Re: MtMan-List: iron arrowheads made by the plains indians

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Author: Dennis Fisher
Date:  
To: David Scott, hist_text
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: iron arrowheads made by the plains indians
David,

Just curious about your sources for mountain men carrying bows - could you make
that available for the rest of us. I believe, but can't remember for sure, that
I read an account of Jim Bridger having an iron arrowhead removed from his back
at one of the rendezvous. Anyone else recall reading that.

Dennis Fisher
AMM 612






________________________________
From: David Scott <davmscott@???>
To: gregmuich@???; markloader@???; pat_quilter@???; 
kodiak54@???; hist_text@???; davmscot@???
Sent: Thu, December 2, 2010 12:00:08 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: iron arrowheads made by the plains indians



Thanks- one sees a bunch of info on big arrowheads being for war and small
arrowheads for hunting and after a while- I don't know what's what. In any
event my question on the iron/steel being used only for war is obviously not
true- good to know.

Dave

Still thinking about making a bow- several documented sources that at least a
couple of mountain men carried them for back up weapons.

> Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2010 10:13:00 -0800
> From: gregmuich@???
> To: MarkLoader@???; pat_quilter@???; kodiak54@???;
>hist_text@???; davmscot@???
> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: iron arrowheads made by the plains indians
>
> Concerning steel trade points. I have seen several bison vertebrae in
>different museums here in the west that had nice steel trade points lodged
>deeply into the bone and they all had penetrated the spinal cord column, to some
>degree, clearly sending the bison to a crashing halt. What a whoop of joy that
>must have brought to the savage hunter!
> I have also seen patterns of steel trade points found on the Custer
>Battlefield and they were in all shapes and sizes and some with multiple points,
>chisel points and multiple barbs. Most likely made "in country" by either
>Indians or a white blacksmith. I do know that Indians owned files and they had
>plenty of time to file out points from scrap metal such as barrel hoops.
> Points were also knapped out of old thick glass bottles. Knapped points are
>sharper but they are not nearly as durable and re-usable as a steel point.
> YMOS,
> beav,
>
> --- On Sat, 11/27/10, David Scott <davmscot@???> wrote:
>
>
> From: David Scott <davmscot@???>
> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: iron arrowheads made by the plains indians
> To: MarkLoader@???, pat_quilter@???, kodiak54@???,
>hist_text@???
> Date: Saturday, November 27, 2010, 10:18 AM
>
>
> I'm not sure whether that many arrowheads were made from scrap metal. I think


> most were trade items and if they weren't available- then flint/obsidian.
>
> While on the subject.......
>
> Were the metal arrowheads used mostly for war? The reason I ask is I think the


> obsidian were sharper and probably better for buffalo- I think I recall them
> being used well past 1840. The question then becomes what was the primary use


> of the metal arrowheads?
>
> And.......
> In the, "I don't have enough to do department" I've been thinking about making
>a
>
> traditional bow and traditional arrows- have any of you done such?
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: "MarkLoader@???" <MarkLoader@???>
> To: pat_quilter@???; kodiak54@???;
> hist_text@???
> Sent: Wed, November 24, 2010 1:32:39 AM
> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: iron arrowheads made by the plains indians
>
> I have a cold chisel and a piece of flat metal the was being used by the
> Indians that I found with my metal detector at camp in North east Colorado
> they had been raiding in western Kansas in 1869
> Roadkill
> _______________________________________________
> Hist_text mailing list
> Hist_text@???
> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hist_text
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> Hist_text@???
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>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> Hist_text@???
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Will do but give me a day to get the information (I have it in my database)=
=2C off hand I remember Beckwourth telling about it and a couple of others.=
I have probably about 3 sources- for the Northern Plains (Green River). O=
n the Southern (Taos) area- I think anyone of Mexican heritage commonly car=
ried bows. Post ASAP.
=20


Date: Thu=2C 2 Dec 2010 12:22:42 -0800
From: difisher@???
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: iron arrowheads made by the plains indians
To: davmscott@???=3B hist_text@???





