just home from paris now. I saw the band in 1991 and 1997. And yesterday, I was very disappointed. No Kling Klang Studio, no Robots, no Pocket-Calculators. Only four old poeple, standing at their laptops, playing old tunes. Very boring. 1997 ZKM was much, much better. Nothing new, only a techno version of Expo 2000 which was the best I heard this evening, an improved Underground Resistance Mix, but better. The Airwaves Extension (Tango) was 95% the same as in 1997. No progress. The only surprise, which wasn't one: Neon Lights, but it sounded like a sampled 1978-version, even with the same bassdrum and snare. Florian looked very bored, looked like he's got nothing to do... Fritz faded some drum-sounds up and down, nothing more... Henning handled some knobs... Ralf played some chords and melodies and did vocals. Most tracks sounded like sampled off their Kling Klang studio. And, the Cubase SX plug-in synths do not sound that fat, no cutoff frequencies at the Autobahn sequence... Numbers was the 1981 sampled version, too. Not the 1991/97 improved version. Lot of Songs sounded to me, as they tried to sound more like the original versions, not MIX versions. Ralf and Florian, get your Kling Klang Studio back, and do some new tracks. But with concerts like this, you are destroying your myth.
I remember seeing Kraftwerk perform in 1991 at Manchester in the UK... I was disappointed in not hearing new material... and thinking that the concerts I attended 10 years before in 1981 were similar but MUCH better (I still think that today). I went on to see Kraftwerk perform several more times in the early 90's and the concerts grew on me... VERY powerful they became, but still I think they lacked that magic from their early years performing live. I know of several people who saw them in 1975 and then went on to see them, in 1981 and 1991. They say that the 1975 concerts were the best they have seen... Oh look.... can you see a pattern developing? ;o) Keep Werking John www.keepwerking.co.uk From: "djm" <bloop2000@gmx.net> just home from paris now. I saw the band in 1991 and 1997. And yesterday, I was very disappointed. No Kling Klang Studio, no Robots, no Pocket-Calculators. Only four old poeple, standing at their laptops, playing old tunes. Very boring.
Did they perform "Tour De France"? If yes, how did it sound? I'm listening to a live version of it now. I'm still looking for US dates! -----Original Message----- From: kraftwerk-admin@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:kraftwerk-admin@mailman.xmission.com]On Behalf Of John Shilcock Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 5:34 PM To: kraftwerk@mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: [Kraftwerk] Paris first day I remember seeing Kraftwerk perform in 1991 at Manchester in the UK... I was disappointed in not hearing new material... and thinking that the concerts I attended 10 years before in 1981 were similar but MUCH better (I still think that today). I went on to see Kraftwerk perform several more times in the early 90's and the concerts grew on me... VERY powerful they became, but still I think they lacked that magic from their early years performing live. I know of several people who saw them in 1975 and then went on to see them, in 1981 and 1991. They say that the 1975 concerts were the best they have seen... Oh look.... can you see a pattern developing? ;o) Keep Werking John www.keepwerking.co.uk From: "djm" <bloop2000@gmx.net> just home from paris now. I saw the band in 1991 and 1997. And yesterday, I was very disappointed. No Kling Klang Studio, no Robots, no Pocket-Calculators. Only four old poeple, standing at their laptops, playing old tunes. Very boring. _______________________________________________ Kraftwerk mailing list Kraftwerk@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/kraftwerk
I read back further and saw that they did perform "Tour De France". I hope they come to Detroit. -----Original Message----- From: kraftwerk-admin@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:kraftwerk-admin@mailman.xmission.com]On Behalf Of Brian Davis Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 9:40 PM To: kraftwerk@mailman.xmission.com Subject: RE: [Kraftwerk] Paris first day Did they perform "Tour De France"? If yes, how did it sound? I'm listening to a live version of it now. I'm still looking for US dates! -----Original Message----- From: kraftwerk-admin@mailman.xmission.com [mailto:kraftwerk-admin@mailman.xmission.com]On Behalf Of John Shilcock Sent: Thursday, September 26, 2002 5:34 PM To: kraftwerk@mailman.xmission.com Subject: Re: [Kraftwerk] Paris first day I remember