George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails" ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Sep 25, 2015 at 8:55 PM Subject: Main Furling System To: montgomery_boats-owner@mailman.xmission.com, montgomeryboats@hotmail.com Wrinkle Boat Mates In my attempt to reduce work during sailing due to advancing age (84) I am adding a Roller furl er for the Jib next season. In light of that I was thinking about a furling system for the Main. I did find that CDI has Main Systems for boats as small as 26'. Has anyone developed one for a M15 or M17. George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
CDI 'main furler', IMO, would add excessive weight & windage and cause terible turbulence across the sail as it is essentially a jib furler bolted to the aft end of the mast. in addition you wouldn't be able to use battens and have terrible sail shape. -- :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com On Fri, Sep 25, 2015 at 7:56 PM, George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> wrote:
Wrinkle Boat Mates
In my attempt to reduce work during sailing due to advancing age (84) I am adding a Roller furl er for the Jib next season. In light of that I was thinking about a furling system for the Main. I did find that CDI has Main Systems for boats as small as 26'. Has anyone developed one for a M15 or M17.
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
I have a main down haul (I think that is what it is called) Holds the boom up when the main is let down. You could also add lazy jacks and you would have an easy way to get the main down and confined to above the boom. Jim E M-17 #603 Grace On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 9:58 AM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> wrote:
CDI 'main furler', IMO, would add excessive weight & windage and cause terible turbulence across the sail as it is essentially a jib furler bolted to the aft end of the mast. in addition you wouldn't be able to use battens and have terrible sail shape.
-- :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com
On Fri, Sep 25, 2015 at 7:56 PM, George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> wrote:
Wrinkle Boat Mates
In my attempt to reduce work during sailing due to advancing age (84) I
am
adding a Roller furl er for the Jib next season. In light of that I was thinking about a furling system for the Main. I did find that CDI has Main Systems for boats as small as 26'. Has anyone developed one for a M15 or M17.
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
Toping lift Jim. Or one could get a BoomKicker :: Dave Scobie On Sep 27, 2015 11:44 AM, "Jim Ellsworth" <jellsworth603@gmail.com> wrote:
I have a main down haul (I think that is what it is called) Holds the boom up when the main is let down. You could also add lazy jacks and you would have an easy way to get the main down and confined to above the boom.
Jim E M-17 #603 Grace
On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 9:58 AM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> wrote:
CDI 'main furler', IMO, would add excessive weight & windage and cause terible turbulence across the sail as it is essentially a jib furler bolted to the aft end of the mast. in addition you wouldn't be able to use battens and have terrible sail shape.
-- :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com
On Fri, Sep 25, 2015 at 7:56 PM, George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> wrote:
Wrinkle Boat Mates
In my attempt to reduce work during sailing due to advancing age (84)
I am
adding a Roller furl er for the Jib next season. In light of that I was thinking about a furling system for the Main. I did find that CDI has Main Systems for boats as small as 26'. Has anyone developed one for a M15 or M17.
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
Thanks Dave, I must be getting old. Only been sailing since 1955 if wrapped in a blanket under the fore deck of a Mercury sailboat counts. On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 10:55 AM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> wrote:
Toping lift Jim. Or one could get a BoomKicker
:: Dave Scobie On Sep 27, 2015 11:44 AM, "Jim Ellsworth" <jellsworth603@gmail.com> wrote:
I have a main down haul (I think that is what it is called) Holds the boom up when the main is let down. You could also add lazy jacks and you would have an easy way to get the main down and confined to above the boom.
Jim E M-17 #603 Grace
On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 9:58 AM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> wrote:
CDI 'main furler', IMO, would add excessive weight & windage and cause terible turbulence across the sail as it is essentially a jib furler bolted to the aft end of the mast. in addition you wouldn't be able to use battens and have terrible sail shape.
-- :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com
On Fri, Sep 25, 2015 at 7:56 PM, George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> wrote:
Wrinkle Boat Mates
In my attempt to reduce work during sailing due to advancing age (84)
I am
adding a Roller furl er for the Jib next season. In light of that I was thinking about a furling system for the Main. I did find that CDI has Main Systems for boats as small as 26'. Has anyone developed one for a M15 or M17.