David=2C

Just curious about your sources for mountain men carrying bows - could you =
make that available for the rest of us. I believe=2C but can't remember fo=
r sure=2C that I read an account of Jim Bridger having an iron arrowhead re=
moved from his back at one of the rendezvous. Anyone else recall reading t=
hat.

Dennis Fisher
AMM 612








From: David Scott <davmscott@???>
To: gregmuich@???=3B markloader@???=3B pat_quilter@???=
=3B kodiak54@???=3B hist_text@???=3B davmscot@yaho=
o.com
Sent: Thu=2C December 2=2C 2010 12:00:08 PM
Subject: Re: MtMan-List: iron arrowheads made by the plains indians


Thanks- one sees a bunch of info on big arrowheads being for war and small =
arrowheads for hunting and after a while- I don't know what's what. In any=
event my question on the iron/steel being used only for war is obviously n=
ot true- good to know.

Dave

Still thinking about making a bow- several documented sources that at least=
a couple of mountain men carried them for back up weapons.

> Date: Sat=2C 27 Nov 2010 10:13:00 -0800
> From: gregmuich@???
> To: MarkLoader@???=3B pat_quilter@???=3B kodiak54@???=

t=3B hist_text@???=3B davmscot@???
> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: iron arrowheads made by the plains indians
>=20
> Concerning steel trade points. I have seen several bison vertebrae in =

different museums here in the west that had nice steel trade points lodged =
deeply into the bone and they all had penetrated the spinal cord column=2C =
to some degree=2C clearly sending the bison to a crashing halt. What a whoo=
p of joy that must have brought to the savage hunter!
> I have also seen patterns of steel trade points found on the Custer Ba=

ttlefield and they were in all shapes and sizes and some with multiple poin=
ts=2C chisel points and multiple barbs. Most likely made "in country" by ei=
ther Indians or a white blacksmith. I do know that Indians owned files and =
they had plenty of time to file out points from scrap metal such as barrel =
hoops.
> Points were also knapped out of old thick glass bottles. Knapped point=

s are sharper but they are not nearly as durable and re-usable as a steel p=
oint.
> YMOS=2C
> beav=2C
> =20
> --- On Sat=2C 11/27/10=2C David Scott <davmscot@???> wrote:
>=20
>=20
> From: David Scott <davmscot@???>
> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: iron arrowheads made by the plains indians
> To: MarkLoader@???=2C pat_quilter@???=2C kodiak54@???=

t=2C hist_text@???
> Date: Saturday=2C November 27=2C 2010=2C 10:18 AM
>=20
>=20
> I'm not sure whether that many arrowheads were made from scrap metal. I =

think=20
> most were trade items and if they weren't available- then flint/obsidian.
>=20
> While on the subject.......
>=20
> Were the metal arrowheads used mostly for war? The reason I ask is I thin=

k the=20
> obsidian were sharper and probably better for buffalo- I think I recall t=

hem=20
> being used well past 1840. The question then becomes what was the primar=

y use=20
> of the metal arrowheads?
>=20
> And.......
> In the=2C "I don't have enough to do department" I've been thinking about=

making a=20
> traditional bow and traditional arrows- have any of you done such?
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> ________________________________
> From: "MarkLoader@???" <MarkLoader@???>
> To: pat_quilter@???=3B kodiak54@???=3B=20
> hist_text@???
> Sent: Wed=2C November 24=2C 2010 1:32:39 AM
> Subject: Re: MtMan-List: iron arrowheads made by the plains indians
>=20
> I have a cold chisel and a piece of flat metal the was being used by the =

=20
> Indians that I found with my metal detector at camp in North east Colorad=

o =20
> they had been raiding in western Kansas in 1869
> Roadkill=20
> _______________________________________________
> Hist_text mailing list
> Hist_text@???
> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hist_text
>=20
>=20
>=20
> =20
> _______________________________________________
> Hist_text mailing list
> Hist_text@???
> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hist_text
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> Hist_text mailing list
> Hist_text@???
> http://mailman.xmission.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hist_text

=20
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