[math-fun] Fractional ordinals
My daughter Eliana will be five-and-a-half tomorrow. We are wondering: will tomorrow be her five-and-a-halfth birthday, or her fifth-and-a-half birthday? Jim Propp
Her eleventh half-orbit, obviously. Don't you want her to be a physicist? -Veit On Apr 4, 2014, at 9:55 AM, James Propp <jamespropp@gmail.com> wrote:
My daughter Eliana will be five-and-a-half tomorrow.
We are wondering: will tomorrow be her five-and-a-halfth birthday, or her fifth-and-a-half birthday?
Jim Propp _______________________________________________ math-fun mailing list math-fun@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/math-fun
Her sixth half-birthday. On 04-Apr-14 09:55, James Propp wrote:
My daughter Eliana will be five-and-a-half tomorrow.
We are wondering: will tomorrow be her five-and-a-halfth birthday, or her fifth-and-a-half birthday?
Jim Propp _______________________________________________ math-fun mailing list math-fun@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/math-fun
The earliest instance of a fractional ordinal that I can come up with is the 1953 Warner Brothers cartoon short "*Duck Dodgers* in the 24½th Century". Although from the spelling you'd guess it's pronounced "twenty-four-and-a-halfth", the protagonist pronounces it "twenty-fourth-and-a-half". (The cartoon also features a memorably nutty form of teleportation.) Jim Propp On Friday, April 4, 2014, James Propp <jamespropp@gmail.com> wrote:
My daughter Eliana will be five-and-a-half tomorrow.
We are wondering: will tomorrow be her five-and-a-halfth birthday, or her fifth-and-a-half birthday?
Jim Propp
Here's some evidence that there were earlier uses: https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=secondth%2Chalfth&year_start=1... On Fri, Apr 4, 2014 at 11:01 AM, James Propp <jamespropp@gmail.com> wrote:
The earliest instance of a fractional ordinal that I can come up with is the 1953 Warner Brothers cartoon short "*Duck Dodgers* in the 24½th Century". Although from the spelling you'd guess it's pronounced "twenty-four-and-a-halfth", the protagonist pronounces it "twenty-fourth-and-a-half".
(The cartoon also features a memorably nutty form of teleportation.)
Jim Propp
On Friday, April 4, 2014, James Propp <jamespropp@gmail.com> wrote:
My daughter Eliana will be five-and-a-half tomorrow.
We are wondering: will tomorrow be her five-and-a-halfth birthday, or her fifth-and-a-half birthday?
Jim Propp
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-- Andy.Latto@pobox.com
Her 2004th unbirthday? --Dan On Apr 4, 2014, at 6:55 AM, James Propp <jamespropp@gmail.com> wrote:
My daughter Eliana will be five-and-a-half tomorrow.
We are wondering: will tomorrow be her five-and-a-halfth birthday, or her fifth-and-a-half birthday?
Jim Propp _______________________________________________ math-fun mailing list math-fun@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/math-fun
Maybe I'm overanalyzing it like the old curmudgeon I am, but the whole fifth-and-a-halfth birthday thing is not making sense to me. Would your call 5.5 the fifth-and-a-halfth integer? The day Eliana exceeds 5.5 years of age isn't *any* kind of birthday, just as 5.5 isn't any kind of integer. Celebrating it seems fine to me (a year is a very long time to a little kid), but we should come up with a different name for it. I guess I'm agreeing with Mike Speciner. On Fri, Apr 4, 2014 at 1:43 PM, Dan Asimov <dasimov@earthlink.net> wrote:
Her 2004th unbirthday?
--Dan
On Apr 4, 2014, at 6:55 AM, James Propp <jamespropp@gmail.com> wrote:
My daughter Eliana will be five-and-a-half tomorrow.
We are wondering: will tomorrow be her five-and-a-halfth birthday, or her fifth-and-a-half birthday?
Jim Propp _______________________________________________ math-fun mailing list math-fun@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/math-fun
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I'm with Veit --- it's her 11th half-birthday. - Cris On Apr 4, 2014, at 11:58 AM, Allan Wechsler <acwacw@gmail.com> wrote:
Maybe I'm overanalyzing it like the old curmudgeon I am, but the whole fifth-and-a-halfth birthday thing is not making sense to me. Would your call 5.5 the fifth-and-a-halfth integer? The day Eliana exceeds 5.5 years of age isn't *any* kind of birthday, just as 5.5 isn't any kind of integer. Celebrating it seems fine to me (a year is a very long time to a little kid), but we should come up with a different name for it. I guess I'm agreeing with Mike Speciner.
On Fri, Apr 4, 2014 at 1:43 PM, Dan Asimov <dasimov@earthlink.net> wrote:
Her 2004th unbirthday?
--Dan
On Apr 4, 2014, at 6:55 AM, James Propp <jamespropp@gmail.com> wrote:
My daughter Eliana will be five-and-a-half tomorrow.
We are wondering: will tomorrow be her five-and-a-halfth birthday, or her fifth-and-a-half birthday?
