July 2014 - montgomery_boats - mailman.xmission.com

Little Breeze M15
by Michael Mann 18 Nov '15

18 Nov '15

Hi, My name is Michael Mann and in 1982, I sailed the Montgomery 15, Little Breeze from CA to Hawaii. I see on the web site that she has been rescued by new owners in Hawaii and I would love to correspond with them. I am currently sailing on a container ship headed for Honolulu and would welcome the chance to make contact. Thanks for any info. Michael Mann

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Re: M_Boats: Now What Have I Gotten Myself Into? Major Transom Repair
by GILASAILR＠aol.com 01 Oct '14

01 Oct '14

Henry, You are correct in believing the interior was repaired due to wrapping the transom edge OVER the top and into the interior of the cockpit area. I also had a large number of holes in the transom to fill - both sides. You can 'get away' with wrapping the tape to the top edge just be sure to cut enough away to allow for the addition of the tape - you will be rebuilding the edge with tape -(bi-axial is your friend) and grinding it back to a suitable contour. I did not take photos of the whole process as I didn't intend to post it - someone asked and now see part of the rest of the story! I would use plywood (epoxy and hi density filler make great slurry for bonding after parts have been coated with 'neat' epoxy') Use the old skin as a base for finishing your transom skin - save the H.I.N. and keep it clearly visible! Carbon is not necessary here. Glass is proper application as there will be flex at joint. Use epoxy for the repair as polyester does not provide a good bond. Good time to fill all extra holes and over drill and back fill the ones you will retain. Good Luck Have Fun, Ask any ?'s you need and Make sure to sail 'Chiquita' while you work. Take Care Have fUn ! GO In a message dated 7/11/2014 9:59:35 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time, heinzir(a)gmail.com writes: Thanks for the reply Dave, There aren't any Suzuki dealers or repair shops around here that I know of and I have not yest seen any used ones on Craigslist in the last 6 months. The Evinrudes are the most popular around here. I'd like to try one to see if it fits. Yes, I have looked at Gary O's pictures on the MSOG site as well as all of the others, including your very nice SWEET PEA. I've been trying to educate myself and have studied every picture or commentary I could find. I have been reading the archives of this list starting from the beginning. There is so much information my little brain can't contain it all! Please excuse me if some of my questions are redundant, having already been discussed in the archives. In Gary's transom repair pictures he shows some fiberglass work on the cockpit side of the transom. I'm guessing that is because of overlapping the new fiberglass over the top to secure the hull/deck joint. The pictures aren't clear on this. I would like to avoid having to paint the inside of the cockpit if possible. Is it absolutely necessary to overlap? If so, could I just cover the top of the transom without going down the inside transom face? This is where I was thinking of using carbon fiber tape. Thanks! Henry On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 11:21 AM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie(a)gmail.com> wrote: > Henry: > > very very common for the damage you are seeing to be caused by a improperly > installed outboard motor bracket, or the outboard was left on the bracket > when she was going down the highway. the M17 sails best if you use the > cutout for the outboard. much better boat balance. not all outboards will > fit in the cutout ... the Suzuki 4HP and 6HP (same motor, just different > carb) do work in the cutout. > > here is an outline on how to fix (your boat is much worse than pictured, > but will give you an idea of how to proceed) - > > http://www.msogphotosite.com/lbgftransom.html > > (click on the spaces where the pictures should be to see a picture. the > www-site isn't working correctly as it uses out-of-date code.) > > > doing alternating layers of fiberglass and carbon fiber is fine as the two > materials will not conflict with each other. you really don't need to do > carbon fiber, but if it makes you sleep better at night ... > > -- > :: Dave Scobie > :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com > > > > On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 10:03 AM, Henry Rodriguez <heinzir(a)gmail.com> > wrote: > > > Yep! > > > > > > On Fri, Jul 11, 2014 at 9:30 AM, Dave Scobie <scoobscobie(a)gmail.com> > > wrote: > > > > > Henry: > > > > > > from you photo it looks like your boat has/had a motor mount on the > > transom > > > (instead of using the cutout for the motor as Jerry & Lyly designed). > > > correct? > > > > > > > > > -- > > > :: Dave Scobie > > > :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred > > > :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com > > > > > > > -- Henry https://picasaweb.google.com/heinzir