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
Good diagrams of both the downhaul and lazy jacks can be found in The Complete Sailor, a book by David Sidman that has been around for awhile, and a bargain at about $ 20. Try the WoodenBoat Center (Maine)cataluoge or WoodenBoat Foundation (Port Twonsend, Washington) if you can not find a copy at your local brick and mortar store. Steve M-15 # 335 -----Original Message----- From: Dave Scobie Sent: Sunday, September 27, 2015 10:55 AM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Subject: Re: M_Boats: Fwd: Main Furling System Toping lift Jim. Or one could get a BoomKicker :: Dave Scobie On Sep 27, 2015 11:44 AM, "Jim Ellsworth" <jellsworth603@gmail.com> wrote:
I have a main down haul (I think that is what it is called) Holds the boom up when the main is let down. You could also add lazy jacks and you would have an easy way to get the main down and confined to above the boom.
Jim E M-17 #603 Grace
On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 9:58 AM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> wrote:
CDI 'main furler', IMO, would add excessive weight & windage and cause terible turbulence across the sail as it is essentially a jib furler bolted to the aft end of the mast. in addition you wouldn't be able to use battens and have terrible sail shape.
-- :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com
On Fri, Sep 25, 2015 at 7:56 PM, George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> wrote:
Wrinkle Boat Mates
In my attempt to reduce work during sailing due to advancing age (84)
I am
adding a Roller furl er for the Jib next season. In light of that I was thinking about a furling system for the Main. I did find that CDI has Main Systems for boats as small as 26'. Has anyone developed one for a M15 or M17.
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
Hi George, I have a roller furling main on my M-15, which was installed probably two owners back. It depends on the upper roller furler to somehow start to twirl as the sail itself twists. I hate it. It has vertical battens so it can roll up. It doesn't work well at all, although it's entirely possible I never figured out if there are any tricks involved. My plan at this point is to convert it back to where it started, a regular main with horizontal battens and two lines of reef points. I'd be interested to hear if you find a system that does work. Best regards, David from East Granby, CT Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 25, 2015, at 9:56 PM, George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> wrote:
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Sep 25, 2015 at 8:55 PM Subject: Main Furling System To: montgomery_boats-owner@mailman.xmission.com, montgomeryboats@hotmail.com
Wrinkle Boat Mates
In my attempt to reduce work during sailing due to advancing age (84) I am adding a Roller furl er for the Jib next season. In light of that I was thinking about a furling system for the Main. I did find that CDI has Main Systems for boats as small as 26'. Has anyone developed one for a M15 or M17.
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
Guys I presently have a Topping Lift & Boomkicker (Belt and Suspenders) in addition to Retractable Lazy Jacks (Help maintain sail shape underway) also a Main down haul along with Single line Reefing. All help but still looking for a magic bullet to help douse the Main. David Gilroy I would be interested in the type/model of Furling System you have. Does your Main have a Luff Tape to help with the sail shape when being furled? How do you reef? What are the battens made off and how wide are they. Dave Scobie I to am concerned with the extra weight aloft. My other thought is to go with Full Battens had them on both my 23's. (Seward & Pearson) Thanks for all the input Fair sailing for the rest of the season. Hauling out on 10/6 a week early as my help is going to Florida. George Merry Helen II 97 M15 #602 George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails" On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 6:10 PM, David Gilroy <dbakergilroy@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Hi George, I have a roller furling main on my M-15, which was installed probably two owners back. It depends on the upper roller furler to somehow start to twirl as the sail itself twists. I hate it. It has vertical battens so it can roll up. It doesn't work well at all, although it's entirely possible I never figured out if there are any tricks involved. My plan at this point is to convert it back to where it started, a regular main with horizontal battens and two lines of reef points. I'd be interested to hear if you find a system that does work. Best regards, David from East Granby, CT
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 25, 2015, at 9:56 PM, George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> wrote:
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Sep 25, 2015 at 8:55 PM Subject: Main Furling System To: montgomery_boats-owner@mailman.xmission.com, montgomeryboats@hotmail.com
Wrinkle Boat Mates
In my attempt to reduce work during sailing due to advancing age (84) I am adding a Roller furl er for the Jib next season. In light of that I was thinking about a furling system for the Main. I did find that CDI has Main Systems for boats as small as 26'. Has anyone developed one for a M15 or M17.
