In recent fractint mailing lists there were postings about the TMan1 (Russ Wallsmith, tweaked by Jim Muth), and Sylvie Gallet's "rising lake" effect. I have figured how to animate them both; they are currently rendering right now and should be posted on my site in a few days or so. They look 2B seriously cool. Lee Skinner also posted 4 PAR formulas in the last mailing, one of them, "Cave of the Fire Pit" is awesome! If you didn't check it out, do it! I rendered it at 1600x1200, printed out a hardcopy, and hung it up on my wall - I don't often do that. I really see a view from the air of a shallow Carribean sea dotted with little islands. In the middle is a gaping black hole, as if an asteroid had just impacted, with a definite 3D appearance and a wall/cliff (tidal wave?) next to it. And fire spewing out of it like there would be. Now if I could animate the fire w/o affecting the rest of it ... ...