Could anyone help me with standard eye to eye lengths for the M15 mast stay and shrouds ? I need to replace one damaged shroud and think I will order a set, I will of course also measure the existing rigging too but just to confirm thank you Alula - M15 Lund B.C. Canada Roger Langmaid
Roger: Do you think the existing shrouds are the incorrect length? I have, someplace, a pdf that shows the rigging specs. Can't find it but I'll keep looking. :: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site! On Thu, Apr 14, 2022, 3:46 PM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Could anyone help me with standard eye to eye lengths for the M15 mast stay and shrouds ? I need to replace one damaged shroud and think I will order a set, I will of course also measure the existing rigging too but just to confirm
thank you
Alula - M15 Lund B.C. Canada
Roger Langmaid
Thanks Dave Roger Sent from my BlackBerry — the most secure mobile device — via the Rogers Network Original Message From: scoobscobie@gmail.com Sent: April 15, 2022 7:37 AM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Reply to: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths Roger: Do you think the existing shrouds are the incorrect length? I have, someplace, a pdf that shows the rigging specs. Can't find it but I'll keep looking. :: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site! On Thu, Apr 14, 2022, 3:46 PM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Could anyone help me with standard eye to eye lengths for the M15 mast stay and shrouds ? I need to replace one damaged shroud and think I will order a set, I will of course also measure the existing rigging too but just to confirm
thank you
Alula - M15 Lund B.C. Canada
Roger Langmaid
Roger. I've looked at all my flash and hard drives. Can't find the document with the M15 shrouds details. I do remember that the early boats have shrouds and forestay of equal lengths. Jerry stopped doing this as folks would set the mast straight so without enough rake (need at least 3-4"). He then built the boats with the forestay a bit longer and the shrouds a bit shorter 'to encourage the correct rake'. IMO unless the current rigging seems as if it was incorrect just duplicate what you have. :: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site! On Fri, Apr 15, 2022, 11:51 AM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks Dave
Roger
Sent from my BlackBerry — the most secure mobile device — via the Rogers Network
Original Message
From: scoobscobie@gmail.com Sent: April 15, 2022 7:37 AM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Reply to: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths
Roger:
Do you think the existing shrouds are the incorrect length?
I have, someplace, a pdf that shows the rigging specs. Can't find it but I'll keep looking.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site!
On Thu, Apr 14, 2022, 3:46 PM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Could anyone help me with standard eye to eye lengths for the M15 mast stay and shrouds ? I need to replace one damaged shroud and think I will order a set, I will of course also measure the existing rigging too but just to confirm
thank you
Alula - M15 Lund B.C. Canada
Roger Langmaid
I haven't made wires for the 15 for years, but I still have the long workbench that I used to cut the wires. I'll take a look and see if any of the marks are left. Don't count on it. I'd sledge one end, hang it on the proper peg on the bench and cut it to length, then put the terminal on the other end. The cutters were bolted to the bench so it was pretty foolproof. The pegs are long gone but the marks might still be there. (Pretty interesting little story, huh?) ________________________________ From: Dave Scobie <scoobscobie@gmail.com> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2022 12:10 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths Roger. I've looked at all my flash and hard drives. Can't find the document with the M15 shrouds details. I do remember that the early boats have shrouds and forestay of equal lengths. Jerry stopped doing this as folks would set the mast straight so without enough rake (need at least 3-4"). He then built the boats with the forestay a bit longer and the shrouds a bit shorter 'to encourage the correct rake'. IMO unless the current rigging seems as if it was incorrect just duplicate what you have. :: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site! On Fri, Apr 15, 2022, 11:51 AM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks Dave
Roger
Sent from my BlackBerry — the most secure mobile device — via the Rogers Network
Original Message
From: scoobscobie@gmail.com Sent: April 15, 2022 7:37 AM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Reply to: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths
Roger:
Do you think the existing shrouds are the incorrect length?
I have, someplace, a pdf that shows the rigging specs. Can't find it but I'll keep looking.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site!