seeing Kraftwerk perform in 1991 at Manchester in the UK... I was disappointed in not hearing new material... and thinking that the concerts I attended 10 years before in 1981 were similar but MUCH better (I still think that today). I went on to see Kraftwerk perform several more times in the early 90's and the concerts grew on me... VERY powerful they became, but still I think they lacked that magic from their early years performing live. I know of several people who saw them in 1975 and then went on to see them, in 1981 and 1991. They say that the 1975 concerts were the best they have seen... Oh look.... can you see a pattern developing? ;o) Keep Werking John www.keepwerking.co.uk From: "djm" <bloop2000@gmx.net> just home from paris now. I saw the band in 1991 and 1997. And yesterday, I was very disappointed. No Kling Klang Studio, no Robots, no Pocket-Calculators. Only four old poeple, standing at their laptops, playing old tunes. Very boring. _______________________________________________ Kraftwerk mailing list Kraftwerk@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/kraftwerk _______________________________________________ Kraftwerk mailing list Kraftwerk@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/kraftwerk
Well, I attended the first Paris concert as well, and I have to say it was an excellent show. And yes, I have seen them before. They looked really good behind their laptops, each one dressed all in black (leather / latex / warm leatherette / idontknow) against one huge projection screen, lit up by three NEC projectors. The setup was really clean, really minimal end really good looking. Ralf kept holding his hand up to his mouth when singing as if he was either whispering or shouting or really nervous. Florian kept blowing his nose in a small handkerchief. When the curtain was lifted after the vocoder/robot voice intro, "the robots" was played and the screen was all in red. A rather red film of the mix-era robots was projected by the middle projector. Very nice. The projections worked well all along, often being direct adaptations of the kraftwerk.com illustrations, shown exactly in sync with the music. They all had a laptop, ralf had a small keyboard that allowed him to play a few leads and chords. They all had midi-controllers, I think (Doepfer?). It appeared as if they used them to to control effects, reverbs and echos. Also, they each had a pedal of some sort, but I'm not sure if the pedals actually did anything. I really like the way Kraftwerk has moved away from most of the 90's disco-ish versions of the songs, and instead made hyper-clear digital interpretations of the original versions. Some of the new instrument sounds are less thick and less beautiful than the older sounds, but most new drum sounds are dry and fantastic. The overall sound was awesome, digitally clear (with a few distorted exceptions) and the bass was especially good. The four members left the stage one at the time, starting with Florian. By the way, he made a weird pose while walking out, like he was waving goodbye and impersonating the letter "K" at the same time (well, something like that...). Ralf was the last one to go. The curtain dropped and the computer voices kept saying "Music non stop" for a long time. Cool stuff, kids. Playlist (as I remember it), Paris 25/9: The Robots Expo 2000 (version of Underground Resistance mix) It's more fun... /Homecomputer Man Machine Tour De France Autobahn The Model Neon Lights Pocket Calculator Airwaves (crappy techno version) Radio Activity Trans Europe Express Extras: Numbers / Computer World Boing Boom../Music Non Stop Regards, Petter --- John Shilcock <john@keepwerking.co.uk> wrote:
I remember seeing Kraftwerk perform in 1991 at Manchester in the UK... I was disappointed in not hearing new material... and thinking that the concerts I attended 10 years before in 1981 were similar but MUCH better (I still think that today).
I went on to see Kraftwerk perform several more times in the early 90's and the concerts grew on me... VERY powerful they became, but still I think they lacked that magic from their early years performing live.
I know of several people who saw them in 1975 and then went on to see them, in 1981 and 1991. They say that the 1975 concerts were the best they have seen...
Oh look.... can you see a pattern developing? ;o)
Keep Werking John www.keepwerking.co.uk
From: "djm" <bloop2000@gmx.net>
just home from paris now. I saw the band in 1991 and 1997. And yesterday, I was very disappointed. No Kling Klang Studio, no Robots, no Pocket-Calculators. Only four old poeple, standing at their laptops, playing old tunes. Very boring.