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Advice or help needed from San Francisco Bay area Montgomery Sailors
by Richard Conn 04 Aug '14

04 Aug '14

Hi, I'm selling my on-the-water town house in Pittsburg, and giving my 2001 Montgomery 17 to my son who lives in Alameda. It's about time, I turned 88 last month. I've sailed up to Martinez in her, and around the Delta, during those 14 years, but never further west. Because my dock was right behind the house I never had a trailer. When I offered the boat to my son I just assumed I would sail her up to whatever slip space he gets on the Island. Now I'm wondering. Is that a reasonable sail, or motor with my 5 horse kicker? Have any of you done it, and how long did it take. I'm anxious for your input. If you all think sailing Beatrice would be crazy, is there anybody out there who would consider renting me a trailer for a weekend. If so, it would be towed by my son who's 38 years my junior, Thanks for listening and kind regards, Richard Conn

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Re: M_Boats: saltwater?
by Dave Scobie 31 Jul '14

31 Jul '14

Steve: My old M15 and the Sage 17 AIR BORN didn't/don't have antifouling bottom paint. neither spent/spend much time in saltwater. the longest my M15 spent was about 10 days. the longest for AIR BORN is 15 days. after this time both boats had slime on the bottom and AIR BORN had one, very small barnacle (hadn't stuck hard, flicked it off with my fingernail). the slime came off easily when taking the boat through a car wash (ie, the you use a power washer wand and 'foaming brush' kind). my M17, SWEET PEA, lived on a buoy in Quartermaster Harbor (Vashon Is.) for about 20 years. she has bottom paint. since i've owned SWEET PEA, she has lived on her trailer excluding times cruising (longest in-water time just over three weeks). if you were to keep a boat, any boat, in the PNW saltwater more than a couple of weeks you need to apply antifouling. it is also best if you apply a barrier coat to the boat before applying anitfouling, if the boat will be in water long-term (more than a couple of months barrier coat is to protect the bottom against blistering, yeah, bottom paint ain't cheap. i bet a M15 would need less than 2Q. a Sage 17 needs just over 2Q. -- :: Dave Scobie :: former M15 owner - www.freewebs.com/m15-named-scred :: M17 #375 SWEET PEA - www.m17-375.webs.com On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 12:05 PM, stevetrapp <stevetrapp(a)q.com> wrote: > Dave, > I was surprised to read that you have sailed your M-17 on the waters of > Puget Sound. I moved to the South Puget Sound area two years ago and towed > my M-15 along after previously having had it on the fresh and cold water of > Lake Couer D' Alene in > Idaho. I heard admonishment from local boat owners about the damage the > waters of Puget Sound can cause, and upon discovering that hull paint runs > about $ 400 gallon, have taken the approach that scrubbing and rinsing with > fresh water would be a less expensive approach. Have seen your Sage 17 on > its trailer near waters of Puget Sound, but did not observe expensive hull > paint. What do you do regarding protecting your boat from saltwater? > Steve > M-15 # 335 >

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YIKES!
by Thomas Buzzi 27 Jul '14

27 Jul '14

Geez Shaun, What a job! I think it would be worth the cost though. Short of buying a brand new Sage 17 (mucho denaro), rehabbing one of Jerry's original boats is the only way to end up with something worth sailing. I read a report from an Ex- EEG customer and it did not sound very good for the newer (old mold) boats coming out and being called M-17's. "Good on ya" for keeping one of the classics seaworthy. Tom B, M17 #258, 1977

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're: Sean's Efforts
by nebwest2＠aol.com 27 Jul '14