On Thu, Apr 14, 2022, 3:46 PM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Could anyone help me with standard eye to eye lengths for the M15 mast stay and shrouds ? I need to replace one damaged shroud and think I will order a set, I will of course also measure the existing rigging too but just to confirm
thank you
Alula - M15 Lund B.C. Canada
Roger Langmaid
One comment on using the lengths you have - per Dave's comment about mast rake, check yours with current stays & shrouds, and adjust new lengths if/as necessary. My M17 came with a forestay that was a bit short (and thus a backstay that was a bit long). No idea why. The shrouds & stays it came with, I think, were not the OEM ones. It came with all nicopress and thimbles at both ends. I think the seller told me it had been re-rigged, maybe even by the previous owner to them. Anyhow - I didn't really think about mast rake until I saw some posts here about it, and also was needing a new forestay, as I was adding a jib furler. So I checked, and I had almost negative rake, the way it was when I bought it. It sailed OK anyhow, but I wouldn't have known there was better performance available then. I adjusted the lengths when ordering the new forestay and backstay, to give appropriate range of rake. You've only got a forestay to worry about, and the shrouds possibly if the rake makes that much difference in shroud length? It doesn't on the M17, plenty of range in the turnbuckles, may be different on an M15. cheers, John On 4/21/22 12:10, Dave Scobie wrote:
Roger.
I've looked at all my flash and hard drives. Can't find the document with the M15 shrouds details.
I do remember that the early boats have shrouds and forestay of equal lengths. Jerry stopped doing this as folks would set the mast straight so without enough rake (need at least 3-4"). He then built the boats with the forestay a bit longer and the shrouds a bit shorter 'to encourage the correct rake'.
IMO unless the current rigging seems as if it was incorrect just duplicate what you have.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site!
On Fri, Apr 15, 2022, 11:51 AM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks Dave
Roger
Sent from my BlackBerry — the most secure mobile device — via the Rogers Network
Original Message
From: scoobscobie@gmail.com Sent: April 15, 2022 7:37 AM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Reply to: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths
Roger:
Do you think the existing shrouds are the incorrect length?
I have, someplace, a pdf that shows the rigging specs. Can't find it but I'll keep looking.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site!
On Thu, Apr 14, 2022, 3:46 PM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Could anyone help me with standard eye to eye lengths for the M15 mast stay and shrouds ? I need to replace one damaged shroud and think I will order a set, I will of course also measure the existing rigging too but just to confirm
thank you
Alula - M15 Lund B.C. Canada
Roger Langmaid
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
I wouldn't worry about rigging length specs for an older sailboat... things get changed around a lot and there were even different length masts used on different M15s. The only measurement that matters is the current rigging length. 1) If the boat sails properly (slight weather helm) adjust the new rigging so it's centered on the turnbuckle/stay adjuster at the current setting, even if it's at the end of the range with the old rigging. 2) Make sure both left and right rear stays are exactly identical in length even if they aren't with the old rigging. Taking care of 1&2 corrects for the cumulative error that occurs when people re-rig a boat repeatedly by measuring the old stay lengths and trying to copy them. Sincerely, Tyler ----- Original Message ----- From: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Cc: "john" <john@eco-living.net> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2022 12:59:04 PM Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths One comment on using the lengths you have - per Dave's comment about mast rake, check yours with current stays & shrouds, and adjust new lengths if/as necessary. My M17 came with a forestay that was a bit short (and thus a backstay that was a bit long). No idea why. The shrouds & stays it came with, I think, were not the OEM ones. It came with all nicopress and thimbles at both ends. I think the seller told me it had been re-rigged, maybe even by the previous owner to them. Anyhow - I didn't really think about mast rake until I saw some posts here about it, and also was needing a new forestay, as I was adding a jib furler. So I checked, and I had almost negative rake, the way it was when I bought it. It sailed OK anyhow, but I wouldn't have known there was better performance available then. I adjusted the lengths when ordering the new forestay and backstay, to give appropriate range of rake. You've only got a forestay to worry about, and the shrouds possibly if the rake makes that much difference in shroud length? It doesn't on the M17, plenty of range in the turnbuckles, may be different on an M15. cheers, John On 4/21/22 12:10, Dave Scobie wrote:
Roger.
I've looked at all my flash and hard drives. Can't find the document with the M15 shrouds details.
I do remember that the early boats have shrouds and forestay of equal lengths. Jerry stopped doing this as folks would set the mast straight so without enough rake (need at least 3-4"). He then built the boats with the forestay a bit longer and the shrouds a bit shorter 'to encourage the correct rake'.
IMO unless the current rigging seems as if it was incorrect just duplicate what you have.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site!
On Fri, Apr 15, 2022, 11:51 AM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks Dave
Roger
Sent from my BlackBerry — the most secure mobile device — via the Rogers Network
Original Message
From: scoobscobie@gmail.com Sent: April 15, 2022 7:37 AM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Reply to: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths
Roger:
Do you think the existing shrouds are the incorrect length?
I have, someplace, a pdf that shows the rigging specs. Can't find it but I'll keep looking.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site!
