- KLF - mailman.xmission.com

RE: [KLF] Shag Times
by Don Gagen 21 Nov '02

21 Nov '02

They released it on CD. On another note, one of my copies was stolen. It's really upsetting since I know so few were pressed. I guarantee the person who stole it had no idea of its value. Anyway, I have an empty case if anyone wants to make me an offer. Don -----Original Message----- From: Hawx [mailto:hawx@slinkyskunk.co.uk] Sent: Wednesday, November 20, 2002 11:13 AM To: klf(a)mailman.xmission.com Subject: [KLF] Shag Times I forget; did they actually release Shag Times on CD or is this just a bootleg jobbie? http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=922505308 Cheers, Chris _______________________________________________ KLF mailing list KLF(a)mailman.xmission.com http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/klf

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Re Shag Times
by mark weston 21 Nov '02

21 Nov '02

The CD JAMS CD 3 Shag Times was definiatly released and sold in the shops.Regards Mark W.

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Copy protection makes me want to steal music
by Don Gagen 21 Nov '02

21 Nov '02

I really think this one is going to backfire on them. With the exception of live recordings and a few SUPER-RARE tracks I purchased the original CD or vinyl of every MP3 in my collection. I've always been a strong advocate of supporting the artist through purchasing the music. But, I don't have the time or patience to deal with this kind of BS. If I have to worry about whether or not a $18.99 CD is compatible with all my players, I'll simply stop buying them. I'd rather download it, and let someone else do the work of breaking the copy protection. Phillips should really force these rogue companies who choose to use non-standard formats to stop using the Compact Disc logo. That way I will at least know which ones to buy.

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RE: [KLF] [ot] Kopy protection
by Stuart Bruce 20 Nov '02

20 Nov '02

Well I told myself I wouldn't get involved, and I was doing better than Jonathan in that regard. But I've cracked... > -----Original Message----- > From: Nick King [mailto:nickwking@ntlworld.com] > Sent: 20 November 2002 01:13 > To: klf(a)mailman.xmission.com > Subject: RE: [KLF] [ot] Kopy protection > Surely, the reason for the fall in CD sales is that there > isn't that many > new artists around nowadays, the charts are full of manufactured Pop > Idol/Star/Rivals/etc, independent labels have been bought up > by majors, etc? CD sales across the board are dropping. This creates a vicious cycle of competition that means that major record labels are leapfrogging each other, always trying to push 'the next big thing' (because first albums tend to sell more than second and third albums). This breeds apathy in the buying public above 18 years old. However the 8- to 12-year-old buying public still lap it up. > I know that there are people out there who don't buy > vinyl/CD's and *DO* > just download MP3's, but don't go and blame a fairly large > percentage fall > in record sales on people with PC's downloading MP3's! I mean > there's a > whole load of people out there who still don't have the > bandwidth/time/knowledge to download MP3's, so surely the > whole percentage > fall can't be attributed to people who download this stuff! Not the whole percentage fall. But a significant portion of it is caused by the availability of bootlegs. > Ah well, we won't be able to dissuade these useless wankers > that the reason > the sales are going down is simply that there isn't that much > good stuff > being released nowadays (apart from, say, Royksopp, Bent, > Orbital, Orb - > latter two recently dropped by their record label, and the like)... This is an opinion held by a lot of people who're into alternative music, and while it's an ideal way of looking at things, sadly it's just not backed up by facts. Ultimately the reason that bands like the Orb get dropped are because they aren't selling as many records as the record company need them to, and while there are various factors to that (publicity etc.) that comes down to the fact that they just aren't mainstream and popular enough. There doesn't have to be any correlation at all between music you or I find good and music that sells well to the general public. I should know, I've been working on Fame Academy... > ...Or maybe I'm just getting too old! Sadly, I've already had to come to terms with the fact that I'm now twice as old as a lot of the people who buy things in the UK singles chart. And (dare I say it?) I'm probably among the youngest people on this list- sorry! Stuart. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com) Version: 6.0.404 / Virus Database: 228 - Release Date: 15/10/2002 ______________________________________________________________________ Any views or opinions expressed in this e-mail are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of ENDEMOL UK plc unless specifically stated. This email and the information it contains are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify us immediately and delete the copy you have received from your system. You should not copy it for any purpose, re-transmit it, use it or disclose its contents to any other person. If you suspect the message may have been intercepted or amended please call the sender.

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KLF Live On Stage
by mark weston 20 Nov '02

20 Nov '02

Hi, On Rob Stringers Server is a copy of the Live on stage CD. Its been through Soundforge and all the gaps taken away.There are a few noticable pitch changes in crowd noise otherwise its perfect. I put it there so im sure if you ask Rob he will let you download it. Regards Mark W.

