud 10% of breaking strength (210 lbs) 25 on Loos gauge Upper Shroud 15% of breaking strength ( 315 lbs) 32 on Loos gauge Forestay 12% of breaking strength ( 396 lbs) 41 on Loos gauge Backstay 15% of breaking strength ( 315 lbs) 32 on Loos gauge This assumes that the forestay is 5/32 and all the rest are 1/8 Rich Makela M-17 #233 - Harmony -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Joe Murphy Sent: Friday, June 10, 2011 10:56 AM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: M_Boats: Shrouds and Stays Tension I'm still at a loss for finding the right amount of tension on shrouds and stays. Jerry has chimed in a number of times with his sage advice but it ends up in my ears the same way that a good friend of mine tunes his guitar. I ask him where he starts and he simply says that you start by finding the right pitch. Oh... So I try and make the shrouds balanced side to side with the tops a tad tighter than the lowers. But just like tuning the guitar, it's that starting point that eludes me. Joe Seafrog M17 #651 ps Turns out I'm tone deaf.... _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
Thanks Rich. I'm not sure if I have a 5/32 forestay. I have a CDI furler. I use a backstay tensioner so I guess if I use the numbers for the back stay I should be in the ballpark. The information for the shrouds will help tremendously. I'll be off to WM to pick up a Loos guage. This is good news. Thanks again, Joe SeaFrog M17 #651 ----- Original Message ----- From: Rich Makela To: 'For and about Montgomery Sailboats' Sent: Friday, June 10, 2011 7:19 PM Subject: Re: M_Boats: Shrouds and Stays Tension Joe, I follow the recommendations in a video produced by Brian Toss of Port Townsend. His numbers are consistent with those that appear on the Loos web site. I use a Loos gauge to measure the tension. I've been using the following numbers for several years with good results. Lower Shroud 10% of breaking strength (210 lbs) 25 on Loos gauge Upper Shroud 15% of breaking strength ( 315 lbs) 32 on Loos gauge Forestay 12% of breaking strength ( 396 lbs) 41 on Loos gauge Backstay 15% of breaking strength ( 315 lbs) 32 on Loos gauge This assumes that the forestay is 5/32 and all the rest are 1/8 Rich Makela M-17 #233 - Harmony -----Original Message----- From: montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:montgomery_boats-bounces@mailman.xmission.com] On Behalf Of Joe Murphy Sent: Friday, June 10, 2011 10:56 AM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: M_Boats: Shrouds and Stays Tension I'm still at a loss for finding the right amount of tension on shrouds and stays. Jerry has chimed in a number of times with his sage advice but it ends up in my ears the same way that a good friend of mine tunes his guitar. I ask him where he starts and he simply says that you start by finding the right pitch. Oh... So I try and make the shrouds balanced side to side with the tops a tad tighter than the lowers. But just like tuning the guitar, it's that starting point that eludes me. Joe Seafrog M17 #651 ps Turns out I'm tone deaf.... _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet! _______________________________________________ http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/montgomery_boats When posting, remember that there is no privacy on the Internet!
participants (6)
-
bownez＠juno.com -
Gary M Hyde -
Joe Murphy -
Rich Makela -
robbin roddewig -
Thomas Howe