I'm curious to know, did your swing keel "bang" in the trunk at anchor or in stays? My first boat was a Newport 17' with a genuine swing keel, as you describe. Although the Newport had a decent v-birth in its cuddy-cabin, sleeping aboard was out of the question, because the banging keel (whether retracted or deployed, made no difference) was like having a jack-hammer next to your head. When we asked around to find a solution, we were told that the banging problem was something a swing-keel boat owner learns to deal with (I can't imagine how). I spent the first night in my M17 with trepidation, nervous that the keel/centerboard design may have the same banging problem: Nope. The one time my M17's centerboard made any noise at all, it was because it wasn't retracted all the way. I love the "beachable" aspect of a swing-keel boat, but I've read that it's a more trouble-prone design and the noise problem is unacceptable. Now, I suppose that if we could have beached the Newport on every overnight, the noise would not have been an issue, but she sailed like a brick, board up, or down, so we sold her after 1 1/2 seasons. I want to make very clear that I'm describing the Newport 17', not the 16': I understand the 16' is a very different boat. For performance, strength, trailerability and thin-water capability, it seems the keel/centerboard is the best compromise. I'm not convinced that the Precision/Catalina (Capri)/Hake "fixed wing keel" designs perform as well as their manufacturers claim. ----- Original Message ----- From: "L Smith" <lsmith56@cox.net> To: <montgomery_boats@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Sunday, December 22, 2002 2:25 PM Subject: range of stability Ron How early of a model is Hula Pie? I had an M-17 which was a '77 and had a swing keel rather than a combo c/b keel. With such an arrangement, I could take the boat right up to shore, a lot like a Catalina or other swing keel boat. Lenny