On Thu, Apr 14, 2022, 3:46 PM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Could anyone help me with standard eye to eye lengths for the M15 mast stay and shrouds ? I need to replace one damaged shroud and think I will order a set, I will of course also measure the existing rigging too but just to confirm
thank you
Alula - M15 Lund B.C. Canada
Roger Langmaid
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
Tyler- All the M 15's that I made had a mast length of 19.5'. Don't know about the Eeg boats. ________________________________ From: casioqv@usermail.com <casioqv@usermail.com> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2022 4:43 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Cc: john <john@eco-living.net> Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths I wouldn't worry about rigging length specs for an older sailboat... things get changed around a lot and there were even different length masts used on different M15s. The only measurement that matters is the current rigging length. 1) If the boat sails properly (slight weather helm) adjust the new rigging so it's centered on the turnbuckle/stay adjuster at the current setting, even if it's at the end of the range with the old rigging. 2) Make sure both left and right rear stays are exactly identical in length even if they aren't with the old rigging. Taking care of 1&2 corrects for the cumulative error that occurs when people re-rig a boat repeatedly by measuring the old stay lengths and trying to copy them. Sincerely, Tyler ----- Original Message ----- From: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Cc: "john" <john@eco-living.net> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2022 12:59:04 PM Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths One comment on using the lengths you have - per Dave's comment about mast rake, check yours with current stays & shrouds, and adjust new lengths if/as necessary. My M17 came with a forestay that was a bit short (and thus a backstay that was a bit long). No idea why. The shrouds & stays it came with, I think, were not the OEM ones. It came with all nicopress and thimbles at both ends. I think the seller told me it had been re-rigged, maybe even by the previous owner to them. Anyhow - I didn't really think about mast rake until I saw some posts here about it, and also was needing a new forestay, as I was adding a jib furler. So I checked, and I had almost negative rake, the way it was when I bought it. It sailed OK anyhow, but I wouldn't have known there was better performance available then. I adjusted the lengths when ordering the new forestay and backstay, to give appropriate range of rake. You've only got a forestay to worry about, and the shrouds possibly if the rake makes that much difference in shroud length? It doesn't on the M17, plenty of range in the turnbuckles, may be different on an M15. cheers, John On 4/21/22 12:10, Dave Scobie wrote:
Roger.
I've looked at all my flash and hard drives. Can't find the document with the M15 shrouds details.
I do remember that the early boats have shrouds and forestay of equal lengths. Jerry stopped doing this as folks would set the mast straight so without enough rake (need at least 3-4"). He then built the boats with the forestay a bit longer and the shrouds a bit shorter 'to encourage the correct rake'.
IMO unless the current rigging seems as if it was incorrect just duplicate what you have.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site!
On Fri, Apr 15, 2022, 11:51 AM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks Dave
Roger
Sent from my BlackBerry — the most secure mobile device — via the Rogers Network
Original Message
From: scoobscobie@gmail.com Sent: April 15, 2022 7:37 AM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Reply to: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths
Roger:
Do you think the existing shrouds are the incorrect length?
I have, someplace, a pdf that shows the rigging specs. Can't find it but I'll keep looking.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site!
On Thu, Apr 14, 2022, 3:46 PM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Could anyone help me with standard eye to eye lengths for the M15 mast stay and shrouds ? I need to replace one damaged shroud and think I will order a set, I will of course also measure the existing rigging too but just to confirm
thank you
Alula - M15 Lund B.C. Canada
Roger Langmaid
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
Hi Jerry, That's exactly it- Bob Eegs boats have slightly longer masts... When I had Harry Pattison make new sails for me I ended up having to send them back to be cut down because they were slightly too big to fit the boat. Sincerely, Tyler ----- Original Message ----- From: "jerry montgomery" <jmbn1@outlook.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Cc: "john" <john@eco-living.net> Sent: Friday, April 22, 2022 1:06:33 PM Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths Tyler- All the M 15's that I made had a mast length of 19.5'. Don't know about the Eeg boats. ________________________________ From: casioqv@usermail.com <casioqv@usermail.com> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2022 4:43 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Cc: john <john@eco-living.net> Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths I wouldn't worry about rigging length specs for an older sailboat... things get changed around a lot and there were even different length masts used on different M15s. The only measurement that matters is the current rigging length. 1) If the boat sails properly (slight weather helm) adjust the new rigging so it's centered on the turnbuckle/stay adjuster at the current setting, even if it's at the end of the range with the old rigging. 2) Make sure both left and right rear stays are exactly identical in length even if they aren't with the old rigging. Taking care of 1&2 corrects for the cumulative error that occurs when people re-rig a boat repeatedly by measuring the old stay lengths and trying to copy them. Sincerely, Tyler ----- Original Message ----- From: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Cc: "john" <john@eco-living.net> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2022 12:59:04 PM Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths One comment on using the lengths you have - per Dave's comment about mast rake, check yours with current stays & shrouds, and adjust new lengths if/as necessary. My M17 came with a forestay that was a bit short (and thus a backstay that was a bit long). No idea why. The shrouds & stays it came with, I think, were not the OEM ones. It came with all nicopress and thimbles at both ends. I think the seller told me it had been re-rigged, maybe even by the previous owner to them. Anyhow - I didn't really think about mast rake until I saw some posts here about it, and also was needing a new forestay, as I was adding a jib furler. So I checked, and I had almost negative rake, the way it was when I bought it. It sailed OK anyhow, but I wouldn't have known there was better performance available then. I adjusted the lengths when ordering the new forestay and backstay, to give appropriate range of rake. You've only got a forestay to worry about, and the shrouds possibly if the rake makes that much difference in shroud length? It doesn't on the M17, plenty of range in the turnbuckles, may be different on an M15. cheers, John On 4/21/22 12:10, Dave Scobie wrote:
Roger.