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Live On Stage for 10 days now
by Thomas Touzimsky 20 Nov '02

20 Nov '02

Due to limited web space, the Live On Stage mp3s will be available for another ten days before they will get deleted. Maybe RMStringer could host them on his server ? --- Thomas Touzimsky same shit // different day

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RE: [KLF] [ot] Kopy protection
by Stuart Bruce 20 Nov '02

20 Nov '02

> -----Original Message----- > From: Thomas Touzimsky [mailto:thomas@klf.de] > Sent: 20 November 2002 14:37 > To: klf(a)mailman.xmission.com > Subject: Re: [KLF] [ot] Kopy protection > > <conspiracy mode on> > > I am not sure if this was the original reason, but could it > be that this > "rule" was introduced to "force" (read "allow") record > companies to share > all the mixes over two CDs instead of one, so the willing > customer has to > buy both of them ? > > <conspiracy mode off> Not really, because the idea of 2CD sets was in existence for years before their length was shifted from 40 minutes to 20. If anything it was a conspiracy by the larger record labels whose pop and indie acts would release singles with B-sides on, against the smaller dance labels whose releases looked more appealing because having 7 remixes was proving preferable to having 3 half-baked B-sides. At the time it was claimed that the chart rules were biased towards dance acts, whereas the new rules are quite obviously biased against them. Stuart. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com) Version: 6.0.404 / Virus Database: 228 - Release Date: 15/10/2002 ______________________________________________________________________ Any views or opinions expressed in this e-mail are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of ENDEMOL UK plc unless specifically stated. This email and the information it contains are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify us immediately and delete the copy you have received from your system. You should not copy it for any purpose, re-transmit it, use it or disclose its contents to any other person. If you suspect the message may have been intercepted or amended please call the sender.

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RE: [KLF] [ot] Kopy protection
by Stuart Bruce 20 Nov '02

20 Nov '02

> -----Original Message----- > From: Andrew Robinson [mailto:andrew@bml.co.uk] > Sent: 20 November 2002 14:11 > To: klf(a)mailman.xmission.com > Subject: Re: [KLF] [ot] Kopy protection > There is a weird inability to scale back promotion and > expenditure with > the major labels. But isn't that because if one label cuts back on promotion and expenditure, then because the other labels are all promoting as much as before, all that happens is that the artists on one label disappear without trace through under-exposure. It's that vicious cycle I mentioned, no one label is strong enough to break the trend. > Another factor is the self-inflicted bad value for money rules on CD > singles, where you can only have 3 tracks totaling 20 minutes > to qualify > as a single (as opposed to 4 and 40 minutes). If the record companies > deliberately give us worse value for money, of course sales will fall! This was pressure from a small number particular artists & labels to change the chart rules because dance singles were being more successful than indie singles. However plenty of record labels are feeling the effect of the resultant drop in sales and to say it's self-inflicted wouldn't be completely true. > > > whole load of people out there who still don't have the > > > bandwidth/time/knowledge to download MP3's, so surely the > > > whole percentage > > > fall can't be attributed to people who download this stuff! > > > > Not the whole percentage fall. But a significant portion of > it is caused by the availability > > of bootlegs. > > Don't forget the drop in sales is caused by the gradual decline in > people who are replacing old vinyl albums with new CDs of the same > material. Once we have all repurchased the ones we want, that > market collapses. There are several reasons why album profits as a whole are dropping. The fact that vinyl collections have been replaced is one, bootlegging is another, the internet providing a cheaper place to buy is a small factor. It all bundles in together into what basically is a long-term recession in the music industry. Stuart. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com) Version: 6.0.404 / Virus Database: 228 - Release Date: 15/10/2002 ______________________________________________________________________ Any views or opinions expressed in this e-mail are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of ENDEMOL UK plc unless specifically stated. This email and the information it contains are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify us immediately and delete the copy you have received from your system. You should not copy it for any purpose, re-transmit it, use it or disclose its contents to any other person. If you suspect the message may have been intercepted or amended please call the sender.

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Re: [KLF] [ot] Copy protection
by Thomas Touzimsky 20 Nov '02

20 Nov '02

> The big record companies (such as BMG) are starting to put copy > protection on all CDs, which means they won't play in many portable and > car CD players. BMG is in fact the german publisher of Kosheen - or at least the CD single I got. Funny enough, I could mp3 the whole album without problems... [???] > This is an acceptable fault apparently, since it stops > piracy, so it's ok to stop genuine listeners who've paid for it from > listening to their own damn album. I doubt UK CDs will be different. Funny enough, this is what the FAQ of the german BMG copy control page tells us... --- 1.Warum kann ich eigentlich mit meiner CD nicht machen, was ich will? Man zahlt entgegen dem allgemeinen Sprachgebrauch nicht für die CD, sondern für die Musik, die auf ihr enthalten ist. Im Grunde kann man eine CD mit einer Konzertkarte vergleichen. Weder bei dem Pappkärtchen noch bei der Plastikscheibe spielt der Materialwert eine nennenswerte Rolle. Und wie bei der Konzertkarte erwirbt man auch beim Kauf einer CD grundsätzlich nur das Recht, die Musik zu hören. --- (c-Row translates...) 1. Why can't I do whatever I want with my CD ? Opposite to the usual understanding, you don't pay for the CD but for the music that plays on it, just like you pay for a concert ticket. In both cases, the material worth is not comparable to what you get for it. And, like the concert ticket, buying a CD only allows you to listen to the music. --- Opinions please... --- Thomas Touzimsky same shit // different day

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[ot] Copy protection
by Thomas Touzimsky 19 Nov '02

19 Nov '02

I bought myself the new (in Germany at least) Kosheen maxi "Hungry", but thanks to paranoid publishers, I am cursed with their copy protection, making it impossible for me to record the tracks on the CD to mp3. Are CDs in the UK copy protected as well ? If not, I would order my CDs from the UK from now on... (what had the advantage that, unlike Germany, the UK stores sell both discs of a 2disc set, so it is easier to get all the mixes) --- Thomas Touzimsky same shit // different day

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