Jim Propp _______________________________________________ math-fun mailing list math-fun@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/math-fun
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Actually, it's common parlance to refer to numbers (n + n+1)/2 as half-integers. --Dan ----- . . . 5.5 isn't any kind of integer. -----
No. See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Half-birthday, carefully defined so that 1/2 is one's first half-birthday. Also note that, in common parlance, "birthday" is the anniversary of the day of birth. Although my daughter sang "Happy Birthday" to her newborns, much to the amusement of the attending nurse/midwives. On 04-Apr-14 14:03, Cris Moore wrote:
I'm with Veit --- it's her 11th half-birthday.
- Cris
On Apr 4, 2014, at 11:58 AM, Allan Wechsler <acwacw@gmail.com> wrote:
Maybe I'm overanalyzing it like the old curmudgeon I am, but the whole fifth-and-a-halfth birthday thing is not making sense to me. Would your call 5.5 the fifth-and-a-halfth integer? The day Eliana exceeds 5.5 years of age isn't *any* kind of birthday, just as 5.5 isn't any kind of integer. Celebrating it seems fine to me (a year is a very long time to a little kid), but we should come up with a different name for it. I guess I'm agreeing with Mike Speciner.
On Fri, Apr 4, 2014 at 1:43 PM, Dan Asimov <dasimov@earthlink.net> wrote:
Her 2004th unbirthday?
--Dan
On Apr 4, 2014, at 6:55 AM, James Propp <jamespropp@gmail.com> wrote:
My daughter Eliana will be five-and-a-half tomorrow.
We are wondering: will tomorrow be her five-and-a-halfth birthday, or her fifth-and-a-half birthday?
Jim Propp _______________________________________________ math-fun mailing list math-fun@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/math-fun
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I'm pretty sure that in Hindi there are separate words for 1.5 and 2.5, so children in Delhi and Chennai will be able to celebrate their one and a halfth and two and a halfth...but even there the fifth and a halfth will be a tongue twister Sent from my iPhone
On 4 Apr 2014, at 18:59, Allan Wechsler <acwacw@gmail.com> wrote:
Maybe I'm overanalyzing it like the old curmudgeon I am, but the whole fifth-and-a-halfth birthday thing is not making sense to me. Would your call 5.5 the fifth-and-a-halfth integer? The day Eliana exceeds 5.5 years of age isn't *any* kind of birthday, just as 5.5 isn't any kind of integer. Celebrating it seems fine to me (a year is a very long time to a little kid), but we should come up with a different name for it. I guess I'm agreeing with Mike Speciner.
On Fri, Apr 4, 2014 at 1:43 PM, Dan Asimov <dasimov@earthlink.net> wrote:
Her 2004th unbirthday?
--Dan
On Apr 4, 2014, at 6:55 AM, James Propp <jamespropp@gmail.com> wrote:
My daughter Eliana will be five-and-a-half tomorrow.
We are wondering: will tomorrow be her five-and-a-halfth birthday, or her fifth-and-a-half birthday?
Jim Propp _______________________________________________ math-fun mailing list math-fun@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/math-fun
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"Sesqui" is 3/2 in Latin, and it was in common use; "Quasqui" for 5/4 apparently existed as well, but I've never seen it in period use. (I have seen it in modern use: "quasquicentennial" for a 125th anniversary.) Charles Greathouse Analyst/Programmer Case Western Reserve University On Fri, Apr 4, 2014 at 2:04 PM, Alex Bellos <alexbellos@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm pretty sure that in Hindi there are separate words for 1.5 and 2.5, so children in Delhi and Chennai will be able to celebrate their one and a halfth and two and a halfth...but even there the fifth and a halfth will be a tongue twister
Sent from my iPhone
On 4 Apr 2014, at 18:59, Allan Wechsler <acwacw@gmail.com> wrote:
Maybe I'm overanalyzing it like the old curmudgeon I am, but the whole fifth-and-a-halfth birthday thing is not making sense to me. Would your call 5.5 the fifth-and-a-halfth integer? The day Eliana exceeds 5.5 years of age isn't *any* kind of birthday, just as 5.5 isn't any kind of integer. Celebrating it seems fine to me (a year is a very long time to a little kid), but we should come up with a different name for it. I guess I'm agreeing with Mike Speciner.
On Fri, Apr 4, 2014 at 1:43 PM, Dan Asimov <dasimov@earthlink.net> wrote:
Her 2004th unbirthday?
--Dan
On Apr 4, 2014, at 6:55 AM, James Propp <jamespropp@gmail.com> wrote:
My daughter Eliana will be five-and-a-half tomorrow.
We are wondering: will tomorrow be her five-and-a-halfth birthday, or her fifth-and-a-half birthday?
Jim Propp _______________________________________________ math-fun mailing list math-fun@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/math-fun
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participants (9)
-
Alex Bellos -
Allan Wechsler -
Andy Latto -
Charles Greathouse -
Cris Moore -
Dan Asimov -
James Propp -
Mike Speciner -
Veit Elser