I've looked at all my flash and hard drives. Can't find the document with the M15 shrouds details.
I do remember that the early boats have shrouds and forestay of equal lengths. Jerry stopped doing this as folks would set the mast straight so without enough rake (need at least 3-4"). He then built the boats with the forestay a bit longer and the shrouds a bit shorter 'to encourage the correct rake'.
IMO unless the current rigging seems as if it was incorrect just duplicate what you have.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site!
On Fri, Apr 15, 2022, 11:51 AM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks Dave
Roger
Sent from my BlackBerry — the most secure mobile device — via the Rogers Network
Original Message
From: scoobscobie@gmail.com Sent: April 15, 2022 7:37 AM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Reply to: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths
Roger:
Do you think the existing shrouds are the incorrect length?
I have, someplace, a pdf that shows the rigging specs. Can't find it but I'll keep looking.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site!
On Thu, Apr 14, 2022, 3:46 PM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Could anyone help me with standard eye to eye lengths for the M15 mast stay and shrouds ? I need to replace one damaged shroud and think I will order a set, I will of course also measure the existing rigging too but just to confirm
thank you
Alula - M15 Lund B.C. Canada
Roger Langmaid
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
Yeah. 15.5 inches. Bob Sent from my iPad
On Apr 22, 2022, at 1:07 PM, jerry montgomery <jmbn1@outlook.com> wrote:
Tyler- All the M 15's that I made had a mast length of 19.5'. Don't know about the Eeg boats. ________________________________ From: casioqv@usermail.com <casioqv@usermail.com> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2022 4:43 PM To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Cc: john <john@eco-living.net> Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths
I wouldn't worry about rigging length specs for an older sailboat... things get changed around a lot and there were even different length masts used on different M15s. The only measurement that matters is the current rigging length.
1) If the boat sails properly (slight weather helm) adjust the new rigging so it's centered on the turnbuckle/stay adjuster at the current setting, even if it's at the end of the range with the old rigging. 2) Make sure both left and right rear stays are exactly identical in length even if they aren't with the old rigging.
Taking care of 1&2 corrects for the cumulative error that occurs when people re-rig a boat repeatedly by measuring the old stay lengths and trying to copy them.
Sincerely, Tyler
----- Original Message ----- From: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Cc: "john" <john@eco-living.net> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2022 12:59:04 PM Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths
One comment on using the lengths you have - per Dave's comment about mast rake, check yours with current stays & shrouds, and adjust new lengths if/as necessary.
My M17 came with a forestay that was a bit short (and thus a backstay that was a bit long). No idea why. The shrouds & stays it came with, I think, were not the OEM ones. It came with all nicopress and thimbles at both ends. I think the seller told me it had been re-rigged, maybe even by the previous owner to them.
Anyhow - I didn't really think about mast rake until I saw some posts here about it, and also was needing a new forestay, as I was adding a jib furler.
So I checked, and I had almost negative rake, the way it was when I bought it. It sailed OK anyhow, but I wouldn't have known there was better performance available then.
I adjusted the lengths when ordering the new forestay and backstay, to give appropriate range of rake.
You've only got a forestay to worry about, and the shrouds possibly if the rake makes that much difference in shroud length? It doesn't on the M17, plenty of range in the turnbuckles, may be different on an M15.
cheers, John
On 4/21/22 12:10, Dave Scobie wrote: Roger.
I've looked at all my flash and hard drives. Can't find the document with the M15 shrouds details.