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le 26/09/2002 22:55, djm à bloop2000@gmx.net a écrit :
just home from paris now. I saw the band in 1991 and 1997. And yesterday, I was very disappointed. ... But with concerts like this, you are destroying your myth.
Dear djm, You should know that a live performance depends on the shape of the artists, the mood of the moment, the ambience, the place, technical problems... all that things you can't control... There are too many details... that make a gig is "great" or not! Anyway a live show will NEVER be perfect, even in the case of Kraftwerk! I actually don't care for the Kraftwerk concerts, as you (should) know (again) ;-) they are not a live-guitar-heroes-band anyway! *lol* So, what IMPORTANCE?? :-I I only enjoy and take care of all their PERFECT studio released masterpieces! - that's enough for me :-) Btw: obviously they keep secret the new tracks released ( and not yet achieved?.. ) for the next planned album... ;-) What do you mean by "with concerts like this, you are destroying your myth"?? :-( Sorry mate, that's a piece of NONSENSE! fyi: It is rather a man like Wolfgang Flür who is involved in the "Kraftwerk myth destruction" ( for example: how is it possible a guy who was a Kraftwerk member can release such a poor album like "Time Pie"? my God!) don't you know? >:-> Some questions: - WHY do you waste time and money to go to concerts you are NOT able to enjoy??? >:-> *rotflol!* - Are you really - still - a Kraftwerk "fan"??? - Let me doubt ;-) Greetings, _ /o o\ Filtre4Pole, ...who is angry with people who are lucky to see KW in concert, and then are not happy! :-/ \ ~ / I I - -
I think Yamo´s Time Pie is not as bad as you think... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Filtre4Pole" <catmeow@wanadoo.fr> To: <kraftwerk@mailman.xmission.com> Sent: Friday, September 27, 2002 9:08 PM Subject: Re: [Kraftwerk] Paris first day le 26/09/2002 22:55, djm à bloop2000@gmx.net a écrit :
just home from paris now. I saw the band in 1991 and 1997. And yesterday, I was very disappointed. ... But with concerts like this, you are destroying your myth.
Dear djm, You should know that a live performance depends on the shape of the artists, the mood of the moment, the ambience, the place, technical problems... all that things you can't control... There are too many details... that make a gig is "great" or not! Anyway a live show will NEVER be perfect, even in the case of Kraftwerk! I actually don't care for the Kraftwerk concerts, as you (should) know (again) ;-) they are not a live-guitar-heroes-band anyway! *lol* So, what IMPORTANCE?? :-I I only enjoy and take care of all their PERFECT studio released masterpieces! - that's enough for me :-) Btw: obviously they keep secret the new tracks released ( and not yet achieved?.. ) for the next planned album... ;-) What do you mean by "with concerts like this, you are destroying your myth"?? :-( Sorry mate, that's a piece of NONSENSE! fyi: It is rather a man like Wolfgang Flür who is involved in the "Kraftwerk myth destruction" ( for example: how is it possible a guy who was a Kraftwerk member can release such a poor album like "Time Pie"? my God!) don't you know? >:-> Some questions: - WHY do you waste time and money to go to concerts you are NOT able to enjoy??? >:-> *rotflol!* - Are you really - still - a Kraftwerk "fan"??? - Let me doubt ;-) Greetings, _ /o o\ Filtre4Pole, ...who is angry with people who are lucky to see KW in concert, and then are not happy! :-/ \ ~ / I I - - _______________________________________________ Kraftwerk mailing list Kraftwerk@mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/kraftwerk
- WHY do you waste time and money to go to concerts you are NOT able to enjoy??? >:-> *rotflol!*
Beacuse I enjoyed them in 1991/97 and did expect to enjoy it again. Another Reason was, No drinking and smoking in the Paris Concert Hall. Very unusual. I hope today in Luxemburg it will be better (drinking and smoking, KW will be the same...)
- Are you really - still - a Kraftwerk "fan"??? - Let me doubt ;-)
Yes, I am.
participants (6)
-
Brian Davis -
djm -
Filtre4Pole -
John Shilcock -
Jose -
Petter