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
Hi George, It’s a Schaefer System 350. No luff tape. Reefing requires furling the sail toward the mast, which is dicey because in heavy winds, the top of the sail balloons out and unfurls, resulting in the opposite of what is safe. Battens (2) are fiberglass and about an inch wide. David
On Sep 27, 2015, at 8:36 PM, George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> wrote:
Guys
I presently have a Topping Lift & Boomkicker (Belt and Suspenders) in addition to Retractable Lazy Jacks (Help maintain sail shape underway) also a Main down haul along with Single line Reefing. All help but still looking for a magic bullet to help douse the Main.
David Gilroy I would be interested in the type/model of Furling System you have. Does your Main have a Luff Tape to help with the sail shape when being furled? How do you reef? What are the battens made off and how wide are they.
Dave Scobie I to am concerned with the extra weight aloft.
My other thought is to go with Full Battens had them on both my 23's. (Seward & Pearson)
Thanks for all the input
Fair sailing for the rest of the season. Hauling out on 10/6 a week early as my help is going to Florida.
George Merry Helen II 97 M15 #602
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 6:10 PM, David Gilroy <dbakergilroy@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Hi George, I have a roller furling main on my M-15, which was installed probably two owners back. It depends on the upper roller furler to somehow start to twirl as the sail itself twists. I hate it. It has vertical battens so it can roll up. It doesn't work well at all, although it's entirely possible I never figured out if there are any tricks involved. My plan at this point is to convert it back to where it started, a regular main with horizontal battens and two lines of reef points. I'd be interested to hear if you find a system that does work. Best regards, David from East Granby, CT
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 25, 2015, at 9:56 PM, George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> wrote:
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Sep 25, 2015 at 8:55 PM Subject: Main Furling System To: montgomery_boats-owner@mailman.xmission.com, montgomeryboats@hotmail.com
Wrinkle Boat Mates
In my attempt to reduce work during sailing due to advancing age (84) I am adding a Roller furl er for the Jib next season. In light of that I was thinking about a furling system for the Main. I did find that CDI has Main Systems for boats as small as 26'. Has anyone developed one for a M15 or M17.
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
If you just want to douse it quickly, it seems the combo of downhaul, boomkicker or cockpit-accessible topping lift, and lazy jacks would be about as quick as any, less likely to fail due to complex mechanical complications, and less likely to affect sail shape, trim, etc.. There are systems that reef onto the boom rather than the mast. An in-the-boom system is probably not available for anything as small as a Monty, and what I've seen of them, they are $$$$$$ at any size. The Ensenada 20 I've owned reefs by rolling onto the boom (that was the factory setup anyhow). People either hate or appreciate the system. Those who hate it have put normal reefing gear on instead. The boom is spring-loaded at the gooseneck mechanism. Pull the boom towards the stern and it will rotate; otherwise it is locked from rotating by the sprung mechanism. It locks at each half turn so the amount of reef can vary greatly. However one can't use a normal vang (though one could presumably use the boomkicker that has the webbing sling instead of fixed plate on the boom end), or any other lines running on the boom that need to be accessed when reefed. I only mention it as another mainsail reefing method I've actually used. I don't necessarily recommend it, as it has its own awkwardness to manage single-handed - - slacking the main halyard but keeping tension on it while pulling back & rolling the boom is not an easy dance to do. And it doesn't douse the main, just reduces it. cheers, John S. On 09/27/2015 05:36 PM, George Iemmolo wrote:
Guys
I presently have a Topping Lift & Boomkicker (Belt and Suspenders) in addition to Retractable Lazy Jacks (Help maintain sail shape underway) also a Main down haul along with Single line Reefing. All help but still looking for a magic bullet to help douse the Main.
David Gilroy I would be interested in the type/model of Furling System you have. Does your Main have a Luff Tape to help with the sail shape when being furled? How do you reef? What are the battens made off and how wide are they.
Dave Scobie I to am concerned with the extra weight aloft.
My other thought is to go with Full Battens had them on both my 23's. (Seward & Pearson)
Thanks for all the input
Fair sailing for the rest of the season. Hauling out on 10/6 a week early as my help is going to Florida.