27 Jul '14

Tom, Thanks for the clarification re: opinions. Yep everyone has them. Good straight info is always a good thing. And anyone has the right to share facts where and when and with whomever appropriate, as well as opinions when identified as such. But it really helps to keep in mind the context of a conversation or post and the venue of such and not take it another direction than it is going or intended to go, so as not to be inflammatory on a known sore spot. I have battled this exact issue to exhaustion within the HPPC until I put my foot down and ended it. It will literally suck the life out of an event and polarize an otherwise cohesive group into two camps. Nothing and I truly mean nothing could be more detrimental to our sport. I have seen it first hand. Some just cannot see that. I'm just a participant here , same as you, but one thing I know is that going negative impacts participation. No one likes conflict or feeling awkward. Myself included. That's why I speak up immediately if I see a post I made being replied to and going down that road. Thanks for the clarification and reply. Hopefully you can come on out and join us in Havasu this Feb. If you like Montys, and you obviously do :-), there will be lots of them here ( as well as just about every other make and model you can shake a stick at). Come , join us.... Let's sail. :-) that's where it's at. :-) Sent from my HTC One on the Verizon Wireless 4G LTE network Sent from my HTC One on the Verizon Wireless 4G LTE network

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Sean's efforts
by Thomas Buzzi 27 Jul '14

27 Jul '14

OhOh! busted! I should have prefaced my remarks with, " I think, or in my opinion", since that is all they were and all they ever could be. I also identified with the customer who had to take delivery of a badly finished craft as I too had the same experience. Having owned several boats from several different manufacturers the best boat is the one you take out and sail. Fairwinds, Tom B. M17, #258

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Re: M_Boats: YIKES!
by Sean Mulligan 27 Jul '14

27 Jul '14

> Tom, > > Thanks for the congrats on saving #44. It's been a fun (although hectic) project trying to get her ready for the Cruiser Challenge....but we made it. Had a great time sailing her and look forward to bringing her back the rest of the way and many more days on the water. After sailing the T200 in "Scout" the Monty 17 felt HUGE! > > Only because you brought it up....I'm a Monty guy through and through....so buying a brand new Sage for $25 to $30k is not even tempting to me. For my personal tastes it doesn't offer me anything that the M17 doesn't already have. The slight performance advantage it may have getting around a couple of buoys come at costs in other areas. Everything is always a give and take, all boats are a compromise, and everyone has to make their own call on what's good for them. For me....If I can buy a boat for $5k that gives me performance on par with a $30k boat, looks identical, and has a few other features I like....that's where I'm gonna be every time. Again, that's not the definitive answer for everyone, just my opinion (before I get blasted). > > I gotta say, those were a couple of harsh zingers there towards Bob and his boats. Not really what this board is for. I'm not a Bob promoter nor a Jerry promoter, nor a Sage promoter......only relaying my first hand experience. I speak to what I know. Bob did a nice job for me helping me save this boat. Period. I very much appreciate it. With respect to his boats not being up to snuff with the old Monty's? ...well....everyone has their opinion, but I would say this....I have yet to see one of Bob's boats have to have the keel gutted and rebuilt because $ were saved using scrap steel....old Monty's are not perfect either, I've owned 5 and been sailing them for many years.....so there are pluses and minus everywhere. It just depends on how you want to look at the picture I guess. Rather than stoking the fire and pitting one manufacturer against the other, it'd be much more fun to talk about the boats we love and that brought us here and how much we love sailing them. Let's do that. ;-) > > Sent from my iPad

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Re: M_Boats: YIKES!
by Sean Mulligan 27 Jul '14

27 Jul '14

Amen Tom and Della!!!! :-) Sent from my iPad

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Re: M_Boats: Aft skeg for Montgomery 17
by Nebwest2＠aol.com 26 Jul '14

26 Jul '14

Hey Tom, The answer to your question is yes, that horrific split was caused by steel ballast that somehow got wet, rusted, swelled, and expanded so much that it fractured out not only the outside skin of the keel, but it also completely destroyed the centerboard trunk (the pocket that the keel centerboard retracts up into). This was an extreme case. It was so bad that the entire keel was cut completely off the boat, a new one laid up in the original M17 mold, and then it was bonded back into place, completely replacing the keel, ballast, and centerboard trunk. This time lead ballast was used rather than steel to prevent any chance of it happening again. The job was above my pay grade so I took it to Bob at Montgomery Boats and he did the repair for me. Sean M23 "Dauntless" M17 #44 Paradox "Scout"

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