I guess my experience is similar to Rik's ... Though mine may not be representative since my jib is slightly smaller than 110% ... I've found that the roller furling is a good safety feature because I can reduce the headsail very quickly ... My experience has been that: "I have never had trouble making way upwind in heavy conditions even with [my] headsail furled to the size of a hanky, IF I could keep the boat under control." So I'm not as concerned about whether I'm using the sails at peak efficiency than I am that I have the boat under control and I can make headway ... I guess I was wondering, if I went to 155% jib, could I still furl my headsail "to the size of a hanky" ... Because I've found that to be a very useful advantage, indeed ... ----- Original Message ----- From: Rik Sandberg To: For and about Montgomery Sailboats Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 12:49 PM Subject: roller furling Larry, I don't know about "survival" situations and when a situation is considered so. I suppose that varies from one sailor to the next, determined by both their skill level AND perhaps more importantly, their ability to maintain their composure under pressure. I have been out on a few days when the winds were gusting up into the mid to high 30s, both with our Flicka and before that with the Rhodes 22 we used to own. On the days this has happened, we were already "out there" so it wasn't a matter of choice. We have (had) a roller furling jib or jenny on both boats and the furlers did their jobs flawlessly. Under these conditions, I am VERY careful not to allow any slack in the lines that could cause the furler to jam. I believe that I would rather have the furler. On a couple of the occassions I mention, the wind changes were quite sudden. I was able to easily reef the jib or jenny to allow for the change. If I had a hanked on jib or jenny, I'd have been standing on the fore deck, trying to change sails, assuming I had the right sail to put up. As it was I pulled a line in the cockpit and everything was back under control again. My opinion on this is: Balancing the boat and keeping her relatively upright (on her feet) are more of an issue in these conditions than finding enough power to make headway. I have never had trouble making way upwind in heavy conditions even with our headsail furled to the size of a hanky, IF I could keep the boat under control. I won't argue that a hank on storm sail might not be better, more efficient. I will argue though that standing on the fore deck of a boat that is wanting to dip it's spreaders in the water is pretty tough and dangerous duty. I do, like you say Larry, always try to keep the mains'l up when motoring if the wind is up. Again, it makes the boat much easier to control and the motion much steadier. Rik Larry E Yake wrote: Craig, I was hoping some others would join in on this thread. I've never been in a "survival" situation (other than maybe the night I was out in the middle of a big lake with a broken motor and a lightning storm rolling in), but wouldn't you agree that performance and safety are somewhat related? Lyle Hess designed these boats to get you home safely, but if your sails won't work properly, you're relegated to motoring in rough conditions and personally, I would much rather sail in rough water. The sails stabilize the motion of the boat and drive her through the waves rather than bouncing around and rolling like motoring. That being said, back to your original question, is a roller furler the way to go if you anticipate those conditions? Maybe not. Some say having that furled headsail up there stabilizes the rolling of the boat. Others would argue that you want to reduce windage as much as possible and having that big "sausage" out there in the wind is a big problem. Your genoa will not furl down to the size of a storm sail and work very well. You can get a storm sail that will fit over the furled genoa, which will also help prevent the sail from coming unfurled, but they're expensive and put you up on the bow in nasty conditions. Something you're trying to avoid in the first place with a furling headsail. Talk to your sailmaker. You may want to go with a smaller genoa than the 155 you're thinking about. Maybe a 130 or so, which should reef a little smaller. All just my opinions. Anyone else want to add jump in here? Larry On Sat, 30 Apr 2005 19:40:12 -0400 "Craig F. Honshell" <chonshell@ia4u.net> writes: What about when you're not particularly concerned with performance, and just want to get home safely? ----- Original Message ----- From: Larry E Yake To: chonshell@ia4u.net ; montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2005 5:03 PM Subject: roller furling Craig, I'm no expert on sails, but I believe the rule of thumb is that you can furl a properly built sail down 30% and still have efficient sail shape. I've had better luck than that, probably going down 50% and still having what I consider satisfactory performance. Racers in the group might not agree. My experience is strictly with my own boat and I find the convenience well worth any performance I might be giving up in stronger winds. I've had good success going to wind in some rough conditions when others had to motor to make any progress, so it must be working fairly well. Larry