I do remember that the early boats have shrouds and forestay of equal lengths. Jerry stopped doing this as folks would set the mast straight so without enough rake (need at least 3-4"). He then built the boats with the forestay a bit longer and the shrouds a bit shorter 'to encourage the correct rake'.
IMO unless the current rigging seems as if it was incorrect just duplicate what you have.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site!
On Fri, Apr 15, 2022, 11:51 AM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks Dave
Roger
Sent from my BlackBerry — the most secure mobile device — via the Rogers Network
Original Message
From: scoobscobie@gmail.com Sent: April 15, 2022 7:37 AM To: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Reply to: montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths
Roger:
Do you think the existing shrouds are the incorrect length?
I have, someplace, a pdf that shows the rigging specs. Can't find it but I'll keep looking.
:: Dave Scobie :: M6'8" #650 :: Baba 30 #233 DEJA VU :: SV SWALLOW - sv-swallow.com :: former owner M17 #375 SWEET PEA - m17-375.com :: former owner M15 #288 SCRED - m15namedscred.wordpress.com <<-- new site!
On Thu, Apr 14, 2022, 3:46 PM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Could anyone help me with standard eye to eye lengths for the M15 mast stay and shrouds ? I need to replace one damaged shroud and think I will order a set, I will of course also measure the existing rigging too but just to confirm
thank you
Alula - M15 Lund B.C. Canada
Roger Langmaid
-- John Schinnerer - M.A., Whole Systems Design -------------------------------------------- - Eco-Living - Whole Systems Design Services People - Place - Learning - Integration john@eco-living.net - 510.982.1334 http://eco-living.net http://sociocracyconsulting.com
Thanks to all who replied to my query. I can duplicate my existing shroud length and on my boat and there is some room for length adjustment - the shroud anchor having a series of pin positions. But after some study I have decided to use 1/4" Dyneema synthetic line for the new shrouds. There are contrary opinions about the weathering life, chafing risks and expansion contraction issues with Dyneema however I like the idea of not having to have either professionally made swaged or tricky DIY mechanical, cable eyes. Instead I will learn to "fiddle" eye splices. I also like the ability to carry a spare set and easily replace the stay and shrouds again should I need to. I carry a full live aboard load, extra fuel etc, on my unusual - unique enlarged cabin M15 while cruising the coast up here in British Columbia and any weight saving is also useful. thanks again Roger M15 Alula On Thu, Apr 14, 2022 at 3:46 PM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Could anyone help me with standard eye to eye lengths for the M15 mast stay and shrouds ? I need to replace one damaged shroud and think I will order a set, I will of course also measure the existing rigging too but just to confirm
thank you
Alula - M15 Lund B.C. Canada
Roger Langmaid
Hi Roger, I haven't tried Dyneema but it seems like a cool option. I wanted to add that I re-rigged my boat myself with Hayn Hi-Mod cable eyes and 316 stainless wire, and found it very straightforward, and just require a pair of wrenches. These are 100% reusable with no replacement parts required, so in the future I can re-rig by just buying wire. They were not as cheap as other rigging options, but still affordable and worth it in my opinion. Sincerely, Tyler M15 #157 S/V Defiant ----- Original Message ----- From: "Roger Langmaid" <rogeregon@gmail.com> To: "For and about Montgomery Sailboats" <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2022 3:46:28 PM Subject: M_Boats: Re: M15 Stay and Shroud lengths Thanks to all who replied to my query. I can duplicate my existing shroud length and on my boat and there is some room for length adjustment - the shroud anchor having a series of pin positions. But after some study I have decided to use 1/4" Dyneema synthetic line for the new shrouds. There are contrary opinions about the weathering life, chafing risks and expansion contraction issues with Dyneema however I like the idea of not having to have either professionally made swaged or tricky DIY mechanical, cable eyes. Instead I will learn to "fiddle" eye splices. I also like the ability to carry a spare set and easily replace the stay and shrouds again should I need to. I carry a full live aboard load, extra fuel etc, on my unusual - unique enlarged cabin M15 while cruising the coast up here in British Columbia and any weight saving is also useful. thanks again Roger M15 Alula On Thu, Apr 14, 2022 at 3:46 PM Roger Langmaid <rogeregon@gmail.com> wrote:
Could anyone help me with standard eye to eye lengths for the M15 mast stay and shrouds ? I need to replace one damaged shroud and think I will order a set, I will of course also measure the existing rigging too but just to confirm
thank you
Alula - M15 Lund B.C. Canada
Roger Langmaid
participants (6)
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Bob Eeg -
casioqv＠usermail.com -
Dave Scobie -
jerry montgomery -
John Schinnerer -
Roger Langmaid