George Merry Helen II 97 M15 #602
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 6:10 PM, David Gilroy <dbakergilroy@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Hi George, I have a roller furling main on my M-15, which was installed probably two owners back. It depends on the upper roller furler to somehow start to twirl as the sail itself twists. I hate it. It has vertical battens so it can roll up. It doesn't work well at all, although it's entirely possible I never figured out if there are any tricks involved. My plan at this point is to convert it back to where it started, a regular main with horizontal battens and two lines of reef points. I'd be interested to hear if you find a system that does work. Best regards, David from East Granby, CT
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 25, 2015, at 9:56 PM, George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> wrote:
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Sep 25, 2015 at 8:55 PM Subject: Main Furling System To: montgomery_boats-owner@mailman.xmission.com, montgomeryboats@hotmail.com
Wrinkle Boat Mates
In my attempt to reduce work during sailing due to advancing age (84) I am adding a Roller furl er for the Jib next season. In light of that I was thinking about a furling system for the Main. I did find that CDI has Main Systems for boats as small as 26'. Has anyone developed one for a M15 or M17.
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
John I hear you and have had some bad experience with a Main furling on the boom. I may have it set up as good as it is going to get George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails" On Mon, Sep 28, 2015 at 2:04 PM, John Schinnerer <john@eco-living.net> wrote:
If you just want to douse it quickly, it seems the combo of downhaul, boomkicker or cockpit-accessible topping lift, and lazy jacks would be about as quick as any, less likely to fail due to complex mechanical complications, and less likely to affect sail shape, trim, etc..
There are systems that reef onto the boom rather than the mast. An in-the-boom system is probably not available for anything as small as a Monty, and what I've seen of them, they are $$$$$$ at any size.
The Ensenada 20 I've owned reefs by rolling onto the boom (that was the factory setup anyhow). People either hate or appreciate the system. Those who hate it have put normal reefing gear on instead. The boom is spring-loaded at the gooseneck mechanism. Pull the boom towards the stern and it will rotate; otherwise it is locked from rotating by the sprung mechanism. It locks at each half turn so the amount of reef can vary greatly. However one can't use a normal vang (though one could presumably use the boomkicker that has the webbing sling instead of fixed plate on the boom end), or any other lines running on the boom that need to be accessed when reefed. I only mention it as another mainsail reefing method I've actually used. I don't necessarily recommend it, as it has its own awkwardness to manage single-handed - - slacking the main halyard but keeping tension on it while pulling back & rolling the boom is not an easy dance to do. And it doesn't douse the main, just reduces it.
cheers, John S.
On 09/27/2015 05:36 PM, George Iemmolo wrote:
Guys
I presently have a Topping Lift & Boomkicker (Belt and Suspenders) in addition to Retractable Lazy Jacks (Help maintain sail shape underway) also a Main down haul along with Single line Reefing. All help but still looking for a magic bullet to help douse the Main.
David Gilroy I would be interested in the type/model of Furling System you have. Does your Main have a Luff Tape to help with the sail shape when being furled? How do you reef? What are the battens made off and how wide are they.
Dave Scobie I to am concerned with the extra weight aloft.
My other thought is to go with Full Battens had them on both my 23's. (Seward & Pearson)
Thanks for all the input
Fair sailing for the rest of the season. Hauling out on 10/6 a week early as my help is going to Florida.
George Merry Helen II 97 M15 #602
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
On Sun, Sep 27, 2015 at 6:10 PM, David Gilroy <dbakergilroy@sbcglobal.net
wrote:
Hi George,
I have a roller furling main on my M-15, which was installed probably two owners back. It depends on the upper roller furler to somehow start to twirl as the sail itself twists. I hate it. It has vertical battens so it can roll up. It doesn't work well at all, although it's entirely possible I never figured out if there are any tricks involved. My plan at this point is to convert it back to where it started, a regular main with horizontal battens and two lines of reef points. I'd be interested to hear if you find a system that does work. Best regards, David from East Granby, CT
Sent from my iPhone
On Sep 25, 2015, at 9:56 PM, George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com>
wrote:
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: George Iemmolo <griemmolo2@gmail.com> Date: Fri, Sep 25, 2015 at 8:55 PM Subject: Main Furling System To: montgomery_boats-owner@mailman.xmission.com,
montgomeryboats@hotmail.com
Wrinkle Boat Mates
In my attempt to reduce work during sailing due to advancing age (84) I
am
adding a Roller furl er for the Jib next season. In light of that I was thinking about a furling system for the Main. I did find that CDI has
Main
Systems for boats as small as 26'. Has anyone developed one for a M15 or M17.
George "We Can Not Control the Wind But We Can Adjust Our Sails"
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design
- Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
participants (6)
-
Dave Scobie -
David Gilroy -
George Iemmolo -
Jim Ellsworth -
John Schinnerer -
Steve Trapp